WILL MICROSOFT PLEASE CLARIFY?

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Does Apple have more of a common sense approach to what may be an issue
within families, that is how best to upgrade the household computers that
does not have families filing for Chapter 7 after upgrading?
 
Simplest answer: Microsoft.

There are several related threads in the NG, filled with people saying how
it used to work for prior products (well known but irrelevant) or how it
ought to work (interesting, but equally irrelevant).

Some key quotes from those supposedly in the know:

"You have to be inside the OS to run setup if you have an upgrade product
key. You cannot boot from the DVD with an Upgrade product key and do a
clean install or upgrade.
Thanks,
Darrell Gorter[MSFT]"

"Only there is no way to do a compliance check from a DVD boot. You can
only do compliance check from with-in an existing OS.
There isn't an option to insert a cd\dvd of the legacy operating system to
meet the check of the legacy OS.
Thanks,
Darrell Gorter[MSFT]"

From the Readme.rtf in the Sources folder on the Vista DVD:
You cannot start, or “boot,†your computer from the Windows Vista upgrade
disc.

On top of that Lenovo says there are 2 dvds in the upgrade, 1 with the OS
and 1 with Lenovo driver updates.

All of this is capable of swift clarification, but needs a definitive
Microsoft statement.
 
I wish Microsoft would have allowed some to download the upgrade versions to
test them and discover what they can and cannot do.
 
If you are using an Upgrade Edition you would have to have a way to target
an empty partition or overwrite the active partition to do a Custom install
(all Vista installations are "clean" installs of the OS now). If Custom
Install is not available or greyed out then you would only be able to
upgrade the running OS from which you launched Setup. This is one of the
things we hope will be clarified soon. With an XP Upgrade cd if you start
Setup from the desktop you can only upgrade the current system. You cannot
do a clean install. Vista will most likely work that way also. It all
comes down to whether or not a Vista Upgrade dvd is bootable or not.

Yes, Microsoft recommends using Image backup solutions like Acronis with
upgraded systems (especially with one upgraded via Anytime Upgrade) to
protect your investment. You will be able to restore such an image backup.
 
You have to like Apple's approach because of the real savings. I just wish
MS would at least offer something like it.
 
I know. I asked for that in TechBeta months ago but it went nowhere. I
kept getting answers that related to the upgrade functions of the full
edition which we were all using or I just got put off.
 
Agreed, I fail to see where Microsoft thinks they will lose with a family
license offering. The positive publicity alone would recoup any percieved
losses by generating higher sales volume.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP

Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
 
I am so disillusioned by the whole scenario. My understanding at this point
is that I cannot do a clean install of Vista from an upgrade disk. I will
have a non-bootable disk. Therefore, I will not have access to the repair
diagnostics on the Vista disk. I will be forced to buy the full version. Is
this correct? BTW, if you do not know for certain about Vista, please do not
reply to my note. I really want clarification from Microsoft please.
 
Hold off until we get clarification.

Jon Acord said:
I am so disillusioned by the whole scenario. My understanding at this
point
is that I cannot do a clean install of Vista from an upgrade disk. I will
have a non-bootable disk. Therefore, I will not have access to the repair
diagnostics on the Vista disk. I will be forced to buy the full version.
Is
this correct? BTW, if you do not know for certain about Vista, please do
not
reply to my note. I really want clarification from Microsoft please.
Click to expand...
 
Rick said:
Agreed, I fail to see where Microsoft thinks they will lose with a
family license offering. The positive publicity alone would recoup any
percieved losses by generating higher sales volume.
Click to expand...

That would require that MS care about its paying customers, something
that they don't do. How can you expect a company that assumes that every
single person who is installing Windows is a pirate to care about their
customers, who they openly disdain?

Alias
 
Whoa Colin! I OWN an Xp Professional upgrade disk. I assure you is is a
BOOTABLE disk. It has a FULL menu of items when you boot from it. It will
allow you to do a CLEAN FULL install from it IF you have your prior OS to
insert into the
ROM when prompted during the setup. It will allow you to access a menu to
login as admin and repair the prior OS. A full host of features, apparently,
unlike the catrarated Vista upgrade disk everyone is bemoaning.
 
Jon, yes, we all know exactly how XP upgrade disks work, but this thread is
about how VISTA upgrade disks work, and that's what Colin was referring to.

We are all guilty of assuming they would be the same as XP, but became aware
of major changes and then realised that we had no idea how various important
scenarios can be performed.

Hence the request for someone who knows (i.e. Microsoft) to explain.
 
OK Colin. I thought about it. I'm still not sure what you were getting at.
Were you hinting that some machines cannot boot from an external DVD drive?
 
Jon, I re-read my reply to you and it sounded irritable and condescending!
That was not my intent. My apologies.
 
That is what I am saying. I was replying to:
It's been a while since I've had to deal with a microsoft upgrade. My
recollection from the last time was the upgrade checked to see if I had
the prior disks but that the operating system did not have to already be
installed.
Click to expand...
It is bootable and it just asks to see the CD for the qualifying OS.
Click to expand...

Of course XP Upgrade cd's are bootable. But the respondant was asserting
that Vista would be the same.
You just misunderstood what I was replying to.
 
Yes. When is the last time you booted a machine from an external usb
optical drive? You can't boot Windows, including Vista, from a device on
the usb bus. Almost all external dvd drives are usb.
 
Hmm. The XP upgrade disk "will allow you to do a CLEAN FULL install from
it IF you have your prior OS to insert into the ROM when prompted during
the setup," BUT the disk you use for proving you have a prior Windows OS
*could* be borrowed from someone else just for this purpose (instead of
actually owned by you, the "upgrader"), n'est-ce pas?

This apparent severe downgrade of the upgrade disks for Vista, if true,
sounds suspiciously like another MS anti-piracy measure to me. I'm sure
MS would argue that a custom clean-install (or whatever they're calling
a "clean install" now) could still be accomplished by an actual owner of
a previous OS install CD by first installing that previous OS from its
bootable disk and then upgrading to Vista (which completely replaces the
old OS) with the nonbootable Vista upgrade DVD.
 
Well, it's been a while, but I have done it. It's very dependant on what
support is in the bootable XP system after it's initialised. It also requires
the bios of the machine to like usb drives. One combo that works (with XP) is
the IBM Thinkpad and USB CD drive. I agree that most don't work.

With the wealth of motherboards that now support USB device boot and the
support for USB devices in Vista install, I just don't know what combos work.
 
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