J
JC Dill
Hecate said:
Why does the Espon 2200 use colored inks to produce muddy "B/W" prints?
O
Owamanga
O
Owamanga
...add another one: Cataracts?
R
rafeb
JC said:
It's like this. The printer has (let's say)
64 nozzles for each color. In the case of the
2200, there are six colors, so there are six
sets of 64 nozzles, one set per color.
The best image happens when all (6 * 64) nozzles
are contributing to the image, and that will be
the case when printing a true RGB image.
When you force the printer to print with black
only, you've now constricted the printer to use
1/6 the available ink nozzles.
In most cases, that produces an image with a
much coarser dither pattern than the printer
is capable of. But it will be neutral, since
only the Black ink is used.
Now... if instead you want to use all (6* 64)
nozzles, you introduce the possibility of a
non-neutral BW print, since you're trying to
get "pure" grays and blacks from wide-gamut
color inks.
In order for that to work, the contributions
of the five color primaries (CMY,lc,lm) have
to be perfectly balanced, all up and down the
tonal scale -- and that's where a good printer
profile comes in.
There are some RIPs that work around this, in
varying ways, though I really don't know how.
I've heard people say that the ImagePrint RIP
delivers perfectly neutral BW prints with the
standard Ultrachrome inks, but I haven't seen
it myself.
The best method for producing really neutral
BW prints (and using all nozzles) is with a
BW ink set, eg., the Piezo inkset from Cone
or the MIS inkset, along with a suitable RIP.
(Eg., Harrington's Quadtone RIP.) Of course,
this pretty much means "dedicating" a printer
to BW work, as it's really impractical to
switch inks on any inkjet printer.
rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com
P
Pete
Having read this thread, my question is:
What is the best online resource for explaining in plain English how to do
color profiling for an Epson printer? Without buying special hardware.
What is the best online resource for explaining in plain English how to do
color profiling for an Epson printer? Without buying special hardware.
W
Wolf Kirchmeir
Pete said:
The following is based on many hours of googling, reading printer
manuals, and printing test prints.
Google on "color calibration monitor". It's the monitor that's the
problem, not the printer. If it doesn't print what you see on the
monitor, that's the monitor's fault, not the printer's. Printers come
factory calibrated to produce certain colour tones with certain colour
profiles, which are included in the printer driver software. There are
also sources for other colour profiles. Be warned: the few I've found
are all for professionals, and cost loadsadough.
I haven't found any way of calibrating a monitor accurately that doesn't
use special hardware. The reason is that the hardware is reliable, but
your eyes aren't. If you're serious about high quality, repeatable
colour printing, you will need special hardware to calibrate the
monitor, and expensive software, too. There is no easy or cheap way to
get professional results. The few artists I've spoken with who print
their own work all told me that it took them a while to figure out how
to print their artworks (with archival ink on archival paper, etc.). But
most artists use professional printers to reproduce their work. Less
hassle, and more reliable in the long run. (BTW, most of them prefer
colour laser output - much more resistant to fading etc than inkjet.
Some use dye-sublimation, which gives stunning colours, but is very
expensive.)
For reasonably good calibration, google "colour chart" or "color
calibration chart". You will find a few that are free. Use them to set
your monitor to something that looks right, then print them, and
compare. You will find differences, so you can either set your monitor
to look more like the printout, or fiddle with the colour profiles in
your printer software. It's best to set your monitor. When satisfied,
print a sample page, and write settings data etc on it. Repeat for
different papers and different software. This is tedious, as you will
find that different papers and different applications will give
different results.
Don't use a photograph - your impression of its colours will be coloured
(pun intended) by your atttudes to the subject.
That's just for colour. If you're concerned with resolution and
photo-like colour gradation, try printing the same images at different
sizes. My Canon i960 offers pixel, resolution, and fit to page; that
seems to be pretty well standard. Printing the same image in all three
modes, and in different fit-to-paper sizes is an eye opener. One thing
it taught me is to use the highest optical resolution that your camera
(and scanner) offers. Setting the camera to take small pictures so that
you can get more on the card is false economy IMO.
Once you have found papers that work well with your printer, that is,
meet your standards for quality, stick with them. Do not shop for price
- cheaper papers generally use bases to buffer or neutralise the acids
in them, which will cause unpredictable colour shifts when you print. In
particular, avoid house brands. The big box stores buy paper in batches
from whoever supplies it at the lowest price, so there is no guarantee
of consistency.
If you want the best possible printing, take a disk or CDs with your
images on them to a professional printer, and pay accordingly. But shop
around - quality varies, as does price.
Good luck!
H
Hecate
If you've read all the posts above you should do now.
J
Jim
You can't profile any printer, any paper, or any monitor without the specialPete said:
hardware that Colorvision or Monaco sell.
Jim
R
rafe bustin
Nah, not exactly. There are lots of other choices,
both at the high end and low end.
High end might include Gretag's Eye-One Photo or
Eye-One Publish systems. The "photo" system costs
about $1300.
Gretag also sells an inexpensive ($200) package
(Eye-One Monitor) that profiles monitors only.
At the low end, you use a flatbed scanner and an
IT8-target for printer profiling. It's somewhat
hit-and-miss, depending on the paper, the ink, and
your skill. Among these systems, I'd mostly
recommend Profile Prism, from ddisoftware.com.
About $75, and you have to provide the (flatbed) scanner.
rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com
P
paul
Pete said:
http://www.computer-darkroom.com/ps8-colour/ps8_1.htm
http://www.computer-darkroom.com/ps7_print/ps7_print_mac.htm
Make sure you use Epson paper or find/buy a profile for the paper you want.
A
Arthur Entlich
This posting just goes to prove you are never going to please everyone.
Overall, the use of the color inks to produce a monochrome print allows
for several features. One, you can easily tone or duo-tone an image.
Many people prefer to have a sepia or other tonal range in their
monochrome images, and secondly, the smoothness of the image can be
improved by providing much more dithered results than using just one or
two levels of black ink.
However, the result, in a perfect world would be almost completely
monochromic gray scale rather than showing color casts. Although not
perfect. Epson's drivers, in general allow for fairly neutral full color
ink images when produced from a monochrome source. If you are using 3rd
party inks that may explain the results being less than perfect.
Most Epson drivers allow for you to turn the driver on for monochromic
prints using just the black inks.
Art
Overall, the use of the color inks to produce a monochrome print allows
for several features. One, you can easily tone or duo-tone an image.
Many people prefer to have a sepia or other tonal range in their
monochrome images, and secondly, the smoothness of the image can be
improved by providing much more dithered results than using just one or
two levels of black ink.
However, the result, in a perfect world would be almost completely
monochromic gray scale rather than showing color casts. Although not
perfect. Epson's drivers, in general allow for fairly neutral full color
ink images when produced from a monochrome source. If you are using 3rd
party inks that may explain the results being less than perfect.
Most Epson drivers allow for you to turn the driver on for monochromic
prints using just the black inks.
Art
G
gbeb
It could also be a paper type issue. The 2200 needs to know the
correct paper in its settings or it lays down too much/too little ink.
I just got a new computer with the epson drivers. The new driver is
missing paper types which were on earlier releases. So, my first color
prints coming out are looking both too red and too muddy.
Did JC confirm that he is selecting the right paper type for his
printout. In OS X, this is found under the Print Setting option on one
of the printer dialog box's menus.
Gary
correct paper in its settings or it lays down too much/too little ink.
I just got a new computer with the epson drivers. The new driver is
missing paper types which were on earlier releases. So, my first color
prints coming out are looking both too red and too muddy.
Did JC confirm that he is selecting the right paper type for his
printout. In OS X, this is found under the Print Setting option on one
of the printer dialog box's menus.
Gary
C
CWatters
JC Dill said:
We've explained this already. The printer driver mixes colours to make extra
grey levels. The alternative would be for it to use just use the black and
grey carts and use a dot pattern a bit like a newspaper does - that reduces
resolution slightly compared to what can be achived by making extra greys
using the colours.
J
J. A. Mc.
Some printers (apparently not Epshun) also have a B&W cart with lighter
'blacks' to do justice to proper greyscale imagery.
'blacks' to do justice to proper greyscale imagery.
H
Hamish Reid
J. A. Mc. said:
The "Epshun" that's the subject of this thread has -- like all high-end
Epsons -- a light grey ink cart as well as the dark (black) cart.
Hamish
H
Hecate
Yes you can. You can profile it with the special hardware Gretag
MacBeth sell...
H
Hecate
The 2100/2200 does have a single light black (gray) cartridge. Of
course the perfect solution is to buy something like the Lyson inks or
the Permajet VTBlax. But you have to dedicate the printer to B&W if
you do that.
P
Pete
Great tips everyone. Mille gracia!
Pete
A
Arthur Entlich
You get two blacks with the 2200, a low colorant load black and a deep
black. (and two deep blacks, a glossy and matte version). If this isn't
enough, the printers can be accommodated with a 4 or 6 shade system of
black inks with 3rd party inks and drivers.
Art
black. (and two deep blacks, a glossy and matte version). If this isn't
enough, the printers can be accommodated with a 4 or 6 shade system of
black inks with 3rd party inks and drivers.
Art
V
Viktor Darnedde
I'm not going to explain everything in detail, but here are some hints:
It uses the colored inks to give you good resolution and with proper
profiles/color management or a suitable RIP color cast free B/W prints.
Printing with only black/light grey has to use heavy dithering to
produce a rich B/W tonal range.
The printer's light grey is pretty brownish, mixing pure black and pure
light grey gives a brown color cast. To compensate this the printer has
to use cyan and magenta!
I don't know what driver settings you used, but it doesn't help to feed
the printer with a grayscale image because the windows (you used it,
didn't you) printer driver internal stuff converts grayscale back to
RGB.
Make your life easy: Google for Harrington QuadToneRIP (QTR). It's
shareware, it's cheap, worth the money and gives you instant access to
color cast free B/W printing. With QTR you can control what color cast
your B/W prints should have (cool grey, neutral grey, sepia, etc.). I'm
really impressed what QTR offers.
I'm not sure if Windows' GDI (used by the printing subsystem) knows
about greyscale. Greyscale might be silently converted back to RGB but
with R=G=B, so ideally it should be color cast free greyscale. Hehe,
don't expect ideal things with Windows (couldn't resist...).
Printing good B/W is kind of an art. It's possible without additional
software but you have to know what to do. Your printer is nevertheless a
very good starting point (I have the european version (Epson Stylus
Photo 2100) which includes Grey Enhancer, a software Epson refuses to
add to the 2200).
Well: 42! Maybe you didn't ask the "proper" question? Maybe you didn't
google for yourself? A lot of web pages which deal with B/W printing
(mostly with Epson printers) do explain a lot of your questions. Learn
to search the internet!
That won't help you...
BTW, why did you buy an Epson 2200? Which inks do you use? Which paper
did you use for your B/W printing?
You don't give much information what you do. How can you expect other
people to help you???
\relax\bye % Viktor
