64 bit X2

  • Thread starter Thread starter philo
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philo

it looks like i'm going to build a 64-bit machine...
very probably an X2 in order to run Photoshop CS-2.
(girlfriend)

i know new-egg is pretty highly recommended...but
they do not seem to have much selection in the bare-bones kits.
i mostly saw those "miniature" cases which i'm deadset against.

since up 'til now i've mostly been working with "relic" computers...
do any of you builders out there have a good source for the "cuting
edge" hardware?
 
philo said:
it looks like i'm going to build a 64-bit machine...
very probably an X2 in order to run Photoshop CS-2.
(girlfriend)
Click to expand...
As I understand it, PS CS-2 is not a full 64bit application, but does
make use of the extra memory a 64bit system can access.

Read the Adobe CS-2 info about the use of extra memory available with a
64bit OS. It looks like you need >4GB for max improvement. Many boards
don't accept that much memory, so select carefully!

With WindowsXPx64, there are not too many 64bit drivers available for
scanners, printers, etc. This will improve, but check first if you want
to use existing ones. Dual booting with the existing Windows 32bit OS
is probably a good idea.
i know new-egg is pretty highly recommended...but
they do not seem to have much selection in the bare-bones kits.
i mostly saw those "miniature" cases which i'm deadset against.
Click to expand...

I agree! You will need a full size case.
since up 'til now i've mostly been working with "relic" computers...
do any of you builders out there have a good source for the "cuting
edge" hardware?
Click to expand...

Just keep looking, and read the specs carefully.
 
philo <[email protected]> said:
it looks like i'm going to build a 64-bit machine...
very probably an X2 in order to run Photoshop CS-2.
(girlfriend)

i know new-egg is pretty highly recommended...but
they do not seem to have much selection in the bare-bones kits.
i mostly saw those "miniature" cases which i'm deadset against.

since up 'til now i've mostly been working with "relic" computers...
do any of you builders out there have a good source for the "cuting
edge" hardware?
Click to expand...

Is this a "money no object" project ?
What kind of budget do you have ?

I like how AMD is not even mentioned as a solution on this page :-)
I guess the software can sense the inherent greatness of Intel
processors :-)

http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/systemreqs.html

Paul
 
Read the Adobe CS-2 info about the use of extra memory available with a
64bit OS. It looks like you need >4GB for max improvement. Many boards
don't accept that much memory, so select carefully!

With WindowsXPx64, there are not too many 64bit drivers available for
scanners, printers, etc. This will improve, but check first if you want
to use existing ones. Dual booting with the existing Windows 32bit OS
is probably a good idea.



I agree! You will need a full size case.



Just keep looking, and read the specs carefully.
Click to expand...

Well her present machine (an XP-2200 with a gig of RAM) is getting by ok...
but it does take quite some time to process large images...
while she was using here machine I checked the system resources
and it was not even using all the RAM...but the CPU was close to being
maxed out...
on the photoshop groups a few folks said with the X2 they had no problems
at all...
but i suppose it may be more than she really needs...

the bottom line is that i was able to find the hardware out there...
but it's really rather expensive...
however...if the prices come down even a little bit
within the next few months...
i may just go for something really high end...

as to my own machine...
i just upgraded my AMD-1100 to a p-4 1.6 ghz
that i found in the trash!!!!
(it was brand new...but only half-built)
 
Is this a "money no object" project ?
What kind of budget do you have ?
Click to expand...

Well, if I have to I've been known to spend some
money...
but all I can think is..."$1000 or more" seems like a lot of money"
I could get a tank of gas for that much said:
I like how AMD is not even mentioned as a solution on this page :-)
I guess the software can sense the inherent greatness of Intel
processors :-)

http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/systemreqs.html

Paul
Click to expand...



Oh...that must be the problem...
a non-Intel cpu.
i also like the recommendation 0f 384 megs of ram <g>
 
Paul said:
Is this a "money no object" project ?
What kind of budget do you have ?

I like how AMD is not even mentioned as a solution on this page :-)
I guess the software can sense the inherent greatness of Intel
processors :-)

http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshop/systemreqs.html
Click to expand...

Have a look here:

http://www.adobe.com/support/techdocs/320005.html

"When you run Photoshop CS2 on a computer with a 64-bit processor (such
as a G5, Intel Xeon processor with EM64T, AMD Athlon 64, or Opteron
processor), and running a 64-bit version of the operating system (Mac OS
v10.3 or higher, Windows XP Professional x64 Edition), that has 4 GB or
more of RAM, Photoshop will use 3 GB for it's image data. You can see
the actual amount of RAM Photoshop can use in the Maximum Used By
Photoshop number when you set the Maximum Used by Photoshop slider in
the Memory & Image Cache preference to 100%. The RAM above the 100% used
by Photoshop, which is from approximately 3 GB to 3.7 GB, can be used
directly by Photoshop plug-ins (some plug-ins need large chunks of
contiguous RAM), filters, actions, etc. If you have more than 4 GB (to 6
GB (Windows) or 8 GB (Mac OS)), the RAM above 4 GB is used by the
operating system as a cache for the Photoshop scratch disk data. Data
that previously was written directly to the hard disk by Photoshop, is
now cached in this high RAM before being written to the hard disk by the
operating system. If you are working with files large enough to take
advantage of these extra 2 GB of RAM, the RAM cache can speed
performance of Photoshop."
 
The comment about needing MORE then 4GB of ram is incorrect. I know what
page he's referring to and it uses 4GB as an EXAMPLE, not a requirement.

Here are my system specs:

ASUS A8N32
AMD X2 4400
(2) 1GB Corsair 3500LL
Creative Labs Fatal1ty
(2) 7800GTX 512MB

The above video cards wont mater when it comes to Photoshop and dual cards
doesn't mater at all when it comes to XP x64. However making the switch to
x64 will help you a LOT when it comes to Photoshop CS2. Under a 32 bit
environment PS is not able to use very much of your memory. Like you
noticed hardly any of it was being used. Switch to x64 and with just 2GB
(NOT MORE THEN 4GB) you will noticed about 70% of it being used just for PS.
Provided you open rather large images.

I have experience using PS on MACs and PCs. Of course the MAC always out
performed the PC on many levels especially when it came to memory management
(in regards to PS). BUT NOT ANYMORE!!! The system described above blows
all my G5's away and it has made our graphics department seriously thinking
about switching over (slowly of course).

I had 4GB in my machine at one point but I didn't get to use it for very
long. It was horrible memory and I ditched it for the above memory. I'm
looking forward to getting another 2GB and seeing how well PS can handle
some extremely large projects.

However as mentioned before you will have driver issues. Make sure you have
another machine available to run your printer(s) and scanner(s).
 
An additional note. As that article mentions any ram you have ABOVE 4GB will
be used to write out your data prior to being written to your drive. I have
no experience of that process nor can I find any data that suggests that
advantage is even worth the cost of the additional memory plus any other
additional costs just to get into a system that can utilize 8GB of memory.

However by no means do you have to have above 4GB to gain huge advantages
over the improved memory management with x64 and PS CS2. 2GB will do
nicely.
 
However as mentioned before you will have driver issues. Make sure you have
another machine available to run your printer(s) and scanner(s).
Click to expand...

I figured that if I was going to go with a 64-bit machine...
I may as well go all the way and use XP-64 also.

If the printer and scanner do not work with XP-64
I have other machines on my home network that would be avail...
so hopefully would not have any issues.

Anyway...since the present machine is doing the job...
there is no major rush ...but hope to get the project done
before summer
 
ISOHaven said:
The comment about needing MORE then 4GB of ram is incorrect. I know what
page he's referring to and it uses 4GB as an EXAMPLE, not a requirement.
Click to expand...

I didn't mean to imply that >4GB of memory was *required*, rather that
in building a new machine one shouldn't let MB limitations decree the
amount of memory CS2 can use. I quoted the example in my reply to Paul.

Of course, it depends on exactly what you are doing, but I would think
using RAM instead of HD for cache would speed some things considerably.
But then, I recall you saying you didn't have a driver problem since you
weren't using a scanner for input.

If PS ever does make a true 64bit application, who knows how much memory
it would be nice to have! :-)
 
I can only imagine. I did some computer work for a graphics company that
made those HUGE signs that would hang from the side of buildings. They
would spend an entire day just processing one request on the image. Now
bust out a Compaq ML570 grade machine with 32GB of memory and go to TOWN!

I know, the ML570 is old but it's the newest I have in my server farm.

I'm sure that secondary benifit would speed things up, no argument there but
I would have to use it first hand to know if spending an additional 2 grand+
on my machine would be worth it.
 
ISOHaven said:
I can only imagine. I did some computer work for a graphics company that
made those HUGE signs that would hang from the side of buildings. They
would spend an entire day just processing one request on the image. Now
bust out a Compaq ML570 grade machine with 32GB of memory and go to TOWN!
Click to expand...

Wonder if they had 64bit drivers for the plotters?
I know, the ML570 is old but it's the newest I have in my server farm.

I'm sure that secondary benifit would speed things up, no argument there but
I would have to use it first hand to know if spending an additional 2 grand+
on my machine would be worth it.
Click to expand...
With PC3200 memory selling for less than $100/GB, who knows what
wonderful things can be done? :-) I'm sure memory slots on new MBs will
accommodate 4GB+ without breaking the bank.

I'm looking at a memory board from a 1984 PC clone. It's 3 1/2" X 13"
and contains four banks of eighteen 16pin DIPS to get 512KB of memory!
 
I'm looking at a memory board from a 1984 PC clone. It's 3 1/2" X 13"
and contains four banks of eighteen 16pin DIPS to get 512KB of memory!
Click to expand...


speaking of memory...
i have a real nice (boat anchor) Zenith Data systems 286
in all my wheeling and dealing...i ended up with a memory expansion card
and was able to put 16 megs of RAM into that machine
(the maximum amount a 286 can address)
it's got two, mfm 20 meg drives
and i have windows 1, windows 2, windows 3.0 and windows 3.1
loaded on that thing...
plus the dos browser, arachne.
if someone would have had 16 megs or RAM in those days...
it would have cost a fortune!!!!

my most recent acquisition is a dual cpu p-133 server board
with 8 slots for ram...
i was able to use up a lot of my 8 meg ram to come up to 64 megs.
runs slackware just fine
 
2 things:

1) I work in the printing business and frequently do Photoshop work, in fact
that is half of what I do for a living. Unless you are doing posters or
billboard size images in Photoshop regularly a gig of ram is more than
satisfactory and a 2 gig CPU is more than enough to handle almost anything
and it does not even need to be 64 bit. A 125 MB tiff file which would be a
20X24 image at 300 DPI suitable for high res printing could be dealt with
quite well on a 2GHZ machine with a gig of ram.
2) NewEgg. Research what you want then go there. I just checked and they
have 214 different AMD motherboards, 231 different Intel motherboards, 871
different computer cases, and 607 graphics cards, pretty much if it can be
had they got it and you are not going to beat the price by much if you do
and certainly not from any one as reputable.

Joe
 
Joe said:
2 things:

1) I work in the printing business and frequently do Photoshop work, in fact
that is half of what I do for a living. Unless you are doing posters or
billboard size images in Photoshop regularly a gig of ram is more than
satisfactory and a 2 gig CPU is more than enough to handle almost anything
and it does not even need to be 64 bit. A 125 MB tiff file which would be a
20X24 image at 300 DPI suitable for high res printing could be dealt with
quite well on a 2GHZ machine with a gig of ram.
2) NewEgg. Research what you want then go there. I just checked and they
have 214 different AMD motherboards, 231 different Intel motherboards, 871
different computer cases, and 607 graphics cards, pretty much if it can be
had they got it and you are not going to beat the price by much if you do
and certainly not from any one as reputable.
Click to expand...


<snip>

the machine is an XP-2200 with a gig of ram
and it certainly does work...
but when processing a tiff which may be up above 200 megs...
it can take a few minutes.
hardly the end of the world...but the photographers i know have a LOT of
work to do...
and it's all fine art/ large prints ...maybe just under poster size.

anyway since newegg has generally been considered one of the more
reliable vendors...i'll probably just not have to quibble about a few
$$$ one way or the other.

in the mean time...i'll just have to tell these folks to have a little
patience!~!!!!

i just got done looking around at all my spare parts and see that
all i will need to to is get a mobo, cpu&cooler and RAM
I pretty much have everything else...so maybe this will not be too bad
after all
 
since up 'til now i've mostly been working with "relic" computers...
do any of you builders out there have a good source for the "cuting edge"
hardware?
Click to expand...

Monarch Computer.

Good prices, good service.
 
Dave said:
Monarch Computer.

Good prices, good service.
Click to expand...



when i was looking that was one i saw
but hadn't dealt with then before...
i'll have another look at them

thanks
 
Boba said:
My printer HP LJ 1020 has no driver for xp 64 pro. You couldn't print from
64x compuer to printer hooked on 32x compuer.

Boba Vankufer
Click to expand...


thanks for the info...
as i though that if i had any problems...i could print from another
machine...

i wonder if i could do two XP installations...
a 32bit on one partition and 64 bit on another...
then merely boot over to the 32bit installation to do printing...

OTOH: my girlfriend will need a new printer before too long...
so i can check the XP-64 compatibility before i buy
 
philo said:
thanks for the info...
as i though that if i had any problems...i could print from another
machine...

i wonder if i could do two XP installations...
a 32bit on one partition and 64 bit on another...
then merely boot over to the 32bit installation to do printing...
Click to expand...

I've been using that set up for several months. Just be sure you install
the XP32 first. You will then get a menu on boot-up. I also have Linux
on a third partition and a FAT32 partition which all the OS's can share.
OTOH: my girlfriend will need a new printer before too long...
so i can check the XP-64 compatibility before i buy
Click to expand...

Things are getting better all the time. Both Brother and Epson have
64bit drivers on many printers. I wanted to use a printer on Linux,
hence needed a parallel-port connection. My Epson Stylus C-88 works
fine. The Brother DCP-110C (USB) works on both Win OS's.

I recommend a dual set-up in any case. There are still too many things
that don't work in WinXP x64.
 
Things are getting better all the time. Both Brother and Epson have
64bit drivers on many printers. I wanted to use a printer on Linux,
hence needed a parallel-port connection. My Epson Stylus C-88 works
fine. The Brother DCP-110C (USB) works on both Win OS's.

I recommend a dual set-up in any case. There are still too many things
that don't work in WinXP x64.
Click to expand...


i think i'll get going pretty soon and order the parts
and download the XP-64 free trial...
the new printer will not be ordered any time soon...
but will be an epson stylus ...

for the really large prints ...a friend of mine will do them.
(he recently printed a 20" x 30" for $50)

no way will i be getting a large format printer...
someone i know spent $800 in paper and ink...
just learning how to use it!!!!
 
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