Why do you still use Windows XP?

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Hmm, a lot of people use BitTorrent *HatehateHate*, and other P2P stuff, and
it's often an issue for them. There have been whole forums full of such talk.
Port forwarding is quite the frentic issue in file sharing circles, and I saw
more than enough to last a lifetime. (I learned a lot of my own coding
practice scripting an admin script for a DC hub). Gamers and users of complex
instant messenger programs have similar needs. These are all very common
activities.
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Those aren't valid concerns anymore, for the most part. BT clients no
longer need port forwarding, nor do modern IM clients, at least that
I'm aware of. I agree, those used to be concerns back around 2004 or
so.
 
I just think that being deliberately vague while representing a company's
authority is disingenous, or at least a sort of unprofessional cock-up.
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I guess we're back to disagreeing then, because to me, "not supported"
couldn't be more clear.
 
Actually, they just don't know they want it. If it vanished, they'd soon be
asking why all the things they took for granted vanished like bad
metaphysics.
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I repeat, end users don't care one bit about APIs. They don't use
them, don't know what they are, and don't care if they come or go. If
the Windows APIs vanished, (why should they?), there wouldn't be a
whole lot of new software, but end users wouldn't make the connection
between that and a missing API.
 
No, I agree it's a distinctive DISADVANTAGE. But taking it literally, it
does "offer" that, but it's an "offer" I sure have no interest in. :-)


I don't see how it's so hard. It IS (as are each of the succeeding OS's).
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It's hard because the two things being compared aren't exactly the
same. There's no disagreement that 7 has a larger disk and memory
footprint, for example, but how much of that is because of new
functionality, more security, or whatever? It's hard to say, so a
comparison of respective bloat is equally hard. I certainly can't do
it.
 
Bill said:
I found 512 MB of RAM more than sufficient for everything
(in Win98SE). Granted, I wasn't running 10 apps at once,
however. But who would?? Especially with that darn system
resource heap problem, which could often turn up at the most
unexpected moments.
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Bill, you and I have discussed these win-98 heap issues several times in
the past.

Here is how I answered you back in May 2011:

=================
You mean like running out of resources due to the 64K heaps? :-)
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The 32-bit User Window, User Menu, and User GDI heaps are 2 mb each, not
64 kb. It's only the 16-bit User heap and 16-bit GDI heaps that are 64
kb.

The fact that you continuously refer to these heaps as a bottleneck
indicates that your experience with Win-98 is probably with older
software that made more use of 16-bit code which might have been more
common 10 years ago. Or your experience is based on "buggy" software
circa 10 years ago (that maybe you still use) that suffers from GDI
leaks.
 
You love an argument, don't you? If they don't care enough to to at least
know there IS some deep structure that gives them all those little controls
they need to get stuff done, that doesn't make me 'wrong'. It just makes them
'stupid'. Now why would you want to side with that mentality? Are you busy
making money out of it and trying to justify yourself?
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So 99.9999999999999999999999999999999% of computer users are stupid,
by your standard? I call that stupid, and I call you wrong.

(I'm being generous there with the percentage. It's probably even
closer to 100% than that.)

Not knowing how something works doesn't make a person stupid. The word
you might be looking for is ignorant, but that's not a serious
liability, either, when your goal is to be a user. Fortunately, you
usually don't have to know how something works in order to use it.
 
Even when all the redundant file caches are discounted, and all the
wallpapers or other flimflammery, there is extra bloat. And it does all come
back to the increasing distance too many people put between themsleves and
the API. I know what Mister Jackson thinks about this but I disagree with it.
I'm NOT denying that it is happening, we KNOW it's happening, but that
doesn't make it any more 'right' that breeding a nation of kiddies who think
milk grows in little polymer-lined cardboard boxes.

The more people take leave of the basic realites that support their
existence, the weaker and more bloated they grow. It's a basic fact of life
that should not be ignored, and people should not be encouraged in that
ignorance unless they want other people to wonder about their motives in
doing so. You can;t help people be as free as you want to be if you're
willing to keep them fat and stupid in their gilded cages.

OS's will not start shrinking until SOMETHING puts that right. To some extent
the deman, the raw need, for mobility, is forcing this to happen in the shape
of ARM chips, and RISC coding for them, to fit phones and PDA's but they
still use exactly the same type of API as a desktop machine, near as damnit,
and people should NOT be encouraged to remain ignorant just because it suits
a marketeering mindset. Those people ARE the market, and should be treated
with more respect. Fortunately these new devices are being introduced into
school teaching, so maybe the current bloated classes will be seen as a 'lost
generation' eventually, and rightly so.
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Have you seen that new TV show called Doomsday Preppers? You sound
like one of the folks on that show. I'm sure they don't see themselves
as kooky, but they sure look strange from the outside looking in.

You seem stuck in a time long past, when things were smaller, leaner,
simpler. Well guess what, time marches on, and it looks like it's left
you far behind. You seem to be ok with that, so who am I to argue?
 
You know I meant that one,
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No, I didn't know you meant that one, but it seemed like the most
logical choice. Even a blind squirrel gets lucky sometimes.
you just want to kick it, for whatever reason. The
guy's french, give him a break.
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Sorry, I don't give breaks for silly things like that. The whole site
looks like it was put up overnight by a kid. It's quite unprofessional
and lacking any technical details. It might be a great product, but I
don't know and have no plans to find out. I was mostly just commenting
on the very poor quality of the site, all of which gives me absolutely
no confidence in the product. If he's that sloppy with web
development, is he equally sloppy with his software development?
 
Well, but the point is, does it really matter what specifically it is
attributed to?
The bottom line is: it is "bloat". An OS is supposed to be just that: an
*operating system*, and that's all. Whiz bang effects, or eye candy, or a
so called "Media Center", don't count. :-) Just like XP was more bloated
(as an OS) than W98 was, and W98 is compared to W95, and, even more
dramatically, W95 is to Win 3.1. And finally, DOS. :-) And again, look
at their respective footprints (both in disk space AND resident memory
requirements. And what the extra bloat or fluff is attributed to is, (to
me), irrelevant, in this context.
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I see your point, but to me the reason for the increased size of the
footprint is the more important question. If the bigger size is
legitimate, (how would a person measure that?), then I don't see it as
bloat. A thing can be bigger than another thing without being bloated.
 
Maybe he'd prefer to see people try it and find a deeper reason for it. :)
Personally, my only beef with that presentation is the indugence in the
shiny-white-box culture of software sales. If I thought he was being
satirical I might like it better. Fortunately the actual software really IS
good. Die-hard proponents in the past, of things like Outpost and AtGuard
would probably like it. Some of those purits might want to separate the
'anti-trojan' bit from the firewall, but I wouldn't. One of its strengths is
detecting some program, and enabling filtering for that program, only when
the program is loaded and needing it. It's a clever and efficient use of
directed switching that keeps things fast, optimised to whatever is running.
When LnS started out, the main alternative was Zone Alarm. *shudders*
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I've never been a fan of software firewalls, so I have no experience
with Zone Alarm, AtGuard, Outpost, Kerio, or any of the others. I used
a Netscreen 5GT for a few years, but only because the local Netscreen
vendor was giving them away. In recent years, I just use the Windows
firewall. Yes, I'm aware of its limitations and I'm ok with it.
 
The bigger size might be "legitimate" or acceptable if someone really NEEDED
the extra stufff that was added. But who really does? Adding USB made
sense. Eliminating the 64k heap resource problem made sense. Ditto on long
file names. But building in a Media Center, or adding more hand holding and
cosmetics like Aero, or whatever, sure doesn't (to me).. :-)
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Windows 7 is designed for idiots! Even if you are an administrator. I
can see creating an OS for idiots like MS Bob. But to sell it to the
masses is an insult IMHO! The only thing that makes any sense to me is
that Microsoft is trying to commit suicide.

And Aero? I am using an almost black wallpaper and the text on the glass
is also black (which is default I guess). And I can barely read a thing.
So what is wrong with the odd way of doing things? As none of this
nonsense happened before.
 
It likely needs you to set text colour too. Always set text and background
explicitly, or let the system decide both. If only coders would also get this
right! You may well be seeing the result of one who didn't, but look into it
anyway, it might ne that newer Windows OS's expect you to. W9X didn't, icon
text (and window and messagebox text) would go either white or black,
depending on whether your background was above or below mid grey, halfway
point in the total scale betwen black and white. In W9X if we want coloured
text on desktop icons, we need a dedicated program to do it. You may just be
seeing the result of M$ abandoning that earlier method and requiring direct
settings by users for all colours.

The old way was ok a lot of the time, until some coder set a web page or
windows control's text white, without also makign sure the background was
appropriate in contrast. This led to the kind of crap you just decribed, with
the added difference that non-coders could rarely do anything about it, which
was why not that many people ever used light text on dark backgounds. Coders
rarely tested to see what their code does if users do this, so the results
were often bad.
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This is Aero under Windows 7 we are talking about! Under XP, you can use
any wallpaper you would like and what does the window care what
wallpaper you use? Under Windows 7, the top of the window turns to glass
and the wallpaper bleeds thru. Now you can't use any wallpaper, but a
wallpaper that is compatible with the window. And this is somehow
better? Not in my reality it isn't!
 
I use Windows XP because I can't afford Windows 7.

I'll upgrade when I can afford it and am forced to do it. I'm
61 years old with brain wave problems and new stuff can be difficult.
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If Windows 7 was free? Would you use it? As Microsoft gave away the RC
version for a few months back in 2009 I believe it was. And it had cost
nothing as in free.

I bought a bunch of pre-ordered Windows 7 versions about 6 months before
the release. Boy am I ever sorry I did that. Now I have a bunch of
Windows 7 boxes still sealed up on the shelf. Maybe they will make some
nifty drink coasters someday.
 
Windows 7 is designed for idiots!
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If you say so, but us non-idiots don't seem to be having many problems
with it. As someone said recently, MS rearranged the deck chairs a
bit, but it's still basically the same ship.
And Aero? I am using an almost black wallpaper and the text on the glass
is also black (which is default I guess). And I can barely read a thing.
So what is wrong with the odd way of doing things? As none of this
nonsense happened before.
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I've seen a lot of strange color combinations before, but black on
black? That can't be good. Do you need help changing it?
 
I bought a bunch of pre-ordered Windows 7 versions about 6 months before
the release. Boy am I ever sorry I did that. Now I have a bunch of
Windows 7 boxes still sealed up on the shelf. Maybe they will make some
nifty drink coasters someday.
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Put'em on Ebay.
 
The bigger size might be "legitimate" or acceptable if someone really NEEDED
the extra stufff that was added. But who really does? Adding USB made
sense. Eliminating the 64k heap resource problem made sense. Ditto on long
file names. But building in a Media Center, or adding more hand holding and
cosmetics like Aero, or whatever, sure doesn't (to me).. :-)
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Need is a strong word and probably doesn't apply, but I'm sure plenty
of people use Windows features that weren't available in previous
versions. Maybe you don't, but many of us do.
 
If you say so, but us non-idiots don't seem to be having many problems
with it. As someone said recently, MS rearranged the deck chairs a
bit, but it's still basically the same ship.
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Is that so non-idiot? IMHO only an idiot would say they don't have a
problem. As all you have to do is to peek in the alt.windows7.general
newsgroup to know that isn't true. Okay non-idiot tell me how I can run
Thunderbird Portable in the Program Files folder?
I've seen a lot of strange color combinations before, but black on
black? That can't be good. Do you need help changing it?
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No, just help deleting Windows 7. Maybe you like having Microsoft
holding your hand while using Windows 7. But I consider it an insult.
And I bet most of those bozos were not even born when I started to use
computers. :-(
 
Is that so non-idiot? IMHO only an idiot would say they don't have a
problem. As all you have to do is to peek in the alt.windows7.general
newsgroup to know that isn't true. Okay non-idiot tell me how I can run
Thunderbird Portable in the Program Files folder?
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Silly goose, why would you want to run a portable app from the program
Files folder? Do you have a serious question?
No, just help deleting Windows 7. Maybe you like having Microsoft
holding your hand while using Windows 7. But I consider it an insult.
And I bet most of those bozos were not even born when I started to use
computers. :-(
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No one holds my hand. If you have someone holding your hand, well
that's a problem I can't help with. It sounds personal.
 
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