short filename formats

[Shanda]

Hi,

Something funny has happened to my computer since I installed a larger
harddrive. The dos short filenames are now in a format like this:
MICROSOF.XXX instead of MICROS~1.XXX.

I've looked and looked but can't find where there is a checkbox to
switch back to the original format. Does anybody know?

Thanks..

 

[Arno Wagner]

Hi,

Something funny has happened to my computer since I installed a larger
harddrive. The dos short filenames are now in a format like this:
MICROSOF.XXX instead of MICROS~1.XXX.

I've looked and looked but can't find where there is a checkbox to
switch back to the original format. Does anybody know?

Probably a mistake on copy-over. I once had this when I copied a
partition with linux and tar and accidentaly mounted the source
partition as "fat" instead of "vfat". If that is the case, there
is no way to recover the old names, since they are not on the new
disk.

Arno

 

[Shanda]

Hi,

It says DRIVE C: FAT32 whatever that means. So I guess I have to go all
through the registry and change all the paths to this new format. Right?

Shanda


:
:

 

[Arno Wagner]

Hi,

It says DRIVE C: FAT32 whatever that means. So I guess I have to go all
through the registry and change all the paths to this new format. Right?

Shanda

No, Windows is sloppy. It will use FAT as VFAT. The problem likely was
in the copying. How did you copy the files?

Arno

 

[Shanda]

Hi,

Maybe I didn't explain it right. What I'm saying is that the computer is
now working in the new format. It can't find anything that has a path in
the old format.

For instance if I type C:\PROGRA~1 on the windows run line I get an
error, likewise if I type CD C:\PROGRA~1 in the dos box. But if I type
C:\PROGRAF it works ok.

Therefore it can't load any of the programs that have "~" in the path in
the registry.

Shanda

p.s. What I did was take the old harddrive out and put it in another
computer that needed a harddrive. Put the new harddrive in and formatted
it. Now I connected the two computers via LPT1 and used the program
Interlink in DOS to xcopy all the files.

 

[Eric Gisin]

You cannot use DOS xcopy and expect any long paths to survive.

The only solution is to delete Windows and PrograF and reinstall.

You could try renaming things by hand, but I doubt it.

 

[Shanda]

Hi,

Well I'm not worrying about that. There was only about 6 files in all of
windows, that were long that I had to rename.

What I'm saying is that the computer has switched to this new format for
short filenames. For instance if I open a folder in Windows Explorer and
click NEW and make a new folder called "A Long Folder", then I right
click on that folder and click properties, where it says MS-DOS NAME it
will say
"ALONGFOL" not "ALONGF~1".

Therefore I believe that somewhere in the computer there is a place
where you have a choice to switch between the two formats, I just can't
find it.

Shanda

 

[Rod Speed]

Well I'm not worrying about that. There was only about 6
files in all of windows, that were long that I had to rename.

What I'm saying is that the computer has switched to this new format for
short filenames. For instance if I open a folder in Windows Explorer and
click NEW and make a new folder called "A Long Folder", then I right
click on that folder and click properties, where it says MS-DOS NAME it
will say "ALONGFOL" not "ALONGF~1".

Therefore I believe that somewhere in the computer there is a place
where you have a choice to switch between the two formats,

Nope, the problem was using dos to copy files with long file
names. THATS what lost the long file names. That ~1 trailing
stuff is just one indication that a long file name is available.

I just can't find it.

Nothing to 'find'

 

[Shanda]

Hi,

You guys are sure dense. I never said there is anything wrong with the
long filenames. They're working perfectly and so are the short filenames
.... they're just in a different format than what they used to be.

Funny that no one's heard of these two formats!

Shanda

 

[Rod Speed]

You guys are sure dense.

We'll see...

I never said there is anything wrong with the long filenames.

No one ever said you did.

They're working perfectly and so are the short filenames
... they're just in a different format than what they used to be.

Because you used dos to copy the disk.

There is no SWITCH to get back to the
~1 style seen with the SHORT file name.

Funny that no one's heard of these two formats!

Everyone with a clue realises that there are
long and short file names in modern systems.

The ~1 ~2 style is used where the long name
wont be unique when its just truncated, stupid.

 

[Eric Gisin]

What I'm saying is that the computer has switched to this new format for
short filenames. For instance if I open a folder in Windows Explorer and
click NEW and make a new folder called "A Long Folder", then I right
click on that folder and click properties, where it says MS-DOS NAME it
will say
"ALONGFOL" not "ALONGF~1".

Therefore I believe that somewhere in the computer there is a place
where you have a choice to switch between the two formats, I just can't
find it.

Windows NT had a registry switch to disable long filenames, but I never heard
of one for Win 9X. You should read chapter 10 of the Win 98 Resource Kit
(avail under technet at microsoft.com).

Did you try "dir /x"? It should show SFN followed by LFN.

 

[Shanda]

You guys are still not getting what I am talking about. I am not talking
about long and short filenames. I am talking about the two formats of
short filenames. For instance:

this format- "ALONGFOL" as short filename for "A Long Folder"

and

this format- "ALONGF~1" as short filename for "A Long Folder"


And how to switch the computer from one to the other.


Now do you understand??????????????, she said getting blue in the face!

Shanda

 

[Rod Speed]

You guys are still not getting what I am talking about.

Fraid so.

I am not talking about long and short filenames.

You are, actually, even tho you dont realise it.

I am talking about the two formats
of short filenames. For instance:

this format- "ALONGFOL" as short filename for "A Long Folder"

this format- "ALONGF~1" as short filename for "A Long Folder"

That was always obvious.

And how to switch the computer from one to the other.

Not even possible. You managed to mangle from the second
format to the first format by copying the files at the dos level.

Now do you understand??????????????,

You're the one that doesnt understand.

she said getting blue in the face!

The reason you cant find the switch you are looking for
documented IS BECAUSE THERE IS NO SWITCH.

 

[Shanda]

Ok, try this. Go to an empty folder.

Make two new text files.

Name one "New Text Document.txt"

Name the other "New Text Document2.txt"


Now go to the DOS window and tell me if you get this:

C:\>


Microsoft(R) Windows 98
(C)Copyright Microsoft Corp 1981-1998.

C:\>cd alongfol

C:\A Long Folder Name>dir

Volume in drive C is DISK2
Volume Serial Number is 3915-1AF1
Directory of C:\A Long Folder Name

.. <DIR> 03-04-04 11:38a .
... <DIR> 03-04-04 11:38a ..
NEWTEXTD TXT 0 03-04-04 5:55p New Text Document2.txt
NEWTEX~1 TXT 0 03-04-04 5:55p New Text Document.txt
2 file(s) 0 bytes
2 dir(s) 16,046.03 MB free

C:\A Long Folder Name>

 

[Arno Wagner]

Hi,

Maybe I didn't explain it right. What I'm saying is that the computer is
now working in the new format. It can't find anything that has a path in
the old format.

Can you create files with long names?

For instance if I type C:\PROGRA~1 on the windows run line I get an
error, likewise if I type CD C:\PROGRA~1 in the dos box. But if I type
C:\PROGRAF it works ok.

Some basics:

PROGRA~1 is a long filename displayed by an OS that is not
long-filename aware or where support for long filenames is off. The
long filename is on disk in a special area and can be used with a
suitably new version of DOS/Windows or Linux when mounted as "vfat".
Older OS versions or Linux when mounted as "fat" will display it
with the '~'.

PROGRAF is a complete filename. There is no long version on disk!
It will look like this, regardless of the OS and support for long
filenames.

Therefore it can't load any of the programs that have "~" in the path in
the registry.

Yes, that would be an effect.

Shanda

p.s. What I did was take the old harddrive out and put it in another
computer that needed a harddrive. Put the new harddrive in and formatted
it. Now I connected the two computers via LPT1 and used the program
Interlink in DOS to xcopy all the files.

It looks like you either used a DOS version that cannot deal with
long filenames or forgot to tell xcopy to copy long filenames
correctly. If this is the case, all names where shortened when
you copied the files and the long names are not on the new disk.

Some software might still work with the now shortened names. In
that case you can change all references (e.g. registry) to the
new short names.

This problem is a pretty nasty pittfall. The two options to repair
it are manual renaming (almost impossible) and copying them again
from the source, this time with the long names.

Regards,
Arno

 

[Shanda]

Hi Arno,

Let me start over from the beginning. Forget that I changed harddrives
or copied files, because this what I am describing has nothing to do
with the harddrive. It is just how windows is treating short file names
on my computer, not just on the C: drive, but the ram drive, the zip
drive, the compact flash drive and the CD burner.

What it is doing is making the short name the first 8 letters of the
long name. Not with a tilde and a "1" like it is supposed to do. If
there is a second filename the same then is uses "~1" for it (not a "~2"
like it's supposed to do).

Read the above paragraph several times, because that's what I have wrote
in every post and nobody seems to get it.

Other than that the computer is working perfectly .. long names and
short ... I just have to use the new format in DOS, that's all. And as
for the registry, you probably know that the paths in the registry are
mostly in short names, they're just not in my new format short names
because they were made before the computer switched over to this new way
of producing short names.

Study this dos list below which is part of program files and compare it
to your computer.

As for the fact that I copied the files in DOS -- that has nothing to do
with it because all the files were short names anyway. There was only a
few that I had to rename to their long names, mostly directories.

Adios,
Shanda

INTERNET <DIR> 01-03-04 8:07p Internet Explorer
IOMEGA <DIR> 01-03-04 8:08p Iomega
IRFANVIE <DIR> 01-03-0410:40a IrfanView
JPEGWIZA <DIR> 01-03-04 8:09p jpegwizard
LEADTECH <DIR> 01-03-04 8:01p LEAD Technologies, Inc
MABRYSOF <DIR> 01-03-04 8:09p Mabry Software
MGI <DIR> 01-03-04 8:07p MGI
MICROSOF <DIR> 01-03-04 8:08p Microsoft Windows Script
MICROS~1 <DIR> 01-03-04 8:08p Microsoft Script Debugger
MIDI2WAV <DIR> 01-03-04 8:08p Midi2Wav Recorder
MSMQ <DIR> 01-03-04 8:07p MSMQ
NORTONAN <DIR> 01-03-04 8:07p Norton AntiVirus
OUTLOOKE <DIR> 01-03-04 8:07p Outlook Express
PAINTSHO <DIR> 01-03-04 8:08p Paint Shop Pro 5

 

[Arno Wagner]

Hi Arno,

Let me start over from the beginning. Forget that I changed harddrives
or copied files, because this what I am describing has nothing to do
with the harddrive. It is just how windows is treating short file names
on my computer, not just on the C: drive, but the ram drive, the zip
drive, the compact flash drive and the CD burner.

What it is doing is making the short name the first 8 letters of the
long name. Not with a tilde and a "1" like it is supposed to do. If
there is a second filename the same then is uses "~1" for it (not a "~2"
like it's supposed to do).

Read the above paragraph several times, because that's what I have wrote
in every post and nobody seems to get it.

Other than that the computer is working perfectly .. long names and
short ... I just have to use the new format in DOS, that's all. And as
for the registry, you probably know that the paths in the registry are
mostly in short names, they're just not in my new format short names
because they were made before the computer switched over to this new way
of producing short names.

Study this dos list below which is part of program files and compare it
to your computer.

O.K., I see it now. Next time post this earlier...
So you actually have long names, just the coressponding
short names are wrong.

I am sorry, but I have no idea what causes this. The docu I know
clearly states that the part of the derived short filename before
the dot ends in ~1, ~2, ...

Arno

 

[LegMan]

Hi Arno,

Let me start over from the beginning. Forget that I changed harddrives
or copied files, because this what I am describing has nothing to do
with the harddrive. It is just how windows is treating short file names
on my computer, not just on the C: drive, but the ram drive, the zip
drive, the compact flash drive and the CD burner.

What it is doing is making the short name the first 8 letters of the
long name. Not with a tilde and a "1" like it is supposed to do. If
there is a second filename the same then is uses "~1" for it (not a "~2"
like it's supposed to do).

Read the above paragraph several times, because that's what I have wrote
in every post and nobody seems to get it.

Other than that the computer is working perfectly .. long names and
short ... I just have to use the new format in DOS, that's all. And as
for the registry, you probably know that the paths in the registry are
mostly in short names, they're just not in my new format short names
because they were made before the computer switched over to this new way
of producing short names.

Study this dos list below which is part of program files and compare it
to your computer.

As for the fact that I copied the files in DOS -- that has nothing to do
with it because all the files were short names anyway. There was only a
few that I had to rename to their long names, mostly directories.

Adios,
Shanda

<snipped for brevity only>

If I may intrude mid-thread, there IS a registry tweak that will turn
off the tilde character. Check out http://www.rexswain.com/friendly.html
and/or http://www.annoyances.org/exec/show/article01-415 for a brief
description/repair.

HTH,

Charlie LegMan (remove 999 for eMail)

 

[Shanda]

Hi Charlie,

Thanks very much for that. I always thought there was a place in the
registry that controlled this. I just never thought to look for
"NameNumericTail" and "PrefetchTail".

Thanks again,
Shanda

 

[Rod Speed]

Hi Charlie,

Thanks very much for that. I always thought there
was a place in the registry that controlled this.

Cant be that, you are getting the ~n format for all but the first one.

And I bet your system doesnt have that set currently.

I just never thought to look for "NameNumericTail" and "PrefetchTail".

You did a lousy job of explaining what you were seeing originally.