Nikon super coolscan 5000 ED B&W film compatabilites

[Michael]

Does anyone know how I can turn ON the GEM and ROC functions when I am using the
16mm filmstrip holder to scan negatives on the 9000 ED? I can put the selected
frame into a GEPE 35mm mount and use the Nikon 35mm slide tray, but doing it
this way I can only scan one frame at a time.

Nikon Scan blanks these two functions out when using the 16mm tray.

I know Don has done some extensive analysis of the Nikon software from reading
his newsgroup posts. Maybe he can tell me how to turn these functions on.

Thanks in advance to all the scanning guru's who reply.

Michael.....

 

[Don]

Does anyone know how I can turn ON the GEM and ROC functions when I am using the
16mm filmstrip holder to scan negatives on the 9000 ED? I can put the selected
frame into a GEPE 35mm mount and use the Nikon 35mm slide tray, but doing it
this way I can only scan one frame at a time.

Nikon Scan blanks these two functions out when using the 16mm tray.

I know Don has done some extensive analysis of the Nikon software from reading
his newsgroup posts. Maybe he can tell me how to turn these functions on.

Thanks in advance to all the scanning guru's who reply.

Michael.....

I'm afraid I won't be much help, Michael, because I don't have the
16mm film strip holder (nor do I have the 9000, for that matter).

I know Kennedy has done some 16mm so maybe he knows?

Browsing the manual for NS4 (pages 63 & 64) I see it explicitly states
that ROC and GEM (and, indeed DEE on page 65) are intentionally
disabled for the FH-816 (the 16mm holder) but doesn't say why!?

I'm assuming these functions work just fine when you scan using the
slide adapter so this looks like a "marketing-based malfunction". :-/

What's weird is that Nikon does that for cheaper scanners (e.g.
disabling multiscanning) but since 9000 is top of the line, that
doesn't make sense.

If you haven't done so already, perhaps, try writing to Nikon's
so-called "support" and ask why this is. However, don't hold your
breath since (in my experience) this "support" is massively
incompetent and gets confused by any question more difficult than
"where's the on/off switch"...

The only other thing (which I suspect may not really be an option) is
to look through the code. I found where the exposure is handled and
extended it to +16 AG (instead of the default +2) but the exact place
will differ depending on the version. I also found the place where I
can turn on multiscanning for the LS-50 but it doesn't do much good
because it appears to require a firmware modification as well. But I
haven't looked much through the GEM/ROC/DEE stuff.

Don.

 

[Don]

Does anyone know how I can turn ON the GEM and ROC functions when I am using the
16mm filmstrip holder to scan negatives on the 9000 ED? I can put the selected
frame into a GEPE 35mm mount and use the Nikon 35mm slide tray, but doing it
this way I can only scan one frame at a time.

Nikon Scan blanks these two functions out when using the 16mm tray.

P.S.

Thinking about this some more (even though I don't really use GEM and
friends) all of these functions are based on image content. Therefore,
in case of 16mm film, as the image changes from frame to frame, so
will the results of all of these functions. These differences may
cause undesirable effects, for example, as the shot pans and thereby
changes image content (brightness, colors, etc). In other words, this
may result in various color casts sweeping in and out, etc.

I'm guessing that would be the official Nikon excuse. ;o)

Now then, GEM, ROC and DEE can be purchased separately as Photoshop
plug-ins (http://www.asf.com). Indeed, these plug-ins are much more
flexible (more options) than the corresponding built-in NikonScan
functions. So you could scan your 16mm film using the FH-816 and then
do GEM/ROC/DEE in post processing. In that way, it should also be
easier to "freeze" the setting for the shot as a whole and avoid above
problems (although I'm not sure if the plug-ins can be made to work in
batch mode on a number of images?). The catch is you have to buy these
functions again!

I'm guessing that's the real reason why Nikon disabled them (rather
than pay the ASF the full fee)! ;o)

Don.

 

[Michael]

Don,

I am only scanning one frame at a time so "image content" is whatever is in that
one frame. Like when I use the 120 film strip tray. Each tray uses different
id holes on their insertion edges.

Thanks for the asf.com web address. And I am guessing you are correct about
Nikon not wanting to pay the licensing fee. We all know how inexpensive their
products are. I think they are carrying their philosophy over from their camera
line that "there is always something extra for you to buy".

Michael......

 

[Michael]

Browsing the manual for NS4 (pages 63 & 64) I see it explicitly states
that ROC and GEM (and, indeed DEE on page 65) are intentionally
disabled for the FH-816 (the 16mm holder) but doesn't say why!?

Yes Don, Nikon tells about these disabled functions in their operating manual
GEM, ROC, and DEE. But DEE is not disabled at all. A software oversight? I am
afraid to notify Nikon about this. They might send me a software patch to help
me out and permanently disable this feature. Info kinda hidden on the bottom of
the page.

I'm assuming these functions work just fine when you scan using the
slide adapter so this looks like a "marketing-based malfunction". :-/

All 35mm and 120 scans produce gorgeous results. I am really impressed with the
scanners performance.

What's weird is that Nikon does that for cheaper scanners (e.g.
disabling multiscanning) but since 9000 is top of the line, that
doesn't make sense.

Something happened at their headquarters for sure.

If you haven't done so already, perhaps, try writing to Nikon's
so-called "support" and ask why this is. However, don't hold your
breath since (in my experience) this "support" is massively
incompetent and gets confused by any question more difficult than
"where's the on/off switch"...

I will write, and I agree with you about their support.

The only other thing (which I suspect may not really be an option) is
to look through the code. I found where the exposure is handled and

The last time I used a disassembler was on 8085 architecture.

.....But I haven't looked much through the GEM/ROC/DEE stuff.

If you do, and are successful, send me the HEX addressees and the values to
change.

Michael.....

 

[Michael]

I found where the exposure is handled and
extended it to +16 AG (instead of the default +2) but the exact place
will differ depending on the version. I also found the place where I
can turn on multiscanning for the LS-50 but it doesn't do much good
because it appears to require a firmware modification as well. But I
haven't looked much through the GEM/ROC/DEE stuff.

I would be a little afraid to alter anything on the Nikon 9000. Because it is
built like a tank and sounds like one while scanning. I might activate some
embedded military function and my house might be destroyed. It sounds a little
like that toy Godzilla I had as a kid, only more powerful.

Michael.....

 

[rafe b]

I would be a little afraid to alter anything on the Nikon 9000. Because it is
built like a tank and sounds like one while scanning. I might activate some
embedded military function and my house might be destroyed. It sounds a little
like that toy Godzilla I had as a kid, only more powerful.

As an engineer, I've always been puzzled by
the sounds emitted by the CoolScan 8000 --
how such a fine machine can sound so
incredibly... coarse.


rafe b
www.terrapinphoto.com

 

[Michael]

I tell myself that it just a stepper motor, but not like any I ve heard in
years. And when the scan actually begins it sounds like pneumatics are
involved. A noise something like in the first Exorcist movie when Linda Blair
was being x-rayed. Further reasons why not to open it up.

Michael.....

 

[Kennedy McEwen]

I'm afraid I won't be much help, Michael, because I don't have the
16mm film strip holder (nor do I have the 9000, for that matter).

I know Kennedy has done some 16mm so maybe he knows?

Not on the large scanners, and not with the 16mm film strip adapter. :-(

 

[Don]

Yes Don, Nikon tells about these disabled functions in their operating manual
GEM, ROC, and DEE. But DEE is not disabled at all. A software oversight?

That's interesting!

I am
afraid to notify Nikon about this. They might send me a software patch to help
me out and permanently disable this feature. Info kinda hidden on the bottom of
the page.

I don't think you have to worry about that. Nikon hasn't fixed the
film strip adapter bug that crashes NikonScan for a couple of years
now so I doubt they'll go through the trouble of disabling DEE. It
seems like Nikon stopped all scanner development a while back.

The last time I used a disassembler was on 8085 architecture.


If you do, and are successful, send me the HEX addressees and the values to
change.

I'd be happy to, Michael, but the problem is I have so much to do it's
not likely I'll be able to look into it any time soon. :-(

Don.

 

[Don]

I would be a little afraid to alter anything on the Nikon 9000.

No, that was all in software.

Because it is
built like a tank and sounds like one while scanning. I might activate some
embedded military function and my house might be destroyed. It sounds a little
like that toy Godzilla I had as a kid, only more powerful.

Don.

 

[Don]

As an engineer, I've always been puzzled by
the sounds emitted by the CoolScan 8000 --
how such a fine machine can sound so
incredibly... coarse.

I saw a documentary recently on how companies (especially in car
manufacturing) pay a lot of attention to how a product (in this case a
car) sounds. They actually go through a lot of trouble and expense to
make a car "sound right" e.g. they would do such drastic things like
change the position of the engine, use different materials etc just to
get the "right" sound. Nothing to do with performance, but just to get
the "vroom".

Apparently, this is something Nikon doesn't seem to be aware of! ;o)

I for one don't mind at all because, given the choice, I always prefer
function over form!

Don.

 

[Don]

I am only scanning one frame at a time so "image content" is whatever is in that
one frame. Like when I use the 120 film strip tray. Each tray uses different
id holes on their insertion edges.

OK, in that case it's fine and you shouldn't have any problems.

Thanks for the asf.com web address. And I am guessing you are correct about
Nikon not wanting to pay the licensing fee.

BTW, something else just occurred to me! The three plug-ins ASF sells
are GEM, ROC and *SHO* (not DEE)!

Since ASF don't sell DEE separately, there was no reason to disable
it! That would seem to further confirm that the reason GEM and ROC are
disabled in NikonScan is simply due to licensing. Disgusting!

I absolutely loath it when companies do that and intentionally cripple
products for marketing reasons (like the aforementioned disabling of
mulitscanning on the LS-50).

I know the bean counters and marketroids are just trying to maximize
profits, but intentionally crippling devices is just despicable!

Don.

 

[rafe b]

I for one don't mind at all because, given the choice, I always prefer
function over form!

Yes, as an engineer, I do too -- and that's why
I care about the sounds made by mechanical things.

Doctors care about sounds too -- that's why they
carry stethescopes. They care about the noises
made by your heart and your lungs.

Sound is, at the very least, wasted energy. It
is also noise pollution -- and being partially
deaf, I take that very seriously.

But most worrisome, a machine that "sounds bad"
often is bad. Somehow, while it hasn't happened
yet (in 4.5 years or so) my LS-8000 always
sounds like it's about to fly apart, or like
there's a loose part inside. Many others have
made similar observations.

When it comes to rotating machinery, less noise
is *always* a good thing.

As a counter-example (to the Nikon) I've always
been impressed and amazed by Honda's automobile
engines, particulary at idle. If you can hear
them at all, you hear a quiet purr.


rafe b
www.terrapinphoto.com

 

[Don]

Yes, as an engineer, I do too -- and that's why
I care about the sounds made by mechanical things.

Doctors care about sounds too -- that's why they
carry stethescopes. They care about the noises
made by your heart and your lungs.

Sound is, at the very least, wasted energy. It
is also noise pollution -- and being partially
deaf, I take that very seriously.

But most worrisome, a machine that "sounds bad"
often is bad. Somehow, while it hasn't happened
yet (in 4.5 years or so) my LS-8000 always
sounds like it's about to fly apart, or like
there's a loose part inside. Many others have
made similar observations.

Oh, I agree with all of that!

The point I was trying to make is that Nikon's gurgling is not a sign
of anything bad. It's just the way its mechanics naturally sound given
the acoustic environment of its metal box, etc. And Nikon didn't try
to hide it concentrating instead on more important things.

However, over the years users have been conditioned (under the
influence of marketroids) to expect certain noises. Therefore, when
faced with natural noises, all of a sudden we perceive them as "bad".

The same thing happened to our taste. Recently, research revealed that
people prefer artificial flavors to natural flavors (they are trying
to emulate). The younger the person the more pronounced this is as
some have never even tasted natural flavors. The end result is that
natural flavors are perceived as "bad".

Don.