Experiment (Gateway stores closed)

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dave C.
  • Start date Start date
D

Dave C.

I was posting earlier that if you want a decent computer, you should build
your own. It only takes a flat-blade screwdriver, and you don't even need
to know how to partition a hard drive anymore. (window xp, for example,
will install itself with almost no input from the end user, even on a brand
new never-been-partitioned hard drive) Any cabling confusion should be
cleared up by reading the manual of whatever motherboard you choose.

My wife is the perfect example of someone who doesn't know anything about
hardware and doesn't care to learn. I wanted to know, if for some odd
reason, she decided to build her own computer, WHAT would she come up with?

I made a shopping list which read motherboard, CPU, video card, hard drive,
RAM, DVD drive, case, power supply, keyboard mouse. I left sound card off
the list as most people would be happy with onboard sound. I also left
monitor off the list as most people buying a computer would already have a
monitor. I forgot to add OS to the list, but that's a minimal expense, when
purchased with a system. I then pointed her to www.newegg.com and turned
her loose. I told her to add any component she wanted to her shopping cart.
THIS is what she came up with, with no help from me:

APEX Beige Mid-Tower Super Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "7C574-115"
Item# N82E16811154017
$24.00

Plextor 12X DVD+RW/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A, Retail
Item# N82E16827131326
$196.99

Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y120P0, OEM Drive Only
Item# N82E16822144148
$95.97

Aopen KB858 Keyboard USB 107keys -OEM
Item# N82E16823144011
$7.80

Kingston ValueRAM 184 Pin 256MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
Item# N82E16820141425
$49.00 X 2
$98.00

ASUS "K8V SE Deluxe" K8T800 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754
CPU -RETAIL
$119.00

Logitech SBF69 Optical Wheel Mouse PS/2 -OEM
Item# N82E16826104137
$10.00

AMD Athlon 64 2800+, 512KB L2 Cache, 64-bit Processor - OEM
Item# N82E16819103450
$173.00

GIGABYTE ATI RADEON 9200SE Video Card, 128MB DDR, 64-bit, TV-Out, 8X AGP,
Model "GV-R92S128T" -RETAIL
Item# N82E16814125116
$48.00

Total (Before tax): $ 772.76

She threw a couple curve-balls at me. She opted to go straight for
Athlon64, which is more power than most people need for office apps. and
Internet use (what SHE uses the system for). She also chose one of the most
expensive DVD burners available. A plextor 12X dual??? Yikes! I asked her
how she chose this stuff. Under each category, she looked at the featured
items/specials, and paid attention to the "star" rating. (user reviews).
OK, so she knows nothing about hardware, but she's not an idiot. (!)

I think she proved my point nicely. Show me any pre-built system under $800
that is better quality than what someone who knows NOTHING about hardware
can build themselves. It aint gonna happen!!! For the same price at Dell
(for example), your desktop would have a 40GB hard drive (crap) and no DVD
or CDR burning capability. Even if you are willing to spend an extra $200
or $300 on a Dell with similar capabilities to save the "hassle" of building
your own system, you will still end up with something that likely can't be
upgraded later (proprietary power supply connectors, for example)

This experiment proved that it's just plain stupid to order a pre-built
system, unless you really hate your money, for some odd reason. :) -Dave
 
you will still end up with something that likely can't be
upgraded later (proprietary power supply connectors, for example)
Click to expand...

You havent seen the insides of a dell for a long while have you, no more
proprietry components.

You seem to have forgotten about what if something goes wrong during the
build? An inexperienced user wouldnt have a clue what to check. Dont get me
wrong, i build my own systems, but there is a place for OEM's.

hamman
 
Hamman said:
you will still end up with something that likely can't be

You havent seen the insides of a dell for a long while have you, no more
proprietry components.

You seem to have forgotten about what if something goes wrong during the
build? An inexperienced user wouldnt have a clue what to check. Dont get me
wrong, i build my own systems, but there is a place for OEM's.

hamman
Click to expand...

Well that's what forums like the homebuilt ng are for. If you get stuck,
ask the experts. :) I guarantee you that you will get better support on
usenet than you will from Dell, etc. retailers. But what do you think of
that system my wife spec'd out? Talk about KICK-ASS!!! A athlon64 with all
good name-brand components, 512MB of RAM and 120GB hard drive? I'm half
tempted to build that puppy, just so I can show her what she did. I am
sooooooooooooo proud of her. :) Oh there are some things I would have done
differently. For example, I would have gotten a Pioneer 8X burner for half
the price and spent that money on a better video card. But damn, just
leaving the system the way my wife designed it would satisfy all but the
most hardcore gamer.

I firmly believe that people just need to get over that "I can't do it"
mentality and JUST DO IT. 99.9% of people who are afraid to crack the case
of their PC would be AMAZED at how easy it is to build one, if they'd just
make up their mind to do it. And if you do it once, you'll never even think
about buying pre-built again. -Dave
 
Well that's what forums like the homebuilt ng are for. If you get stuck,
ask the experts. :) I guarantee you that you will get better support on
usenet than you will from Dell, etc. retailers.
Click to expand...

The "average" user is completely unaware of the existence of usenet and
would have no idea how to find their way here. I know many computer users
who are farely knowledgable of PCs, having used them regularly for years,
and am surprised to find they've never even heard the word "newsgroup".

Boff
 
Dave said:
I was posting earlier that if you want a decent computer, you should build
your own. It only takes a flat-blade screwdriver, and you don't even need
to know how to partition a hard drive anymore. (window xp, for example,
will install itself with almost no input from the end user, even on a brand
new never-been-partitioned hard drive) Any cabling confusion should be
cleared up by reading the manual of whatever motherboard you choose.

My wife is the perfect example of someone who doesn't know anything about
hardware and doesn't care to learn. I wanted to know, if for some odd
reason, she decided to build her own computer, WHAT would she come up with?

....

... I asked her
how she chose this stuff. Under each category, she looked at the featured
items/specials, and paid attention to the "star" rating. (user reviews).
OK, so she knows nothing about hardware, but she's not an idiot. (!)

I think she proved my point nicely. Show me any pre-built system under $800
that is better quality than what someone who knows NOTHING about hardware
can build themselves. It aint gonna happen!!!...
Click to expand...

A most interesting approach, choosing the items with the highest
"star" rating. But: Nobody guarantees that the selected items are
compatible with each other! That is the core weakness of this
approach. And that is, at the same time, the main strength of
pre-built systems. The OEMs are no idiots, either...

Roy
 
Hamman said:
You havent seen the insides of a dell for a long while have you, no more
proprietry components.
Click to expand...

Furthermore, Dell's are fantastic boxes to upgrade. Many of the components (like
harddrives, CDRW, etc) just click in with no screws. Dell usually includes
extra rails as well.
 
Dave C. said:
I was posting earlier that if you want a decent computer, you should build
your own. It only takes a flat-blade screwdriver, and you don't even need
to know how to partition a hard drive anymore. (window xp, for example,
will install itself with almost no input from the end user, even on a brand
new never-been-partitioned hard drive) Any cabling confusion should be
cleared up by reading the manual of whatever motherboard you choose.

My wife is the perfect example of someone who doesn't know anything about
hardware and doesn't care to learn. I wanted to know, if for some odd
reason, she decided to build her own computer, WHAT would she come up with?

I made a shopping list which read motherboard, CPU, video card, hard drive,
RAM, DVD drive, case, power supply, keyboard mouse. I left sound card off
the list as most people would be happy with onboard sound. I also left
monitor off the list as most people buying a computer would already have a
monitor. I forgot to add OS to the list, but that's a minimal expense, when
purchased with a system. I then pointed her to www.newegg.com and turned
her loose. I told her to add any component she wanted to her shopping cart.
THIS is what she came up with, with no help from me:

APEX Beige Mid-Tower Super Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "7C574-115"
Item# N82E16811154017
$24.00

Plextor 12X DVD+RW/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A, Retail
Item# N82E16827131326
$196.99

Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y120P0, OEM Drive Only
Item# N82E16822144148
$95.97

Aopen KB858 Keyboard USB 107keys -OEM
Item# N82E16823144011
$7.80

Kingston ValueRAM 184 Pin 256MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
Item# N82E16820141425
$49.00 X 2
$98.00

ASUS "K8V SE Deluxe" K8T800 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754
CPU -RETAIL
$119.00

Logitech SBF69 Optical Wheel Mouse PS/2 -OEM
Item# N82E16826104137
$10.00

AMD Athlon 64 2800+, 512KB L2 Cache, 64-bit Processor - OEM
Item# N82E16819103450
$173.00

GIGABYTE ATI RADEON 9200SE Video Card, 128MB DDR, 64-bit, TV-Out, 8X AGP,
Model "GV-R92S128T" -RETAIL
Item# N82E16814125116
$48.00

Total (Before tax): $ 772.76

She threw a couple curve-balls at me. She opted to go straight for
Athlon64, which is more power than most people need for office apps. and
Internet use (what SHE uses the system for). She also chose one of the most
expensive DVD burners available. A plextor 12X dual??? Yikes! I asked her
how she chose this stuff. Under each category, she looked at the featured
items/specials, and paid attention to the "star" rating. (user reviews).
OK, so she knows nothing about hardware, but she's not an idiot. (!)

I think she proved my point nicely. Show me any pre-built system under $800
that is better quality than what someone who knows NOTHING about hardware
can build themselves. It aint gonna happen!!! For the same price at Dell
(for example), your desktop would have a 40GB hard drive (crap) and no DVD
or CDR burning capability. Even if you are willing to spend an extra $200
or $300 on a Dell with similar capabilities to save the "hassle" of building
your own system, you will still end up with something that likely can't be
upgraded later (proprietary power supply connectors, for example)

This experiment proved that it's just plain stupid to order a pre-built
system, unless you really hate your money, for some odd reason. :) -Dave
Click to expand...


I didn't check the compatability of the equipment listed. I'm amazed that a
person with no hardware knowledge could pick out an optimal M/B(chipset),
CPU and ram combination. Then theirs AGP compatability, determining power
consumption / power supply compatability and heating / cooling issues. How
much time did she spend making out this list?

Is OEM a good idea for a first time builder? Does the CPU have a fan/heat
sink?

Not trying to rain on your parade but I spent a lot of time figuring out the
components to put into my last system and its hard to believe somone could
just go to a website and click on items to get a good one.
 
Dave C. said:
I was posting earlier that if you want a decent computer, you should build
your own. It only takes a flat-blade screwdriver, and you don't even need
to know how to partition a hard drive anymore. (window xp, for example,
will install itself with almost no input from the end user, even on a brand
new never-been-partitioned hard drive) Any cabling confusion should be
cleared up by reading the manual of whatever motherboard you choose.

My wife is the perfect example of someone who doesn't know anything about
hardware and doesn't care to learn. I wanted to know, if for some odd
reason, she decided to build her own computer, WHAT would she come up with?

I made a shopping list which read motherboard, CPU, video card, hard drive,
RAM, DVD drive, case, power supply, keyboard mouse. I left sound card off
the list as most people would be happy with onboard sound. I also left
monitor off the list as most people buying a computer would already have a
monitor. I forgot to add OS to the list, but that's a minimal expense, when
purchased with a system. I then pointed her to www.newegg.com and turned
her loose. I told her to add any component she wanted to her shopping cart.
THIS is what she came up with, with no help from me:

APEX Beige Mid-Tower Super Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "7C574-115"
Item# N82E16811154017
$24.00

Plextor 12X DVD+RW/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A, Retail
Item# N82E16827131326
$196.99

Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y120P0, OEM Drive Only
Item# N82E16822144148
$95.97

Aopen KB858 Keyboard USB 107keys -OEM
Item# N82E16823144011
$7.80

Kingston ValueRAM 184 Pin 256MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
Item# N82E16820141425
$49.00 X 2
$98.00

ASUS "K8V SE Deluxe" K8T800 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754
CPU -RETAIL
$119.00

Logitech SBF69 Optical Wheel Mouse PS/2 -OEM
Item# N82E16826104137
$10.00

AMD Athlon 64 2800+, 512KB L2 Cache, 64-bit Processor - OEM
Item# N82E16819103450
$173.00

GIGABYTE ATI RADEON 9200SE Video Card, 128MB DDR, 64-bit, TV-Out, 8X AGP,
Model "GV-R92S128T" -RETAIL
Item# N82E16814125116
$48.00

Total (Before tax): $ 772.76

She threw a couple curve-balls at me. She opted to go straight for
Athlon64, which is more power than most people need for office apps. and
Internet use (what SHE uses the system for). She also chose one of the most
expensive DVD burners available. A plextor 12X dual??? Yikes! I asked her
how she chose this stuff. Under each category, she looked at the featured
items/specials, and paid attention to the "star" rating. (user reviews).
OK, so she knows nothing about hardware, but she's not an idiot. (!)

I think she proved my point nicely. Show me any pre-built system under $800
that is better quality than what someone who knows NOTHING about hardware
can build themselves. It aint gonna happen!!! For the same price at Dell
(for example), your desktop would have a 40GB hard drive (crap) and no DVD
or CDR burning capability. Even if you are willing to spend an extra $200
or $300 on a Dell with similar capabilities to save the "hassle" of building
your own system, you will still end up with something that likely can't be
upgraded later (proprietary power supply connectors, for example)

This experiment proved that it's just plain stupid to order a pre-built
system, unless you really hate your money, for some odd reason. :) -Dave
Click to expand...

While I will admit she did admirable, the cost of the product does not
include monitor, warranty and customer support, operating system, etc....
When all added together they are about the same cost........................
 
"Dave C." <[email protected]> said:
I was posting earlier that if you want a decent computer, you should build
your own. It only takes a flat-blade screwdriver, and you don't even need
to know how to partition a hard drive anymore. (window xp, for example,
will install itself with almost no input from the end user, even on a brand
new never-been-partitioned hard drive) Any cabling confusion should be
cleared up by reading the manual of whatever motherboard you choose.

My wife is the perfect example of someone who doesn't know anything about
hardware and doesn't care to learn. I wanted to know, if for some odd
reason, she decided to build her own computer, WHAT would she come up with?

I made a shopping list which read motherboard, CPU, video card, hard drive,
RAM, DVD drive, case, power supply, keyboard mouse. I left sound card off
the list as most people would be happy with onboard sound. I also left
monitor off the list as most people buying a computer would already have a
monitor. I forgot to add OS to the list, but that's a minimal expense, when
purchased with a system. I then pointed her to www.newegg.com and turned
her loose. I told her to add any component she wanted to her shopping cart.
THIS is what she came up with, with no help from me:

APEX Beige Mid-Tower Super Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "7C574-115"
Item# N82E16811154017
$24.00

Plextor 12X DVD+RW/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A, Retail
Item# N82E16827131326
$196.99

Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y120P0, OEM Drive Only
Item# N82E16822144148
$95.97

Aopen KB858 Keyboard USB 107keys -OEM
Item# N82E16823144011
$7.80

Kingston ValueRAM 184 Pin 256MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
Item# N82E16820141425
$49.00 X 2
$98.00

ASUS "K8V SE Deluxe" K8T800 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754
CPU -RETAIL
$119.00

Logitech SBF69 Optical Wheel Mouse PS/2 -OEM
Item# N82E16826104137
$10.00

AMD Athlon 64 2800+, 512KB L2 Cache, 64-bit Processor - OEM
Item# N82E16819103450
$173.00

GIGABYTE ATI RADEON 9200SE Video Card, 128MB DDR, 64-bit, TV-Out, 8X AGP,
Model "GV-R92S128T" -RETAIL
Item# N82E16814125116
$48.00

Total (Before tax): $ 772.76

She threw a couple curve-balls at me. She opted to go straight for
Athlon64, which is more power than most people need for office apps. and
Internet use (what SHE uses the system for). She also chose one of the most
expensive DVD burners available. A plextor 12X dual??? Yikes! I asked her
how she chose this stuff. Under each category, she looked at the featured
items/specials, and paid attention to the "star" rating. (user reviews).
OK, so she knows nothing about hardware, but she's not an idiot. (!)

I think she proved my point nicely. Show me any pre-built system under $800
that is better quality than what someone who knows NOTHING about hardware
can build themselves. It aint gonna happen!!! For the same price at Dell
(for example), your desktop would have a 40GB hard drive (crap) and no DVD
or CDR burning capability. Even if you are willing to spend an extra $200
or $300 on a Dell with similar capabilities to save the "hassle" of building
your own system, you will still end up with something that likely can't be
upgraded later (proprietary power supply connectors, for example)

This experiment proved that it's just plain stupid to order a pre-built
system, unless you really hate your money, for some odd reason. :) -Dave
Click to expand...

You did not explain all the conditions of your experiment and it was too
heavily controlled. You started out your wife with a list of components
to include. Most novice computer users would have no clue how to assemble
such a list in the first place.

Also, please explain how your wife, who you claim to be a complete
novice with computers knew how to fill in the blanks with specific
brand names and model numbers for all the components on your list.

I work with computer users all the time, esp. those who know little to
nothing about computers. I guarantee you that the typical computer user
has no idea what an AMD Athlon 64 2000+ processor is, or even why he or
she would need one, or how to install it, or even where to buy it without
the help of a knowlegable person such as yourself.

Many people who need to use a computer do not have the expertise
available that your wife has, nor do they even know how to research
such things via the Internet.
 
"Dave C." <[email protected]> said:
Well that's what forums like the homebuilt ng are for. If you get stuck,
ask the experts.
Click to expand...

But the irony is that you need to be fairly computer literate in the
first place even before you can get to online forums such as homebuilt.
Try going to a big box store and listening to a conversation between a
prospective computer buyer and the sales droid there. I have overheard
these conversations all the time, and what's even worse is that the
sales droid has only slightly more of a clue than the customer does.

Most customers have no idea what RAM is, what a CPU board is, what
a mother board is, much less how to distinguish between the good ones
and the bad ones and they have no clue what a "homebrew" is or why they
should spend their time dealing with such a forum when they can plunk
down a few hundred bucks, walk out the door of the big box store and
have their pre-built computer up and running in an hour or so, and be
surfing the web to their heart's content.

I am not against building a computer from base components, but to expect
your typical home computer user to be able to do that, much less be
smart about buying the best components for the computer is absolutely
unrealistic. If it were so easy to build an cheap computer, fast, then
stores such as CompUSA, Best Buy, Circuit City, and the like would have
gone out of the computer business long ago.
 
Well that's what forums like the homebuilt ng are for. If you get stuck,
ask the experts. :) I guarantee you that you will get better support on
usenet than you will from Dell, etc. retailers.
Click to expand...

The "average" user is completely unaware of the existence of usenet and
would have no idea how to find their way here. I know many computer users
who are farely knowledgable of PCs, having used them regularly for years,
and am surprised to find they've never even heard the word "newsgroup".[/QUOTE]

Exactly. That's even true for Mac users. I still maintain that the Mac
is by far the easiest computer to use. For example, a few years ago, my
sister (a clinical pyschologist) got sick of her Windows PC and I took
her to buy a cheap iMac. $800 for a brand new unit. I helped her bring
the computer and a new printer up her stairs to her apartment. Then i
told her to unpack the thing and set it up. I went out to buy groceries
while she did this. When I got back, she had it all done and the
computer was up and running. This is a person who has would have to go
far to even come close to having a clue about computers, despite using
them for years.

I then showed her how to use the AppleWorks software to do what she used
to do in Microsoft Works on her old computer. That took maybe an hour.
Since than, she's managed to replace her printer with an all-in-one
model without any help from me. She's set up a floppy drive to do
backups of her documents (no cd-burner), and she does everything she
needs to do without calling me. When she used Windows, hardly a week
went by where my sister didn't have to call me about one problem or
another. Her live-in boyfriend now uses Windows XP on his computer and
he's constantly having problems. He recently had to rebuilt the entire
hard drive because it went corrupt on him. All the while, my sister's
old iMac just hums along.
 
Roy Coorne said:
A most interesting approach, choosing the items with the highest
"star" rating. But: Nobody guarantees that the selected items are
compatible with each other! That is the core weakness of this
approach. And that is, at the same time, the main strength of
pre-built systems. The OEMs are no idiots, either...
Click to expand...

And what happens when Dave is out of town on business or away with his
buddies on a fishing trip and that home built computer dies right when
his wife has to get out some important document? Who does she call? Will
she be smart enough to post a question on Usenet? What if the computer is
so daamaged that it won't even start up?
 
Dave C. said:
Total (Before tax): $ 772.76

She threw a couple curve-balls at me. She opted to go straight for
Athlon64, which is more power than most people need for office apps. and
Internet use (what SHE uses the system for). She also chose one of the most
expensive DVD burners available. A plextor 12X dual??? Yikes! I asked her
how she chose this stuff. Under each category, she looked at the featured
items/specials, and paid attention to the "star" rating. (user reviews).
OK, so she knows nothing about hardware, but she's not an idiot. (!)

I think she proved my point nicely. Show me any pre-built system under $800
that is better quality than what someone who knows NOTHING about hardware
can build themselves. It aint gonna happen!!! For the same price at Dell
(for example), your desktop would have a 40GB hard drive (crap) and no DVD
or CDR burning capability. Even if you are willing to spend an extra $200
or $300 on a Dell with similar capabilities to save the "hassle" of building
your own system, you will still end up with something that likely can't be
upgraded later (proprietary power supply connectors, for example)

This experiment proved that it's just plain stupid to order a pre-built
system, unless you really hate your money, for some odd reason. :) -Dave
Click to expand...

Dave, you are without a slightest clue! I've built plenty of systems
in the past and have come to realize that there's nothing like the
hassle-free experience of buying and MAINTAINING a PC from Dell. I can
buy a Dimension 4600 with better specs than what you have listed for
$500, if I take advantage of one of the offers they e-mail me every
week!
 
Yeah yeah like someone would honestly say anything bad about a Dell
when they own one and justifying why they bought it.
 
Andrew said:
Dave, you are without a slightest clue! I've built plenty of systems
in the past and have come to realize that there's nothing like the
hassle-free experience of buying and MAINTAINING a PC from Dell. I can
buy a Dimension 4600 with better specs than what you have listed for
$500, if I take advantage of one of the offers they e-mail me every
week!
Click to expand...
When I went to Dell.com the cheapest Dimension 4600 that I saw was 798
after a 10% discount. It had P4-2.8/256mb/80gb/16x dvdrom/48x cdrw with
a 1 year warranty. That doesnt't look quite as good as the system of
the OP.

Obviously YMMV.

dick
 
Well that's what forums like the homebuilt ng are for. If you get stuck,
ask the experts. :) I guarantee you that you will get better support on
usenet than you will from Dell, etc. retailers. But what do you think of
that system my wife spec'd out? Talk about KICK-ASS!!! A athlon64 with all
good name-brand components, 512MB of RAM and 120GB hard drive? I'm half
tempted to build that puppy, just so I can show her what she did. I am
sooooooooooooo proud of her. :) Oh there are some things I would have done
differently. For example, I would have gotten a Pioneer 8X burner for half
the price and spent that money on a better video card. But damn, just
leaving the system the way my wife designed it would satisfy all but the
most hardcore gamer.
Click to expand...

Has she discovered how difficult it is to find 12x DVD media, or is
she happy with the bragging rights?

Haven't seen a response yet to my comment on flat blade vs. Phillips
for PC assembly.
 
A most interesting approach, choosing the items with the highest
"star" rating. But: Nobody guarantees that the selected items are
compatible with each other! That is the core weakness of this
approach. And that is, at the same time, the main strength of
pre-built systems. The OEMs are no idiots, either...

Roy
Click to expand...

Oh, well I forgot to mention the mainboard is the first item she chose, and
then she kind of picked everything else. So when she got to CPU, she
figured an athlon 64 processor would be good for an athlon 64 mainboard.
Makes sense, eh? :) -Dave
 
I didn't check the compatability of the equipment listed. I'm amazed that a
person with no hardware knowledge could pick out an optimal M/B(chipset),
CPU and ram combination. Then theirs AGP compatability, determining power
consumption / power supply compatability and heating / cooling issues. How
much time did she spend making out this list?

Is OEM a good idea for a first time builder? Does the CPU have a fan/heat
sink?

Not trying to rain on your parade but I spent a lot of time figuring out the
components to put into my last system and its hard to believe somone could
just go to a website and click on items to get a good one.
Click to expand...

Oh shin on a shitgle. Good catch!!! I'm betting that OEM CPU comes with no
HSF. But the last time I built a system, both the CPU and mainboard had
very stern instructions not to install a CPU without one. And so it is
likely she would have caught that mistake herself. She spent about ten
minutes picking out parts. There may have been a bit of luck involved, and
she did screw up on forgetting the HSF. But she did take a somewhat logical
approach, for someone who is totally clueless. For example (as I wrote
elsewhere), she figured an athlon 64 CPU would be a good idea for an athlon
64 mainboard. Still, I think she did awesome. I told her I'm tempted to
build her creation. -Dave
 
You did not explain all the conditions of your experiment and it was too
heavily controlled. You started out your wife with a list of components
to include. Most novice computer users would have no clue how to assemble
such a list in the first place.

Also, please explain how your wife, who you claim to be a complete
novice with computers knew how to fill in the blanks with specific
brand names and model numbers for all the components on your list.

I work with computer users all the time, esp. those who know little to
nothing about computers. I guarantee you that the typical computer user
has no idea what an AMD Athlon 64 2000+ processor is, or even why he or
she would need one, or how to install it, or even where to buy it without
the help of a knowlegable person such as yourself.

Many people who need to use a computer do not have the expertise
available that your wife has, nor do they even know how to research
such things via the Internet.
Click to expand...

Yes, you make some good points there. If someone had no spouse to make a
shopping list for them, it would take a bit of research first just to make a
shopping list. Still, if you are somewhat intelligent, you could go to just
about any good computer vendor web site and look over all the categories of
parts. A good vendor will not let you forget anything, they will want to
make SURE that you know all the parts that they carry. :) So you'll be
zipping down the list of categories and think something like "oh yeah . . .
I suppose a hard drive would be useful". And then you'll see video cards
and think "gee, I think one of those would be nice". For that matter, you
could pop into a store like CompUSA and make a shopping list just browsing
the store for a while.

My point is, all I did was save her a considerable amount of time in getting
to the point where she knew what parts she would need to build it. Without
my help, she would have got there eventually, if she was so inclined.

Oh, my wife didn't fill in blanks with specific information. When she chose
a component, she added it to the newegg shopping cart. When she was done, I
just copied what was there into windows notepad to convert it to plain text
so I could re-post it here. -Dave
 
But the irony is that you need to be fairly computer literate in the
first place even before you can get to online forums such as homebuilt.
Try going to a big box store and listening to a conversation between a
prospective computer buyer and the sales droid there. I have overheard
these conversations all the time, and what's even worse is that the
sales droid has only slightly more of a clue than the customer does.
Click to expand...

Actually, from the conversations I have overheard, the customers of the big
box stores usually know more about computers than the sales droids.
:) -Dave
 
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