Advice Please; How to "Quarantine" Hard Drives

[Darren Harris]

I did not claim to 'decide' what 'idea' is, or is not, a workable solution

"for you." What I said was it's clear you're not seeking one because you go
out of your way to NOT explain what you're trying to accomplish and,
instead, insist that your 'solution' is not only the 'right way' but the
'only way' of accomplishing whatever the hell the 'job' is and that 'the
industry' is stupid, or conspiratorial, for not providing the 'solution'
you've dreamed up.

I've explained myself clearly(multiple times for you). And I've come
to the conclusion(without any help from you) that what I want to do is
not possible because hardware/sofware manufacturers don't have it
implemented.

The fact of the matter is, based on what meager hints you've provided as to
the nature of the supposed 'problem', your 'solution' does not solve it and
'the industry' does not provide such a thing, except for perhaps
specialized applications unrelated to your situation, because there are
superior solutions already available.

Incorrect. There are no superior solutions. My goal was stated. The
reasons for my goal were stated. The solutions were given. Those
soultions don't work for me. The reasons they don't work for me were
given. The end.

But you have shown to not be interested in hearing the flaws in it,
alternate solutions, or anything else; instead insisting the only issue is
"can it [your idea] be done," which is why I say you are apparently not
really interested in a 'solution' to 'the problem'.

Wrong. I'm not interested in *your* solution.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[Darren Harris]

That isn't what I said. Can you tell me what era PCs had a switch on

Wiring this on machines which contained drives with a write-protect jumper
was trivial. Two pieces of wire and and a switch.

Once again. Since it was implemented already, can you tell me what era
PCs had a switch on the outside of the case that allowed one to turn
off/on writes to any of it's hard drives?

Yes, America did. The physics had been worked out--it was reduced to an
engineering problem.

Incorrect. It would be a simple matter for me to tailor my basic game
playing techniques to allow me to score 3.3 million points on Pac-man,
but since I haven't done it I cannot claim that I can with any
credibilty.

Well, actually, no, it didn't. It was a matter of designing and building
the spacecraft.

Wrong. "designing and building" a spacecraft has always entailed
unforseen problems and issues that the engineers had to come up with
solutions for.

Well, at least far enough to demonstrate that you actually understand the
issues involved.

Um, Didn't you say "Wiring this on machines which contained drives
with a write-protect jumper was trivial."?

Look, if it's so all-fired important to you to have this capability, go
through the Seagate site, find the drives that had write-protect jumpers,
buy however many you need off of ebay, and install them with switches
outside the case wired to the headers. Or are you too stupid to figure out
how to solder two wires to a couple of pins and a switch?

Hey moron. This doesn't involve my PC building project. All I did was
post an idea I had, and think that manufacurers should implement. That
was no excuse for you to attack me(again). If you disagree with it
then that is your perogative. But you need to correct your personal
problems before posting.

How does what you propose constitute "an easier and cheaper way to fight
viruses and hackers"?

?!? Where were you when write-protecting was discussed?

If it was the smallest and cheapest vehicle available, then I wouldn't have
much choice, now, would I.

That's the whole point. Everyone would be asking for smaller and
cheaper vehicles.

I had an idea like you did. I stated it. That's all.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[J. Clarke]

Once again. Since it was implemented already, can you tell me what era
PCs had a switch on the outside of the case that allowed one to turn
off/on writes to any of it's hard drives?

About ten years back. If you wanted a switch on the outside you installed
it yourself.

Incorrect. It would be a simple matter for me to tailor my basic game
playing techniques to allow me to score 3.3 million points on Pac-man,
but since I haven't done it I cannot claim that I can with any
credibilty.

Fine, believe what you want to.

Wrong. "designing and building" a spacecraft has always entailed
unforseen problems and issues that the engineers had to come up with
solutions for.

The same is true for an airliner, a large ship, or a tall building. So I
guess by your standards we don't know how to build airliners, large ships,
or tall buildings.

Um, Didn't you say "Wiring this on machines which contained drives
with a write-protect jumper was trivial."?

So what do you believe is the mechanism by which the write-protect jumper
prevents writes?

Knowing how to put the key in the ignition doesn't mean that you know how a
car operates.

Hey moron. This doesn't involve my PC building project. All I did was
post an idea I had, and think that manufacurers should implement. That
was no excuse for you to attack me(again). If you disagree with it
then that is your perogative. But you need to correct your personal
problems before posting.

I asked you a question. That was not an attack, that was an attempt to
determine whether any solution more complex than opening a cardboard box
and pulling out the contents was within your capabilities.

?!? Where were you when write-protecting was discussed?

Right here and I saw no convincing case made that it was either easier or
cheaper than the alternatives.

That's the whole point. Everyone would be asking for smaller and
cheaper vehicles.

And suppose everybody drives greyhound buses in preference to cars. Should
the car manufacturers continue to produce cars that nobody wants?

I had an idea like you did. I stated it. That's all.

I'm sorry, but I do not recall introducing any "ideas" to this thread, only
techniques that will address the issues you raise. Since in point of fact
you don't seem to actually _want_ to protect your system and were instead
just trolling, that point is moot.

 

[David Maynard]

I've explained myself clearly(multiple times for you). And I've come
to the conclusion(without any help from you) that what I want to do is
not possible because hardware/sofware manufacturers don't have it
implemented.




Incorrect. There are no superior solutions. My goal was stated. The
reasons for my goal were stated. The solutions were given. Those
soultions don't work for me. The reasons they don't work for me were
given. The end.

Your stated 'question' was whether you could 'quarantine' drives by a
hardware 'write protect' switch. That's not a goal; it's an already
proposed solution to 'whatever' the goal was. One you still keep as close
to the vest as possible; leaking out hints of what you intended to do with
it only when it suits your need to attack.

But you have shown to not be interested in hearing the flaws in it,
alternate solutions, or anything else; instead insisting the only issue is
"can it [your idea] be done," which is why I say you are apparently not
really interested in a 'solution' to 'the problem'.

Wrong. I'm not interested in *your* solution.

I didn't give 'a' solution. I, and others, provided an entire panoply of
possible approaches yet, even after you admit to arriving at the conclusion
your 'solution' is "not possible," you still, not just reject but, ridicule
any alternatives. If your idea of seeking a solution is to reject
everything except an "impossible" one then I see where our difference of
opinion lies.

But, hey, have fun deleting and copying your O.S. all over the place. It's
no skin off my nose.

 

[David Maynard]

Darren Harris wrote:

You sir are the biggest idiot I've ever come across on the newsgroups.

If, when this started, I had known you were such an ignorant ass so intent
on remaining an ignorant ass I wouldn't have tried to help. So I leave you
now with the impossible solution of your own design that you so richly deserve.

Have a nice day.

 

[Darren Harris]

Once again. Since it was implemented already, can you tell me what era

About ten years back. If you wanted a switch on the outside you installed
it yourself.

Well my searches have found nothing to that effect.

The same is true for an airliner, a large ship, or a tall building. So I
guess by your standards we don't know how to build airliners, large ships,
or tall buildings.

As usual you are incorrect. Many airliners, many large ships, and many
tall buildings have been built, which makes them bad examples when you
are comparing them to things that had not been done before at the
dates you menioned.(ie: atomic bomb(1940), and trip to the moon(1960).

So what do you believe is the mechanism by which the write-protect jumper
prevents writes?

What difference does it make? You said wiring the jumpers to a switch
was trivial. The bottom line is that if it can easily be done, then
what I said can easily be done.

Knowing how to put the key in the ignition doesn't mean that you know how a
car operates.

I fail to see what that has to do with anything.

I asked you a question. That was not an attack, that was an attempt to
determine whether any solution more complex than opening a cardboard box
and pulling out the contents was within your capabilities.

And I guess using the word stupid helps you do that.

Right here and I saw no convincing case made that it was either easier or
cheaper than the alternatives.

What's new? You also gave no reasons why the alternatives you gave are
easier or cheaper than my idea.

And suppose everybody drives greyhound buses in preference to cars. Should
the car manufacturers continue to produce cars that nobody wants?

Another bad example, because everyone will never drive greyhound buses
in preference to cars.

I'm sorry, but I do not recall introducing any "ideas" to this thread, only
techniques that will address the issues you raise. Since in point of fact
you don't seem to actually _want_ to protect your system and were instead
just trolling, that point is moot.

Wrong again. The following was your first idea...
"_Safest_ bet is to put the files you want to protect on a server that
has no
Internet access and then use the security features of the OS on that
server
to prevent writing."

And you need to learn what "facts" are. My intent not to use your idea
doesn't mean I don't want to protect my system.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[J. Clarke]

Well my searches have found nothing to that effect.

So what? Contrary to popular belief there is much knowledge that is not on
or accessible from the Internet, and even when it is there constructing
searches that actually find it can be problematical.

As usual you are incorrect. Many airliners, many large ships, and many
tall buildings have been built, which makes them bad examples when you
are comparing them to things that had not been done before at the
dates you menioned.(ie: atomic bomb(1940), and trip to the moon(1960).

Believe what you want to. Every new one presents challenges.

Put it this way, if the United States wanted to build a faster-than-light
starship, could the US do it? Until you know how to do something you can't
plan a path to get from here to there.

What difference does it make? You said wiring the jumpers to a switch
was trivial. The bottom line is that if it can easily be done, then
what I said can easily be done.

Fine. It can "easily be done". So put a write protect header on a new
drive and then hook a switch to it since you're sure it's so easy.

I fail to see what that has to do with anything.
Figures.


And I guess using the word stupid helps you do that.

I asked you a question concerning your intelligence. You had the choice of
answering it "yes, I'm too stupid to do that" or "no, I'm smart enough to
do that". There's an old saying, "if the shoe fits, wear it". From your
general attitude one can guess how you answered the question to yourself.

What's new? You also gave no reasons why the alternatives you gave are
easier or cheaper than my idea.

So there was no convincing case made that any of the alternatives was easier
or cheaper. So what?

This is USENET. You claim that some technique is "easier or cheaper" then
it's up to you to prove it. Don't like it, find a venue that is more
tolerant of fuzzy reasoning.

Another bad example, because everyone will never drive greyhound buses
in preference to cars.

It wasn't an "example", it was a "hypothetical".

Wrong again. The following was your first idea...
"_Safest_ bet is to put the files you want to protect on a server that
has no
Internet access and then use the security features of the OS on that
server
to prevent writing."

That's not an "idea", it's a proven technique that works well and reliably
in millions of installations around the world.

And you need to learn what "facts" are. My intent not to use your idea
doesn't mean I don't want to protect my system.

I'm sorry, but _my_ idea? You're the one who said that he wanted drives
that could be write protected by flipping a switch on the outside of the
case. I told you how to implement that. If you don't want to implement
_your_ idea when told how to do so then why are you wasting everyone's time
with this?

 

[Darren Harris]

Darren Harris wrote:




If, when this started, I had known you were such an ignorant ass so intent
on remaining an ignorant ass I wouldn't have tried to help. So I leave you
now with the impossible solution of your own design that you so richly deserve.

Have a nice day.

You are/were incapable of helping me anyway. All you have done is
waste bandwidth in your attempt to have the last word. And you've been
wrong every time. Now be a jackass with someone else.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[Darren Harris]

Incorrect. There are no superior solutions. My goal was stated. The

Your stated 'question' was whether you could 'quarantine' drives by a
hardware 'write protect' switch. That's not a goal; it's an already
proposed solution to 'whatever' the goal was. One you still keep as close
to the vest as possible; leaking out hints of what you intended to do with
it only when it suits your need to attack.

A) The original question did *not* involve whether or not I could
quarantine drives by a hardware write protect switch. Write-protect
was proposed and discussed later.
B) I never said that write protect was a goal.
c) There were no hints to lead. I've spent most of this thread
responding to your attacks and stupidity.

But you have shown to not be interested in hearing the flaws in it,
alternate solutions, or anything else; instead insisting the only issue is
"can it [your idea] be done," which is why I say you are apparently not
really interested in a 'solution' to 'the problem'.

Wrong. I'm not interested in *your* solution.

I didn't give 'a' solution. I, and others, provided an entire panoply of
possible approaches yet, even after you admit to arriving at the conclusion
your 'solution' is "not possible," you still, not just reject but, ridicule
any alternatives. If your idea of seeking a solution is to reject
everything except an "impossible" one then I see where our difference of
opinion lies.

A)Yes you did give (impractical)solutions. You can call them
approaches all you want.
B) I didn't arrive at the conclusion that my "solution" was "not
possible".
c) I did not "ridicule any alternatives".
D) And our difference in opinion is a moot point. You've failed to
understand my questions. So there was no way you could provide a
reasonable answer.

But, hey, have fun deleting and copying your O.S. all over the place. It's
no skin off my nose.

You certainly don't act like it.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[Darren Harris]

Well my searches have found nothing to that effect.

So what? Contrary to popular belief there is much knowledge that is not on
or accessible from the Internet, and even when it is there constructing
searches that actually find it can be problematical.

In that case. I won't believe it until I see it.

Believe what you want to. Every new one presents challenges.

Put it this way, if the United States wanted to build a faster-than-light
starship, could the US do it? Until you know how to do something you can't
plan a path to get from here to there.

I have no idea what your point is. And the laws of physics don't allow
for travel faster than light.

Fine. It can "easily be done". So put a write protect header on a new
drive and then hook a switch to it since you're sure it's so easy.

You said that was easy. My idea involves what the manufacturers can
do.

Figures.

Yes it does.

I asked you a question concerning your intelligence. You had the choice of
answering it "yes, I'm too stupid to do that" or "no, I'm smart enough to
do that". There's an old saying, "if the shoe fits, wear it". From your
general attitude one can guess how you answered the question to yourself.

I'd rather respond to insults with insults.

So there was no convincing case made that any of the alternatives was easier
or cheaper. So what?

So what?

This is USENET. You claim that some technique is "easier or cheaper" then
it's up to you to prove it. Don't like it, find a venue that is more
tolerant of fuzzy reasoning.

You haven't proven anything. I'm still wating for what you said was
done already.

It wasn't an "example", it was a "hypothetical".

What difference does that make? It was a hypothetical example and it
was a bad one.

That's not an "idea", it's a proven technique that works well and reliably
in millions of installations around the world.

It is still an idea...

I'm sorry, but _my_ idea? You're the one who said that he wanted drives
that could be write protected by flipping a switch on the outside of the
case. I told you how to implement that. If you don't want to implement
_your_ idea when told how to do so then why are you wasting everyone's time
with this?

It is you who are wasting everyone's time. I'm not the one who said
that connecting a switch to the drives jumpers was trivial. I believe
that there are software a firmware changes that have to be made
inorder to make this plausible. And I believe the manufacturers have
the ability to do it. You can disagree all you want.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[David Maynard]

A) The original question did *not* involve whether or not I could
quarantine drives by a hardware write protect switch. Write-protect
was proposed and discussed later.
B) I never said that write protect was a goal.
c) There were no hints to lead. I've spent most of this thread
responding to your attacks and stupidity.

Trying to find out what the hell you're talking about isn't an 'attack' nor
is pointing out flaws in your proposed hardware write protect methodology.
What constitutes an 'attack' is your perpetual hurling of insults simply
because people can't read your mind.

But, from now on, you can get your jollies banging your head against the
wall and hurling insults into the 'industry ethos' that doesn't make your
pet 'solution' for all I care because, as I said in the last one, I'm done
with you and simply closing out the remaining threads.

<snip>

 

[J. Clarke]

In that case. I won't believe it until I see it.
Fine.


I have no idea what your point is. And the laws of physics don't allow
for travel faster than light.

The laws that we _know_. See the point? In 1850 the laws of physics did
not allow nuclear weapons.

You said that was easy. My idea involves what the manufacturers can
do.

So try to figure out what manufacturers have to do to give you what you want
and maybe you'll understand why they don't bother.

Yes it does.


I'd rather respond to insults with insults.

It would help if you first learned to recognize an insult.

So what?


You haven't proven anything. I'm still wating for what you said was
done already.

Well, since you don't believe what people who have been there and done that
tell you, you're going to have a long wait.

What difference does that make? It was a hypothetical example and it
was a bad one.

Your opinion.

It is still an idea...

If you choose to call it that.

It is you who are wasting everyone's time. I'm not the one who said
that connecting a switch to the drives jumpers was trivial. I believe
that there are software a firmware changes that have to be made
inorder to make this plausible.

I see, you are illiterate. I said that putting a switch on a drive that had
a write-protect header was trivial. Since that fact is intuitively obvious
to the most casual observer it needs no proof. And I am surprised that in
the extensive research that you claim to have conducted you have not
encountered any of the many, many drives that were shipped with such a
header.

And I believe the manufacturers have
the ability to do it. You can disagree all you want.

Nobody has claimed that the manufacturers lack the ability. What has been
claimed is that they have no reason whatsoever to want to provide it.

Regardless, this is pointless--I don't know if your problem is illiteracy,
idiocy, or a bad attitude but I'm not wasting any more time on you.

<plonk>

 

[Darren Harris]

Trying to find out what the hell you're talking about isn't an 'attack' nor
is pointing out flaws in your proposed hardware write protect methodology.
What constitutes an 'attack' is your perpetual hurling of insults simply
because people can't read your mind.

It's your perpetual lies and false assumptions that are the issue.
Anyone can see that you are just trolling and willnot stop. And you
comments about my reading comprehension, alleged inability to read or
type with any clarity, and inference that I am nutty because I want to
keep copies of my O.S. on all four of my drives that have prompted the
insults back.

But, from now on, you can get your jollies banging your head against the
wall and hurling insults into the 'industry ethos' that doesn't make your
pet 'solution' for all I care because, as I said in the last one, I'm done
with you and simply closing out the remaining threads.

I serious doubt it. You will continue to casue problems. That is why I
said we will be at this for the next 50 years.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

 

[Darren Harris]

I have no idea what your point is. And the laws of physics don't allow

The laws that we _know_. See the point? In 1850 the laws of physics did
not allow nuclear weapons.

In 1850 the laws of physics did very little to address this issue at
all. So this is all academic. And once they did, it was determined
that acheiving speeds faster than light is not possible. See the
point?

So try to figure out what manufacturers have to do to give you what you want
and maybe you'll understand why they don't bother.

I understand, and I've covered this already.

It would help if you first learned to recognize an insult.

I have and did.

Well, since you don't believe what people who have been there and done that
tell you, you're going to have a long wait.

When "people who have been there and done that" show up my wait will
have ended.

Your opinion.

That is correct.

If you choose to call it that.

I do, and have.

I see, you are illiterate. I said that putting a switch on a drive that had
a write-protect header was trivial. Since that fact is intuitively obvious
to the most casual observer it needs no proof. And I am surprised that in
the extensive research that you claim to have conducted you have not
encountered any of the many, many drives that were shipped with such a
header.

A moron calling me illiterate? I never said that proof was need that
it is possible to put a switch on a drive that had a write-protect
header. I was referring to proff that there were PCs for sale with
switches on the outside of their cases that would allow one to turn
on/off writing to individual drives.

Also, I never said that after "extensive research that (I) have
conducted (I) have not encountered any of the many, many drives that
were shipped with such a header."

Nobody has claimed that the manufacturers lack the ability. What has been
claimed is that they have no reason whatsoever to want to provide it.

You need to re-read these posts.

Regardless, this is pointless--I don't know if your problem is illiteracy,
idiocy, or a bad attitude but I'm not wasting any more time on you.

Good riddance.

Darren Harris
Staten ISland, New York.