J
jhunter
For those who backup more than 80 GB nightly, how do you perform your
backup? Hardware? Software?
backup? Hardware? Software?
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R
Rod Speed
For those who backup more than 80 GB nightly, how
do you perform your backup? Hardware? Software?
You need to say if its 80G new every
night or if its the same 80G every night.
If its the same 80G every night, hard drive as the destination
and True Image works pretty well. You have a choice of
backing up by partition or folder/specified files etc.
J
jhunter
I need to backup 80 GB per night and I need to store it offsite.
R
Rod Speed
(e-mail address removed) wrote
AGAIN, you need to say if thats 80GB of NEW data every night
or basically the same 80G with some of that 80G changing daily.
Thats not necessarily a major consideration. External hard
drives or eSATA drives would be fine as long as it isnt 80G
of NEW data every night. Basically because you arent
producing 80G of NEW data every night and so can reuse
the hard drive(s) with some swap scheme.
If you do produce 80G of new data every
night, its really only tape thats viable.
I need to backup 80 GB per night
AGAIN, you need to say if thats 80GB of NEW data every night
or basically the same 80G with some of that 80G changing daily.
and I need to store it offsite.
Thats not necessarily a major consideration. External hard
drives or eSATA drives would be fine as long as it isnt 80G
of NEW data every night. Basically because you arent
producing 80G of NEW data every night and so can reuse
the hard drive(s) with some swap scheme.
If you do produce 80G of new data every
night, its really only tape thats viable.
J
jhunter
It's basically the same 80G with some of that 80G changing daily (for
me) BUT I do have a client that has about 70GB of new data daily so I'd
like to see what people use in both scenarios.
me) BUT I do have a client that has about 70GB of new data daily so I'd
like to see what people use in both scenarios.
R
Rod Speed
It's basically the same 80G with some of that 80G changing daily
(for me) BUT I do have a client that has about 70GB of new data
daily so I'd like to see what people use in both scenarios.
They use what I said, hard drives and tapes.
Hard drives have significant advantages when its not
mostly new data, basically they are a lot faster and
less twitchy, but they dont like being dropped.
A
Al Dykes
They use what I said, hard drives and tapes.
Hard drives have significant advantages when its not
mostly new data, basically they are a lot faster and
less twitchy, but they dont like being dropped.
Yes, but I wouldn't want to drop the DLT cartridge that would get me
fired if it couldn't be read.
I expect there will be a market for backpack eSATA drives that are
padded in rubber and shock mounted. Disk drives, when powered off,
can survive low 3-digit G force shock. An inch of rubber will provide
that, easily. Not that this helps the OP, now.
Depending on the OPs retention requirements, I'd find disks
attractive. Everything is about a buck per GB these days. And you
can buy lots of disk trays for the $1000 a good tape drive costs.
Disks have the advantage of being trivially and cheaply readable on
any cheap computer, long into the future. You can't say that about the
tape drive you were using 5 years ago.
J
jhunter
It's basically the same 80G with some of that 80G changing daily (for
me) BUT I do have a client that has about 70GB of new data daily so I'd
like to see what people use in both scenarios.
me) BUT I do have a client that has about 70GB of new data daily so I'd
like to see what people use in both scenarios.
R
Rod Speed
Yes, but I wouldn't want to drop the DLT cartridge
that would get me fired if it couldn't be read.
Sure, but there is a difference between something that will
normally survive a drop fine, and something that normally wont.
I expect there will be a market for backpack eSATA
drives that are padded in rubber and shock mounted.
Yep, and it isnt that hard to do yourself if you need one.
Disk drives, when powered off, can survive low 3-digit
G force shock. An inch of rubber will provide that, easily.
Specially if you use laptop drives.
Not that this helps the OP, now.
Yes it does for all except the 70G new data per day situation.
Not economic for that one tho.
Depending on the OPs retention requirements, I'd find disks
attractive. Everything is about a buck per GB these days. And you
can buy lots of disk trays for the $1000 a good tape drive costs.
And you have a much more viable product if you use sata too.
Disks have the advantage of being trivially and cheaply readable
on any cheap computer, long into the future. You can't say that
about the tape drive you were using 5 years ago.
And its much more likely to be still usable in 5 years too.
A
Arno Wagner
Previously said:For those who backup more than 80 GB nightly, how do you perform your
backup? Hardware? Software?
Cron-job starts GNU tar that pushes the data over the network via
ssh to a tape-archive.
Arno
J
jhunter
Anyone have just one computer (no network) that they backup? What
hardware and software do you use?
hardware and software do you use?
A
Al Dykes
Anyone have just one computer (no network) that they backup? What
hardware and software do you use?
If this is an average home computer with important pictures and some
important files such as that book you are writing or some tax data,
all your data can be burned into CDR disks and it may fit on one 600MB
CD. Do it daily and get the CDs offsite.
In addition, you need to prepare for the day that your disk dies. This
involves keeping copies of all the serial numbers you needed to
install software. I recommend burning any sofware I buy over the
internet to CDRs, keeping the proof of purchase and writing down all
serial numbers needed to install the software.
The downside of this is when your disk dies the reinstallation is a
real PITA and takes time unles you are an expert. YOu may find you
don't have all the setup CDs or serial numbers.
The next step up is to put a second disk in your machine, big and
cheap. Make it a 200GB disk. Buy some software like Acronis True Image
and do full disk-to-disk backups to the second disk. It's big enough
to keep two or three generations of backup (that's *very* important)
and if you need to replace your C drive it will be a piece of cake to
restore from the backup disk.
There are two risks to this setup; It's rare but possible that a
failure will kill both disks at once or that a house fire will destroy
everything. You address this by burning CDRs for you irreplaceable
data and keeping them offsite.
M
max
Anyone have just one computer (no network) that they backup? What
hardware and software do you use?
I've set this up for a number of not-very-technical friends and
family, and use 2 basic configurations, depending on their PC.
Desktop users: 2nd internal hard drive and True Image from
www.acronis.com.
Laptop users: external USB2 drive and True Image.
I run a full image once a week, incremental images every day except
the full image day, and an alternate full image 3-4 days away from the
primary full image.
Ideally, I like to store the alternate on a different device than the
primary, but that's getting a bit more complicated and requires more
devices.
The alternate provides a bit of redundancy in case the main backup
goes bad for some reason (and a failure during the full image creation
will wipe out the whole backup). If they don't churn a whole lot of
data, none of the backups take very long, and they don't even notice
the incrementals.
The only problem with all this is that TI isn't much good at letting
you know when a backup has failed, so the log needs to be checked on a
regular basis (this could be automated with a bit of effort).
Now, if you want to take backups offsite, you're really limited to
either removables or multiple externals, assuming such a user wouldn't
want to deal with tape (which I hate). This greatly complicates
things, and increases the expense a fair bit.
max
J
jhunter
I DO need to take my backups (80GB total size) off-site. Most, if not
all, of the suggestions here so far do NOT allow to take backups
off-site (one fire could put a company out of business). Are small
businesses, with no server, not taking backups off-site? Are there tape
drives designed for non-servers (workstations and notebooks)? I think
HP has discontinuted all of their low end tape drives. I just can't
believe that small businesses aren't storing their backups off-site.
After what happened regarding 911 you would think that affordable
off-site backup would be available even for en small businesses.
all, of the suggestions here so far do NOT allow to take backups
off-site (one fire could put a company out of business). Are small
businesses, with no server, not taking backups off-site? Are there tape
drives designed for non-servers (workstations and notebooks)? I think
HP has discontinuted all of their low end tape drives. I just can't
believe that small businesses aren't storing their backups off-site.
After what happened regarding 911 you would think that affordable
off-site backup would be available even for en small businesses.
A
Al Dykes
I DO need to take my backups (80GB total size) off-site. Most, if not
all, of the suggestions here so far do NOT allow to take backups
off-site (one fire could put a company out of business). Are small
businesses, with no server, not taking backups off-site? Are there tape
drives designed for non-servers (workstations and notebooks)? I think
HP has discontinuted all of their low end tape drives. I just can't
believe that small businesses aren't storing their backups off-site.
After what happened regarding 911 you would think that affordable
off-site backup would be available even for en small businesses.
Do incrementals to a CDR or DVDR and put it in your pocket to take
home each day, or get an ISP host and move the incremental files to it
each day.
I can think of a bunch of ways of syncing My Documents on the PC with
the ISP service.
You need to think about retention requirements and allowable downtime
in the event of a disaster. Only you and you lawyer and accountant
can help you. And your boss, if that's not you.
A
Arno Wagner
Previously said:I DO need to take my backups (80GB total size) off-site. Most, if not
all, of the suggestions here so far do NOT allow to take backups
off-site (one fire could put a company out of business).
I think is you want to take full backups off-site and cannot do it
via network, then professional tape, like AIT or DLT is your
best option. Also if you need fast business continuity, have
a cold spare system off-site, that yuou can move in andf restore
the backup to in the timeframe you needf. This also allows
you to test your backup and restoration procedure, and you should
do so at least once a year.
Are small businesses, with no server, not taking backups off-site?
Only those that have been bitten before. There is little experience
with long-term data storage and computing in the general population
after all.
Are there tape
drives designed for non-servers (workstations and notebooks)?
Workstation or server makes no difference. You might need an SCSI card,
but you can put that into a waorkstation as well.
I think
HP has discontinuted all of their low end tape drives. I just can't
believe that small businesses aren't storing their backups off-site.
See above. I completely agree that storing backups off-site
is necessary for any type of dependable operation. Still, most
beople operating small IT infrastrucures do not know that.
In some decades this will get better, because the fact that
HDDs fail will be common knowledge then.
After what happened regarding 911 you would think that affordable
off-site backup would be available even for en small businesses.
Well, 911 is overrated. While politics exploit it as a huge desaster
(for their own reasons, such as better control of the population or
hiding their own incompetence), from a business perspective it was
a smaller event. Erthquakes, hurricanes, etc. are a much more real
threat.
And as to "affordable", I think that, say, 600 EUR/USD for a 100GB
AIT drive and another 650EUR/USD for 10 100GB tapes, or 800EUR/UDS
for an 160GB DLT drive and another 400EUR/UDS for 10 160GB tapes
is entirely reasonable and affordable. After all these are not
TRAVAN or DAT "write only" backups you want.
Arno
P
Peter
I DO need to take my backups (80GB total size) off-site. Most, if not
LTO2 is a preferable option (about 1,500$ plus tapes).
Otherwise a dedicated laptop(s) and a network is good option, if you don't
like external hard drives.
You would need a 100GB drive inside a laptop though (950$ or less for a
brand new laptop).
all, of the suggestions here so far do NOT allow to take backups
off-site (one fire could put a company out of business). Are small
businesses, with no server, not taking backups off-site? Are there tape
drives designed for non-servers (workstations and notebooks)? I think
HP has discontinuted all of their low end tape drives. I just can't
believe that small businesses aren't storing their backups off-site.
After what happened regarding 911 you would think that affordable
off-site backup would be available even for en small businesses.
LTO2 is a preferable option (about 1,500$ plus tapes).
Otherwise a dedicated laptop(s) and a network is good option, if you don't
like external hard drives.
You would need a 100GB drive inside a laptop though (950$ or less for a
brand new laptop).
A
Al Dykes
LTO2 is a preferable option (about 1,500$ plus tapes).
Otherwise a dedicated laptop(s) and a network is good option, if you don't
like external hard drives.
You would need a 100GB drive inside a laptop though (950$ or less for a
brand new laptop).
Never write on your only backup. You'd need at least 2 laptops.
What's your growth? Are you going to backup up 100GB a year from
now?
R
Rod Speed
(e-mail address removed) wrote
Fine, anyone with a clue does that too unless its
feasible to have the backup in a fireproof safe onsite.
Oh bullshit. External hard drives were mentioned right
from the start. Completely routine to do offsite with those.
Indeed. Tho any decent system should be able
to write what matters to a DVD occasionally for
protection against that and have that offsite.
Doesnt have a damned thing to do with whether there is a server or not.
Any tape drive can work in a workstation fine.
Notebooks normally use external drives.
Perfectly feasible to take an external drive offsite.
Just not that practical for the 70G of new data
every day situation, as I said more than once.
Quite a few dont. Yes, they will discover
the downsides if the place burns down etc.
Quite a few arent fully insured anyway, just because that
isnt economically viable. Its just a risk they take. There arent
that many small businesses that do burn down accidentally.
It is, external hard drives, stupid. Nothing to do with 911.
Just take that drive home with you at the end of the day etc.
I DO need to take my backups (80GB total size) off-site.
Fine, anyone with a clue does that too unless its
feasible to have the backup in a fireproof safe onsite.
Most, if not all, of the suggestions here so
far do NOT allow to take backups off-site
Oh bullshit. External hard drives were mentioned right
from the start. Completely routine to do offsite with those.
(one fire could put a company out of business).
Indeed. Tho any decent system should be able
to write what matters to a DVD occasionally for
protection against that and have that offsite.
Are small businesses, with no server, not taking backups off-site?
Doesnt have a damned thing to do with whether there is a server or not.
Are there tape drives designed for non-servers (workstations and notebooks)?
Any tape drive can work in a workstation fine.
Notebooks normally use external drives.
Perfectly feasible to take an external drive offsite.
Just not that practical for the 70G of new data
every day situation, as I said more than once.
I think HP has discontinuted all of their low
end tape drives. I just can't believe that small
businesses aren't storing their backups off-site.
Quite a few dont. Yes, they will discover
the downsides if the place burns down etc.
Quite a few arent fully insured anyway, just because that
isnt economically viable. Its just a risk they take. There arent
that many small businesses that do burn down accidentally.
After what happened regarding 911 you would
think that affordable off-site backup would be
available even for en small businesses.
It is, external hard drives, stupid. Nothing to do with 911.
Just take that drive home with you at the end of the day etc.
P
Peter
LTO2 is a preferable option (about 1,500$ plus tapes).
One is better than none.
My growth? I stopped growing some time ago. Ask OP.
Laptop drives are easy to replace.
Never write on your only backup. You'd need at least 2 laptops.
One is better than none.
What's your growth? Are you going to backup up 100GB a year from
now?
My growth? I stopped growing some time ago. Ask OP.
Laptop drives are easy to replace.