3-tier winforms architecture

[Steve S]

The mouse reappears...... this time, dripping wet and a towel around his
waist......... he clears his throat...... and taks one deep breath........

It was YOUR reference..... there wasn't any discussion of these facts your
attempting to add into the record..... this case has been close.... and
YOU HAVE BEEN FOUND..... WANTING! You simply don't read the stuff you
quote before you use it to make your point......

As for me proving a point YOUR trying to disprove....... ? Sorry
counseler..... your the plaintiff here...... YOUR the one making the
charges..... and failed to prove your point.....

Let me AGAIN quote the record..... still contained below in it's entirety
for your reading pleasure......

You said.... "management does what programmers tell them"......you have
been spending far too many hours watching Nick-At-Night and FantasyIsland
reruns...... Like.... WHO is running this ship ? wait..... don't tell
me.... the mailboy is actually approving budgets for next year......

You almost sound like a manager with the first blast you made at the
programmers...... and MCSDs..... but then you come back around and do a
salvo at them.......

[He pulls out a dictionary from under his towel.... and flips to the
word.... ] TIER..... a level within an object or building. If your
application isn't related to the term TIER.... guess that is a real wiz
bang program you got there....

Even though I would find it tough to believe that anyone could enlighted
you, I will try to add this...... like programmers..... there are good
managers... and bad ones.......

[he stops... his hands go limp.... his towel falls......] HOLY
RIPPERS........ your a ... a.... a.... mainframer..... and it is US
who should be worshipping the very ground you choose to engrace with your
presence...... how foolish it was of me...... NOT to recognize just WHO
you were....... this explains alot..... You bitch about......

- the FBI..... (obvoius they didn't choose IBM)
- The arches... (they choose to build their own)
- n-tier.... well..... who can afford several mainframes.....
- MCSDs...

OOPS...... you complain about management..... OK...... so your NOT
IBM....... as they are mostly management since their fundamental system
hasn't changed in years....... [he quickly grabs his cell phone.....
calls IBM central...... "I really didn't mean to imply that you would ever
have such an assshole under your employment...... NO...... NO.......
YES..... NO...... NO...... YES...... YES they really are.....
NO...... I don't think so....... they didn't smell like rue......
THANKS"] Now where was I......... OH YEA........

He quickly proclaims...... "HOUSE KEEPING IN ASLE 13...... WE HAVE
ANOTHER PILE OF BULLSHIT THAT NEEDS TO BE REMOVED......."

In conclusion...... I have just one course of action...... The mouse bends
over to pick up his towel........ "STOP CHECKING OUT MY ASS".......

On second thought....... "FORGET IT HOUSE KEEPING....... SEND IN
LANDSCAPING..... WE WANT A ROSE GARDEN PUT HERE...... AND YES.... WE
ALREADY HAVE THE FERTILIZER"

As for me.... I'm going back into the hot-tub.... with the TWINS.......

COMMENTS INLINE BELOW...

The little mouse slides his thumbnail back out oneto the floor...... this
time he wears a court robe and a white curly wig...... He clears his
throat.... takes a sip of water........ then announces.......

HEAR YE....... HEAR YE....... nospan..... has spoken...... and cited
another reference...... which has been pulled and inserted below (hey
careful where you insert that) :
*************
In the meantime, Trilogy's problems have been mounting. Last month, the
Justice Department's inspector general told lawmakers that the committee was
experiencing a cost overrun of $137.9 million for one year. When combined
with another overrun, it translated into a 50 percent increase in the
program's total cost.

"This is not a surprise," Senate appropriators said in a report filed
earlier this month. "The attempt to make up for 20 years of neglect in two
years of frenzied spending was destined to fail."

Although the committee has already provided a $100 million cushion in
supplemental funds, that money also has been used up.

"The FBI chose to squander this reserve. So when the funds are needed, none
are available," the report said.

Sen. Judd Gregg, the chairman of the Appropriations Committee panel that
handles the FBI budget, said in a recent speech on the Senate floor that
Trilogy has become a "disaster."

"Programs such as Trilogy do not need more money. What they need is more
management," Gregg said.

He said Congress "threw" too much money at the program last year to

"show

we
were concerned about terrorism." And as a result, he said, the program has
fallen apart.

"FBI software and hardware contracts for Trilogy have essentially become
gold-plated. The cost is soaring. The schedule is out of control," Gregg
said. "Right now we still do not have contracts on Trilogy hardware or
Trilogy software. We are completely at the mercy of the contractors

*************

Just for the record...... where in this..... did they say...... n-tier
or selected solution? I believe this is a result of poor project
management.... which is a totally different issue.....

OH NO IT"S NOT!

MANAGEMENT choose MCSD certified programmers and Java Certified porgrammers
and that oh so high FAILURE TRACK RECORD n-Tier Architecture.

Management does what the Programmers tell them to do. Management doesn't
know crap about actually doing the programming and you know it.

I challenge you to prove otherwise that management knows heads or tails of
what an IDE is or has even written a single line of code.. And those
management that did code at one time were really really crappy coders that
realized that they can survive with their people skills. These management
types have a hard enough time figuring out how to use MS Office let alone
know what VisualStudio.NET is.

THE BOTTOM LINE is that as a WHOLE, the PROJECT, and IT PROJECT in the
MILLIONS AND MILLIONS of DOLLARS FAILED....PERIOD....

IF n-Tier was SOOOOOO GREAT, it should have been able to at least overcome
management blunders like hiring MCSD's all over the place.

Then again...... READ THE REFERENCES YOU ARE GOING TO USE...... TO PROVE
YOUR POINT...... it could save you from moments like these....

SEE ABOVE for YOUR ANSWER


Why do you embarrass yourself?

OH YEA..... if you want a piece of the action...... why don't you write
a proposal to the FBI..... that you recommend they do it all......
BROWSER BASED... ONE TIER, FIXED PRICE, NO TESTING AND IT WILL BE DONE IN
A FEW WEEKS!!!!!!! [the crowd gasps ...... and an immediate hush falls
over the masses] After all..... you keep bashing n-tier... and if you
truely are writing browser apps..... they are by defination...
MULTI-TIER.....

UH OH, buzz word bingo redefining the term MULTI-TIER!!!

Since you have ZIPPO to go on, I will let you know that 2-Tier doesn't refer
to n-Tier...but as you want to twist these words out of proportion, go
ahead, you need to "think" that you had a chance of proving something that
you were right.

simply due to how the webservers operate and run the
code...... BUT..... hey...... go for it.......

The little mouse steps off his thumbnail..... and slides it back to his
house.....

 

[Guest]

You remind of the liberals who point out simple misspellings and
mispronunciations.

You are wrong, PERIOD..

The FBI reference is CLEAR PROOF that n-TIER and OOP have failed..as
USUAL.......

Although management can really screw things up, you got to ask yourself,
just exactly what decisions did management make...well they, Trilogy, got a
bunch of MSCD and who know what..... Certified Programmers and a bunch of
college trained programmers who think n-Tier and OOP can solve all these
problems....

But wait, isn't OOP and n-Tier FLEXIBLE and EXTENSIBLE enought to handle the
changes introduced by management??????

Obviously, if there are changes, it seemed to have cost them, the FBI, 50%
more.....
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA.....

Oh, well so much for the economics and cost savings of OOP and n-Tier....

The mouse reappears...... this time, dripping wet and a towel around his
waist......... he clears his throat...... and taks one deep breath........

It was YOUR reference..... there wasn't any discussion of these facts your
attempting to add into the record..... this case has been close.... and
YOU HAVE BEEN FOUND..... WANTING! You simply don't read the stuff you
quote before you use it to make your point......

As for me proving a point YOUR trying to disprove....... ? Sorry
counseler..... your the plaintiff here...... YOUR the one making the
charges..... and failed to prove your point.....

Let me AGAIN quote the record..... still contained below in it's entirety
for your reading pleasure......

You said.... "management does what programmers tell them"......you have
been spending far too many hours watching Nick-At-Night and FantasyIsland
reruns...... Like.... WHO is running this ship ? wait..... don't tell
me.... the mailboy is actually approving budgets for next year......

You almost sound like a manager with the first blast you made at the
programmers...... and MCSDs..... but then you come back around and do a
salvo at them.......

[He pulls out a dictionary from under his towel.... and flips to the
word.... ] TIER..... a level within an object or building. If your
application isn't related to the term TIER.... guess that is a real wiz
bang program you got there....

Even though I would find it tough to believe that anyone could enlighted
you, I will try to add this...... like programmers..... there are good
managers... and bad ones.......

[he stops... his hands go limp.... his towel falls......] HOLY
RIPPERS........ your a ... a.... a.... mainframer..... and it is US
who should be worshipping the very ground you choose to engrace with your
presence...... how foolish it was of me...... NOT to recognize just WHO
you were....... this explains alot..... You bitch about......

- the FBI..... (obvoius they didn't choose IBM)
- The arches... (they choose to build their own)
- n-tier.... well..... who can afford several mainframes.....
- MCSDs...

OOPS...... you complain about management..... OK...... so your NOT
IBM....... as they are mostly management since their fundamental system
hasn't changed in years....... [he quickly grabs his cell phone.....
calls IBM central...... "I really didn't mean to imply that you would ever
have such an assshole under your employment...... NO...... NO.......
YES..... NO...... NO...... YES...... YES they really are.....
NO...... I don't think so....... they didn't smell like rue......
THANKS"] Now where was I......... OH YEA........

He quickly proclaims...... "HOUSE KEEPING IN ASLE 13...... WE HAVE
ANOTHER PILE OF BULLSHIT THAT NEEDS TO BE REMOVED......."

In conclusion...... I have just one course of action...... The mouse bends
over to pick up his towel........ "STOP CHECKING OUT MY ASS".......

On second thought....... "FORGET IT HOUSE KEEPING....... SEND IN
LANDSCAPING..... WE WANT A ROSE GARDEN PUT HERE...... AND YES.... WE
ALREADY HAVE THE FERTILIZER"

As for me.... I'm going back into the hot-tub.... with the TWINS.......

COMMENTS INLINE BELOW...

The little mouse slides his thumbnail back out oneto the floor...... this
time he wears a court robe and a white curly wig...... He clears his
throat.... takes a sip of water........ then announces.......

HEAR YE....... HEAR YE....... nospan..... has spoken...... and cited
another reference...... which has been pulled and inserted below (hey
careful where you insert that) :
*************
In the meantime, Trilogy's problems have been mounting. Last month, the
Justice Department's inspector general told lawmakers that the

committee
was

experiencing a cost overrun of $137.9 million for one year. When combined
with another overrun, it translated into a 50 percent increase in the
program's total cost.

"This is not a surprise," Senate appropriators said in a report filed
earlier this month. "The attempt to make up for 20 years of neglect in two
years of frenzied spending was destined to fail."

Although the committee has already provided a $100 million cushion in
supplemental funds, that money also has been used up.

"The FBI chose to squander this reserve. So when the funds are needed, none
are available," the report said.

Sen. Judd Gregg, the chairman of the Appropriations Committee panel that
handles the FBI budget, said in a recent speech on the Senate floor that
Trilogy has become a "disaster."

"Programs such as Trilogy do not need more money. What they need is more
management," Gregg said.

He said Congress "threw" too much money at the program last year to

"show

we
were concerned about terrorism." And as a result, he said, the program has
fallen apart.

"FBI software and hardware contracts for Trilogy have essentially become
gold-plated. The cost is soaring. The schedule is out of control," Gregg
said. "Right now we still do not have contracts on Trilogy hardware or
Trilogy software. We are completely at the mercy of the contractors

*************

Just for the record...... where in this..... did they say...... n-tier
or selected solution? I believe this is a result of poor project
management.... which is a totally different issue.....

OH NO IT"S NOT!

MANAGEMENT choose MCSD certified programmers and Java Certified porgrammers
and that oh so high FAILURE TRACK RECORD n-Tier Architecture.

Management does what the Programmers tell them to do. Management doesn't
know crap about actually doing the programming and you know it.

I challenge you to prove otherwise that management knows heads or tails of
what an IDE is or has even written a single line of code.. And those
management that did code at one time were really really crappy coders that
realized that they can survive with their people skills. These management
types have a hard enough time figuring out how to use MS Office let alone
know what VisualStudio.NET is.

THE BOTTOM LINE is that as a WHOLE, the PROJECT, and IT PROJECT in the
MILLIONS AND MILLIONS of DOLLARS FAILED....PERIOD....

IF n-Tier was SOOOOOO GREAT, it should have been able to at least overcome
management blunders like hiring MCSD's all over the place.

Then again...... READ THE REFERENCES YOU ARE GOING TO USE...... TO PROVE
YOUR POINT...... it could save you from moments like these....

SEE ABOVE for YOUR ANSWER


Why do you embarrass yourself?

OH YEA..... if you want a piece of the action...... why don't you write
a proposal to the FBI..... that you recommend they do it all......
BROWSER BASED... ONE TIER, FIXED PRICE, NO TESTING AND IT WILL BE

DONE
IN

A FEW WEEKS!!!!!!! [the crowd gasps ...... and an immediate hush falls
over the masses] After all..... you keep bashing n-tier... and if you
truely are writing browser apps..... they are by defination...
MULTI-TIER.....

UH OH, buzz word bingo redefining the term MULTI-TIER!!!

Since you have ZIPPO to go on, I will let you know that 2-Tier doesn't refer
to n-Tier...but as you want to twist these words out of proportion, go
ahead, you need to "think" that you had a chance of proving something that
you were right.

simply due to how the webservers operate and run the
code...... BUT..... hey...... go for it.......

The little mouse steps off his thumbnail..... and slides it back to his
house.....

 

[Guest]

One of the reasons Goverment is sooo SCREWED up is because they have
programmers who choose crap like SAP and Oracle and n-Tier and OOP......

Stuff like the above only make complex stuff more complex and confusing,
which leads to collapse.....

Yes, please tell me all about those LARGE projects as they only fail
anyway.......

I can already see how you are choosing to build your site and I can see it's
going to fail or be wayyyy over budget........


Your problem is your have no appreciation of simplicity and fear for your
job if you make it too simple....

 

[Bob Lehmann]

Actually, liberals wouldn't dare point out an error such as a mispelling.
The danger of bruising an individual's self-esteem would be too great.

Bob Lehmann

You remind of the liberals who point out simple misspellings and
mispronunciations.

You are wrong, PERIOD..

The FBI reference is CLEAR PROOF that n-TIER and OOP have failed..as
USUAL.......

Although management can really screw things up, you got to ask yourself,
just exactly what decisions did management make...well they, Trilogy, got a
bunch of MSCD and who know what..... Certified Programmers and a bunch of
college trained programmers who think n-Tier and OOP can solve all these
problems....

But wait, isn't OOP and n-Tier FLEXIBLE and EXTENSIBLE enought to handle the
changes introduced by management??????

Obviously, if there are changes, it seemed to have cost them, the FBI, 50%
more.....
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA.....

Oh, well so much for the economics and cost savings of OOP and n-Tier....

The mouse reappears...... this time, dripping wet and a towel around his
waist......... he clears his throat...... and taks one deep breath........

It was YOUR reference..... there wasn't any discussion of these facts your
attempting to add into the record..... this case has been close.... and
YOU HAVE BEEN FOUND..... WANTING! You simply don't read the stuff you
quote before you use it to make your point......

As for me proving a point YOUR trying to disprove....... ? Sorry
counseler..... your the plaintiff here...... YOUR the one making the
charges..... and failed to prove your point.....

Let me AGAIN quote the record..... still contained below in it's entirety
for your reading pleasure......

You said.... "management does what programmers tell them"......you have
been spending far too many hours watching Nick-At-Night and FantasyIsland
reruns...... Like.... WHO is running this ship ? wait..... don't tell
me.... the mailboy is actually approving budgets for next year......

You almost sound like a manager with the first blast you made at the
programmers...... and MCSDs..... but then you come back around and do a
salvo at them.......

[He pulls out a dictionary from under his towel.... and flips to the
word.... ] TIER..... a level within an object or building. If your
application isn't related to the term TIER.... guess that is a real wiz
bang program you got there....

Even though I would find it tough to believe that anyone could enlighted
you, I will try to add this...... like programmers..... there are good
managers... and bad ones.......

[he stops... his hands go limp.... his towel falls......] HOLY
RIPPERS........ your a ... a.... a.... mainframer..... and it

is

US
who should be worshipping the very ground you choose to engrace with your
presence...... how foolish it was of me...... NOT to recognize just WHO
you were....... this explains alot..... You bitch about......

- the FBI..... (obvoius they didn't choose IBM)
- The arches... (they choose to build their own)
- n-tier.... well..... who can afford several mainframes.....
- MCSDs...

OOPS...... you complain about management..... OK...... so your NOT
IBM....... as they are mostly management since their fundamental system
hasn't changed in years....... [he quickly grabs his cell phone.....
calls IBM central...... "I really didn't mean to imply that you would ever
have such an assshole under your employment...... NO...... NO.......
YES..... NO...... NO...... YES...... YES they really are.....
NO...... I don't think so....... they didn't smell like rue......
THANKS"] Now where was I......... OH YEA........

He quickly proclaims...... "HOUSE KEEPING IN ASLE 13...... WE HAVE
ANOTHER PILE OF BULLSHIT THAT NEEDS TO BE REMOVED......."

In conclusion...... I have just one course of action...... The mouse bends
over to pick up his towel........ "STOP CHECKING OUT MY ASS".......

On second thought....... "FORGET IT HOUSE KEEPING....... SEND IN
LANDSCAPING..... WE WANT A ROSE GARDEN PUT HERE...... AND YES.... WE
ALREADY HAVE THE FERTILIZER"

As for me.... I'm going back into the hot-tub.... with the TWINS.......

COMMENTS INLINE BELOW...


The little mouse slides his thumbnail back out oneto the floor......
this
time he wears a court robe and a white curly wig...... He clears his
throat.... takes a sip of water........ then announces.......

HEAR YE....... HEAR YE....... nospan..... has spoken...... and cited
another reference...... which has been pulled and inserted below (hey
careful where you insert that) :
*************
In the meantime, Trilogy's problems have been mounting. Last month, the
Justice Department's inspector general told lawmakers that the committee
was
experiencing a cost overrun of $137.9 million for one year. When combined
with another overrun, it translated into a 50 percent increase in the
program's total cost.

"This is not a surprise," Senate appropriators said in a report filed
earlier this month. "The attempt to make up for 20 years of neglect

in
two

years of frenzied spending was destined to fail."

Although the committee has already provided a $100 million cushion in
supplemental funds, that money also has been used up.

"The FBI chose to squander this reserve. So when the funds are needed,
none
are available," the report said.

Sen. Judd Gregg, the chairman of the Appropriations Committee panel that
handles the FBI budget, said in a recent speech on the Senate floor that
Trilogy has become a "disaster."

"Programs such as Trilogy do not need more money. What they need is more
management," Gregg said.

He said Congress "threw" too much money at the program last year to "show
we
were concerned about terrorism." And as a result, he said, the

program
has

fallen apart.

"FBI software and hardware contracts for Trilogy have essentially become
gold-plated. The cost is soaring. The schedule is out of control," Gregg
said. "Right now we still do not have contracts on Trilogy hardware or
Trilogy software. We are completely at the mercy of the contractors

*************

Just for the record...... where in this..... did they say......
n-tier
or selected solution? I believe this is a result of poor project
management.... which is a totally different issue.....




OH NO IT"S NOT!

MANAGEMENT choose MCSD certified programmers and Java Certified porgrammers
and that oh so high FAILURE TRACK RECORD n-Tier Architecture.

Management does what the Programmers tell them to do. Management doesn't
know crap about actually doing the programming and you know it.

I challenge you to prove otherwise that management knows heads or

tails

of

what an IDE is or has even written a single line of code.. And those
management that did code at one time were really really crappy coders that
realized that they can survive with their people skills. These management
types have a hard enough time figuring out how to use MS Office let alone
know what VisualStudio.NET is.

THE BOTTOM LINE is that as a WHOLE, the PROJECT, and IT PROJECT in the
MILLIONS AND MILLIONS of DOLLARS FAILED....PERIOD....

IF n-Tier was SOOOOOO GREAT, it should have been able to at least overcome
management blunders like hiring MCSD's all over the place.




Then again...... READ THE REFERENCES YOU ARE GOING TO USE...... TO PROVE
YOUR POINT...... it could save you from moments like these....


SEE ABOVE for YOUR ANSWER


Why do you embarrass yourself?


OH YEA..... if you want a piece of the action...... why don't you
write
a proposal to the FBI..... that you recommend they do it all......
BROWSER BASED... ONE TIER, FIXED PRICE, NO TESTING AND IT WILL BE DONE
IN
A FEW WEEKS!!!!!!! [the crowd gasps ...... and an immediate hush falls
over the masses] After all..... you keep bashing n-tier... and if you
truely are writing browser apps..... they are by defination...
MULTI-TIER.....



UH OH, buzz word bingo redefining the term MULTI-TIER!!!

Since you have ZIPPO to go on, I will let you know that 2-Tier doesn't refer
to n-Tier...but as you want to twist these words out of proportion, go
ahead, you need to "think" that you had a chance of proving something that
you were right.






simply due to how the webservers operate and run the
code...... BUT..... hey...... go for it.......

The little mouse steps off his thumbnail..... and slides it back to his
house.....

 

[Steve S]

The little mouse jumps back out from his house....
dressed in his leather jacket....

And there we have it.... ANOTHER golden goodie GAS FROM
THE ASS..... (OOPS.........) a golden goodie blast from
the past.......

Just keep the SHIT SPINNING.......... (oops.....) those
hits spinning..... as your blowing something.... from
somewhere....

I'm going back to hop with the TWINS.........

 

[Guest]

ooooohhhhh....let's point out one other thing....

DOTNET JUNKIES REDESIGN....

What happened to the OOP n-Tier stuff? Huhhhhhh??????

Where is that 2-SECOND CHANGE?

WOW...TOTAL REBUILD OF THE ENTIRE ENGINE!!!!

I WONDER what it really is like in the CORPORATE WORLD


You OOP n-TIER fanactics have to face up to the fact the the OOP model can't
work in the business world? Where are all those design patterns?

If these guys can't do it, why should you MVP's who don't even have a web
site be able to do it?

BUILDING A PRODUCTION WEB SITE IS A LOT HARDER THEN JUST ANSWERING QUESTIONS
ON THE NEWSGROUPS or TEACHING A .NET CLASS OR EVEN GIVING OUT A PDC SEMINAR



EVEN THE .NET PORTAL and DOTNETNUKE have LOTS AND LOTS of trouble
implementing changes...


THIS IS THEIR MESSAGE...
------------------------------------------------
We're Sorry
As many of you know we have recently launched SqlJunkies.com. We have
overhauled our runtime and will be using it on DotNetJunkies.com also. With
the new runtime and build we implemented a central users database so you
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Rest assured we have a ton of articles and how to's on hold so when we
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Again we're sorry for any hassle we may be causing and the new build will be
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