ATI 9200 won't synch above 75 hertz...why?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Don Enderton
  • Start date Start date
Well, I don't need "Reforce" after all, Daniel et al.

I just removed the ATI 9200 and replaced it with my old (and VERY noisy)
NVIDIA GeForce4 ti4200. Guess what?

Now XP (without Reforce or any other third party hardware) together with the
NVIDIA card and drivers, let my monitor run, once again, at a refresh rate
of 100 hertz. This is with default settings, no tweaking involved, XP Home
with SP 1 and current updates (but no updates since before changing the
cards).

So there is something about the ATI 9200 card, or its supplied drivers and
installation "test" routines, which prevents my CRT from running at its (and
my) preferred refresh rates. Again, I'm not talking games here, just the
refresh rate at the desktop.

I have corresponded with ATI technical support twice on this. The first
time, they sent back a bunch of inapplicable and irrelevant links and FAQs.
The second time, they didn't respond yet.

This ATI 9200 goes back to Frys today or tomorrow for a full refund.

I'll look for another quiet card.

I'm afraid to try the non-Pro ATI 9600 because I suspect the same refresh
rate problem (ATI's, not XP's) will happen with that one too.

Maybe the Gainward FX5200 Lite. I know it's slow, but I have to downgrade
to get rid of the fan noise while still keeping all my PCI slots available,
and that card is passive cooled. And if I stay with nVidia, at least I'm
more likely to keep my higher refresh rate.

My old, noisy, ti4200 also has better 2d performance (clearer and more
precise text display) than the ATI 9200. Hm.

Don Enderton said:
Daniel, no, I still haven't tried Reforce, but I will eventually, I'm pretty
sure! It's just that I haven't read elsewhere about the 75Hz barrier, only
the 60Hz, including in the description of the software at its own download
site. I'm cautious about installing unfamiliar software.

Is there a Reforce readme file available after download, but before
commencing installation?

My Trinitron monitor is good, but old (about 5 years or more), so I wouldn't
be surprised if it's not giving DDC information. [I confess I don't know
what DDC information is.] But XP does "know" which refresh rates my monitor
can handle - they are listed in Display Properties.

If Reforce does nothing to the registry, how can it work? I assume it has
to run every time Windows starts?

I'm going to temporarily reinstall my old GeForce4 ti4200 noisy fan card to
verify that it is stuck at 75Hz as well (if it was, I hadn't noticed that
before). If it is, then I'll be fully convinced this has nothing to do with
the new ATI 5200.

-- Don

Look, have you tried the program yet? It'll fix what you're seeing. XP
Click to expand...
has
a
problem where the video drivers will max out at a "safe" refresh rate of
75Hz no matter what you tell it to run at (or what it thinks its running
at). I believe it's a problem with the driver obtaining incorrect DDC
information from the monitor (or no DDC information).

There's supposedly a registry setting that some folks change to tell the
driver to ignore DDC, but in my case that did absolutely nothing. I went
through the same thing well over a year ago. Just download Reforce and try
it on one resolution rate! It has a "restore" function if you think it
didn't work. This is also a permanent fix, you only have to run it once and
it does nothing to your registry or video drivers.

This is NOT the problem where DirectX games will only run at 60Hz, but
Reforce will solve that too. Also, XP officially does not support 640x480
except in games, no matter what your video card is (although I believe
there's a way to work around that if you really want it).

- Daniel
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Look what I finally found at ATI (but it doesn't apply to my issue):

http://www.ati.com/support/infobase/3653.html

Unfortunately, it is not applicable to my problem, though possibly related.
I was not experiencing a 60 hertz limit, rather a 75 hertz limit. And the
current ATI Radeon drivers do not provide a tab like the illustrated one.
And my monitor (I just verified) *is* DDC compliant.

http://docs.us.dell.com/docs/monitors/66510/notes.htm

Above is a link to some tech notes about my monitor which give the DDC
compliance specs.

-- Disappointed (in ATI) Don

Don Enderton said:
Well, I don't need "Reforce" after all, Daniel et al.

I just removed the ATI 9200 and replaced it with my old (and VERY noisy)
NVIDIA GeForce4 ti4200. Guess what?

Now XP (without Reforce or any other third party hardware) together with the
NVIDIA card and drivers, let my monitor run, once again, at a refresh rate
of 100 hertz. This is with default settings, no tweaking involved, XP Home
with SP 1 and current updates (but no updates since before changing the
cards).

So there is something about the ATI 9200 card, or its supplied drivers and
installation "test" routines, which prevents my CRT from running at its (and
my) preferred refresh rates. Again, I'm not talking games here, just the
refresh rate at the desktop.

I have corresponded with ATI technical support twice on this. The first
time, they sent back a bunch of inapplicable and irrelevant links and FAQs.
The second time, they didn't respond yet.

This ATI 9200 goes back to Frys today or tomorrow for a full refund.

I'll look for another quiet card.

I'm afraid to try the non-Pro ATI 9600 because I suspect the same refresh
rate problem (ATI's, not XP's) will happen with that one too.

Maybe the Gainward FX5200 Lite. I know it's slow, but I have to downgrade
to get rid of the fan noise while still keeping all my PCI slots available,
and that card is passive cooled. And if I stay with nVidia, at least I'm
more likely to keep my higher refresh rate.

My old, noisy, ti4200 also has better 2d performance (clearer and more
precise text display) than the ATI 9200. Hm.

Don Enderton said:
Daniel, no, I still haven't tried Reforce, but I will eventually, I'm pretty
sure! It's just that I haven't read elsewhere about the 75Hz barrier, only
the 60Hz, including in the description of the software at its own download
site. I'm cautious about installing unfamiliar software.

Is there a Reforce readme file available after download, but before
commencing installation?

My Trinitron monitor is good, but old (about 5 years or more), so I wouldn't
be surprised if it's not giving DDC information. [I confess I don't know
what DDC information is.] But XP does "know" which refresh rates my monitor
can handle - they are listed in Display Properties.

If Reforce does nothing to the registry, how can it work? I assume it has
to run every time Windows starts?

I'm going to temporarily reinstall my old GeForce4 ti4200 noisy fan card to
verify that it is stuck at 75Hz as well (if it was, I hadn't noticed that
before). If it is, then I'll be fully convinced this has nothing to do with
the new ATI 5200.

-- Don

Look, have you tried the program yet? It'll fix what you're seeing. XP
Click to expand...
has
a
problem where the video drivers will max out at a "safe" refresh rate of
75Hz no matter what you tell it to run at (or what it thinks its running
at). I believe it's a problem with the driver obtaining incorrect DDC
information from the monitor (or no DDC information).

There's supposedly a registry setting that some folks change to tell the
driver to ignore DDC, but in my case that did absolutely nothing. I went
through the same thing well over a year ago. Just download Reforce and try
it on one resolution rate! It has a "restore" function if you think it
didn't work. This is also a permanent fix, you only have to run it
Click to expand...
once
and
it does nothing to your registry or video drivers.

This is NOT the problem where DirectX games will only run at 60Hz, but
Reforce will solve that too. Also, XP officially does not support 640x480
except in games, no matter what your video card is (although I believe
there's a way to work around that if you really want it).

- Daniel
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
http://www.ati.com/support/infobase/3653.html
Unfortunately, it is not applicable to my problem, though possibly related.
I was not experiencing a 60 hertz limit, rather a 75 hertz limit. And the
current ATI Radeon drivers do not provide a tab like the illustrated one.
And my monitor (I just verified) *is* DDC compliant.
Click to expand...

I am seeing a 60 HZ limit, but there is no such dialog anywhere in my
display properties, and the monitor pages does offer me frequencies
greater than 60 HZ, it apparently just doesn't actually set them to
the number I select.
--email: (e-mail address removed) icbm: Delray Beach, FL |
<URL:http://home.att.net/~Tom.Horsley> Free Software and Politics <<==+
 
Well, I just tried the program on my XP system with a 9200, and no
matter what I try to set using either the program or the display properties,
the monitor always and forever reports that it is running at 60HZ.
Click to expand...


This issue crops up once or twice each week, the origins of the problem
go back to a BUG in the MicrosoftXP O/S. not the drivers/ATI etc!

..1. I use the Omega' drivers, they put in the appropriate 'tabs' for
everything.

GoTo: http://www.omegacorner.com/

-click on ATi Radeon
-click on My ATi Radeon Help Page
-read "PROBLEMS WITH XP REFRESH RATES "

..2 Additionally read the BIOS suggestions, I use these settings:-

Enable - Assign IRQ for VGA
Enable - AGP master 1 WS write
Enable - AGP master 1 WS read
Enable - SDRAM Bank Interleave at 4/Way

Disable - Fast writes
Disable - System BIOS cacheable
Disable - Do not install the ATi 'Control Panel'

..... Hope this helps!

BoroLad
 
Don Enderton said:
Well, I don't need "Reforce" after all, Daniel et al.

I just removed the ATI 9200 and replaced it with my old (and VERY noisy)
NVIDIA GeForce4 ti4200. Guess what?

Now XP (without Reforce or any other third party hardware) together with the
NVIDIA card and drivers, let my monitor run, once again, at a refresh rate
of 100 hertz. This is with default settings, no tweaking involved, XP Home
with SP 1 and current updates (but no updates since before changing the
cards).

So there is something about the ATI 9200 card, or its supplied drivers and
installation "test" routines, which prevents my CRT from running at its (and
my) preferred refresh rates. Again, I'm not talking games here, just the
refresh rate at the desktop.

I have corresponded with ATI technical support twice on this. The first
time, they sent back a bunch of inapplicable and irrelevant links and FAQs.
The second time, they didn't respond yet.

This ATI 9200 goes back to Frys today or tomorrow for a full refund.
Click to expand...


Sigh, whatever man... kind of pointless to try to help someone who doesn't
even want to try the solution.

- Daniel
 
Runnung windows XP. Got the 9600 PRO loaded only drivers and couldn't
get over 60 for refresh with a Philips 201P (BNC's), or over 75 with a
Nokia 445PRO; both of them do 100 with old tnt card. Properties had
refresh of 100 selected, monitors showed 60/75 being displayed. After
wasting much time I loaded their control panel (downloaded latest
drivers & control panel from ATI). Suddenly clicking display
properties/settings/advanced brings up a totally different screen.
Once there pick displays tab, then Monitor bar in middle of page; now
you can select max resolution and refresh rates for the monitor
yourself. If you don't do this it just relies on DDC info returned
from monitor (may be right/wrong/or non existant; weird thing is
you're not even informed you have this limitation anywhere till panel
is loaded.

Till you load their control panel as well as the driver you can't do
this.

GOOD LUCK
 
Yeah, tom, I returned the ATI 9200, bought an ATI 9600 (nonpro), discovered
I had the same problem, installed the control panel, managed to set my
refresh rate to what I wanted (100, in my case), then uninstalled the
control panel (didn't want that extra software loading and running all the
time, don't need it), but then returned the ATI 9600 due to other issues.

Bought an eVGA brand nVidia FX5200 with 128MB of 128 bit memory instead.
Works better with FS9 (Flight Simulator 2004) which is only one of a couple
of games I play. And still has no fan - no noise. Hard to find an FX5200
with 128 bit not 64 bit memory, and no fan, but I did. Huge heat sink.

One odd thing about the ATI 3.8 drivers with the ATI 9600: Device Manager
always showed 4 monitors, 2 "default" monitors and two of the one model and
make of monitor I have....

I didn't try older drivers with the ATI 9600, just took it back.
 
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