"Free" and "pro" versions

  • Thread starter Thread starter fjghdhg
  • Start date Start date
bambam said:
The version of MailWasher on the Pricelessware list is the last
uncrippled version.

I'm not talking about the Pricelessware list. I'm talking about
it being recommended HERE, which I see happen very often.
My understanding is that the licencing terms for MPEG-2 require
payment of a fee for each user. When this fact was bought to the
attention of the developers of TMPGEnc they dropped support for
MPEG-2 in the free version

Not true. You can still upgrade the free version to have MPEG2
support by paying the fee and then entering a serial.
 
fjghdhg said:
Explain why TMPGEnc and MailWasher get regular recommendations here,
as both of these are "free" and "pro" as I intend my app to be.

There are loads of other examples. I think most here try to keep fairly
close to an 'absolute' definition of the word 'freeware' and how far we
stray is then a matter of personal 'boundaries'
In the case of John Corliss, a couple of examples come immediately to
mind:
Webwasher Classic, which he recommends regularly and which a purist
would have no hesitation in defining as 'nagware', and Kerio Personal
firewall 4 which John reckons "...has enough features to not be
considered as crippled."

It might be worth your while looking at the ware glossary here:

http://pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.htm

I think there will always be grey areas. How well your free app is
received here will be dependent on a number of criteria, some of which
have been detailed by other posts to this thread.
 
I'm not talking about the Pricelessware list. I'm talking about
it being recommended HERE, which I see happen very often.

If the program is good and the limitations are not a real problem in using the
program many will consider it freeware and recommend it.

We all differ somewhat in personal definitions. The useability of the program is
the factor considered.
 
fjghdhg said:
Explain why TMPGEnc and MailWasher get regular recommendations here,
as both of these are "free" and "pro" as I intend my app to be.

I agree. TMPGEnc is definitely what I'd call time-limited crippleware
and even I have recommended it in the past. I quit doing so a while
back though, when I noticed that the ability to code in MPEG-2
disappeared from my copy. As for MailWasher, since I have no need for
such a program, I don't use it and haven't ever even looked at it. I
can't be expected to evaluate every single piece of programming out there.

Look, all I'm saying is that if you're going to use a lite version of
your program to promote your pro version, simply label it as liteware
(assuming that it's not crippleware or nagware). Liteware is
frequently discussed in this group. However, promoting any form of
$ware here is off topic and that should be obvious.

If you're curious, here's a quote from my old FAQ and what the group
agreed were definitions of various kinds of software (note that since
this is a text only group, obviously I can't color code certain parts
of the text: this is a simple cut and paste):
_________________________________________

Freeware is programming that is offered for your use at no cost,
monetary or otherwise.
You may use freeware for as long as you wish. However, it is
usually copyrighted so that you can't incorporate its programming into
anything you may be developing. The least restrictive examples of
freeware are uncopyrighted programs in the public domain.
Freeware is simply written by generous people whose main rewards
are the satisfaction of knowing that they are both helping other
people and making other people happy!
At one time, "freeware" was a trademark of Andrew Fluegelman, the
author of the well-known MS-DOS communication program PC-TALK III. The
trademark wasn't enforced after his mysterious disappearance and
presumed death in 1984 (how cheery!) However, the name has evolved to
the current meaning above.

Freeware is often distributed via:

* users' groups
* via electronic mail
* local bulletin boards
* Usenet (in a binary post newsgroup like alt.binaries.freeware,
NOT alt.comp.freeware) or other electronic media.



The following are not considered freeware either in the purest sense
or by definition. Note that this does not necessarily mean that
discussion of a non-freeware type is considered "off topic" in
alt.comp.freeware (ACF):

(Indications that discussion of a software type is considered "off
topic" in ACF are in bolded red and are italicized. Indications that
discussion of a software type is considered "on topic" in ACF are in
bolded green and are underlined.)

Adware - Has advertising for other products and/or services built into
it. The "price" you pay for the software is having to give up some of
your screen real estate (and your attention) for the advertising.
Adware is often, in reality, spyware (see below.)
Adware should not be recommended as a solution to a software need
in alt.comp.freeware. It should only be discussed in the context of
whether or not a supposed freeware program is in fact adware.
Otherwise, adware should be discussed in the alt.comp.adware newsgroup.

Betaware - A "rough draft" version of what will be the final version.
You run the risk of having problems with your system when you use such
software. You pay for its use by pointing out bugs to the author and
by otherwise evaluating the program. Sometimes this evaluation is not
optional and when that is the case, the program should not be
recommended as a software solution. Betaware is sometimes recommended
when it is from a reputable and well know author (an example would be
Zone Labs and their program Zone Alarm) and the evaluation is not
mandatory.

Careware - The author wants you to send a sum of money to one or more
of their favorite charities/causes. The honor system applies here: you
must live with your guilt if you don't make a donation. Careware is
infrequently discussed in alt.comp.freeware. You just don't see a lot
of it.

CDWare - Software that is included on CDs that come with magazines. If
the software is freeware that is freely downloadable from the
internet, then it is okay to recommend it as a solution to a software
need. A link to the download site should be provided when recommending
it as a software solution. If there is no download site available,
then it should not be recommended as a solution to a software need in
alt.comp.freeware for two reasons: first, you MUST purchase the
magazine to obtain the CD. Secondly, such software on most "free" CDs
usually may not be freely distributed according to the EULA (end user
licensing agreement.)

Commercial Software - Costs money. The recommendation of commercial
software is not appropriate in alt.comp.freeware. However, sometimes a
commercial program is mentioned in ACF as an example of a type of
freeware being sought.

Demoware - Software that is intended to allow the user to see what the
full version of a program looks like so they will then purchase the
unlimited commercial version. Crippleware, time-limited software and
trialware are all various types of demoware. The recommendation of
demoware is not appropriate in alt.comp.freeware because it is
considered to be either shareware (in the case of crippleware or
time-limited software) or trialware.

Donationware - Payment to the author for the software is completely
optional. Donationware is frequently discussed in alt.comp.freeware.

Liteware - A free, reduced feature version of program that normally
costs money. The missing features are not "grayed out" (disabled) in
the menu and you are not constantly reminded with popups that the
missing feature is only available in the full version. No critical
features like "Save" or "Print" are missing. In other words, the
missing features might be nice to have but are not critical.
The missing features are simply listed where the "pro" or
full-featured version is promoted. If you don't read the promotion,
you will not be aware that any features are missing. Promotion of the
full-featured version in liteware can be done via:

* a "nag" type screen at startup or program closing
* an inclusion in the help file or the "About..." screen
* a link/ad on the main program screen.

If the latter is done, then the program borders on being adware
(see above.) If the ad is too obnoxious, then the program shouldn't be
recommended as anything other than a temporary solution until
something better comes along.
This is as opposed to crippleware, where removed features are
grayed out and you are reminded every time you try to use one that the
feature is only available in the full version.
Liteware is often discussed in alt.comp.freeware. It should not
be confused with demoware (see above) or crippleware (see below, under
"shareware".)

Orphanware - Software that is no longer supported or offered to the
public by the original author or company. Some people have saved the
original compressed download somewhere and occasionally will make it
available if asked.
Sometimes offering it to others is okay to do and sometimes it
isn't. The main instance where offering orphanware is not okay is when
the product has been improved and changed from freeware to shareware.
In this case the freeware version has been made unavailable by the
author because it would compete with the newer non-freeware version.
With the author's permission, orphanware can become freeware.
Orphanware is infrequently discussed in alt.comp.freeware. Be
careful about copyright infringement when using orphanware.

Postcardware - The author wants you to send them a postcard as the
price of using the software. The cost is the postcard. It's not to
much to ask for their effort and usually, it's optional anyway. Thus,
this category is very close to being freeware and discussing it is not
frowned upon in alt.comp.freeware.

Registerware - The cost is that you must provide personal information
via registration. Some people falsify the information which is
requested. However, since the author has asked the price, falsifying
what they are asking for is not ethical. Registerware is often
discussed in alt.comp.freeware.

Shareware - AKA "try before you buy". Obviously not freeware since
ultimately you are supposed to pay for the software. The
recommendation and discussion of shareware is not appropriate in
alt.comp.freeware. There are several kinds of shareware:

* Crippleware - limited in the amount of features available.
Purchasing the software removes these limitations and renders the
software fully functional. Not the same as trialware, since you can
save and print.
* Nagware - there is a popup (nag) screen at program startup,
exhorting you to purchase the software.
* Time limited - also considered by some to be trialware (see
below)- some of the features or the entire program become unusable
after a period of time.

Spyware - Any software that installs components on your computer which
allow companies and/or individuals to access your hard drive or spy on
your surfing habits. The cost you pay is your privacy and/or security.
You can learn more about spyware at
http://www.spychecker.com/spyware.html or
http://www.tom-cat.com/spybase/spylist.html.
Often, after you remove the software, the files that do the
spying remain on your hard drive. An excellent freeware utility for
removing such garbage is AdAware, available at:
www.lavasoft.de/aaw/index.html.
Spyware is almost always Adware and is often discussed in
alt.comp.freeware, always in a negative context and NEVER should be
recommended as a software solution. To see whether or not a suspected
program is spyware, go to: www.spychecker.com.

Trialware - Usually commercial software that is limited in the ability
to save and/or print. The intention of the author is that you learn
what the program can do and how to use it so that you will then
purchase the unlimited commercial version. The discussion of trialware
is not appropriate in alt.comp.freeware.

Viruses or virus authoring software - Either is or makes malicious
programming. It is highly inappropriate to discuss viruses or virus
authoring software in alt.comp.freeware.

Warez - Stolen software and software for stealing other software.
Stolen software is also known as having been pirated, cracked, etc.
Use of warez is usually a felony, (at least in the U.S.) where you can
be punishable by a large fine and prison time if you are caught. It is
highly inappropriate to discuss warez in alt.comp.freeware. Warez is:

* Commercial software or shareware which has had the registration
codes bypassed (cracked), or other security features breached (time
limits, feature limits, etc.)
* Software designed to be used for cracking.
* Serial numbers for unpurchased shareware or commercial software.
 
["»Q«"; Mon, 23 Aug 2004 04:21:00 GMT]
Add a third, but I'm one of those who doesn't draw a distinction
between crippleware and liteware. If you make the free, watered-down
version of your app useful enough, people here will use and recommend
it.

If the free version stands on its own, there's no problem.
 
A ‘lighter’ version of a program can be considered freeware if:
1) There is no sign of functionality that can not be used.
2) All functionality, basic to the function of the program is amiable

is "available" ?
3) The differences between the ‘lite’ and the ‘full’ version is not too
much.

< snip >

I would think that the first two points pretty much explain things.
The third is handy but not IMO necessary.

If the "free" program doesn't do much then people here will not be
using/recommending it. Which will adversely affect sales of a "full"
version.

Regards, John.

--
****************************************************
,-._|\ (A.C.F FAQ) http://clients.net2000.com.au/~johnf/faq.html
/ Oz \ John Fitzsimons - Melbourne, Australia.
\_,--.x/ http://www.vicnet.net.au/~johnf/welcome.htm
v http://clients.net2000.com.au/~johnf/
 
The only difference between my "free" and "pro" versions is that the "pro"
version allows the user to store MORE app-related data. It's a bit like
buying a PC: my "free" version would be a PC with a 3 GB hard drive, but
my "pro" version would be a PC with a 120 GB hard drive. That's the point
I'm trying to get across -- that the "free" version is still usable in
every way, but obviously the "pro" version lets you store more data in
which to use the app. So is this considered "freeware" or "liteware"?
 
fjghdhg said:
The only difference between my "free" and "pro" versions is that the "pro"
version allows the user to store MORE app-related data. It's a bit like
buying a PC: my "free" version would be a PC with a 3 GB hard drive, but
my "pro" version would be a PC with a 120 GB hard drive. That's the point
I'm trying to get across -- that the "free" version is still usable in
every way, but obviously the "pro" version lets you store more data in
which to use the app. So is this considered "freeware" or "liteware"?

I personally make no distinction between "liteware" and "crippleware" (same
thing AFAIC) and from the way you've worded the above, I'd definately call
it cripple/liteware. There's no way it could be called freeware.... at all.

--

Regards

Steven Burn
Ur I.T. Mate Group
www.it-mate.co.uk

Keeping it FREE!
 
Steven said:
from the way you've worded the above, I'd definately call it
cripple/liteware. There's no way it could be called freeware

I honestly fail to see why not. Most users would be happy to
use it as it stands. It's only a certain group who would need
to pay for the extra storage. So it's much like the "free for
home use" policy, IMO. Anyway, I guess this is getting boring.
 
fjghdhg said:
I honestly fail to see why not. Most users would be happy to
use it as it stands. It's only a certain group who would need
to pay for the extra storage. So it's much like the "free for
home use" policy, IMO. Anyway, I guess this is getting boring.

From what your saying, it sounds as though you've already decided to call it
freeware (feel free to tell me if I'm wrong), so I am beginning to fail to
see the point in this....?

The fact that "most users would be happy to use it as it stands" has nothing
to do with whether it can or cannot be classed as freeware.

--

Regards

Steven Burn
Ur I.T. Mate Group
www.it-mate.co.uk

Keeping it FREE!
 
I would think that the first two points pretty much explain things.
The third is handy but not IMO necessary.

Well with the 3rd point, what I mean is: id the 'pro' version is a fully
featured Office solution, while the light version is nothing more as a
package witch roughly combines notepad with mspaint, then ther is too much
difference imo. It would be like compating the gimp, phtotfiltre of Serif
Photo Plus with a specific not-to-be-named Australian photoediting program
(sorry mate ;-) )
If the "free" program doesn't do much then people here will not be
using/recommending it. Which will adversely affect sales of a "full"
version.

Regards, John.

--

http://www.it-hulp.nl/
http://fotoalbum.it-hulp.nl/

gmx.net is the mailserver of mightykitten
start subject with *ping* or the antispam monster will eat it.
 
I'm not talking about the Pricelessware list. I'm talking about
it being recommended HERE, which I see happen very often.

OK, I'll try this one more time. The version of MailWasher that is
recommended here is not the lite or crippled version, nor is it the pro
version. It is the last release before there was ever a pro version. It is
fully functional freeware.
Not true. You can still upgrade the free version to have MPEG2 support
by paying the fee and then entering a serial.

I can see your point on this one, although as I pointed out you can
download the last version of TMPGEnc that had MPEG-2 support if you wish.
The legality of this is unknown to me.

Post your program features, both free + pro, it won't take long for a
classification. ;o)
 
fjghdhg said:
I'm not talking about the Pricelessware list. I'm talking about
it being recommended HERE, which I see happen very often.

You're right about Mailwasher. It has never been freeware, only nag- or
adware (I can't remember).
Not true. You can still upgrade the free version to have MPEG2
support by paying the fee and then entering a serial.

So what. TMPGenc is not recommended as a freeware MPEG2 encoder, but as a
freeware MPEG1 encoder/editor.
 
fjghdhg said:
I honestly fail to see why not. Most users would be happy to
use it as it stands. It's only a certain group who would need
to pay for the extra storage. So it's much like the "free for
home use" policy, IMO.

No, you are missing an important distinction. This group is primarily
concerned with home/individual use. If you release the full product
with dual home/commercial licensing, most (though with substantial
exceptions) will not object to your characterizing it as "freeware for
home use" or similar.

What you are describing is similar to a document, database, or media
management system that supports virtually unlimited numbers of
documents/rows/downloads (or is system or design limited) with a
corresponding version version that only supports 1000 or 100. The
latter is AT BEST liteware. More often is demoware or crippleware
masquerading as liteware or freeware.

My Suggestion
Give the reduced functionality (crippled) version a slightly different
name -- "XYZ Lite" is popular. Or use "Junior", "Petite", "Limited",
even "XYZ Free". Then advertise it as free (not freeware). That will
not offend and will be accurate provided the limitation is clear and
sufficiently broad that few home users will encounter it.

An Aside
I do use, buy, and recommend commercial products more frequently than
freeware. Some have been ones where I started using the free version
(e.g, an old major release or personal use licensed).

I will always strongly favor applications that offer lengthy trials
over those that don't. I give bonus points to applications that offer
free private use or restricted (but still quite useful) functionality.

I avoid applications that do not make their limitations clear. At
best I am irritated at having to search for answers. Other times I
eventually feel duped -- and sometimes rather angry if I have invested
effort in learning and starting to use the product before I discover
the hidden limitations or if it takes multiple rounds of questions to
get a simple answer. This applies to "free liteware" as well as to
any package that has two or more paid lite, standard, plus, or deluxe
versions and to any vendor who uses misleading advertising. This
"feeling" influenced recommendations to friends and very small
businesses making $15 to $200 purchases as well as to businesses and
agencies spending $1000 to multimillions (though usually with
inversely proportional affect on the final decision).

BTW, I have similar feelings about software archives that classify all
software available for "free download" (i.e., any kind of demo,
cripple, trial, even install-now-pay-when-run) as "freeware"! While
offensive, at least those sites are readily avoided. I reserve
special ire sites that make a pretense of classification.
Anyway, I guess this is getting boring.

Yes. Just advertise it as "free XYZ Lite" (or whatever)instead of as
freeware. If you hope for support from ACF readers, produce a good
product where limitations are clearly stated and will constrain few
home users.

I write this less in hopes of influencing you, fjghdhg, than future
readers researching a similar question.

BillR
 
Back
Top