Vista EULA - transfer once - good!

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I think retail sales are more important than you might think-
especially, at product launch. After a couple of years, then
the spread between OEM and retail becomes even larger
as users replace their computers. Let's say retail sales now
represent around 10% of the total WinXP licenses sold-
that is still a staggering figure when you consider worldwide
numbers.

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2001/nov01/11-08xpmomentum1pr.mspx
Windows XP Is Flying Off The Shelves!
New Operating System is Creating Early Holiday Excitement
REDMOND, Wash., Nov. 8, 2001 — Since its retail debut Oct. 25, Microsoft Corp.'s newest
operating system, Windows® XP, is achieving high demand worldwide. So high that some retailers
are having trouble keeping store shelves stocked with Windows XP. Growing consumer demand for
Windows XP has led to sales that are exceeding initial sales of Windows 95 and Windows
Millennium Edition (Windows Me) and keeping pace with initial sales of Windows 98.

"We are extremely pleased with the enthusiastic response from our customers," said Chris Jones,
vice president for Windows at Microsoft. "We see Windows XP as being a positive catalyst for a
great holiday season for the entire PC industry."

"In a survey of major retailers in large markets across the country, we have found that 62
percent have reported that Windows XP is selling as expected or better," said Alan Davis,
analyst at McAdams Wright Ragen Inc. "Overall, we are finding that retailers are optimistic
about sales of Windows XP and the prospects leading into the holiday season."

Along with retail sales of Windows XP, sales of new personal computers, peripherals and
devices, and software applications have been boosted by excitement around Windows XP. According
to NPD INTELECT, total retail software sales have climbed more than 50 percent in the week
following the launch of Windows XP.

http://www.microsoft.com/billgates/speeches/2001/11-11comdex.aspx

Closer to home, Microsoft just two weeks ago put out Windows XP. It was a very important launch
for us, as important as the initial launch of Windows or the launch of Windows 95 that brought
us into the 32-bit era.

With all the uncertainty, we weren’t sure what the sales would be like, what the OEM sales
would be like, what the retail sales would be like. Now, two weeks later, we have that data.
Our OEM sales are far beyond any new product we’ve ever had. Our retail sales are more than
double any version of Windows or, of course, any software product that’s ever been released.

-Bill Gates

http://pcworld.com/article/id,70344-page,1/article.html

In the three days following the official launch of Windows XP, U.S. retailers sold more than
300,000 copies of the new operating system, according to data from NPD Intelect, a sales
tracking firm for the consumer electronics industry that gathers sales estimates from major
retailers and mail-order companies.
 
Read this carefully:

<quote>

29th April 2005
The OEM business, where large PC makers negotiate for volume discounts, accounts for about 80%
of Windows sales, and Anderson said that in the third quarter the mix of OEM versus retail had
shifted towards OEM.

</quote>

Windows XP was launched on 25 October 2001- Over four years later

retail sales *still* make up about 20%. Yes, some of those sales are MCE.
 
Even if it is that high, and I doubt it, what % of the buyers do you think
will read the EULA. Even on this site there is but a small number who have
seemed to care passionately. I personally won't but Vista at least until I
build my next computer (probably 6 months) and then should be only changing
the mobo 1 time before the next os anyway. So, while not enthusiastic about
the change it isn't a big deal to me. Also, I won't be going for the
Ultimate version anyway. I don't have time for TV and have no use for
anything but Home Premium or Business.
 
Clint said:
While your suggestions 3 - 5 are reasonable ways to make MS know that you're
displeased (vote with your dollar, and educating others), suggestions 1 and
2 are counter-productive if you want to actually see some improvements. How
will they know that you (and others) are wanting changes if you don't tell
them? How will they know why people aren't buying Vista? It's like people
deciding not to vote because they don't like the way the government is
spending their money; you're basically giving up your right to tell them
what you want them to do.

IMHO, YMMV, etc

Clint
Click to expand...

And BTW: Should anyone want to comment on this issue directly to MS in a
way that they could reasonably expect their comment to be registered,
how should they go about it?
 
John said:
Even if it is that high, and I doubt it, what % of the buyers do you think
will read the EULA. Even on this site there is but a small number who have
seemed to care passionately. I personally won't but Vista at least until I
build my next computer (probably 6 months) and then should be only changing
the mobo 1 time before the next os anyway.
Click to expand...

What next OS? LOL! This one will put MS out of business.

Alias
 
Could be, but not based on losing the business of the 20-30 posters on this
site that are passionate about the issue. :-) 99% or more of the buyers
won't even glance thru the EULA let alone find the transfer clause.
 
They may be "relatively" small but we are still talking millions worldwide
as even Thurrott finally acknowledged. This is the group that supports
Microsoft in its beta testing and provides a significicant contribution to
innovation and development in IT It seems a great pity that Microsoft is
alienating this significant group.
Alan
 
John said:
Could be, but not based on losing the business of the 20-30 posters on this
site that are passionate about the issue. :-) 99% or more of the buyers
won't even glance thru the EULA let alone find the transfer clause.
Click to expand...

I've already talked 15 people of that 99% out of getting it.

Alias
 
I have to agree with John Barnes. If you ask the average XP user what a EULA
is you'll most likely get a blank stare. If you ask them if they are going
to transfer their OS to another computer the stare will continue. This is a
non issue for most people. For the vast majority this change will mean
nothing. For the minority who did use this transfer right in XP it is
probably a very big deal. I don't mean to trivialise this change for these
people. I'm just saying it's a very small minority who even know this right
existed and a smaller minority yet who actually took advantage of it.

This has nothing to do with the spin MS is putting on it. That is wrong.
This right clearly exists with XP and it is a change with Vista. To deny
this is FUD at it's worst.
 
Actually, going from motherboard "A" to "B" and back to "A" might well
still be seen as three systems, not two. In fact, currently, it is (I
went through that experience .... I was able to get reactivation by
explaining it, but as far as how MS PA sees it .... it's three systems,
not two).

But, that said, the statement that "Microsoft will not yield since it's
in the EULA" is not correct. Actually, Microsoft is pretty reasonable
and flexible. By no means are they sticking 100% to the strict letter
of the EULA, although they have the legal right to do so if they choose
to do so.

And that, really, is a big part of the issue: Not what they can do, but
what they actually do. Specifically, EULA not withstanding, if the PA
database for Vista contiues the XP policy of resetting completely after
4 months of inactivity, then much of the issue goes away, at least from
a practical perspective.
 
I agree. It will be interesting to see how the changes in activation points
affects me if they do not stay with the 120 day reset. My most common
change over the years has been to reinstall on a newer hard drive, which I
hear now has the greatest points assigned.
 
I tend to agree about the beta programs. While one might argume that
Microsoft doesn't get free bug discovery done .. perhaps it is time they pay
for it? They don't even so much as give people wo run the betas a coupon.
Heck, they are even charging now to download the betas.

Personally, I don't bug report. It dawned on me that the labourer's labour
is worth its wages, and since Microsoft doesn't so much even give a coupon,
it really really is not my problem if they are slowed down by a lack of
participation. Of all companies in this world, Microsoft can afford coupons
for beta / cpp participants.

So I agree, don't beta test. Use the betas maybe for your own advantage, but
don't bug report. Post maybe and point out why you don't report so Microsoft
knows why. But if they want reports, they should offer discount coupons.

If you continue bug reporting, you become an 'enabler' and Microsoft won't
change its ways.

I stopped reporting with Vista Beta 1. I realized - hey - I won't be getting
so much as a coupon for this and here I am spending hours for Microsoft
trying to figure any bugs .. forget about it .. find your own bugs
Microsoft.

And now look. Not only will you not be getting a coupon, you will have to
pay in full for Vista, have WGA N shoved down your throat and, if you want
to run it, submit to a much more restrictive EULA.

Free labour under these terms? Forget it.
 
Hmmmm - my first reaction is: if one knew that before downloading then
downloaded then why download?

I suppose there is a good and worthwhile PR perspective in community
releases but a technical release ity isn't (that sorta goes towards the
technicals as a priority).

So, as an interim conclusion: you have Vista in prerelease form - it
can't by limitation do what a full commercial variant do so why fret?
Have fun and enjoy?
 
Right. Download 'em, enjoy them, make a profit if you can. But free labour
for the richest company on earth when all's they do is slap more
restrictions on? No. They really should somehow arrange for a coupon if one
makes honest bug reports. It's labour, it's worht something better in the
end than a more restictive EULA and forced WGA N.

But as is? No way am I going to fill out a bug report. My "feedback" is the
product activation signal, should the software last that long on my machine.
 
There is nothing wrong with discussing this here.
But this is peer to peer and no Microsoft presence should be expected.
BUT, if you want Microsoft to here, this is not the right place.

If you do not care if Microsoft hear your message, post only here where it
is probable Microsoft will not get your message.
If you want Microsoft to get the message, also follow my suggestion to get
your message directly to Microsoft.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org
 
I never suggested I do not like the discussion or I do not like it here.
If you think I did, I suggest you read my post again.

This is not the place if you want Microsoft to get the message.
There is no requirement or expectation that Microsoft participate in these
newsgroups.

If it is desired that Microsoft get the message, there are more appropriate
places, and I posted that information.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org
 
"they are even charging now to download the betas"
Absolutely FALSE.
Where did you hear this myth?
Please post the source.

There is no cost from you to Microsoft to download, install or use the Beta.
 
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