Fans etc.

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The capasitors pop, swell, bulge, whine or scream under load. A bad power
supply may fry a Mainboard and CPU before its too late, a good supply >IF<

It does not fry a mainboard the PSU refuses to switch on, [ surge ]
the 'over current protection' circuit in a good-or-bad PSU is
triggered by

= bad caps.
they go most often do so quickly and save the rest of the parts from
overload.

Bad caps are bad caps, cause = bad caps not poor PSU, ask Homie© he
nearly sank Abit & the entire Taiwanese capacitor industry making.

= bad caps

ask Gary here : mailto:[email protected]
Good luck
BoroLad
 
Bonj:
Why are you posting this apparent spam, unless you are affiliated
with the makers of the power supplies?

You wrote that to me and in your next post you begged someone else for
recommendations for a different power supply and got the same answers I
and others have already given you. If you had bothered to read all the
replies, from people who have been trying to help you, you would have
noticed that I was neither the first person or the last person to
recommend an Antec power supply. Instead of acting like a jerk you should
be asking yourself why almost every reply has recommended that you not buy
a generic PS and has recommend an Antec instead. Best of luck.
 
Bonj:
Any chance of answering the question that was asked, i.e. fans?

I answered your first question. The answer to your second question is
'no', if you take my advice. If you don't take my, and everyone else's
advice, and buy the cheapest case & PS that you can find, then the 2nd
question is impossible to answer without some familiarity with the case. I
read a post this morning from a guy who had stability problems, that he
replaced his El Cheapo PS with an Antec and his CPU temps dropped 10c.
 
Any chance of answering the question that was asked, i.e. fans?

Fans, brand Case- 2000RMP [ish ]:
- brand, 'Panaflow' or, ;
- Sanyo-Denki, or ;
- YS-TECH

PSU, brand :
- Fortron/Sparkle

N.B SilenX.com make a refined version of the Fortron/Sparkle with
better heatsinks capacitors and mofsets - this gives the 12V rail more
stability.

BoroLad
 
Bonj:


I answered your first question. The answer to your second question is
'no', if you take my advice. If you don't take my, and everyone else's
advice, and buy the cheapest case & PS that you can find, then the 2nd
question is impossible to answer without some familiarity with the case. I
read a post this morning from a guy who had stability problems, that he
replaced his El Cheapo PS with an Antec and his CPU temps dropped 10c.

Give me a f*cking break. If his temps dropped 10C then his cooler wasn't
on right to begin with or he had vcore set to high on the board or in the
bios. To actually atribute the drop in temps to the PSU is about the
wildest BS I've ever heard.
 
En URaCd.45784$dv1.37805@edtnps89, String va escriure:
If power supplies were cars your cheap 500w would be a Yugo I have
a Enermax 365w if a car a BMW5, so we load them both with 4 people
and luggage head on round trip coast to coast full throttle.

I know of too much people that had problems with their BMWs because these
cars had too much power available for the average driver, and they end
outside the road. Never heard of this kind of problem with Yugo.

Of course I'd prefer being in a BMW (or a Volvo or a Hummy, this not against
Germans) than in a Yugo if I crashed against a wall. But overall I prefer
NOT crashing.

Anyway your comparison is reversed. Better compare low-priced GTi (like R.5
GT turbo, injured/killed a lot; do not know U.S. equivalent) as cheap 500W
against a luxury car.


Antoine
 
Wes Newell:
Give me a f*cking break. If his temps dropped 10C then his cooler
wasn't on right to begin with or he had vcore set to high on the
board or in the bios. To actually atribute the drop in temps to the
PSU is about the wildest BS I've ever heard.

I'm just relaying another person's experience, don't get hostile with me.
FYI, if the generic powersupply wasn't evacuating air from the case
properly, then YES, it is entirely possible that changing the PS dropped
the CPU temp. Why do people put extra fans on their case? To move more air
through the case and keep the temps lower. What happens if you plug up the
case? The temps will increase. Think things through before posting.
 
Wes Newell:


I'm just relaying another person's experience, don't get hostile with me.

You think that was hostile? it wasn't ment to be. I'm just blunt.:-)
FYI, if the generic powersupply wasn't evacuating air from the case
properly, then YES, it is entirely possible that changing the PS dropped
the CPU temp.

No way in hell (just being blunt, so don't get offended) does this have
anything to do with power. If the fan was screwed up on the PSU, that's a
whole different story. Still can't see cpu temps dropping that much even
if the fan was completely dead. But the temp problem he was having could
most certainly be directly related to the stability problem. So now we
don't know if the power or the temp was the cause of the stabilty problem.
IOW, BS.:-)

Why do people put extra fans on their case? To move more air
through the case and keep the temps lower. What happens if you plug up the
case? The temps will increase. Think things through before posting.

And all this time I though the people just liked the extra noise.:-)

But you used the message to infer that the el cheapo PSU as the cause of
all his problems, when in fact you can't relate it to a certain to any of
them.

i'm just here to state for a fact that out of the hundreds of cheap PSU's
I've used the failure rates were no different than the expensive ones. And
there's really no reason to warn people off them if they choose to buy
them. BTW, the systems I build run in some of the worst invironments you
can think of. And they run 24/7 unattended. Some in places that range fron
30-100+F over the year. Some in enclosed small places that stay
constantly hot. Yes, some morons insist that they nust go there. I can't
do anything but warn them. They bought it, it's there's, but with a
defaulted warranty.
 
Right... I've decided to go for the existing case and stick with the new
(cheap) 500w psu, but replace the heatsink and cpu-fan that comes with the
amd64 chip with a much more hardcore one, possibly even watercooled. This'll
keep it running like a mutha. I'll then add an exhaust fan, and monitor the
cpu's temparature from within software and see if it's within an acceptable
range. After all, why would I have any reason to think that the cooler I get
with the chip would be a particularly good one - (on the contrary even),
I've therefore decided this is good enough reason for me to indicate the
standard cpu-fan and heatsink to be a more susceptible component than the
psu that I don't know anything about, and neither would I know anything
about a more expensive one, other than the fact that it's more expensive.

Cheers for the input
 
Oh, I see, yes.... the one that supposedly dropped when he replaced the psu.
Reading backwards again, sorry...
 
Reminds me of the people who smoke and use the few examples of people who
smoke and live to old age BUT the grave yard is full of those that make the
bulk of smokers who did not.
Cheap power supplies have a piss poor success rate but you have one that's a
miracle magic ones deifying average you think its something to promote to
everyone. I was hired by a local shop to manage their tech shop, the money
coming in was not equaling salaries out? I discovered the amount of power
supply failures and problems associated with the same were taking half the
day for most technicians. I instituted a NO cheap power supplies sold as
stand alone or in cases. Those problems disappeared almost instantly
freeing up our technicians to make money not diagnose $20 poor power
supplies. Buy cheap buy twice, sell cheep pay too many technicians. (Ram as
well)
You stubbornly stick to promoting junk and if you made computers for my
clients insisting using those piss poor power supplies you would not work
for me.
Thought ? Do you work for the generic power supply consortium?

I wish you continued success with your power supplies,
Eyes Open
 
Bonj said:
Right... I've decided to go for the existing case and stick with the
new (cheap) 500w psu, but replace the heatsink and cpu-fan that comes
with the amd64 chip with a much more hardcore one, possibly even
watercooled. This'll keep it running like a mutha. I'll then add an
exhaust fan, and monitor the cpu's temparature from within software
and see if it's within an acceptable range. After all, why would I
have any reason to think that the cooler I get with the chip would be
a particularly good one - (on the contrary even), I've therefore
decided this is good enough reason for me to indicate the standard
cpu-fan and heatsink to be a more susceptible component than the psu
that I don't know anything about, and neither would I know anything
about a more expensive one, other than the fact that it's more
expensive.

On the other hand, I'm using the stock HSF on my 3200+ and an Enermax PSU.
It's running stable @ 2500MHz (idles in the upper 30's and hits 52 or so at
100%). Do what you want, but I think buying a cheap PSU while spending
money for unnecessary stuff like liquid cooling is just dumb

Of course, a good PSU won't look anymore impressive than a shitty one and
the stock HSF just doesn't look the least bit pimp.
 
Bonj said:
Oh *Antec*, you work for them then - that explains it.

I'm getting the distinct impression that you weren't looking for sound
advice, but for someone to validate your own opinion. Good luck with your
$200 water cooling kit and your $20 PSU.
 
Wes Newell:
But the temp problem he was having could most certainly be directly
related to the stability problem. So now we don't know if the power
or the temp was the cause of the stabilty problem. IOW, BS.:-)

You're making assumptions... his temps were in the 40's prior to
changing the power supply and I didn't say that his stability problem
went away.
And all this time I though the people just liked the extra noise.:-)

But you used the message to infer that the el cheapo PSU as the cause
of all his problems, when in fact you can't relate it to a certain to
any of them.

No, you infer, I imply, but I wasn't implying anything. I don't know if
changing the power supply fixed his problem or not, I was relating an
experience about temperature.
i'm just here to state for a fact that out of the hundreds of cheap
PSU's I've used the failure rates were no different than the
expensive ones.

How do you know? Facts can be proven. Prove it.
 
Right... I've decided to go for the existing case and stick with the new
(cheap) 500w psu, but replace the heatsink and cpu-fan that comes with the
amd64 chip with a much more hardcore one, possibly even watercooled.

There's really no need to replace the stock A64 cooler. The HS itself is
very good (unlike coolers for the XP line). It works well with the stock
fan, but I replaced the little 70x15mm fan with a 70->80mm fan adapter and
installed an 80x25mm low speed fan just to make it quieter. Can't even
hear it now. If you want max cooling just throw an 80mm high speed fan on
it with a fan control.
This'll keep it running like a mutha. I'll then add an exhaust fan, and
monitor the cpu's temparature from within software and see if it's
within an acceptable range.

You don't want to add an exhaust fan unless you first add 1 or 2 intake
fans. In reality, all you shoukld need to add would be 1 intake fan. The
PSU already has an exhaust fan where it should be, at the top of case.
Adding all exhaust fans will create stress, noise, and without an intake
fan is just not good. It could leave your PSU overheating as it will
fighting for air to pull through the PSU too. Not to mention a starved fan
makes more noise.

Just like PSU's, there's also cheap coolers that will work better than
expensive ones.
 
I'm getting the distinct impression that you weren't looking for sound
advice, but for someone to validate your own opinion. Good luck with your
$200 water cooling kit and your $20 PSU.

Heck if he paid $20 he got ripped off, Mine was only $12, $15 shipped.:-)
 
Reminds me of the people who smoke and use the few examples of people who
smoke and live to old age BUT the grave yard is full of those that make
the bulk of smokers who did not.

Not even close to what i said. I said the majority, somewhere between
90-95% of the hundreds of inexpensive PSU's I've used run 5 years or more.
The one I put in the company server in about 1995 is still running. It
cost about $20 then.
Cheap power supplies have a piss poor success rate but you have one
that's a miracle magic ones deifying average you think its something to
promote to everyone.

I don't know where you get your success rate figures from, but I know
where mine come from, and the PSU works just as good as the expensive
ones. Granted I don't run extensive test to see if they actually put out
100% of their ratings, but I don't care about that. At under $20 a pop
they work, and work well enough for any system I've built. If they didn't,
I wouldn't use them in my machine and certainly not in machines we sell
and maintain at customers sites, since failures cost way more money in
time than than the price of an expensive PSU.
I was hired by a local shop to manage their tech shop, the money coming
in was not equaling salaries out? I discovered the amount of power
supply failures and problems associated with the same were taking half
the day for most technicians. I instituted a NO cheap power supplies
sold as stand alone or in cases. Those problems disappeared almost
instantly freeing up our technicians to make money not diagnose $20 poor
power supplies. Buy cheap buy twice, sell cheep pay too many
technicians. (Ram as well) You stubbornly stick to promoting junk and if
you made computers for my clients insisting using those piss poor power
supplies you would not work for me.

There's many reasons reasons you may have had so many failures. And if it
took one of the techs I supervise a half a day to replace a PSU, he'd be
looking for another job fast. Most PSU's can be changed in a matter of
mintues. Certainly less than 30, not counting travel time. The failure
rates you found could just as easily be contributed to the wrong size PSU
ion the first place. I've seen this problem many times. I'll be the first
to admit that cheap PSU's *may* be over rated. Simply buy one with that
in mind and you should be fine. And don't worry, I'm not looking for a
job.

So I gather you don't like cheap ram either? That's all I use too.:-) A
60ns ram chip is a 60ns ram chip. Doesn't matter who's circuit board you
stick it on as long as the ram is the same PN. I can see you waste a lot
of money, so you would most definately not work for me, at least not for
long. Want to know what I know about ram? I used to design, manufacture
and sell ram upgrades. yep, I designed them, layed them out, had the
boards manufactured, assembled, and distributed. So BS all the other
people you want. I know better.
Thought ? Do you work for the generic power supply consortium?
Nope, I don't work at all any more. Now don't get me wrong, there are some
trashy PSU's out there. I bought 20 old AT PSU's for $2 each. They even
looked trashy. And they had a 20% failure rate within a few months. I know
the others were still going after a couple of years. Needless to say, no
more were purchased. But the majoirty of cheap psu's ( just not that
cheap) work fine.
I wish you continued success with your power supplies, Eyes Open
Luck has nothing to do with it, but thanks.
 
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