J
John Fitzsimons
Great idea. If someone is willing to pay for the site costs. Are you ?
Thought not. Genna can do anything she likes with her site. It isn't
up to you, me or Susan to tell her what she can do.
Great idea. If someone is willing to pay for the site costs. Are you ?
Thought not. Genna can do anything she likes with her site. It isn't
up to you, me or Susan to tell her what she can do.
R
R.L
I think one thing that is important is that if my memory
serves. Two years ago when Susan, with her much appreciated
passion, volunteered to do the job, she was (and rightfully
should be, as a member of this group) welcomed, although Genna
was already doing the job at that time and she didn't really
indicated that she was going to resigned yet.
By the same token, Genna volunteered to provide the site as
she has been (and we all appreciated this too), she should not
be "kicked out" or "excluded" either (just like Susan wasn't
excluded to help in the first place). I think everyone should
be welcomed to contribute, but part of the deal, IMO, is also
to work with other already existing volunteer(s), for better
or worst. Tolerance is a must.
When one volunteer to do a job for a group, one is also
implicitly agreeing to work with other volunteering
participants who are already being involved, like it or not,
or for better or worse.
I think the bottomline is, if Pricelessware is *really* in
principle belong to everyone here, everyone should be welcomed
to participate and no one should have the right to "kick"
another person out of the game (moving the site is "kicking"
Genna out of the game, taking away the part that she wants to
contrubute - I honestly think that it is unfair, especially
she has been doing it since before Sue is involved).
I think if Sue still wants to be the webmaster, she should
still be welcomed and appreciated, and if Genna wants to
provide the site as she has been, she should also be welcomed,
too. If one really consider PL is a thing for everyone here,
everyone should have the right to contribute (although first
come first serve, as most volunteer works usually are) Genna
does not have the right to kick Sue out and Sue should not try
kick Genna out either. Volunteer works like this is not about
who does the best job, it is about who is willing to do it and
whether one is willing put up the unbearbles and to work
things out with others.
If either of them found that they are not happy about the
situation, they can either beg the other one to leave, work it
out, or sad to say, just leave. The group here should not be
asked to take "side". It is just volunteer work, not a matter
of life and death and should not have that kind of politics
involved.
<shoot! finally cannot help to say something on this thread,
have been holding my tongue up for sooo looooog and finally
exploded !>
--
RL
*******************************************
Unofficial Adaware Updater:
http://home.earthlink.net/
~ringomei/Unofficial_adaware_updater.html
Little (File) Backer Upper:
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
*******************************************
O
Olaf Janson
John Fitzsimons said:
Wow, you are a hypocrite in a grand sense.
So, anyone who is "paying the bills" should be allowed to dictate an
operation, regardless of someone who actually makes things work.
Susan wanted support from the people who appreciated the work she had
done on the site and for the group.
You, however, feel it's more important to give leeway to the person
who's paying for it.
As I said, you are a hypocrite in a grand sense.
Shame on you.
O
Olaf Janson
John Fitzsimons said:
I'm sorry to have to break this news to you, but the Pricelessware site
was set up to accommodate the votes from the participants of this Usenet
group.
Genna should be ashamed of herself for driving away the best thing that
ever happened to the Pricelessware
site. Susan made the site useable in a way that hadn't been done before,
and to suggest that it should all be thrown away is despicable.
T
Tiger
You should run for office.
T
Tiger
Ok, 'nuff said.
J
jason
Susan said:
I want more info, but I think the format is important.
Can you make a list of the unworkable items? That would let us know at a
glance what the problem is. And it will help Genna too. It's more
productive than a bunch of narrative posts that quickly get personal.
Just make a 'slide' with bullets listing what the problem areas are.
That'll give us a top-level view. If details are needed, we can get into
that as the next step.
J
jason
Olaf Janson said:
The only problem with that is that it leaves a cloud over everyone's head.
That's not fair IMO. Which is why I'm for a concise list or 'vugraph' with
bullet items of what the problems are. Genna can respond to each bullet
with a proposed solution. If that doesn't work, then both parties made a
good faith effort to come to a solution and they can move on without a
cloud over their head. Nobody's reputation is unfairly tarnished.
S
Semolina Pilchard
I didn't miss it. I discounted it as valueless weasel words.
If it was pure speculation then it would have been better left unsaid.
Characterising a deliberate insult, which this was, as opinion,
doesn't lessen its effect. You clearly sought to damage her
reputation. What other reason could you possibly have had for saying
it?
It was never necessary to attack Genna in order to support Susan. The
ridiculous and ill-considered polarisation of the argument is in no
small degree contributory to the sad state we find ourselves in now.
The decent thing for you to do, Olaf, would be to make an unreserved
apology to Genna for the false accusation you made against her.
Nothing you have said so far, however, suggests to me that you are man
enough to do that.
R
REM
Well, you sure had some concrete ideas of what Geena "should" do.
refer to the part that you evidently did not read:
She asked for _group approval to move the site_ and was called a
"drama queen" in return. How can she possibly just move in light of
this?
I get the impression that you rarely, if ever, even use the PL site.
Yet, you had much to say... and here we are.
It is truly regrettable. It's been emotionally stressful for those
involved. It's really time to allow the thread to drift away now.
I think you and I can agree that collectively, ACF earned what it
deserves... not to have the time and talent of Susan slaving away for
it free.
T
Tramp
<snip>
|I think you and I can agree that collectively, ACF earned what it
|deserves... not to have the time and talent of Susan slaving away for
|it free.
You make it sound like everything was dumped on Susan. She is the one
that volunteered to do stuff at Pricelessware. No asked/told her to do
things completely on her own. From organizing the vote, the CD and
managing the web site. Others offered to help. Sure, she asked for help
here and there but she is the one who chose to do the majority of the
work on her own.
|I think you and I can agree that collectively, ACF earned what it
|deserves... not to have the time and talent of Susan slaving away for
|it free.
You make it sound like everything was dumped on Susan. She is the one
that volunteered to do stuff at Pricelessware. No asked/told her to do
things completely on her own. From organizing the vote, the CD and
managing the web site. Others offered to help. Sure, she asked for help
here and there but she is the one who chose to do the majority of the
work on her own.
R
REM
This is true Tramp. I think that she was an unrealized dynamo however,
and her efforts were largely unappreciated and/or taken for granted. I
suppose I was bitter in seeing votes cast against her by people who
had no clue as to exactly how dedicated she was and/or no _real_
interest in who does what where concerning the PL site.
I actually cautioned her as not to go into details, as I really
_thought_ the regular readers here would prefer_ not_ to read a bunch
of tit for tat. State the position (the subject header), and ask for a
group vote, as simply as that. Anyone denying there were personal
problems surely had another agenda other than the operation of the PL
site. Given there were problems, what can details possibly do to solve
them? Neither party involved should be called to air dirty laundry to
satisify the few who are backordered for The Enquirer.
That obviously, was bad advise. It took a carnival atmosphere almost
immediately and went downhill from there. I'll not give advise so
freely in the future for certain.
Anyway, I've had my say, I really need to take a seat now.
Welcome back btw.
P
*ProteanThread*
Tiger said:
Good, then can we kill this thread now ?
)
P
*ProteanThread*
Dan Goodman said:
That doctor must be the moniker for the US Gov.
)
P
*ProteanThread*
Olaf Janson said:
*TROLL* perhaps ?
J
John Corliss
Cruising said:
I cancelled the post in case you didn't notice. And I haven't
killfiled you... yet.
D
Dan Goodman
*ProteanThread* said:That doctor must be the moniker for the US Gov.
Did you read "The wounded man refuses to allow this until he has all the
facts" as something like "The doctor refuses to operate until....?"
Or do you actually see the Federal Government as trying to get things
done, and frustrated by citizens who insist on knowing, for example,
Vicente Fox's blood type before any agreements are made with Mexico?
P
*ProteanThread*
Dan Goodman said:
Remind me to ask Michael Moore that next time I see him.
)
J
jason
REM said:
Heh. I saw it as the exact opposite. People could *clearly* see what
Susan was doing since they see her day-to-day involvement, but Genna was
a big mystery because she's strictly behind the scenes. Most people
didn't know either Genna or her history. So when the unwarranted
accusations started flying, people automatically believed Susan and
(unfairly) looked upon Genna with suspicion.
The truth is that both people are good people. But there were some HUGE
communication issues going on. From my POV, Susan wasn't able to clearly
articulate what the problem was, so Genna wasn't able to do anything to
fix it. If Susan had clearly outlined her issues in a LIST, giving Genna
a chance to propose solutions for each of the listed 'grievances', it
might have saved us these endless rounds of personal attacks.
Just my 2 cents.
P
*ProteanThread*
jason said:
I agree, you have ppl blindly side with Susan without realzing what the real
issues are. Thats the point that I and several others have tried to make
but then we get slammed (like >><Q<< got slammed because he didn't side with
Susan).has pretty much made this a pointless thread (why ask for advice or a
vote when you might not like what you get) and ... and ...
But that is just *MY* opinion....
--
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