Two Bad WD Drives..?

[ac892]

Again, thanks to all who have replied. Let me offer this last bit of
information regarding my problem to date. I'm at the point where I can
NOT perform these temperature test because the "clicking" problem is
preventing the machine from even booting off the HD.. I can't be sure
these drives are not both DEAD from a previous battle with heat, but
they certainly are not overheated NOW and are actually COLD to the
touch, still they are not even able to supply up the OS data required
to get this machine off the ground.

 

[Peter]

Again, thanks to all who have replied. Let me offer this last bit of

information regarding my problem to date. I'm at the point where I can
NOT perform these temperature test because the "clicking" problem is
preventing the machine from even booting off the HD.. I can't be sure
these drives are not both DEAD from a previous battle with heat, but
they certainly are not overheated NOW and are actually COLD to the
touch, still they are not even able to supply up the OS data required
to get this machine off the ground.

So the next step would be to move one of those drives to
another PC and hear if it clicks too.

 

[Bob]

In my PC I have 4 hard drives (1 Samsung, 2 WD, and 1 Maxtor)
sandwiched on the bottom of the case with 1/4" (1 cm) space between
the drives. However it is protected by a powerful 80 cfm fan that
pulls the air from the bottom front vent and blows across the 4 hard
drives. Round IDE cable helps with the airflow too. The drive rarely
got past 90F (32C) (ambient air typically 65-70F or 19-21C)

I can never quite understand why people won't put in extra fans,
especially in the front next to the HD bays. My case has provisions
for 4 fans in the front 2 of which blow directly thru the HD bays.

The Panaflow 80mm costs only $8 at Directron. Put 4 of those suckers
in front and you could cool off an Atlas missle.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"

 

[Rolf Blom]

On 2005-06-20 16:46, Bob wrote:

-snip-

I can never quite understand why people won't put in extra fans,
especially in the front next to the HD bays. My case has provisions
for 4 fans in the front 2 of which blow directly thru the HD bays.

The Panaflow 80mm costs only $8 at Directron. Put 4 of those suckers
in front and you could cool off an Atlas missle.

But too noisy, perhaps.

I had one PC with front & rear case fans, PSU fan, CPU fan, graphics
card fan, and a couple of drive bay fans for the disks. It sounded like
a turbo hoover, and I could never stand having it turned on for long.

/Rolf

 

[Peter]

I can never quite understand why people won't put in extra fans,

especially in the front next to the HD bays. My case has provisions
for 4 fans in the front 2 of which blow directly thru the HD bays.

OP said:
"Other issue is that I have two intake and two exhaust fans in
the case."

The possible reasons for not to put extra fans, could be:
- current cooling is sufficient
- no design provisions for extra fans
- additional noise
- overall cost of installation

 

[Bob]

But too noisy, perhaps.

Perhaps not.

Panaflo 80mm Ultra Quiet Fan
http://www.directron.com/80l1a.html

"Panaflos are the best computer case fans you can buy. Utilizing the
new Hydro-Wave bearing technology, the Panaflo L1 series produces
stellar CFM (cubic feet per minute), while being some of the quietest
fans on the market."

I had one PC with front & rear case fans, PSU fan, CPU fan, graphics
card fan, and a couple of drive bay fans for the disks. It sounded like
a turbo hoover, and I could never stand having it turned on for long.

I have 1 Panaflo up front, 1 on the side, and 1 in back plus the PSU
fan and the CPU fan and a 60mm fan for the Enermax ES-352 RAID/Backup
unit and 3 40mm fans for the Kingwin KF-23 removable drive bay. There
is no fan on the graphics chip.

I have the case at the side of my desk within 4 feet of my left ear
and I can barely hear it running.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"

 

[Rolf Blom]

Perhaps not.

Panaflo 80mm Ultra Quiet Fan
http://www.directron.com/80l1a.html

"Panaflos are the best computer case fans you can buy. Utilizing the
new Hydro-Wave bearing technology, the Panaflo L1 series produces
stellar CFM (cubic feet per minute), while being some of the quietest
fans on the market."

On the website you referenced, there's also a comparision chart for
various 80mm fans; in this the Panaflow lands in the middle ground.
(It's probably better than the fans in my old noisebox though.)

And strangely, the comment on Panaflow in the test says:

Quote:

From the results in Table 1, it’s clear that the more expensive fans
may not necessarily always be quieter. One such example is the Panaflo.

:end quote.

This does not quite agree with the 'best computer fans you can buy' line
from the same site.

/Rolf

 

[Ron Reaugh]

The Panaflow 80mm costs only $8 at Directron. Put 4 of those suckers
in front and you could cool off an Atlas missle.

Jesus, you're an old fart but why not a Redstone.

 

[CWatters]

Work on your bullshitting 'skills'

I've been doing it for a hell of a lot longer than you have.

I'm with Rod on this. Heat can kill a drive but it's very unlikely to do so
instantly. The OP never got it working not even for a single boot.

 

[CWatters]

I can never quite understand why people won't put in extra fans,

The last three PC I built had extra drive bay fans (different makes). They
were a pain to fit and they only lasted a few months then started to make a
horrible racket. I've removed them as the only way to shut them up was to
give them a good kicking.

 

[Bob]

On the website you referenced, there's also a comparision chart for
various 80mm fans; in this the Panaflow lands in the middle ground.
(It's probably better than the fans in my old noisebox though.)

And strangely, the comment on Panaflow in the test says:

From the results in Table 1, it’s clear that the more expensive fans
may not necessarily always be quieter. One such example is the Panaflo.

:end quote.

This does not quite agree with the 'best computer fans you can buy' line
from the same site.

The head of technical services at Directron told me to ignore that
chart. It was put there by a third party.

I can only tell you what I know from direct experience, namely, that
my system is very quiet - and very cool.

But hey - I am not a Panaflow salesman. Take all the bloody fans out
of your computer for all I care.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"

 

[Folkert Rienstra]

While power supply might be the culprit, your remarks about
temperature are a bit misleading.
From the fact that ambient room temperature "has never gone
beyond maybe 38°C " you cannot draw conclusion that
"inside environment" has never exceeded that. Even with good
ventilation.
And there are differences between "room ambient temperature",
"hard disk ambient temperature" and "hard disk operating
temperature".
Usually the last one is listed in hard drive specs (as maximum),
and traditionally has been reported by S.M.A.R.T. (that is
my understanding) though hard drive manufacturers do not
specifically say that.
So I would check S.M.A.R.T (or using temperature probe
attached to the HD case) first, just to make sure.

BTW, learn how to post using Google, so replies to your message
can be quoted (until Google fixes that).

If you know what exactly there is to learn in avoiding Google to
behave that way, why don't you just tell?

And if this bothers you so much why not use OE-Quotefix and not
be bothered by it anymore.

 

[Folkert Rienstra]

Work on your bullshitting 'skills'

I've been doing it for a hell of a lot longer than you have.

What, working on your bullshitting 'skills'?
Yup, that can be witnessed every day.

[snip]

 

[Rod Speed]

I'm with Rod on this. Heat can kill a drive but it's very unlikely to do
so instantly. The OP never got it working not even for a single boot.

And with the cooling he says he has, its very unlikely
indeed that the drive is getting stinking hot that quickly.

Its MUCH more likely to be a bad power supply or just a
coincidence, the second drive just died from infant mortality.

 

[Rod Speed]

I can never quite understand why people won't put in extra fans,

I dont like the noise. I prefer to monitor the SMART drive temp
and do passive stuff like a spare drive bay between drives if the
temp is too high for my liking with the drives mounted adjacent.

especially in the front next to the HD bays. My case has provisions
for 4 fans in the front 2 of which blow directly thru the HD bays.

Pity about the noise.

The Panaflow 80mm costs only $8 at Directron. Put 4 of
those suckers in front and you could cool off an Atlas missle.

No thanks, I like silent systems.

 

[Bob]

Jesus, you're an old fart

You're just jealous.

I worked at NASA Marshall Space Flight Center the summer of 1964
between undergrad and grad school. I actually met Werner von Braun in
person. He gave a seminar on German engineering practices.

How many NAZI butchers have you met in your lifetime? I even shook his
hand - the same one he used to launch V-2 rockets over London.

The only other experience that comes even close was when I had dinner
with Hannibal Lecter. The main course was a JBGT named Paul Krendler
who got to eat some of his own sauteed brain .

but why not a Redstone.

Marshal Space Flight Center was located on the US Army Redstone
Arsenal in Huntsville, Alabama. That's where the Saturn V program was
headquartered. I saw them machining the bulkheads for the rocket body
out of a 33 foot diameter piece of welded aluminum. Incredible what
they could do in terms of fabrication back then.

Even though NASA took the limelight in the early 1960s, the Redstone
Arsenal was still very active in such projects as the Nike Hercules
and the Pershing missles, to name but a few from that era.

I witnessed the building of the Saturn V system which included testing
the F-1 Rocketdyne engine. The burn took about 120 seconds and the
deflector plate used up over 1 million gallons of water for cooling.

You could hear the sound as far away as Birmingham, Alabama, about 100
miles away. It was indeed an awesome sight. They were building the
test stand for the 5-rocket system so I missed seeing that.

Does anyone know if those test shots are available on VHS or even DVD?

--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"

 

[Impmon]

The Panaflow 80mm costs only $8 at Directron. Put 4 of those suckers
in front and you could cool off an Atlas missle.

heh if your case is wide enough you could use 120mm fans instead.
They put 80m to shame easy.

But nothing could beat the shop vac method. Tape up extra vents on
the side and rear leaving on the front vents open and power supply
vents open. Make sure the power supply *blows* out not suck in (few
cheap supplies are like this but rare) then attach a shop vac to the
exhaust port of the supply and turn it on. Most compoments would
never get past ambient air temp at all. Also no dust buildup to clean
up either. Of course the noise of the shop vac would drive most
people crazy. =)

 

[Bob]

heh if your case is wide enough you could use 120mm fans instead.
They put 80m to shame easy.

No need to. My machine is not the kind that gets hot. My son's is, and
with the 80mm fans it stays cool.

But nothing could beat the shop vac method.
LOL

Of course the noise of the shop vac would drive most
people crazy. =)

Good Grief! Why not just hook the case up to a window air conditioner?


Those suckers are good for 5,000 BTUs per hour.


--

Map of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
http://home.houston.rr.com/rkba/vrwc.html

"Whatever crushes individuality is despotism."
--John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"

 

[J. Clarke]

You're just jealous.

I worked at NASA Marshall Space Flight Center the summer of 1964
between undergrad and grad school. I actually met Werner von Braun in
person. He gave a seminar on German engineering practices.

How many NAZI butchers have you met in your lifetime? I even shook his
hand - the same one he used to launch V-2 rockets over London.

So how many did he personally launch over London?

 

[J. Clarke]

The head of technical services at Directron told me to ignore that
chart. It was put there by a third party.

I can only tell you what I know from direct experience, namely, that
my system is very quiet - and very cool.

But hey - I am not a Panaflow salesman. Take all the bloody fans out
of your computer for all I care.

First, there are a number of Panaflo models--the quietest are pretty good
but they don't move much air either. Second, any grille or other source of
backpressure will increase the noise, so will any restriction in the
incoming flow path. Next, they are not as quiet as the numbers might lead
you to believe--they are clearly audible in the machines in which I have
installed them and aren't noticeably quieter than the stock fans of the
same flow capacity.