Shenan said:
I do not know how many thousands of computers I have put SP3
on at this point. I do know that I have only had a handful
of problems. "Access Denied"... One HP with AMD processor
and an image made from a machine with an Intel processor. A
few with the 'updates download but do not install' after the
fact (my bad - should have rebooted before installing SP3.)
I have not had a single Windows XP (32bit) system that I have
not been able to put SP3 onto yet. Those few required a
little research - and in response to that - I now *prepare*
before I start to install SP3 just so I don't have to
troubleshoot later.
- Does virus protection *have* to be turned off? I have not
had that be the case in any of my installations yet.
- Do you *have* to reboot right before installing SP3? I
have had cases where it worked out fine without the reboot.
- Do you have to update hardware drivers? Do you have to
CHKDSK/defragment? Do you have to scan with
Antivirus/Antispyware? Do you have to uninstall unused
applications? Do you have to backup your important
files/folders? Had the SP3 installation onto Windows XP work
without any/most/some of those being done.
Is it *wise* to do most of that? Should you be doing many of
those things reguardless of what you are/are not installing?
I think so. It's just like getting the oil changed in your
car, taking out your garbage, washing the dishes, cutting the
grass... It's the cost of ownership...and although you can go
so long without doing any of it - given none of it is
difficult - you may just be oiling the trigger on the gun to
shoot your own foot off by neglecting these things.
But... That's a 'to each their own' thing. Not my place to
say what anyone else chooses to do. All I can present is
what I would do and why...
James said:
I don't know when Shenan Stanley's post appeared but I did not see
it, perhaps because it may be gmail and I may have to add him to my
allowed list.
There has been a lot of good advice posted on the SP3 update but
very little seems to be from individual users rather than experts.
I do not change the oil myself for my car nor adjust the brakes.
Why would individual users post advice about SP3? You don't post advice
about changing the oil in a car because you just said you don't do it.
Experts *should* be the ones to give advice - after all - who would you be
more apt to listen to about getting an operation, changing your oil, saving
money, etc... The regular person with no training/experience in said field
or someone who does it on a daily basis?
The above is a case in point: "I do not know how many thousands of
computers I have put SP3 on at this point. I do know that I have
only had a handful of problems."
A lot of people are just this: users and don't find even reading
computer magazines particularly interesting except perhaps to learn
about new programs. Like me, they may have heard of SP3 but did not
see a need to install it until MS included it in an *update*.
However, they do download and install *all* Microsoft suggested
updates, even if like me they choose when to install.
Great - and the majority of the people will have no problems.
Outside Windows XP, I do know a little about computers but, like a
lot of Windows users, I don't have many drivers; printer, display,
scanner and USB external hard disc, and I've never noticed any need
to update them. The only major change occurred when I heard about
USB 2.0 and made the change. I do back up my machine six days a
week. I think users can be expected to have security suites from
one of 2 or 3 other suppliers than MS and, if they must (not
should) be deactivated during a major update, they should be told
before *installation* is started. Such deactivation has not been
necessary for an *update* in 6 years. It was bad enough that
Microsoft has never seemed to understand the functioning of a USB
hard disc and it took a while to find why updates occasionally
failed.
Who maintains the large list of security providers and the many versions of
each any one user could have and who tests against that entire list?
As I said, I am going to consider the SP3 update and probably
install it deliberately following much of the excellent advice that
has appeared in this group but I will expect to do it myself
without alarming failure messages. Mind you, the failure of
manufacturers sometimes provides "job security"
With very
adequate office programs now available, the only thing that has
stopped me from going completely to Linux is that Canon does not
provide a driver for my very good scanner.
My point was simple: Most Windows XP users will not have a problem
installing Windows XP. Those that do have particular issues specific to
their computer (and/or a "batch" of computers or some similar third party
software they or other people installed.) I have empathy for those with
issues - as it can be traumatic (although usually more dramatic than
traumatic) - but no one can test for every possible scenario.
It's a lot like the recent trouble some people had with Zone Alarm (a
free/for pay firewall application) and a Microsoft patch. Some people who
had a particular version (latest at the time in fact) of Zone Alarm lost
Internet connectivity if the Microsoft patch was installed. Removing the
patch fixed it, changing the settings in Zone Alarm fixed it and/oir
removing Zone Alarm completely fixed it. It was a problem *with* Zone
Alarm - but only a small set of versions. A few versions older - no
problem. The new version released days later - no problem. There is *no
way* anyone could reasonably suggest to me that Microsoft should have known
that some people would have a particular version of Zone Alarm installed and
that the patch they created to fix a known issue would cause such a problem
when installed with that version of Zone Alarm.
It's like purchasing a stock vehicle and adding some special 'performance'
parts to it. Later - there is a critical recall to the stock vehicle.
Something has to be changed/updated to protect the end-consumer. However -
it is discovered that if that change is made, the 'performance' parts
purchased and installed no longer work. Is it the original manufacturer's
place to make sure those third party parts work "no matter what" with their
vehicle - or is it the third party manufacturer's place... Or is it "buyer
beware" when you change what you originally purchased?
I've gotten a little off-topic there - but not too far. Microsoft may be
well aware (they have to be) that people will install third party software
on their operating systems. Some of that third party software may well be
antivirus, antispyware, office suites, browsers, etc. However - to expect
them to test every possible combination seems ridiculous.
I look at my set of machines alone and know the differences are pretty
broad. With three of my machines - they do not have the same service pack
level (two are SP3, one is SP2), the same Internet Explorer version(IE6,
IE78 and IE8 beta), the same antivirus software (Symantec AV 10.1.5.5000,
AVG 8.0.169 and Avast!) or even the same office suite (Microsoft Office
2003, Microsoft Office 2007 and Open Office.) Each one is fairly unique at
the hardware level as well. That's three machines owned by one individual -
all unique. Expand that to the millions upon millions of users and the
possibly multiple machines they utilize (work, home, laptops, etc) and the
number of possibilities is astounding.
No operating sytem is perfect (if it was - there would be no need for
patches, updates, etc), no means of patching is perfect and there is no
homogeniality amongst computers and their users. It is the very prescence
of uniqueness that prevents perfection. No one is *expecting* anyone to
have to research anything in order to utilize Windows and/or install SP3.
It might happen though.
No one expects you to change the oil in your car, pump your own fuel, change
your own tires, etc... But if you don't do it - someone else may have to and
you just may have to compensate that individual. If you don't do that
stuff, the car dies - sooner or later, one way or another, temporarily or
permanently... I just always saw it as the wiser course to make sure the
things that can prolong the use of something get done. If I feel it is
better handled by someone else - so be it. If I feel I can learn/do it
myself, so be it. I accept the fact that I may, even through diligence,
miss something through ignorance of its existance and that may adversely
affect me/my time occassionally - and I deal with that when it occurs. It's
worked for thousands of years for millions of people in billions of
situations... ;-)
Surely you've seen this set of advice on SP3 - but just in case:
In order to possibly 'pre-answer' some of your concerns with SP3 - I am
including the basic list of things you should know about before installing
SP3. There are a couple of ways of obtaining it (beyond the normal
Automatic Updates and
http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com methods) as well as
troubles others have had because of various issues already existing on their
system that SP3 was not designed to 'work-around' and that you may have to
fix before you install SP3.
I highly suggest you look through this list of things and see if any of them
look like/repair you issues and everyone would likely appreciate you coming
back to provide further feedback and information on how you get along
solving
your problem(s)...
A place to get FREE support for SP3 installation issues *from Microsoft*...
http://support.microsoft.com/oas/default.aspx?ln=en-us&prid=11273&gprid=522131
Windows XP Service Pack 3 - ISO-9660 CD Image File
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...ce-b5fb-4488-8c50-fe22559d164e&DisplayLang=en
Windows XP Service Pack 3 Network Installation Package for IT Professionals
and Developers
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...A8-5E76-401F-BE08-1E1555D4F3D4&displaylang=en
WinXP SP3 - Read all prerequisites for a successful installation
http://msmvps.com/blogs/harrywaldro...requisites-for-a-successful-installation.aspx
Steps to take before you install Windows XP Service Pack 3
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/950717
Release Notes for Windows XP Service Pack 3
http://download.microsoft.com/download/c/d/8/cd8cc719-7d5a-40d3-a802-e4057aa8c631/relnotes.htm
Key things to note:
Internet Explorer:
"If you have installed Windows Internet Explorer® 7 or a beta version of
Internet Explorer 8, and then install Windows XP SP3, you cannot uninstall
Internet Explorer. To avoid this, ensure Internet Explorer 7 or a beta
version of Internet Explorer 8 is not installed before installing Windows XP
SP3. If you have already encountered this issue, uninstall Windows XP SP3,
uninstall Internet Explorer, and then reinstall Windows XP SP3."
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2002:
"If you install Windows XP SP3 on a computer running Windows XP Media Center
Edition 2002 with SP1, Windows XP Media Center Edition may malfunction. To
avoid this, install Windows XP SP2 before you install Windows XP SP3. If
this issue has already occurred, uninstall Windows XP SP3, install Windows
XP SP2, and then reinstall Windows XP SP3."
It seems some people are unable to get further updates after installing
SP3... Seems some have experienced a symptom similar to doing a repair
installation on Windows XP - and the same fix seems to work for them for
that...
Updates are not installed successfully from Windows Update, from Microsoft
Update, or by using Automatic Updates after you repair a Windows XP
installation
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/943144
Some people experience an "endless reboot" issue...
From PA Bear [MS MVP]:
Workarounds:
http://msinfluentials.com/blogs/jes...ed-computer-boot-after-installing-xp-sp3.aspx
[NB: The above has been updated many times and now includes "a small tool
that will detect the IntelPPM problem and mitigate it before installing
[WinXP SP3]."
1. Boot into Safe Mode and rename INTELPMM.SYS to INTELPMM.OLD.
2. After booting into Safe Mode:
Start --> Run --> (copy/paste)
sc config intelppm start= disabled
--> OK --> Reboot into normal (Windows) mode.
Other references include:
..
http://aumha.net/viewtopic.php?p=187790#p187790
..
http://msinfluentials.com/blogs/jes...ed-computer-boot-after-installing-xp-sp3.aspx
..
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/05/09/windows_xp_sp3_reboots_crashes/
..
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9084418
.. You receive a "Stop 0x0000007E" error message after you upgrade to Windows
XP Service Pack 2 or Service Pack 3 on a non-Intel-processor-based computer
(Revised 06 May-08)
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/888372
Some people have gotten an "Access Denied" message when trying to install
SP3... Method 3 of this article:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/949377
Armed with the above information (and actually reading/comprehending it to
the best of your ability and patience) you should get through the
installation of Windows XP SP3 with little or no trouble and end up with an
updated machine and a little knowledge you did not have before. Why limit
yourself?
