Become REAL Administrator

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Alright!

This is no philosophical discussion that I intended.

In a recent discovery, I have noticed I cannot even access
C:\Users\Administrator\Local Settings without an "Access Denied"..
 
This is by design. The folder "Local Settings" is called a Junction and is
only there for compatibility purposes. When an older program is installed
and looks for this folder, the junction automatically redirects the program
to the new location in Vista, which is:

C:\Users\user name\AppData\Local

These junctions will have an arrow on the folder similar to a standard
shortcut arrow.


--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User
 
There is nothing in that folder? It does not contain any useful data, since
it's sole reason for existing is to simply redirect programs that try to
write to the folder with that name on to the proper folder.

If you simply want to know the target where a Junction or Symbolic Link is
pointing to you can do this from a command prompt.

Go to Start and type cmd and click the cmd.exe program.

The command window should open at the C:\Users\<username> folder.

Type dir /AHL and press the ENTER key. (Note the space in the
command)

The result will be a list of folders in that users folder.

A typical junction will look like this:

<date> <time> <JUNCTION> SendTo
[C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\SendTo]

This shows that the information for the old Send To folder is now
contained in the folder that the path points to in the brackets. You should
see all of the junction points with the old name of the folder and the new
location for that folder in Vista. Run this same command on the root drive
to see more junctions.

Here is more information on Junctions and Symbolic Links.

Symbolic Links:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365680.aspx

Hard Links and Junctions:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365006.aspx

NTFS junction point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_junction_point




--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User
 
Ok, you are right. That command did work.

Now, why can I not delete The MSN folder (among other various folders) in
the C:\Program Files (x86)? I get an access denied. I cannot audit either, I
get an access denied.

Ronnie Vernon MVP said:
There is nothing in that folder? It does not contain any useful data, since
it's sole reason for existing is to simply redirect programs that try to
write to the folder with that name on to the proper folder.

If you simply want to know the target where a Junction or Symbolic Link is
pointing to you can do this from a command prompt.

Go to Start and type cmd and click the cmd.exe program.

The command window should open at the C:\Users\<username> folder.

Type dir /AHL and press the ENTER key. (Note the space in the
command)

The result will be a list of folders in that users folder.

A typical junction will look like this:

<date> <time> <JUNCTION> SendTo
[C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\SendTo]

This shows that the information for the old Send To folder is now
contained in the folder that the path points to in the brackets. You should
see all of the junction points with the old name of the folder and the new
location for that folder in Vista. Run this same command on the root drive
to see more junctions.

Here is more information on Junctions and Symbolic Links.

Symbolic Links:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365680.aspx

Hard Links and Junctions:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365006.aspx

NTFS junction point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_junction_point




--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


D3DAiM said:
I see. I would still like access to this folder however. How may I go about
doing that?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Niether do I have access to my own C:\Users\Administrator\Start Menu or
C:\Users\Administrator\Application Data among others. "Access Denied"
 
I have said this before and will say it again - Instead of an box popping up
with "Access Denied", the box should say "Junction or Symbolic Folder.
Folder Contains No Files. Please See Help Files". Or something similar,
then, Ron, your very helpful information could be put into the Help files on
the users system.
 
I don't disagree with what you are saying, but most all of the underlying
structure of the OS is hidden from view with the focus on making things
easier for the typical user. Most people will not be concerned with things
like junctions, symbolic links, and etc.

In fact these folders are hidden by default and a user must change at least
2 of these default options to even make these folders appear in Windows
Explorer. For the non-typical tech savvy user who really wants to dive deep
into how things work, there is plenty of resources available and these users
normally know where to find this information, like these newsgroups. :)

--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User
 
--
Carl G

Ronnie Vernon MVP said:
There is nothing in that folder? It does not contain any useful data,
since it's sole reason for existing is to simply redirect programs that
try to write to the folder with that name on to the proper folder.
Click to expand...

I still don't understand this , Then what good is it if it just sends
everything along to the real folder ?
If it sends EVERYTHING along , It sounds like it is just a wasted stop along
the way. No wonder Vista is
slower then XP is. All them wasted stops.
I just don't get it.
Carl G
If you simply want to know the target where a Junction or Symbolic Link is
pointing to you can do this from a command prompt.

Go to Start and type cmd and click the cmd.exe program.

The command window should open at the C:\Users\<username> folder.

Type dir /AHL and press the ENTER key. (Note the space in the
command)

The result will be a list of folders in that users folder.

A typical junction will look like this:

<date> <time> <JUNCTION> SendTo
[C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\SendTo]

This shows that the information for the old Send To folder is now
contained in the folder that the path points to in the brackets. You
should see all of the junction points with the old name of the folder and
the new location for that folder in Vista. Run this same command on the
root drive to see more junctions.

Here is more information on Junctions and Symbolic Links.

Symbolic Links:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365680.aspx

Hard Links and Junctions:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365006.aspx

NTFS junction point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_junction_point




--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


D3DAiM said:
I see. I would still like access to this folder however. How may I go
about
doing that?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Carl

You need to read the entire thread. The junctions and Symbolic Links are
there for older programs and applications that were written for earlier
versions of Windows, like XP for instance. These programs will look for the
folders names that existed in XP, but have been replaced with a newer group
of folders, with different names in Vista.

If they do not find these old folders, they will simply throw an error and
quit. The junctions prevent this.



--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


Carl G said:
--
Carl G

Ronnie Vernon MVP said:
There is nothing in that folder? It does not contain any useful data,
since it's sole reason for existing is to simply redirect programs that
try to write to the folder with that name on to the proper folder.
Click to expand...

I still don't understand this , Then what good is it if it just sends
everything along to the real folder ?
If it sends EVERYTHING along , It sounds like it is just a wasted stop
along the way. No wonder Vista is
slower then XP is. All them wasted stops.
I just don't get it.
Carl G
If you simply want to know the target where a Junction or Symbolic Link
is pointing to you can do this from a command prompt.

Go to Start and type cmd and click the cmd.exe program.

The command window should open at the C:\Users\<username> folder.

Type dir /AHL and press the ENTER key. (Note the space in the
command)

The result will be a list of folders in that users folder.

A typical junction will look like this:

<date> <time> <JUNCTION> SendTo
[C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\SendTo]

This shows that the information for the old Send To folder is now
contained in the folder that the path points to in the brackets. You
should see all of the junction points with the old name of the folder and
the new location for that folder in Vista. Run this same command on the
root drive to see more junctions.

Here is more information on Junctions and Symbolic Links.

Symbolic Links:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365680.aspx

Hard Links and Junctions:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365006.aspx

NTFS junction point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_junction_point




--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


D3DAiM said:
I see. I would still like access to this folder however. How may I go
about
doing that?

:

This is by design. The folder "Local Settings" is called a Junction and
is
only there for compatibility purposes. When an older program is
installed
and looks for this folder, the junction automatically redirects the
program
to the new location in Vista, which is:

C:\Users\user name\AppData\Local

These junctions will have an arrow on the folder similar to a standard
shortcut arrow.


--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


Alright!

This is no philosophical discussion that I intended.

In a recent discovery, I have noticed I cannot even access
C:\Users\Administrator\Local Settings without an "Access Denied"..

:

But only to itself as long as NOTHING leaves that computer.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


Even a system that is not connected to the internet is still at
risk. Every time a CD/DVD/Floppy Disk or any other kind of media
is
inserted into the system, there is a risk.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 21:57:18 -0700, "Ronnie Vernon MVP"
You need to read the entire thread. The junctions and Symbolic Links are
there for older programs and applications that were written for earlier
versions of Windows, like XP for instance. These programs will look for the
folders names that existed in XP, but have been replaced with a newer group
of folders, with different names in Vista.
Click to expand...
If they do not find these old folders, they will simply throw an error and
quit. The junctions prevent this.
Click to expand...

I think he's asking why they changed the locations and names in the
first place, and the answer may be partly cosmetic (get rid of the
patronizing "My..." stuff) and to undo some ill-advised nesting
defaults that wre applied before Vista.

It also lets the compatibility cord be cut down the line, at a time
when one prefers to avoid current legacy apps that "break the rules"
by accessing such paths directly, rather than shell lookup.
 
I still don't understand Kerry.
My understanding is that these junction folders were there for security
reasons,not just compatability for older OS.
If that is correct,then just passing from them to the new location has no
security at all if they just get passed along.

--
Carl G

Ronnie Vernon MVP said:
Carl

You need to read the entire thread. The junctions and Symbolic Links are
there for older programs and applications that were written for earlier
versions of Windows, like XP for instance. These programs will look for
the folders names that existed in XP, but have been replaced with a newer
group of folders, with different names in Vista.

If they do not find these old folders, they will simply throw an error and
quit. The junctions prevent this.



--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


Carl G said:
--
Carl G

Ronnie Vernon MVP said:
There is nothing in that folder? It does not contain any useful data,
since it's sole reason for existing is to simply redirect programs that
try to write to the folder with that name on to the proper folder.
Click to expand...

I still don't understand this , Then what good is it if it just sends
everything along to the real folder ?
If it sends EVERYTHING along , It sounds like it is just a wasted stop
along the way. No wonder Vista is
slower then XP is. All them wasted stops.
I just don't get it.
Carl G
If you simply want to know the target where a Junction or Symbolic Link
is pointing to you can do this from a command prompt.

Go to Start and type cmd and click the cmd.exe program.

The command window should open at the C:\Users\<username> folder.

Type dir /AHL and press the ENTER key. (Note the space in the
command)

The result will be a list of folders in that users folder.

A typical junction will look like this:

<date> <time> <JUNCTION> SendTo
[C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\SendTo]

This shows that the information for the old Send To folder is now
contained in the folder that the path points to in the brackets. You
should see all of the junction points with the old name of the folder
and the new location for that folder in Vista. Run this same command on
the root drive to see more junctions.

Here is more information on Junctions and Symbolic Links.

Symbolic Links:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365680.aspx

Hard Links and Junctions:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365006.aspx

NTFS junction point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_junction_point




--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


I see. I would still like access to this folder however. How may I go
about
doing that?

:

This is by design. The folder "Local Settings" is called a Junction
and is
only there for compatibility purposes. When an older program is
installed
and looks for this folder, the junction automatically redirects the
program
to the new location in Vista, which is:

C:\Users\user name\AppData\Local

These junctions will have an arrow on the folder similar to a standard
shortcut arrow.


--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


Alright!

This is no philosophical discussion that I intended.

In a recent discovery, I have noticed I cannot even access
C:\Users\Administrator\Local Settings without an "Access Denied"..

:

But only to itself as long as NOTHING leaves that computer.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


Even a system that is not connected to the internet is still at
risk. Every time a CD/DVD/Floppy Disk or any other kind of media
is
inserted into the system, there is a risk.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
This is beyond "security" and has reached "stupidity". Yes, we need secure
operating systems and as mentioned most "robust" OS's are secure. However,
all those mentioned also have provisions for "GOD" keys. In the OS390 world,
it's called non-cancelable.

I am building this machine, I bought it, I installed it, I setup the Users,
etc., I am God and I am tired of being nagged by Vista already.

Give us a REAL administrator’s key.
 
Well..

Back to my problem:

I would like to be able to access files without an "access denied". I am
logged onto the administrator account right now. That SHOULD be enough.

However, all hidden files located in C:\Users\Administrators give me an
"access denied" error when I attempt to access the files.

This includes the Start Menu, Application Data, and Cookies folders among
others.

There are also various folders in the Pram Files I cannot access/modify.
 
So what is the answer here .


--
Carl G

Carl G said:
I still don't understand Kerry.
My understanding is that these junction folders were there for security
reasons,not just compatability for older OS.
If that is correct,then just passing from them to the new location has no
security at all if they just get passed along.

--
Carl G

Ronnie Vernon MVP said:
Carl

You need to read the entire thread. The junctions and Symbolic Links are
there for older programs and applications that were written for earlier
versions of Windows, like XP for instance. These programs will look for
the folders names that existed in XP, but have been replaced with a newer
group of folders, with different names in Vista.

If they do not find these old folders, they will simply throw an error
and quit. The junctions prevent this.



--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


Carl G said:
--
Carl G

There is nothing in that folder? It does not contain any useful data,
since it's sole reason for existing is to simply redirect programs that
try to write to the folder with that name on to the proper folder.

I still don't understand this , Then what good is it if it just sends
everything along to the real folder ?
If it sends EVERYTHING along , It sounds like it is just a wasted stop
along the way. No wonder Vista is
slower then XP is. All them wasted stops.
I just don't get it.
Carl G

If you simply want to know the target where a Junction or Symbolic Link
is pointing to you can do this from a command prompt.

Go to Start and type cmd and click the cmd.exe program.

The command window should open at the C:\Users\<username> folder.

Type dir /AHL and press the ENTER key. (Note the space in the
command)

The result will be a list of folders in that users folder.

A typical junction will look like this:

<date> <time> <JUNCTION> SendTo
[C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\SendTo]

This shows that the information for the old Send To folder is now
contained in the folder that the path points to in the brackets. You
should see all of the junction points with the old name of the folder
and the new location for that folder in Vista. Run this same command on
the root drive to see more junctions.

Here is more information on Junctions and Symbolic Links.

Symbolic Links:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365680.aspx

Hard Links and Junctions:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa365006.aspx

NTFS junction point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_junction_point




--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


I see. I would still like access to this folder however. How may I go
about
doing that?

:

This is by design. The folder "Local Settings" is called a Junction
and is
only there for compatibility purposes. When an older program is
installed
and looks for this folder, the junction automatically redirects the
program
to the new location in Vista, which is:

C:\Users\user name\AppData\Local

These junctions will have an arrow on the folder similar to a
standard
shortcut arrow.


--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


Alright!

This is no philosophical discussion that I intended.

In a recent discovery, I have noticed I cannot even access
C:\Users\Administrator\Local Settings without an "Access Denied"..

:

But only to itself as long as NOTHING leaves that computer.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org


Even a system that is not connected to the internet is still at
risk. Every time a CD/DVD/Floppy Disk or any other kind of media
is
inserted into the system, there is a risk.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
LOL

Ok, so I understand they "junctions" then. How about the folders in my
C:\Program Files that I cannot modify.

Such files include, but are definitely not limited to, the MSN, Windows
Defender, and Windows Mail folders.
 
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