Solvent v water based ink

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Peter Sutton

I have a Canon iP3000 in which I use cheap water based inks. But the holes
are now partly blocked after a few years. A salesman at PC World say water
based inks cause holes to get blocked and it doesn't happen with solvent
based inks, even when the printer is not used for several weeks. I find this
hard to believe - I see no scientific justification. Is this just another
way of saying please pay over the top for our cartridges.
 
Peter Sutton said:
I have a Canon iP3000 in which I use cheap water based inks. But the holes
are now partly blocked after a few years. A salesman at PC World say water
based inks cause holes to get blocked and it doesn't happen with solvent
based inks, even when the printer is not used for several weeks. I find
this
hard to believe - I see no scientific justification. Is this just another
way of saying please pay over the top for our cartridges.
Click to expand...

God save us from salespeople. All inkjet inks are water based. What you can
do for cleaning is use one of the "solvents" that ink sellers offer. You put
it in empty ink tanks and print till clear. It's an ink "base" with do dye
or pigment in it. Others have used Windex or ammonia with similar results.

"Holes are partially blocked" can mean anything. If you are seeing banded
printing and the nozzle check test reveals problems, then cleaning may or
may not help. The head itself may also be the problem, which would require
replacement. If you use the printer in this condition, the odds of a cooked
head go up very quickly.

Perhaps you should specify what, exactly, the symptoms are.
 
DanG said:
God save us from salespeople. All inkjet inks are water based. What you can
do for cleaning is use one of the "solvents" that ink sellers offer. You put
it in empty ink tanks and print till clear. It's an ink "base" with do dye
or pigment in it. Others have used Windex or ammonia with similar results.

"Holes are partially blocked" can mean anything. If you are seeing banded
printing and the nozzle check test reveals problems, then cleaning may or
may not help. The head itself may also be the problem, which would require
replacement. If you use the printer in this condition, the odds of a cooked
head go up very quickly.

Perhaps you should specify what, exactly, the symptoms are.
Click to expand...
Thanks for your reply Dan. The question was really about solvent v water
based inks (are they really all water based?), as I am considering buying a
new printer anyway. My specific problem has moved on. I soaked the print
head in water overnight, and left it to dry on the (warm only) boiler for
three days. I tried it since my post and the colours now work perfectly, but
the black is totally dead. From my reading I think I have cooked the head
for good. I am tempted to get another print head if I can get one at a
reasonable price, but I see them offered for £80 (ie twice the cost of a new
printer) - but you can still use cheap ink, and over a three year period I
may still save. Also I run windows 98 and am not sure it it will support a
new printer.
 
Peter Sutton said:
Thanks for your reply Dan. The question was really about solvent v water
based inks (are they really all water based?), as I am considering buying
a
new printer anyway. My specific problem has moved on. I soaked the print
head in water overnight, and left it to dry on the (warm only) boiler for
three days. I tried it since my post and the colours now work perfectly,
but
the black is totally dead. From my reading I think I have cooked the head
for good. I am tempted to get another print head if I can get one at a
reasonable price, but I see them offered for £80 (ie twice the cost of a
new
printer) - but you can still use cheap ink, and over a three year period I
may still save. Also I run windows 98 and am not sure it it will support a
new printer.
Click to expand...

Yes, letting a head dry out is a bad idea. ;-)

Here, IP3000 heads are about $50US. Not really worth it unless you like to
do a lot of refilling or use compatible tanks, either of which is more
difficult with new printers. The IP3500 is a good choice for the same stuff
the IP3000 is good at. For photos, it's hard to beat the IP4500 even at 3x
the price. For photos and discs, but nothing much else, the Epson R280 is a
good value, but use of compatible tanks or refills is difficult.

As for Win98, you'd have to check with Canon regarding OS support for the
newer drivers and software.

There are 2 types of ink: Pigment and dye. Both are water-based.
 
Peter said:
I have a Canon iP3000 in which I use cheap water based inks. But the holes
are now partly blocked after a few years. They should be rusted out.
A salesman at PC World say water
based inks cause holes to get blocked and it doesn't happen with solvent
based inks, even when the printer is not used for several weeks. I find this
hard to believe - I see no scientific justification. Is this just another
way of saying please pay over the top for our cartridges.
Click to expand...
 
DanG wrote:

"Peter Sutton" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...



I have a Canon iP3000 in which I use cheap water based inks. But the holes are now partly blocked after a few years. A salesman at PC World say water based inks cause holes to get blocked and it doesn't happen with solvent based inks, even when the printer is not used for several weeks. I find this hard to believe - I see no scientific justification. Is this just another way of saying please pay over the top for our cartridges.



God save us from salespeople.

Oh Yeah the fly by niters are unbelievalbe.


All inkjet inks are water based. What you can do for cleaning is use one of the "solvents" that ink sellers offer. You put it in empty ink tanks and print till clear. It's an ink "base" with do dye or pigment in it. Others have used Windex or ammonia with similar results.

If you use the right ink you do not have to do any of this waste.


"Holes are partially blocked" can mean anything. If you are seeing banded printing and the nozzle check test reveals problems, then cleaning may or may not help. The head itself may also be the problem, which would require replacement. If you use the printer in this condition, the odds of a cooked head go up very quickly. Perhaps you should specify what, exactly, the symptoms are.
 
DanG wrote:

"Peter Sutton" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...



Thanks for your reply Dan. The question was really about solvent v water based inks (are they really all water based?), as I am considering buying a new printer anyway. My specific problem has moved on. I soaked the print head in water overnight, and left it to dry on the (warm only) boiler for three days. I tried it since my post and the colours now work perfectly, but the black is totally dead. From my reading I think I have cooked the head for good. I am tempted to get another print head if I can get one at a reasonable price, but I see them offered for £80 (ie twice the cost of a new printer) - but you can still use cheap ink, and over a three year period I may still save. Also I run windows 98 and am not sure it it will support a new printer.



Yes, letting a head dry out is a bad idea. ;-) Here, IP3000 heads are about $50US. Not really worth it unless you like to do a lot of refilling or use compatible tanks, either of which is more difficult with new printers. The IP3500 is a good choice for the same stuff the IP3000 is good at. For photos, it's hard to beat the IP4500 even at 3x the price. For photos and discs, but nothing much else, the Epson R280 is a good value, but use of compatible tanks or refills is difficult. As for Win98,

Oh Win98 ha ha ha
that explains everything


you'd have to check with Canon regarding OS support for the newer drivers and software. There are 2 types of ink: Pigment and dye. Both are water-based.
 
I have been doing the opposite. I drink only ink-based water. Sometimes,
I feel very good. Sometimes, I do not, and don't look well. Often, I use
generic water to save money. But when I use OEM water, I tell people
that my name is "measekite," and when they see me coming, they cross the
street. What am I doing wrong?

Bubba
 
I have been doing the opposite. I drink only ink-based water. Sometimes,
I feel very good. Sometimes, I do not, and don't look well. Often, I use
generic water to save money. But when I use OEM water, I tell people
that my name is "measekite," and when they see me coming, they cross the
street. What am I doing wrong?
Click to expand...

You are breathing.
 
The Irascible Talpid wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jan 2008 23:10:12 -0800, Cal Bubba <[email protected]> wrote in <news:[email protected]>:



I have been doing the opposite. I drink only ink-based water. Sometimes, I feel very good. Sometimes, I do not, and don't look well. Often, I use generic water to save money. But when I use OEM water, I tell people that my name is "measekite," and when they see me coming, they cross the street. What am I doing wrong?



You are breathing.


Guess what

It is not he he he

It is
ha ha ha
 
|I have been doing the opposite. I drink only ink-based water. Sometimes,
| I feel very good. Sometimes, I do not, and don't look well. Often, I use
| generic water to save money. But when I use OEM water, I tell people
| that my name is "measekite," and when they see me coming, they cross the
| street. What am I doing wrong?
|
| Bubba

Perhaps you should consider bathing in aftermarket water? Use of soap is
recommended. Try it you might enjoy it.
 
God save us from ... who?

I know you have the best of intentions in your reply, and indeed the
salesman is also pushing the point, but indeed there are solvent based
inkjet inks and printers. They print onto substrates like vinyl,
plastics, metal materials, etc, are waterproof when dry and often are
used for outdoor signage like billboards and permanent and
semi-permanent signage for businesses. In effect, they use very dilute
"paints".

Many solvent printers use UV light or heat sources to cure and solidify
them the ink. Solvent ink printers which use a curing process tend to
not clog badly because the ink doesn't "dry" without the help of a
catalyst like UV or heat. However, solvent ink inkjet printers
certainly do clog and often require cleaning processes.

Art
 
As my earlier reply mentions, there rae indeed solvent ink inkjet
printers. However, they don't come cheaply. They are used in
commercial printing operations and usually are only made in wide
carriage versions. For most home use situations the inks are indeed
water based. Solvent ink printers cost thousands and tens of thousands
of dollars.

Art
 
Arthur Entlich said:
As my earlier reply mentions, there rae indeed solvent ink inkjet
printers. However, they don't come cheaply. They are used in
commercial printing operations and usually are only made in wide
carriage versions. For most home use situations the inks are indeed
water based. Solvent ink printers cost thousands and tens of thousands
of dollars.
Click to expand...
Many thanks Arthur for your sensible reply I am afraid that some of the
other threads got a bit bogged down!
 
Peter Sutton said:
Many thanks Arthur for your sensible reply I am afraid that some of the
other threads got a bit bogged down!
Click to expand...

Helpful information for everyone.

Thanks Art

Dave C.
 
As my earlier reply mentions, there rae indeed solvent ink inkjet
printers.  However, they don't come cheaply.  They are used in
commercial printing operations and usually are only made in wide
carriage versions.  For most home use situations the inks are indeed
water based.  Solvent ink printers cost thousands and tens of thousands
of dollars.

Art






- Show quoted text -
Click to expand...

There is some alcohol-based solvent even in the water-based inks.
E.g. Canon dye-based inks contain a percentage of glycol, which varies
according to colour, and the percentage is stated right on the box (at
least it does on some of the older ones I still have laying around).
I would think that it'd be necessary to keep it soluable in the tank,
otherwise wouldn't the water and dye separate over time?

Phineas
 
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