M
MyndPhlyp
Grumble said:
In your opinion.
In your opinion.
G
Grumble
MyndPhlyp said:
Yes. In my humble opinion, based on the facts presented in the press
and in the article the link to which you inappropriately snipped.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald's_coffee_case
R
Robert Redelmeier
In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips MyndPhlyp said:
Very nice, but I wouldn't consider debridement to be required
for "minor burns". Especially not on the vulva (ouch!)
IMHO, Wikipedia is a bit more authoratative:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald's_coffee_case
It _is_ an interesting question of responsibility:
1) coffee is customarily served at 150-160'F
2) McD coffee was deliberately served at 180-190'F
(presumably for competitive advantage -- staying warm longer
or to use cheaper coffee beans)
3) who is to blame for the resulting burns?
The same question of responsibility arises in lots of cases,
tire blowouts, vehicles catching fire, ...
Maybe people in the computer field accept strict "caveat emptor"
because the major software supplier(s) produce buggy products.
-- Robert
M
MyndPhlyp
Robert Redelmeier said:
This is getting way off the path, but one just can't flog a dead horse
enough. <g>
Maybe I am old school. Obviously I firmly believe we are responsible for our
own acts and decisions (or lack thereof). It is something I was taught at a
very early age by my Depression Era parents and has little to do with being
in the computer field.
Just for grins I pulled out a manual that came with a water heater I
recently installed. (Just look at all those warning statements on the
BernzOmatic propane tank. Who would have thought it contained flammable
gas?) There's a handy chart showing the time it takes to produce a serious
burn for various temperatures (in Fahrenheit):
120F => More than 5 minutes
125F => 1-1/2 to 2 minutes
130F => About 30 seconds
135F => About 10 seconds
140F => Less than 5 seconds
145F => Less than 3 seconds
150F => About 1-1/2 seconds
155F => About 1 second
Given that knowledge and that coffee is generally served at > 150F, would I
expect to /*not*/ be burned if I dumped a coffee in my lap?
Caveat emptor has been around for a very long time. A consumer of any
product or service is an idiot for failing to use at least a modicum of
common sense. To seek compensation for one's stupidity or ignorance is a
redundant act.
(Wouldn't you know it -- I was just doing some repairs around the house and
whacked my thumb with the hammer. There's no warning label. Time to leaf
through the Yellow Pages in search of a liar ... er, lawyer ... to go after
Craftsman.)
M
MyndPhlyp
Lee Waun said:
Yeppers. Somehow your post escaped me. Now that I've found it, you can
expect a summons delivery soon. I'm going to sue you for defamation of
character. <g>
W
Wes Newell
BS, Any coffee drinker knows that the water is boiling when brewed. I'd
assume it to be freshly brewed at 212F, and as such a potential danger if
spilled on someone. She shouldn't have gotten crap. And yes I read the
link even though you didn't post it right. it wasn't M's fault she was a
79 year old idiot. And I guess that the driver was an idiot too for not
warning her it was hot. After all, he's the one that took the coffee from
the drivein window, not her. It also wasn't M's fault that she decided to
stick it between her legs. You can argue this crap all you want, but those
are the facts. Shouldn't have respned to this off topic crap, but idiots
just make me sick.
M
MyndPhlyp
Wes Newell said:
ROFLMAO! It's like walking by a sign that says "Wet Paint".
L
Lee Waun
AMD sucks. Intel rules. Now you have more grounds to sue.MyndPhlyp said:
M
MyndPhlyp
Lee Waun said:AMD sucks. Intel rules. Now you have more grounds to sue.
Uh ... nope. I don't shill for AMD. But seeing as how you are so fond of
them <g>, I called off the liar.
L
Lee Waun
MyndPhlyp said:
I am not fond of AMD. I am a long time Intel user and read these newsgroups
everyday and despite all the pro AMD info circulated around these newsgroups
I will not change machines. Something about a old dog and tricks or
something like that. I also killfiled JK a long time ago.
R
Robert Redelmeier
In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips MyndPhlyp said:
I bet this manual was published after McD coffee!
Running hot water is different from spilled coffee.
The spilled coffee cools very quickly, running hot
water replaces itself.
Look, there is no big issue if _everyone_ had coffee as hot
as McD. America generally serves hotter coffee than Europe.
Worse beans. Everyone would expect it to be scalding hot
and take approporiate precautions. It is more that McD had
a sizeable hidden increased hazard.
Of course. The debate is on how large that modicum
should be. Or more specifically, how gracefully products
should fail when misused.
Did the hammerhead fly off? Was it coated with some toxin?
Did sharp spikes spring from the head into your thumb?
If the coffee had been normally hot, McD wouldn't have lost.
-- Robert
R
Robert Redelmeier
In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips Wes Newell said:
I wouldn't want to drink any of your coffee!
http://www.coffeeresearch.org/coffee/brewing.htm
The water might _start_ out boiling, but the beans,
apparatus and contact with air cool it quite a bit.
-- Robert
D
David Schwartz
Grumble said:
Intelligent people can disagree over whether the lawsuit was frivolous
or not, but it was not *obviously* frivolous, so it's bad to use as an
example of a frivolous lawsuit. There are so many genuinely and obviously
frivolous lawsuits in which sums of money were awarded.
DS
W
Wes Newell
I don't drink coffee, but that doesn't mean I've never brewed it or seen
it brewed. And if I know it's hot as hell, she sure as hell should have.
She was just plain stupid and didn't deserve a dime.
So that's why there's a burner underneath the coffeepot, to cool it off.
Christ man, you're making a fool of yourself. I said it was freshly brewed
at 212F, not served at 212F. Freshly served, I'd expect what she got
,180-190F.
W
Wes Newell
And to follow that up, her lawyer should have had to pay all court cost
and M's attorneys fees.
Give me a break.
Y
Yousuf Khan
Lee said:
Killfiling JK is no proof that you're pro-Intel or anti-AMD.
Yousuf Khan
R
Robert Redelmeier
In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips Wes Newell said:
Nope. The thermostat on the keep-warm burner is around
155'F. McDonalds had to threaten Bunn (the mfr) to get
special-order coffee makers with thermostats at 185'F.
Bunn warned McD of the hazards.
There are frivolous lawsuits. This ain't one.
-- Robert
W
Wes Newell
I don't give a shit if it was 210F, she wouldn't have gotten a dime from
me and I would have found her attorney guilty of a friivilous lawsuit.
It's a matter of opinion. In mine it is. You must be an attorney.
L
Lee Waun
Yousuf Khan said:Killfiling JK is no proof that you're pro-Intel or anti-AMD.
Yousuf Khan
Yah but it sure makes the group easier to read.
I hope Intel catches up to AMD tech wise but even if they don't I won't buy
AMD just to piss JK off.