M
McGrandpa
ok, going by the tests shown at these links, where does anyone getDRS said:
"noticeably faster"? Moot point though. There aren't any more 'GT's
being produced. And I've gone to 7800GTX's now.
McG.
"noticeably faster"? Moot point though. There aren't any more 'GT's
being produced. And I've gone to 7800GTX's now.
McG.
M
McGrandpa
Ed Forsythe said:You're my hero McG - Reminds me of me when I was your age youngster.;-)McGrandpa said:Ed Forsythe said:Hi McG,
6800 GS = $200, 7800 GTX = $400+ Even if you're PCIe now, the 6800 GS is
a far better PP ay $170.. Do you have anything that the 6800 GS won't
run? If you're looking for bragging rights you've got it goin'! Deuce
7800 SLI Yahoooey!! I've never been accused of being frugal but I'm far
wiser now than when I paid $5000 for an IBM MicroChannel system)
So how long did your Micro Channel system stay in use?
Well, those 'awhile back dollars' were harder earned. I have always
been fairly frugal, with 4 kids and all that goes with em. Turning point
in life, kids are all out with kids of their own and I'm now in my 50's.
I kinda think it's my turn now
$900 for the pair of eVGA 7800GTX 256 ACS3 cards. Back in August the X2
4800+ was $985. I could have waited on that bit, but didn't as I figured
I might end up talking myself out of itSO for just a mobo, 2 vid
cards and a cpu I've dropped 2 grand. And, no, never had the GS's,
just a 6800GT AGP. Then, stage II of the planned upgrade. pci-e sli
mobo and pair of 7800GTX512's. The GTX512's never materialized, and I've
had to juggle stuff around to get a pair of matched GTX 256 cards.
I'm not desperate, nuts or ignorant. This is just what I want to do. I
likely will go back to being frugal after this
will last a year or two!
McG.
McGrandpa wrote:
Hi Troops,
After much deliberation I finally decided to deep six my venerable
9800Pro/128 and replace it with a 6800GS/AGP.
[...]
I think you'd enjoy a 6800GT 256 a lot more, if you can find one.
What on earth makes you say that? The 6800GS is the replacement for
the 6800GT. It's cheaper, cooler and its performance varies from a
bee's dick under the GT to up to 40% faster depending on the
benchmark. And those 6800GS cards are 256Mb.
About availability; not all stores are lacking in 6800GT's:
NewEgg (original URL was WAAAY too long)
http://tinyurl.com/z5y9v
It's a given the GS is less expensive. And also, the 7800GS is right
there in the price range with the 6800GT's that are left.
Well hell, I've just talked myself right away from all the 6800's!!!
My new 2nd 7800GTX will be here tomorrow anway
McG.
I'm 76 and I've become a wee bit more patient. *BUT* I'm going to do a
major upgrade before I load Vista. New PCIe MB, AMD's best CPU (unless
Intel
AMD's best should be about to get better, if I read things right. For the
moment, BEST would be an FX60, and that's a dual core also.
Youngster
My doctor is 86 and calls me that, and it gets a smile outtame too
I've always wanted to have a really nice system. Been buildingmy own since about '85. Started out doing it all on the cheap, buying used
and bargain parts as I could. This rig was to be special from the
beginning. When I first heard of AMD building a dual core cpu that runs as
cool as any Athlon 64 single core, I wanted one. Then came the scaled name
scheme, so I picked the top of the list. Had to wait for it to become
available, then had to special order one and wait about a month. Everything
else was easy. I actually started this build back in August with an AGP
mobo with clear plans to go PCI-e and get a pair of matched cards and run
them in SLI. I have a new PCI-e mobo, a new 7800GTX256 ACS3, a new 550W
dual +12v rail SLI ready PSU. All I need is for Mr. Brown to drop off my
carton with my other new 7800GTX256 ACS3
)) Yeah, I could have gottenthe pair at one time from NewEgg. Shoulda gone there first huh?
Then it's ON! LOL!
McG.
M
McGrandpa
Ed Forsythe said:Thanks for the helpful advice troops ;-) I'll mull everything over but, as
of now, I'm still torn between eVGA, XFX, and BFG. I'm leaning toward XFX
because it has dual DVI+ the capability to power one LCD with dual DVI
input for higher resolutions. Of course your monitor must have dual DVI
inputs. A word of advice - Wait until the 3rd week in March before making
*any* vid card purchase. That's when the new stuff will be released and
the old prices will drop considerably. It's going to be hard 'cause I'm
ready now
Depends on what you're waiting for the price to come down on Ed. As I've
learned the hard way this past year, there may not be any to wait on by the
time you're ready!
McG.
E
Ed Forsythe
Which MB did you select McG?
McGrandpa said:Ed Forsythe said:You're my hero McG - Reminds me of me when I was your age youngster.;-)McGrandpa said:Hi McG,
6800 GS = $200, 7800 GTX = $400+ Even if you're PCIe now, the 6800 GS
is a far better PP ay $170.. Do you have anything that the 6800 GS
won't run? If you're looking for bragging rights you've got it goin'!
Deuce 7800 SLI Yahoooey!! I've never been accused of being frugal but
I'm far wiser now than when I paid $5000 for an IBM MicroChannel system
So how long did your Micro Channel system stay in use?
Well, those 'awhile back dollars' were harder earned. I have always
been fairly frugal, with 4 kids and all that goes with em. Turning
point in life, kids are all out with kids of their own and I'm now in my
50's. I kinda think it's my turn now
$900 for the pair of eVGA 7800GTX 256 ACS3 cards. Back in August the X2
4800+ was $985. I could have waited on that bit, but didn't as I
figured I might end up talking myself out of it
2 vid cards and a cpu I've dropped 2 grand. And, no, never had the
GS's, just a 6800GT AGP. Then, stage II of the planned upgrade. pci-e
sli mobo and pair of 7800GTX512's. The GTX512's never materialized, and
I've had to juggle stuff around to get a pair of matched GTX 256 cards.
I'm not desperate, nuts or ignorant. This is just what I want to do.
I likely will go back to being frugal after this
rig will last a year or two!
McG.
McGrandpa wrote:
Hi Troops,
After much deliberation I finally decided to deep six my venerable
9800Pro/128 and replace it with a 6800GS/AGP.
[...]
I think you'd enjoy a 6800GT 256 a lot more, if you can find one.
What on earth makes you say that? The 6800GS is the replacement for
the 6800GT. It's cheaper, cooler and its performance varies from a
bee's dick under the GT to up to 40% faster depending on the
benchmark. And those 6800GS cards are 256Mb.
About availability; not all stores are lacking in 6800GT's:
NewEgg (original URL was WAAAY too long)
http://tinyurl.com/z5y9v
It's a given the GS is less expensive. And also, the 7800GS is right
there in the price range with the 6800GT's that are left.
Well hell, I've just talked myself right away from all the 6800's!!!
My new 2nd 7800GTX will be here tomorrow anway
McG.
I'm 76 and I've become a wee bit more patient. *BUT* I'm going to do a
major upgrade before I load Vista. New PCIe MB, AMD's best CPU (unless
Intel
AMD's best should be about to get better, if I read things right. For
the moment, BEST would be an FX60, and that's a dual core also.
Youngster
me too
building my own since about '85. Started out doing it all on the cheap,
buying used and bargain parts as I could. This rig was to be special
from the beginning. When I first heard of AMD building a dual core cpu
that runs as cool as any Athlon 64 single core, I wanted one. Then came
the scaled name scheme, so I picked the top of the list. Had to wait for
it to become available, then had to special order one and wait about a
month. Everything else was easy. I actually started this build back in
August with an AGP mobo with clear plans to go PCI-e and get a pair of
matched cards and run them in SLI. I have a new PCI-e mobo, a new
7800GTX256 ACS3, a new 550W dual +12v rail SLI ready PSU. All I need is
for Mr. Brown to drop off my carton with my other new 7800GTX256 ACS3
Shoulda gone there first huh?
Then it's ON! LOL!
McG.
M
Mxsmanic
Ed said:
You'll _need_ a major upgrade before Vista, if you want to maintain
the same performance. Vista sets new records for processor time
wasted on pretty graphics.
E
Ed Forsythe
That's what I said?? Think I'd better go back to the ATI group. It's a
kinder world - just kidding <S>.
kinder world - just kidding <S>.
M
McGrandpa
Ed Forsythe said:McGrandpa said:Ed Forsythe said:Hi McG,
6800 GS = $200, 7800 GTX = $400+ Even if you're PCIe now, the 6800 GS
is a far better PP ay $170.. Do you have anything that the 6800 GS
won't run? If you're looking for bragging rights you've got it goin'!
Deuce 7800 SLI Yahoooey!! I've never been accused of being frugal but
I'm far wiser now than when I paid $5000 for an IBM MicroChannel
system
So how long did your Micro Channel system stay in use?
Well, those 'awhile back dollars' were harder earned. I have always
been fairly frugal, with 4 kids and all that goes with em. Turning
point in life, kids are all out with kids of their own and I'm now in
my 50's. I kinda think it's my turn now
$900 for the pair of eVGA 7800GTX 256 ACS3 cards. Back in August the
X2 4800+ was $985. I could have waited on that bit, but didn't as I
figured I might end up talking myself out of it
2 vid cards and a cpu I've dropped 2 grand. And, no, never had the
GS's, just a 6800GT AGP. Then, stage II of the planned upgrade. pci-e
sli mobo and pair of 7800GTX512's. The GTX512's never materialized,
and I've had to juggle stuff around to get a pair of matched GTX 256
cards.
I'm not desperate, nuts or ignorant. This is just what I want to do. I
likely will go back to being frugal after this
rig will last a year or two!
McG.
McGrandpa wrote:
Hi Troops,
After much deliberation I finally decided to deep six my venerable
9800Pro/128 and replace it with a 6800GS/AGP.
[...]
I think you'd enjoy a 6800GT 256 a lot more, if you can find one.
What on earth makes you say that? The 6800GS is the replacement for
the 6800GT. It's cheaper, cooler and its performance varies from a
bee's dick under the GT to up to 40% faster depending on the
benchmark. And those 6800GS cards are 256Mb.
About availability; not all stores are lacking in 6800GT's:
NewEgg (original URL was WAAAY too long)
http://tinyurl.com/z5y9v
It's a given the GS is less expensive. And also, the 7800GS is
right there in the price range with the 6800GT's that are left.
Well hell, I've just talked myself right away from all the 6800's!!!
My new 2nd 7800GTX will be here tomorrow anway
McG.
You're my hero McG - Reminds me of me when I was your age youngster.;-)
I'm 76 and I've become a wee bit more patient. *BUT* I'm going to do a
major upgrade before I load Vista. New PCIe MB, AMD's best CPU (unless
Intel
AMD's best should be about to get better, if I read things right. For
the moment, BEST would be an FX60, and that's a dual core also.
Youngster
outta me too
building my own since about '85. Started out doing it all on the cheap,
buying used and bargain parts as I could. This rig was to be special
from the beginning. When I first heard of AMD building a dual core cpu
that runs as cool as any Athlon 64 single core, I wanted one. Then came
the scaled name scheme, so I picked the top of the list. Had to wait for
it to become available, then had to special order one and wait about a
month. Everything else was easy. I actually started this build back in
August with an AGP mobo with clear plans to go PCI-e and get a pair of
matched cards and run them in SLI. I have a new PCI-e mobo, a new
7800GTX256 ACS3, a new 550W dual +12v rail SLI ready PSU. All I need is
for Mr. Brown to drop off my carton with my other new 7800GTX256 ACS3
Shoulda gone there first huh?
Then it's ON! LOL!
McG.
Which MB did you select McG?
Gigabyte GA-K8N-SLI. I originally wanted the one that has wireless
networking built in. Everyone I went to just gave me a blank look when I
told em which one. This one ain't shabby, but is short a few odds and ends
that can be useful.
http://www.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard/Products/Products_GA-K8N-SLI.htm is
the one I have running right now on the desk here.
http://www.giga-byte.com/Motherboard/Products/Products_GA-K8NS Ultra-939.htm
is the AGP based board I just gave to my son, along with the eVGA 6800GT
256. And 2x1gb PC3200 DIMMs. Well, had to make room for the new stuff,
right?
http://www.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard/Products/Products_GA-K8N Pro-SLI.htm
is the 'Pro' version, only difference I see between mine and this is this
one has Firewire ports.
http://www.giga-byte.com/Motherboard/Products/Products_GA-K8NXP-SLI.htm is
the one that I actually wanted and started out looking for. Dual power
system (not as good as Asus 8phase but better than stock), has 8 sata ports,
802.11g/b onboard as well as all the other stuff
All Gigabytes nForce4 SLI chipset mobos:
http://www.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard/Products/Products_nForce4+SLI.htm
I wanted SLI, and I'm doing my best to see that it happens!
McG.
M
McGrandpa
Nah, I read that one too. Just as many 'fanbois' there as here or anywhereEd Forsythe said:
really
I don't like *just* hardware. I like, and buy and use; hardware that
WORKS.
AMD *after* the xP's, with the Athlon 64 and up... have hardware that
really works good! And they ain't little fryin pans any more, yaknow?
Nice. Now, the high end video cards. Wow, they can get warm quick these
days. I've had to re-think air-flow through my case. Replacing the three
80mm case fans with quiet 120mm fans. The X2 4800+ has topped 99F a couple
times.
)))McG.
E
Ed Forsythe
McG,
Thanks for the poop on the MBs. I'll check them out. But now I face another
dilemma - I just heard about the 7800GS. Probably the last AGP card nVidia
will support. $299 ($100 more than the 6800GS). By the end of March that
price may be < $175 but I don't think I can wait that long
"> Snip>
Thanks for the poop on the MBs. I'll check them out. But now I face another
dilemma - I just heard about the 7800GS. Probably the last AGP card nVidia
will support. $299 ($100 more than the 6800GS). By the end of March that
price may be < $175 but I don't think I can wait that long
"> Snip>
F
First of One
That's not a good way to look at it, because a 6800GT can overclock even
higher.
Keep in mind the 6800GT itself is already one generation old, about as fast
as the X800XL or XT depending on the game, so it's not necessarily a good
target to shoot for. For example, you'd still find yourself limited to
800x600 in F.E.A.R. to get smooth framerates - a step up from a slideshow,
but still a letdown at the same time.
higher.
Keep in mind the 6800GT itself is already one generation old, about as fast
as the X800XL or XT depending on the game, so it's not necessarily a good
target to shoot for. For example, you'd still find yourself limited to
800x600 in F.E.A.R. to get smooth framerates - a step up from a slideshow,
but still a letdown at the same time.
M
McGrandpa
Have you played FEAR with a 6800GT? I have. It's a bit better than you
make it out to be.
McG.
make it out to be.
McG.
M
Mxsmanic
McGrandpa said:Nah, I read that one too. Just as many 'fanbois' there as here or anywhere
really
I didn't read it. I was told this by people at MS who were trying to
use the OS. They need to upgrade to much faster video cards in order
to get some parity of performance.
What are you running on the machine when the card heats up?
My video card stays around 43° C all the time, except when I play The
Sims 2, which does a lot of 3D work, but even then it only gets up to
60° at worse. Flight Simulator hardly has any effect at all, and
SimCity4 also seems to put no load on the card.
M
McGrandpa
Mxsmanic said:
Any "accelerated 3D application" ... such as Doom3, Quake4, Half-Life 2 -
Lost Coast, the 3D screensavers. Yeah, even the OpenGL 3D Text screensaver
will heat em up
The temp tab in the nvidia driver applet is sitting on 54C right now. I'm
watching King Arthur on the left and typing this on the right. It's fairly
warm in here right now.
This GTX runs a good bit cooler than the FX5900 does.
McG.
D
DRS
McGrandpa said:
To my mind 10%+ over stock is noticeable.
A
abc
DRS said:
So you are saying you would notice 110 fps over 100 fps?
M
McGrandpa
eVGA has excellent customer support, they build a quality board, they haveEd Forsythe said:
what seems to be THE best lifetime warranty in the business and they seem to
have the lowest pricetag of the three brands.
I like eVGA because of consistent good quality across the entire line. All
3 of my eVGA cards have been excellent. All are running fine right now.
THEY WORK, and so far... keep working. That is more than I can say for
Asus, Abit, Aopen, BFG and ATI. I have yet to have an eVGA card fail.
(touch wood!)
I'm picking up my 2nd eVGA 7800GTX card in about an hour!
)))))Yeah, I like eVGA. Plain box, no bundled games or frilly stuff
notwithstanding. Again, THEY WORK. And for a good price too. I think I'll
check out their motherboards next...
McG.
M
McGrandpa
Ah right. In the same tests it shows both the GS and GT oc'd. So you canDRS said:
see the GS oc'd against the GT stock clocked by just scrolling the page.
Thing is, as another poster mentioned two things, 'from under a bees dick
difference' to the charts shows both cards scale just about dead even. So
that correlates accurately enough. The second thing said is 'up to 40%
faster depending on the benchmark'. There is nothing to indicate such
performance gain in any of those tests. There is nothing to indicate that
the GS is fast*ER* than a GT. That it is AS fast as a GT, by those tests,
I'll accept. That it is less than half the price of a GT for basically the
same performance, I'll accept that too. That it is rolled out to replace
the GT, accepted. So I'm accepting everything except 'up to 40% faster...'.
Oops... in reading back through the posts, I see you're the 'another
poster'. Sorry.
It isn't a moot point that, likely, for another year or even two now, the
6800GS will be available to the public, and is a performance part that is
priced for the masses. Folks have just GOT to stop thinking that a MX4000
is a high performance and cheap card!! Really, THAT is what the 6800GS
should be targeted to! Eradicating that 'urban legend' as it were. If the
GS gets any cheaper it may just do that too.
McG.
M
McGrandpa
In game, you kidding? In game who's got time to look at fps unless theabc said:
game feels like you're wading through mud? LOL! Then you're lookin to fix
that problem ASAP.
McG.
M
Mxsmanic
McGrandpa said:Any "accelerated 3D application" ... such as Doom3, Quake4, Half-Life 2 -
Lost Coast, the 3D screensavers. Yeah, even the OpenGL 3D Text screensaver
will heat em up
Really?? I've actually checked the temp on my card after running the
"Open pipes" screensaver all night, and the temperature was up by only
two degrees or so.
Right now my card (a Gigabyte card with a 6800GS) is running at 44° C,
and I have only ordinary desktop applications running. The case
temperature is 23.8° C, room temperature varies from 18.6° C at floor
level to 22.1° C above the PC. Disk drives are at 28° C and the CPU
itself is at 44° C.
I haven't noticed any increase in temperature in the video card when
playing video. That doesn't seem to put much of a load on the card.
D
DRS
McGrandpa said:
It's 5:40 in the am and I can't remember which benchmark that was so I'll
quite happily forgo it. In the past month or so I've read more reviews than
is healthy but it's distracting from the point and not worth any grief. One
other test I remembered did note the overclocked GS was up to 10% faster
than the 6800 Ultra
(http://www.hardwarezone.com/articles/view.php?id=1759&cid=3&pg=12) and 20%
faster than the stock GS. Admittedly the retail overclocked versions like
the XFX or Leadtech run the GPU at 485Mhz rather than 510Mhz but when you're
talking about retail overclocked cards like the XFX or Leadtech you've got
to keep the distinction in mind. They are faster and cheaper than any
reference GT card.
Heheh. I just replaced my Geforce 4600 Ti. The MX4000 made that look good!