General Schvantzkoph - future best CPU

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von nummans mates magnum bottle with bloated neck :)
Apparently, he doesn't consider it to be affordable now or to have been
affordable last year, so he must mean that they will become as
affordable as today's 4GB (or 2GB?) systems. I'd be tickled to death if
a pair of 4GB SO-DIMMs in a year for today's price of a pair of 1GB
SO-DIMMs ... or if a set of 4 2GB DIMMs will be available for today's
price of a set of 4 1/2 GB DIMMs (they're currently different in price
by a factor of 10 or so).
Click to expand...

maybe the'll have compression pages built in??

400MHz -> 8GB = about 18 seconds to use all memory banks fastest. is
this a power waste??
64 bit Windows 2003 server will probably be quite standard in 12
months.
Click to expand...

emphisis on server and big brother.

i just wonder what the next MCUSIWYG more crap you see is what you get
word processor will be like. UTF-256 so we can invent new alien
languages which will not fit in the unicde user area.

just think of the number of years my spreadsheet could cover, i'll have
to buy life extension!

preload that dvd just for no reason but to spin up to 200000 billion
revs and waste mega whatts on sustaining unplayed video. oooh the power
:)

8GB graphics cards and 4GB main memory pheew i just got to see the moon
shining out of the badies arse :)

hehe, o snes though art more benifluent of beer, ciggis and the pocket.
must be the only way the hairdryer with disk and tarty graphics can be
justified.

cheers hehe :) hehehe
 
Stephen said:
The simple answer when dealing with any tech purchase is to wait as long
as you can stand it, because there's always something better, faster,
and cheaper about to come out.

Of course, you have to weigh the cost of not having the newer machine
while you wait, so it's not so simple in reality, particularly if you
don't have a dollar cost for the time spent waiting. Is having today's
hottest machine for the next 6 mos worth the extra money you'd spend
over what that machine would cost 6 mos from now? Only you can answer
that.

I'd advise you to check out AnandTech, Tom's Hardware, and other similar
enthusiast sites to get the roadmaps from Intel and AMD and make your
own decisions. My personal strategy is to buy one of the first boards
available with a new socket and the cheapest processor that'll fit at
the time, then hold off on upgrading the CPU until the socket is dead
and the fastest processor for it goes on sale for being "obsolete". I
skip the next socket, then repeat the process when the _next_ socket
comes out. I don't stay at the cutting edge, but I'm reasonably close
and spend less than half the money of people that upgrade every chance
they get.

S
Click to expand...


I'm very intrigued. OK, say I am going to buy a motheroard with socket
in April, that will accomodate a fast (the fastest?) chip that will be
out as that socket goes out of fashion (isn't that what you are
saying?). So, which motherboard/socket would you recommend for next
April? Even though the money can't be spend after April/May, I don't
mind spending a up to a grand further down the road to upgrade the CPU.


So, how can you know which socket to get in the future? Do you know
what's coming up?

Thanks a lot.....

(BTW, the link for the system I quoted is in the message. If not, let
me know and I'll post it. I'm sure they'd love the business.)
 
Read in one of the computer mags that AM2 will be around for a "few" years.
Personnally, I don't think AMD can afford to wait to get DDR3 up while Intel
uses it. I wonder if all those people switching to conroe will now have to
start using an Intel news group instead of this one? Probably be leaving
messges about how great their computer runs trying to switch us over. Won't
ever convince me.

--
Love and Teach, Not Yell and Beat
Stop Violence and Child Abuse.
No such thing as Bad Kids. Only Bad Parents.
Friends don't turn friends on to drugs.
The path often thought about and sometimes chosen by abused children as
adults is Suicide. Be a real friend.

A64 3500+, Gigabyte GA-K8NSC-939,AIW 9800 128mb
MSI 550 Pro, X-Fi, Pioneer 110D, 111D
Antec 550 watt,Thermaltake Lanfire,2 Gb Dual Channel OCZ
2XSATA 320gb Raid Edition, PATA 120Gb
XPMCE2005, 19in Viewsonic,BenchMark 2001 SE- 19074
Games I'm Playing- Falcon 4, SP:WAW
 
* (e-mail address removed):
Apparently, he doesn't consider it to be affordable now or to have been
affordable last year, so he must mean that they will become as
affordable as today's 4GB (or 2GB?) systems.
Click to expand...

This probably won't happen within one year. Especially since the need
for more than 4GB isn't simply there for the majority of applications
which still are 32bit and thus limited to 2GB (resp. 3.5GB but these are
extremely rare) memory. And when considering the amount of motivation
(or better the lack of) ISVs put in bringing out 64bit versions of their
mainstream applications it's highly unlikely this will change until end
of 2007...
I'd be tickled to death if
a pair of 4GB SO-DIMMs in a year for today's price of a pair of 1GB
SO-DIMMs ... or if a set of 4 2GB DIMMs will be available for today's
price of a set of 4 1/2 GB DIMMs (they're currently different in price
by a factor of 10 or so).
Click to expand...

Right, and this factor will probably fall down to 5 or 6 within one year...
64 bit Windows 2003 server will probably be quite standard in 12
months.
Click to expand...

64bit Windows 2003 server is already standard. However, as the name
implies, it's for server. This doesn't change the fact that 64bit for
(Windows) desktop is still nothing more than a very small niche with
almost no applications. And this won't change within a year, either.

Benjamin
 
Apparently, he doesn't consider it to be affordable now or to have been
affordable last year, so he must mean that they will become as
affordable as today's 4GB (or 2GB?) systems. I'd be tickled to death if
a pair of 4GB SO-DIMMs in a year for today's price of a pair of 1GB
SO-DIMMs ... or if a set of 4 2GB DIMMs will be available for today's
price of a set of 4 1/2 GB DIMMs (they're currently different in price
by a factor of 10 or so).
Click to expand...

I think 2GB modules within 25% over the price per GB for 1GB modules
would qualify as affordable. Then you could buy 2GB modules to preserve
slots for a later upgrade when DRAM is even cheaper.
 
* General Schvantzkoph:


Depends on what you mean with "affordable". It's extremely likely that
8GB won't be standard in two years, forget about 12 month. Besides that,
8GB requires an 64bit OS (if you don't want to use the crippled and slow
PAE of Windows Server or 32bit Linux), and with no sign of coming masses
of new 64bit applications this simply is useless, especially since 32bit
Windows programs are still limited to 2GB...

Benjamin
Click to expand...

Standard and affordable are two different things. I'm really talking about
the transition point where the price/gigabyte of a 2G DIMM approaches the
price/gigabyte of a 1G DIMM. The thing that will drive that is the switch
over to higher RAM densities. The 2G generation is sampling right now,

http://www.micron.com/products/dram/ddr2/partlist.aspx

1G DIMMs made in the same process as the 2G parts will become the
workhorse parts for all DIMM sizes. 2G DIMMs using 1G RAMs require 16
parts, i.e. a standard double sided DIMM so that's likely to be the way
that most 2G DIMMs will be built. The more popular 1G DIMMs, which are
currently double sided, will become single sided (8 x 1G RAMs) which will
allow them to run faster and will also lower their price. Because it's the
same RAM on both the 1G and 2G DIMMs the price/gigabyte will be comparable.
 
General said:
Standard and affordable are two different things. I'm really talking about
the transition point where the price/gigabyte of a 2G DIMM approaches the
price/gigabyte of a 1G DIMM. The thing that will drive that is the switch
over to higher RAM densities. The 2G generation is sampling right now,
Click to expand...

For almost all sorts of server-grade memory dual-ranked 2GB DIMMs
already reached price parity with 1GB DIMMs.
In case of FB-DIMMs 2GB dual-ranked DIMMs are *cheaper* per GB than any
other size.

The only exception is Intel Mikilteo platform that needs unbuffered
DIMMs. Unbuffered 2GB DIMMs are still expensive.
 
CharlesBlackstone said:
I'm very intrigued. OK, say I am going to buy a motheroard with socket
in April, that will accomodate a fast (the fastest?) chip that will be
out as that socket goes out of fashion (isn't that what you are
saying?). So, which motherboard/socket would you recommend for next
April? Even though the money can't be spend after April/May, I don't
mind spending a up to a grand further down the road to upgrade the
CPU.

So, how can you know which socket to get in the future? Do you know
what's coming up?
Click to expand...

I get the roadmap info from a few enthusiast sites, so I have an idea of
what's coming and previews of what performance to expect.

I don't have any specific recommendation for April, since that's a long
ways away and I'm not in the market for a new machine right now. But,
to illustrate my strategy:

I bought a Socket 939 board when they first came out, and put in the
slowest CPU I could find at the time, an A64 3000. Now that 939 is
officially dead (announced last week I think), I'm looking at upgrading
to the last CPU made for it, which IIRC is an A64 X2 5200. I'll
probably skip socket AM2 completely, and when the socket after that
comes out (AM3?), I'll buy a board and the cheapest CPU that fits it.
Lather, rinse, repeat.

Obviously, this strategy isn't focused on what to buy on a particular
date; I buy based on product introductions and pricing. I'm also an AMD
fan; Intel does seem to have an edge right now and for the next couple
of quarters, so buying a low-end Core 2 Duo system now and putting aside
money for a Quad later is what I'd do if I wanted to buy a new system
_today_ and didn't have a personal dislike for Intel.

If you're looking for the absolute best performance you can get, this
isn't the way to buy, but if you're looking to stay ahead of the curve
with small incremental investments, it's worked well for me so far.

S
 
I wonder if all those people switching to conroe will now have to
start using an Intel news group instead of this one? Probably be
leaving messges about how great their computer runs trying to switch
us over. Won't ever convince me.
Click to expand...

I switched, but I'll still read this group, because I'm still interested in
how things continue to develope with AMD (and my A64 PC is still up and
running).

I used AMD for about six years because it was the better choice. I love my
new Conroe machine, but wouldn't dream of trying to convince an AMD
loyalist to switch. If it weren't for AMD, Conroe probably wouldn't exist
and hopefully Conroe will keep the fire under AMD's feet and lead to
something good. I'd like nothing more than to switch back to AMD with my
next upgrade.
 
What did you upgrade from and did you really notice much of a performance
difference? Be honest now....

--
Love and Teach, Not Yell and Beat
Stop Violence and Child Abuse.
No such thing as Bad Kids. Only Bad Parents.
Friends don't turn friends on to drugs.
The path often thought about and sometimes chosen by abused children as
adults is Suicide. Be a real friend.

A64 3500+, Gigabyte GA-K8NSC-939,AIW 9800 128mb
MSI 550 Pro, X-Fi, Pioneer 110D, 111D
Antec 550 watt,Thermaltake Lanfire,2 Gb Dual Channel OCZ
2XSATA 320gb Raid Edition, PATA 120Gb
XPMCE2005, 19in Viewsonic,BenchMark 2001 SE- 19074
Games I'm Playing- Falcon 4, SP:WAW
 
What did you upgrade from and did you really notice much of a
performance difference? Be honest now....
Click to expand...

Fron a 3200+ OCed @ 2500MHz to E6600 OCed @ 3000MHz. Yes. Very nice
improvements in some areas. I can go into more detail, but it really isn't
that relavent, because I'm comparing a Late 2006 dual core system with 2GB
of RAM to a late 2004 single core system with 1GB of RAM. Not exactly a
fair comparison.

I considered an AM2 system and had I gone that way with 2GB I'm sure it
would have been comparable, but I do believe Intel finally got a desktop
chip right for the first time in a long while. The price/performance ratio
on Conroe has AMD beat for now.
 
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