R
Rod
The way I read it, the word donation was mentioned in a OT manner before
there was something to say thank you for.
The way I read it, the word donation was mentioned in a OT manner before
there was something to say thank you for.
M
ms
MLC said:
If you read earlier in the thread, I *did* thank him for creating a no-install.
When it finally happened, I was put off when he expected a donation for freeware.
Mike Sa
S
Susan Bugher
Rod said:
The author was asked to do some extra work. He said no and explained
why. Instead of accepting that (What part of NO don't you understand?)
the OP asked *again* if the author would do something special just for him.
Posting the URL to the donations page implied "Perhaps *you* would like
to do something special for *me*."
Evidently that was too subtle. . .
Susan
D
Donald Lessau
Susan Bugher said:
thank you!
Donald
R
Rod
Like I said, the way I read it was as I described above.
The author didn't say no, he said something like "I could... but"
So there was no part of NO to not understand.
Subtility in answers can and will cause confusion, and are a easy way to
say "I meant that and that" afterwards.
I agree on the fact that the OP was a bit pushy, and apparently subtility
wouldn't do the trick.
But asking for money as a subtle answer in a freeware newsgroup ? I can
live without that.
But then again, maybe I'm not bright enough to participate in this
newsgroup.
S
Susan Bugher
Rod said:
Sure - sometimes. OTOH some people say *FOAD* and some people try to
refuse gracefully. The latter may lead to confusion - as it did here.
Donald Lessau goes out of his way to be both polite and helpful. Read
his posts in other threads. I think you'll find he's one of the good guys.
Susan
M
MLC
_Susan Bugher_, lunedì 15/nov/2004:
I think like you. It's for this reason I reacted.
I think like you. It's for this reason I reacted.
R
Rod
And some people say something clear that lies in the big area in between.
I read his posts and have been following his product. He's indeed a very
helpful and polite person. I also consider myself a polite and helpful
person, that doesn't mean I do something wrong sometimes and people can
aomment on that.
S
Susan Bugher
Rod said:
Your interpretation of what was posted and my interpretation differ. I
see no wrong doing. I do see a misunderstanding. If you've never been
misunderstood you're a lucky person. . . and probably unique.
Susan
M
ms
Susan said:
It has always been odd to me when authors only provide an install, than state that
it has no effect, really. The people that use the program usually know how to
handle an executable.
I'll say to you what I said to MLC, you misread my posts. I was reasonable in what
I asked, the author was concerned about the license text, and I explained how I
felt. He then kindly provided a no-install version. I had thanked him previously.
Asking for a donation afterward was inappropriate IMO, even if he is helpful
otherwise which I have noticed.
I was not "pushy" and you added some misunderstanding to my thread with Donald.
Mike Sa
M
ms
Rod, you at least read what I wrote in the thread.Rod said:
Mike Sa
D
Donald Lessau
Rod said:
True, but I don't think I did anything wrong here. Apart from maybe breaking
a taboo of mentioning money in a freeware NG. Which should not be a taboo in
my opinion. Money is (among a lot of other functions) a symbolic
acknowledgement for the time and energy that has been invested by somebody.
Saying "thank you" is another way to do the same thing. Having said that I
agree, of course, that asking for money is OT in this NG.
But did I ask for money? No! As Susan correctly understood, I just offered
Mr. Sa an opportunity to return a favor or to even advance a favor (Why
not?! After all he has asked me for a very specific personal favor.). In his
following post he completely ignored this (maybe he already started being
"put off") and just repeated his request in a way that was in fact a bit
pushy (but maybe this time I was lost on the subtility
). I then fulfilledhis request and repeated my request (which put him off even more). From then
on I never heard of him again. No "thank you" and, of course, no donation.
His claim that he thanked me is wrong. He only thanked me in advance
*before* he got what he wanted, and there's a more than subtle difference
between a TIA and a "thank you" after the action, don't you agree?
Concerning the "subtility" in my answer, yes, I could not resist the
temptation to put some "formal irony" into it which obviously failed to
arrive everywhere: I just mirrored his ways of approaching me to let him
experience the feeling. Push the pusher, you know.
Donald
H
Harvey Van Sickle
It has always been odd to me when authors only provide an install,
than state that it has no effect, really. The people that use the
program usually know how to handle an executable.
I'll say to you what I said to MLC, you misread my posts. I was
reasonable in what I asked, the author was concerned about the
license text, and I explained how I felt. He then kindly provided
a no-install version. I had thanked him previously.[/QUOTE]
And it would have really busted your gut to say thanks again -- after
the favour had been given....some people...
M
ms
Donald said:snip
But did I ask for money? No! As Susan correctly understood, I just offered
Mr. Sa an opportunity to return a favor or to even advance a favor (Why
not?! After all he has asked me for a very specific personal favor.). In his
following post he completely ignored this (maybe he already started being
"put off") and just repeated his request in a way that was in fact a bit
pushy (but maybe this time I was lost on the subtility
his request and repeated my request (which put him off even more). From then
on I never heard of him again. No "thank you" and, of course, no donation.
His claim that he thanked me is wrong. He only thanked me in advance
*before* he got what he wanted, and there's a more than subtle difference
between a TIA and a "thank you" after the action, don't you agree?
Concerning the "subtility" in my answer, yes, I could not resist the
temptation to put some "formal irony" into it which obviously failed to
arrive everywhere: I just mirrored his ways of approaching me to let him
experience the feeling. Push the pusher, you know.
Donald
Here was your post
A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the) Forum:http://www.trackerv3.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=154
still don't see no donation,
Donald
You weren't politely suggesting, you were plainly requesting a donation in return
for a simple act that other authors did as a matter of course.
I am normally courteous, as you might see from past posts. I explained earlier why
you did not hear from me again.
Mike Sa
D
Donald Lessau
snip
That was my second post, after you ignored my first one. My "still don't see
no donation" was a parody of your anormally uncourteous "At your site- still
don't see the no-install version??" You are not the only one that did not
get that little joke.
Is it really so hard for you being asked for a favor? You still do not
appear to have regained an emotional condition that allows you to simply
thank me. That "simple act" (can you know?) cost me about 20 min, and I gave
them just for you, baby! Enjoy...
Donald
That was my second post, after you ignored my first one. My "still don't see
no donation" was a parody of your anormally uncourteous "At your site- still
don't see the no-install version??" You are not the only one that did not
get that little joke.
Is it really so hard for you being asked for a favor? You still do not
appear to have regained an emotional condition that allows you to simply
thank me. That "simple act" (can you know?) cost me about 20 min, and I gave
them just for you, baby! Enjoy...
Donald
M
ms
"Is it really so hard for you being asked for a favor?"Donald said:
That's what I really asked you.
You said OK as a one-time thing, and we went from there, and I thanked you for
going ahead with it. And then, you asked to get paid for it, so I did not thank
you for doing it. If you had said that up front, that would have ended it.
Justify all you want, I deleted the program, it's not worth this crap. You may be
helpful to others, but that's certainly not what I've seen.
Mike
O
omega
Donald Lessau said:
I've one thing to say (with sincerity): Thank you, Donald!
I've got a large E-Card to send you, with lots of animation and tracking,
plus a few active-X routines. Will that suffice?
S
Susan Bugher
ms said:
Cheesh Mike,
Donald thinks you were pushy, you think he had his hand out. I think
he's wrong about you and you're wrong about him. Donald doesn't know you
have a one track mind. You don't recognize his type of humor.
Look at the exchanges:
MIKE: As a one-time thing. . . if you could provide it. . . . YMMV. . . .
DONALD: YMMV... the same is true with users. Just as a one-time thing
MIKE: still don't see the no-install version
DONALD: still don't see no donation
Do you really think that's a *serious* request for money? He's tweaking
your tail because he thinks you're being pushy.
IMO you're both good guys. . . maybe you could take a deep breath and
label this as another great failure to communicate. . .
Susan
R
Rod
Your interpretation of what was posted and my interpretation differ. I
see no wrong doing. I do see a misunderstanding. If you've never been
misunderstood you're a lucky person. . . and probably unique.
Yep, our interpretations in this matter differ.
I am a very lucky person and everyone is unique, and obviously everyone is
misunderstood once every while, which reminds me to blow the dust of my old
santa esmeralda album.
R
Rod
SNIP
Donald, you and Mike have both been helpful and polite persons in this
newsgroup. I have no beef with you, you and Mike should 'fix' things or at
least agree to disagree (or not, whatever you both wish). I just doubt the
fact that you didn't wanted money for the extra work, but that's just my
opinion against yours. And I think it shouldn't have been mentioned here. I
can agree to disagree with you. No use in continuing this discussion for
me.
A lot of people like your product, keep up the good work.
Now I'll go back to something more usefull, before you're gonna charge me
for your posting time