A
Arno Wagner
Read his OP, then you too may know what he wants...
They don't claim it does SMART over USB. I just verified
that it indeed cannot. It is really simple to check this
reliably.
Arno
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Read his OP, then you too may know what he wants...
They don't claim it does SMART over USB. I just verified
that it indeed cannot. It is really simple to check this
reliably.
Arno
A
ANTant
For short backups, it should be ok. For any longer activity, only
adequate cooling will work. Not that Seagates or Samsungs are quite
as sensitive to heat, but hot HDD are never good.
Hmm, I guess I know why this HDD has problem. I *DID* use it as a
regular drive. I didn't care how slow USB2 was. It was basically for
playing back music, videos, copy VMware images, etc.
I did notice this Maxtor USB HDD has one vent on the back. The case did
get hot after a few hours.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
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( )
A
ANTant
Backups involve having the drive very active for longish periods.
OR using the HDD for hours like listening to MP3 files, watching videos,
VMware images, etc. Basically, using it like a regular HDD.
That's what makes drives get hot, from what I can tell. I have a 3.5"
160gb Seagate 7200.x drive (not sure of exact model) in a generic usb2
enclosure with a tiny fan. It runs cool when idling or slightly
active even when I run it overnight. But doing a backup, it's quite
warm after 10 minutes or so, and the backup takes much longer than
that.
Yep. Mine gets hot after a few hours of activities.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
A
ANTant
Nope, they arent too bad when adequately cooled.
Yes, that appears to be the problem, the design of the
case means that the drives dont get adequately cooled.
Not sure what this is about, what 'custom HDDs' ?
Sorry I meant custom enclosures that you buy for HDDs. At home, I have
an external Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 (ST325082 3A; 250 GB HDD; 7200 RPM)
in a Kingwin HDD Enclosure (MS-350U-S) via USB (connected when needed).
I noticed this one has a few more vents more than Maxtor's enclosure.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
B
Budd
Read his OP, then you too may know what he wants...
Yes, and obviously you didn't or you would have known that he
doesn't want to do a SMART test. He wants to exercise the drive.
A S.M.A.R.T test hardly exercises the drive.
Right, and now we know you didn't.
They don't claim it does SMART over USB.
The "someone" did.
I just verified that it indeed cannot.
But you cannot and will not tell how.
It is really simple to check this reliably.
Sure, you just say so and hey presto: it's proof.
F
Folkert Rienstra
Rod Speed said:Corse it did/does. It takes a hell of a lot longer with a drive which
has marginal sectors than a conventional surface scan does.
Only if it finds something out of the ordinary, else it just trots along.
Bet it doesnt.
You dont know that it even uses that.
Corse I do:
"Is SpinRite compatible with USB and Firewire devices?
The best answer to this is a firm "maybe". DOS device drivers are available
for most USB and Firewire controllers. If such drivers are added to a DOS
boot diskette so that your USB or Firewire drive is "seen" by DOS, SpinRite
will also be able to "see" and operate with it. " source: Spinrite FAQ
It solely relies on the OS, being DOS and what that OS sees, being partitions.
Dos doesn't use drivers -ergo uses Int13- except when there is no Int13 support,
ergo drivers do add Int13 support.
Yes it does, most obviously with access to the SMART data.
It exercises the SMART data? Wow, great. Big improvement.
A
Arno Wagner
Hmm, I guess I know why this HDD has problem. I *DID* use it as a
regular drive. I didn't care how slow USB2 was. It was basically for
playing back music, videos, copy VMware images, etc.
I did notice this Maxtor USB HDD has one vent on the back. The case did
get hot after a few hours.
There is your problem...
Arno
A
Arno Wagner
Yes, and obviously you didn't or you would have known that he
doesn't want to do a SMART test. He wants to exercise the drive.
A S.M.A.R.T test hardly exercises the drive.
Right, and now we know you didn't.
The "someone" did.
SEAGATE does not clkaim SMART capability for the USB-compatible
tests. They do know how this works and what they can and cannot
do.
But you cannot and will not tell how.
Just so to not give anybody the wrong idea about this "budd"
fellow, one approach is as follows: Run tests with USB
and then check with (S)ATA if there are additional self-test
result in the disk's log. Easy, really.
Arno
A
Arno Wagner
Previously (e-mail address removed) wrote:
[...]
Convection cooling is tricky. It usually does not work too well.
(Example for fluids: The technicians at Cernobyl wanted to find out
whether their reactor had adequate convewction cooling. The results
were a bit worse than expected...)
A fan, on the other hand, is a reliable way to get a defined
airflow. And airflow makes all the difference in cooling.
Arno
[...]
Sorry I meant custom enclosures that you buy for HDDs. At home, I have
an external Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 (ST325082 3A; 250 GB HDD; 7200 RPM)
in a Kingwin HDD Enclosure (MS-350U-S) via USB (connected when needed).
I noticed this one has a few more vents more than Maxtor's enclosure.
Convection cooling is tricky. It usually does not work too well.
(Example for fluids: The technicians at Cernobyl wanted to find out
whether their reactor had adequate convewction cooling. The results
were a bit worse than expected...)
A fan, on the other hand, is a reliable way to get a defined
airflow. And airflow makes all the difference in cooling.
Arno
R
Rod Speed
Only if it finds something out of the ordinary, else it just trots along.
Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
Corse I do:
Fraid not.
"Is SpinRite compatible with USB and Firewire devices?
The best answer to this is a firm "maybe". DOS device
drivers are available for most USB and Firewire controllers.
If such drivers are added to a DOS boot diskette so that
your USB or Firewire drive is "seen" by DOS, SpinRite will
also be able to "see" and operate with it. " source: Spinrite FAQ
That doesnt apply to the earlier versions.
It solely relies on the OS,
Wrong again.
being DOS and what that OS sees, being partitions.
Dos doesn't use drivers
Wrong again.
-ergo uses Int13- except when there is no
Int13 support, ergo drivers do add Int13 support.
You just claimed that dos doesnt use drivers. Cant have it both ways.
It exercises the SMART data?
ACCESSES aint EXCERCISES, you pathetic excuse for a bullshit artist.
Wow, great. Big improvement.
Leaves a simple scan for defective sectors for
dead, you pathetic excuse for a bullshit artist.
A
ANTant
A third; only power the drive up when doing a backup ?
Are there any external HDDs that don't get hot easily? Maybe I should
remove all my enclosures if I want to use them a lot, Heh.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
There is your problem...
Are there any external HDDs that don't get hot easily? Maybe I should
remove all my enclosures if I want to use them a lot, Heh.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
F
Folkert Rienstra
Rod Speed said:Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
Fraid not.
Who's Fraid, what's he got to do with this?
That doesnt apply to the earlier versions.
Corse it does.
Even someone as stupid as you can see that there is no version number included.
Wrong again.
Yes, you are, Roddles.
Wrong again.
Nope, it doesnt, except for devices with no bios support.
You can't run DOS from a device with no bios support because
it doesn't use drivers. If it was, you could. Dos drivers are just
BIOS extensions, except (there's that word again, Roddles) for
ASPI which is a different programming interface.
You just claimed that dos doesnt use drivers.
And it doesn't.
Cant have it both ways.
Hey Roddles, perhaps you should lookup the word "except", eh.
That's what it was invented for, to have it both ways.
ACCESSES aint EXCERCISES,
Yes, exactly my point Roddles, I'm so glad you see it my way.
you pathetic excuse for a bullshit artist.
Yes, you are, Roddles.
Leaves a simple scan for defective sectors for
dead, you pathetic excuse for a bullshit artist.
Yes, I can see now how that makes the drive tremble
and have an instant heart-attack.
R
Rod Speed
Are there any external HDDs that don't get hot easily?
Yes, there are a few.
Maybe I should remove all my enclosures if I want to use them a lot, Heh.
Some drives get surprisingly hot when run loose on the desktop, essentially
because they are designed to get rid of a lot of the heat by conduction to
the metal drive bay stack and that isnt there in that situation.
R
Rod Speed
Some ****wit rabid pseudo kraut claiming to be
Folkert Rienstra <[email protected]> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
Folkert Rienstra <[email protected]> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
F
Folkert Rienstra
Rod Speed said:Some ****wit rabid pseudo kraut claiming to be
Folkert Rienstra <[email protected]> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
Thanks Roddles, so nice of you, letting me win. Very much appreciated.
R
Rod Speed
Some ****wit rabid pseudo kraut claiming to be
Folkert Rienstra <[email protected]> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
Folkert Rienstra <[email protected]> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
A
ANTant
Yes, there are a few.
Which ones? Include enclosure types too.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
R
Rod Speed
(e-mail address removed) wrote
I havent bothered to keep track of them, just aware that some have
said that their fan cooled enclosure does work very well and keeps
the drive nice and cool. It aint rocket science, the problem appears
to be that far too many care more about appearance than keeping
the drive cool and dont bother with a decent fan etc.
Its harder to keep the drive cool without a fan, but it can be
done, particularly with the cooler running drives like Samsungs.
I also prefer the separate enclosure approach over the packaged
external drives, basically because none of the packaged drives
have more than a 1 year warranty and I prefer to retain the full
3 or 5 year warranty that the drive itself has. Its usually
cheaper to buy a decent external housing separately too.
Lot to be said for eSATA because that gives you the full speed
of an internal drive and the SMART stuff is trivial with those.
Not quite as convenient cabling wise, but thats not a big enough
consideration to matter IMO. And you can get some very decent
SATA port multipliers too so you can have multiple drives in a
decently fan cooled box and thats more mechanically convenient
too if you need more than one external drive.
I basically go the NAS route myself, gives even more flexibility.
Which ones?
I havent bothered to keep track of them, just aware that some have
said that their fan cooled enclosure does work very well and keeps
the drive nice and cool. It aint rocket science, the problem appears
to be that far too many care more about appearance than keeping
the drive cool and dont bother with a decent fan etc.
Its harder to keep the drive cool without a fan, but it can be
done, particularly with the cooler running drives like Samsungs.
I also prefer the separate enclosure approach over the packaged
external drives, basically because none of the packaged drives
have more than a 1 year warranty and I prefer to retain the full
3 or 5 year warranty that the drive itself has. Its usually
cheaper to buy a decent external housing separately too.
Include enclosure types too.
Lot to be said for eSATA because that gives you the full speed
of an internal drive and the SMART stuff is trivial with those.
Not quite as convenient cabling wise, but thats not a big enough
consideration to matter IMO. And you can get some very decent
SATA port multipliers too so you can have multiple drives in a
decently fan cooled box and thats more mechanically convenient
too if you need more than one external drive.
I basically go the NAS route myself, gives even more flexibility.
A
ANTant
Are there any external HDDs that don't get hot easily?
How about one little fan on the bottom of the enclosure case in the
back? It doesn't seem to blow a lot of air out if it is on a table due
to short height space between the table and case's fan vent.
Yeah, that is why I picked this Kingwin HDD Enclosure (MS-350U-S)
HDD enclosure
(http://www.kingwin.com/pdut_detail.asp?LineID=&CateID=27&ID=230 or
http://tinyurl.com/ym3nb8 ).
Ah nice.
Nah, that wouldn't happen. I just needed it to carry around and mainly
as a backup/archive place.
Heh. Probably too much for me.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
I havent bothered to keep track of them, just aware that some have
said that their fan cooled enclosure does work very well and keeps
the drive nice and cool. It aint rocket science, the problem appears
to be that far too many care more about appearance than keeping
the drive cool and dont bother with a decent fan etc.
Its harder to keep the drive cool without a fan, but it can be
done, particularly with the cooler running drives like Samsungs.
How about one little fan on the bottom of the enclosure case in the
back? It doesn't seem to blow a lot of air out if it is on a table due
to short height space between the table and case's fan vent.
I also prefer the separate enclosure approach over the packaged
external drives, basically because none of the packaged drives
have more than a 1 year warranty and I prefer to retain the full
3 or 5 year warranty that the drive itself has. Its usually
cheaper to buy a decent external housing separately too.
Yeah, that is why I picked this Kingwin HDD Enclosure (MS-350U-S)
HDD enclosure
(http://www.kingwin.com/pdut_detail.asp?LineID=&CateID=27&ID=230 or
http://tinyurl.com/ym3nb8 ).
Lot to be said for eSATA because that gives you the full speed
of an internal drive and the SMART stuff is trivial with those.
Ah nice.
Not quite as convenient cabling wise, but thats not a big enough
consideration to matter IMO. And you can get some very decent
SATA port multipliers too so you can have multiple drives in a
decently fan cooled box and thats more mechanically convenient
too if you need more than one external drive.
Nah, that wouldn't happen. I just needed it to carry around and mainly
as a backup/archive place.
I basically go the NAS route myself, gives even more flexibility.
Heh. Probably too much for me.
--
[Laser pulsing] "Bah. It's as easy as crushing an ant! You know, the..." [grunting] "Wh-wh-whoa! Hey, take my wallet and leave me alone!" --Mr. Burns from The Simpsons (Fraudcast News; FABF16/FABF18 episode)
/\___/\
/ /\ /\ \ Phillip (Ant) @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site)
| |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links (AQFL): http://aqfl.net
\ _ / Please remove ANT if replying by e-mail.
( )
A
Arno Wagner
How about one little fan on the bottom of the enclosure case in the
back? It doesn't seem to blow a lot of air out if it is on a table due
to short height space between the table and case's fan vent.
Difficult to say. A small fan may or may not be enough.
Yeah, that is why I picked this Kingwin HDD Enclosure (MS-350U-S)
HDD enclosure
(http://www.kingwin.com/pdut_detail.asp?LineID=&CateID=27&ID=230 or
http://tinyurl.com/ym3nb8 ).
Ah nice.
Indeed. And you also get temperature monitoring with the SMART.
Nah, that wouldn't happen. I just needed it to carry around and mainly
as a backup/archive place.
There are also USB/eSATA enclosures. Use eSATA at home and
USB when on the road.
Arno