Repairing a damaged CD-R file

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J44xm

I saved a very large file to CD-R, but when I tried to access it, I find
that the file is damaged. Can anyone recommend a utility to repair the
file, if it's possible to? The disc itself wasn't damaged; the data was
just burned screwy or it got like that within the past couple of months
(which, I think, is doubtful).
 
J44xm said:
I saved a very large file to CD-R, but when I tried to access it, I find
that the file is damaged. Can anyone recommend a utility to repair the
file, if it's possible to? The disc itself wasn't damaged; the data was
just burned screwy or it got like that within the past couple of months
(which, I think, is doubtful).

You could try CD-Check (http://www.elpros.si/CDCheck/). It's free but, if I
remember well, there's a nag screen that pops up from time to time. Aside
from that, it's clean.

Joe
 
I saved a very large file to CD-R, but when I tried to access it, I find
that the file is damaged. Can anyone recommend a utility to repair the
file, if it's possible to? The disc itself wasn't damaged; the data was
just burned screwy or it got like that within the past couple of months
(which, I think, is doubtful).

CD-R is a very temporary storage medium. Unlike commercial CD writers
the CD-R writers we have in our computers are pretty lightweight. They
do not really pit the medium as commercial writers do. There is a
layer of dye in a CD-R that is manipulated by the laser in your writer
to change the reflectivity of it.

An audio CD you buy is reproduced in bulk from a mastered CD that was
pitted and will last for a great many years if treated properly.

A CD-R that you create on your computer has an expected lifespan of
3-5 years if treated properly.

I do not know of a way to repair the file. I had a similar problem
recently with a commercial product I bought and put on CD. I could see
the setup file, but my computer locked up when I tried executing or
copying it to disk. The CD was 3 years old and the writer that read it
could not read it.

The way I solved the problem was to use my DVD, which uses a shorter
wavelength and is engineered to read data far more closely packed. It
read the file fine. If you don't have a DVD maybe you know someone who
does and you can copy your CD to disk and make another CD-R.

Anyway, I found this interesting and maybe of interest to others who
archive to CD-R. Depending on how valuable you consider the data, it
might be worth the work to dump each CD-R to disk and create a newer
backup from time to time.
 
Just curious to know where you got the lifespan data. I've got el-cheapo
data and audio discs (both cdr and cdrw) burned over five years ago that
are reading perfectly and, having read tons of stuff on cdr's have never
seen such a short span projection. With the costs of today's blanks I do
tend to back up discs from that far back but only to be doubly safe. Thanks.
 
A good source for that stuff is cdrfaq.org. I read it a couple of years
ago, and what I recall reading is a 15-20 year cdr lifespan. I've
switched to RAID 1 (mirroring) + an external drive. I try not to keep
too much stuff... I have 13 GB worth, (excluding music and movies, but I
don't hoard these)
 
Ron Goodenow <[email protected]> wrote:
Just curious to know where you got the lifespan data. I've got el-cheapo
data and audio discs (both cdr and cdrw) burned over five years ago that
are reading perfectly and, having read tons of stuff on cdr's have never
seen such a short span projection. With the costs of today's blanks I do
tend to back up discs from that far back but only to be doubly safe. Thanks.

That was exam material that I took on Tuesday in an Architecture
class. The book did not state the lifespan. The instructor did as we
discussed it.

Note: CD-RW is a totally different approach than CD-R.

The dye layer in CD-R's evidently is not stable over time. Or, that is
the only conclusion that I can draw from the information. The book
does not address this issue, but that looks like a logical deduction.

My CD-R was written and stored immediately in a hard jewel case in a
dark drawer. After 3 years the writer could not read the CD, although
my DVD did. That was the second time it had been removed from the
case.

You might be safer in your CD-RW's. Nothing about a lifespan was
mentioned about these, other than for overusage.

<q>
The CD-RW optical disk can be repeatedly written and overwritten, as
with a magnetic disk. Although a number of approaches have been tried,
the only pure optical approach that has proved attractive is called
phase change. The phase change disk uses materialthat has two
significantly different reflectivities in two different phase states.
There is an amorphous state, in which the molecules exhibit a random
orientation and which reflects light poorly; and a crystalline state,
which has a smooth surface that reflects light well. A beam of laser
light can change the material from one phase to another. The primary
disadvantage of phase change optical disks is that the material
eventually and permanently loses its desirable properties. Current
materials can be used for between 500,000 and 1,000,000 erase cycles.

A key advantage of the optical disk is that the engineering tolerances
for optical disks are much less severe than for high-capacity magnetic
disks. Thus, they exhibit higher reliability and longer life. </q>

This sounds far better than CD-R and they don't cost all that much
more. They can be reused to boot.

Back to CD-R, each block is 2352 bytes. The last 288 bytes are error
correction code. If you verify the write each block should contain an
error correction code for the block. But, back to the drawing board...
if your CD writer cannot read the CD after a period of time, what good
is the error correction code?

If you don't verify the write you get an extra 288 bytes per block to
store data on.

I think CD-RW sounds like the better choice, until we can afford DVD
writers at least.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Thanks.

That was exam material that I took on Tuesday in an Architecture
class. The book did not state the lifespan. The instructor did as we
discussed it.

Note: CD-RW is a totally different approach than CD-R.

The dye layer in CD-R's evidently is not stable over time. Or, that is
the only conclusion that I can draw from the information. The book
does not address this issue, but that looks like a logical deduction.
http://www.cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-5
This site has the dirt on CD-R lifespan, 3-5 years is definately way short
of manufacturers expected life with quality media. You mileage may vary
though.
HK
 

To Ron or me?
This site has the dirt on CD-R lifespan, 3-5 years is definately way short
of manufacturers expected life with quality media. You mileage may vary
though.

As was pointed out in another thread, the cost of blank CD-R's has
dropped dramatically. To some extent manufacturers enjoy mass
production savings. To another extent, they are figuring out the
cheapest way to make a CD-R and sell it at the largest profit. I think
this cheapness in manufacturing is the culprit and is responsible for
the difference in comparisons with CD-R's manufactured 5+ years ago
and what you might expect when you buy a CD-R off the shelf today.

It is your data.
 
I saved a very large file to CD-R, but when I tried to access it,
I find that the file is damaged. Can anyone recommend a utility to
repair the file, if it's possible to? The disc itself wasn't
damaged; the data was just burned screwy or it got like that
within the past couple of months (which, I think, is doubtful).

See message: <[email protected]>
 
The dye layer in CD-R's evidently is not stable over time. Or, that is
the only conclusion that I can draw from the information. The book
does not address this issue, but that looks like a logical deduction.

My CD-R was written and stored immediately in a hard jewel case in a
dark drawer. After 3 years the writer could not read the CD, although
my DVD did. That was the second time it had been removed from the
case.

This is a gross over generalization. Most serious studies put the
lifespan of CD-R's at decades. I have created several multi session
CD-R's that are around 5 years old of which I have no problem reading
a single one. There are a few theories why *some* CD-R's degrade over
a period of a couple years or less. One would be the dye layer.
However all dye layers are not necessarily created equal. If they
were, then there would be no explaining why some CD-R's last several
times longer than others under similar conditions. One person claimed
that most CD-R's he put a label on became unreadable after a year or
two. Possibly the adhesive caused a problem. Some claim using the
wrong type of marker to label the CD-R's caused problems. Also
factoring in the mix, not all devices read equally (as you suggest
above). Some devices may be more sensitive to minor degradations than
others. It may also be possible all burners don't burn "equally".
 
This is a gross over generalization. Most serious studies put the
lifespan of CD-R's at decades. I have created several multi session
CD-R's that are around 5 years old of which I have no problem reading
a single one. There are a few theories why *some* CD-R's degrade over
a period of a couple years or less. One would be the dye layer.
However all dye layers are not necessarily created equal. If they
were, then there would be no explaining why some CD-R's last several
times longer than others under similar conditions. One person claimed
that most CD-R's he put a label on became unreadable after a year or
two. Possibly the adhesive caused a problem. Some claim using the
wrong type of marker to label the CD-R's caused problems. Also
factoring in the mix, not all devices read equally (as you suggest
above). Some devices may be more sensitive to minor degradations than
others. It may also be possible all burners don't burn "equally".

Here is a pretty good article:

http://www.melbpc.org.au/pcupdate/2106/2106article14.htm

Yes, many factors contribute to the ultimate lifespan of a CD-R. The
manufacturing process is the first, both for the CD-R and the CD
writer in your machine. If either has defects the lifespan will be
low. Different brands are produced with different materials and with
different manufacturing processes. Storage has an effect, as CD's
absorb water, oil and contaminants in the air. Ink from a magic marker
can be absorbed into and corrupt a CD-R. Temperature and humidity play
a role in where the CD-R is stored. Bright light can break down the
dye. High temperatures can harm CD-R's. The delivery truck's are not
air conditioned.

I think the point of stating that the life expectancy is 3-5 years is
due to all of the factors that can affect the CD-R and to alert us not
to be too complacent in storing important data on this particular
media. Should you surpass the expectancy... power to ya! But if you
have valuable data it is worthy to test your media to make sure it is
hanging with you, or better, select a better media, such as Cd-RW.

I am pretty skeptical that an off the shelf CD-R will last 100 years.
The manufacturers that hold this also give an unrecorded shelf life of
5-10 years. I might read more into this than there is, but it tends to
point to the instability of the dye layer.
 
There's more on the subject that might be of interest here:
http://www.langa.com/newsletters/2003/2003-11-03.htm#1
juzme

<snip>

It's always the simple things that count and failure to do them can
have unwelcome consequences. Always, always test your CDs after
burning to assure they are are correct. Most burning software comes
with that ability, the Nero CD Speed utility for example, or use the
freeware CDCheck
http://www.elpros.si/CDCheck/
Don't assume the burn is correct just because the CD plays.

Always keep your CDs in a cool, dark, dry place, a bottom dresser
drawer for example. Moulds and fungi can attack your disks by seeping
into the foil layer and bright light is never good. Know that the CDRs
you pack around with your Discman or in your car have the lifespan of
a gnat because of rough handling and exposure to sunlight and
shouldn't be your only copy. Never use Windex type cleaners or
detergents to clean your disks. Use a soft, damp cloth or a lint-free
tissue and a cleaner for coated plastic eyeglass lenses. You can get
decent sized bottles of plastic lense cleaner for a dollar or less
from dollar stores in North America. It's a blue solution called
"Clear Lens" and is made in Canada. Whatever the brand, if the
solution says plainly on the label that it is for plastic lenses it is
safe to use with CDRs. Do these simple things and your CDRs should
out-live you.
 
monkeyman said:
Always keep your CDs in a cool, dark, dry place, a bottom dresser
drawer for example. Moulds and fungi can attack your disks by seeping
into the foil layer and bright light is never good. Know that the CDRs

Good advice but not always necesssary.
CD-R left dye side up in direct summer sun
in 1996 for a day or so to test longevity
Whenever I can be bothered I have repeated the exposure
or dropped them under an actinic lamp for a while
probably 4 or 5 times.

still read fine,
that is by read error level not just apparent lack of problems.

They were $20 each then, and said that such exposure could possibly
affect longevity.
Perhaps the quality has changed , or they will only last 10 years
instead of 100 ;-)


If it verifies after writing okay and the label glue or pen doesn't eat
through they should be fine for many years.
If really important then duplicate, and store crc checks with files, and
verify periodically. standard archiving methods.

CD-RW packet writing on the other hand is a candle in the wind.
 
[""; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:45:37 GMT]
Yes, many factors contribute to the ultimate lifespan of a CD-R. [...]
Ink from a magic marker can be absorbed into and corrupt a CD-R.

Uh-oh. I used a medium-thick Sharpie on, like, 50 discs. I might have
really screwed myself ...
 
["Joe"; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 04:20:31 GMT]
You could try CD-Check (http://www.elpros.si/CDCheck/). It's free
but, if I remember well, there's a nag screen that pops up from time
to time. Aside from that, it's clean.

Thanks for the note. I got it and, sure enough, it found the error. It's
attempting to recover the file (it's just one huge PGP file), but it's
gonna be another couple of hours plus.
 
J44xm said:
[""; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:45:37 GMT]
Yes, many factors contribute to the ultimate lifespan of a CD-R. [...]
Ink from a magic marker can be absorbed into and corrupt a CD-R.

Uh-oh. I used a medium-thick Sharpie on, like, 50 discs. I might have
really screwed myself ...

Maybe not, at least for a while.
http://www.cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-7

Solvent based (Xylene , toluene, alcohol etc) based pens may penetrate
thin lacquer coats
but decent brand cds with good coating should be okay for a while.
Brand names often indicate they have some sort of enhanced laquer,
in truth most _are_ a little harder to peel but not a lot.
I haven't found a marker pen yet that has destroyed a reputable brand disk.
( though as time goes on..things may be happening )

With a thin or weak coat any grit can also scratch through the lacquer and
foil
letting moisture and oxidisation weaken the dye then the foil delaminates.
You can usually tell, the dye goes pretty colours.

A ball point pen or pencil with a tiny bit of grit will strip the foil right
quick.

CD-R marker pens are available for much the same price as normal
felt pens.

CDR
lacquer protective coat
foil <--
dye not a lot of a bond strength
plastic <--

As for repair and recovery, often you can get most files and perhaps
interpolate
those that have unreadable sections. If you have cunningly saved a few cents
by
storing large archives you are probably out of luck.
 
FYI, folks, things are fine. Turns out there was a significant smudge of
something on my disc. This didn't occur to me because I burned it and put
it right back on the spool of CD-Rs. How utterly silly and embarrassing.
Ah well ... I gots my files back, thoughs. Thanks all. (I still have that
CD program that was recommend ...)
 
J44xm said:
[""; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:45:37 GMT]
Yes, many factors contribute to the ultimate lifespan of a CD-R. [...]
Ink from a magic marker can be absorbed into and corrupt a CD-R.

Uh-oh. I used a medium-thick Sharpie on, like, 50 discs. I might have
really screwed myself ...

Maybe not, at least for a while.
http://www.cdrfaq.org/faq07.html#S7-7

Solvent based (Xylene , toluene, alcohol etc) based pens may penetrate
thin lacquer coats
but decent brand cds with good coating should be okay for a while.
Brand names often indicate they have some sort of enhanced laquer,
in truth most _are_ a little harder to peel but not a lot.
I haven't found a marker pen yet that has destroyed a reputable brand disk.
( though as time goes on..things may be happening )

With a thin or weak coat any grit can also scratch through the lacquer and
foil
letting moisture and oxidisation weaken the dye then the foil delaminates.
You can usually tell, the dye goes pretty colours.

A ball point pen or pencil with a tiny bit of grit will strip the foil right
quick.

CD-R marker pens are available for much the same price as normal
felt pens.

<snip>

Good advice. I use the TDK CD Mark. The things seem to last forever
and they are certified for labeling CDs.
 
Good advice but not always necesssary.
CD-R left dye side up in direct summer sun
in 1996 for a day or so to test longevity
Whenever I can be bothered I have repeated the exposure
or dropped them under an actinic lamp for a while
probably 4 or 5 times.

still read fine,
that is by read error level not just apparent lack of problems.

They were $20 each then, and said that such exposure could possibly
affect longevity.
Perhaps the quality has changed , or they will only last 10 years
instead of 100 ;-)
The light won't "erase" the disk, but over time it will effect the
plastic and make it brittle and hazy. So, short exposure to even
sunlight will not have an immediate effect. It's the long term decay
that UV causes in all plastics that aren't specially treated that
should be avoided.
 
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