WD Raptor or WD Caviar in RAID setup?

[Matt]

Hey guys. I'm interested in getting a hard drive aimed towards the
performance end of the consumer market. I'm keen to get a WD hard
drive as I have had good experiences in the past.

To that end, a WD Raptor 10,000rpm 150GB drive for £115 sounds like a
good idea. However, I would like more capacity if possible. Would I
get the same performance out of two 500GB 7,200rpm WD Caviar drives in
a RAID setup for less money?

My motherboard is the Gigabyte GA-X48-DS4.

Kind Regards,

Matt

 

[Matt]

I think the 300GB Raptor's are a little out of my price range at
nearly £200.

I'm thinking of getting the 150GB Raptor now and getting a slower
750GB Caviar in a few months time for the data I will have built up by
then. The only downside for me is the noise on these Raptor drives. I
found a review earlier on the Raptor 150GB and someone recorded the
noise it made. I've put the link below:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/files/sounds/hddnoise/wd-raptor-150-20-27dba.mp3

Would you say this is the level of sound you hear? If so I don't think
I could stand the noise it makes whilst seeking.

Kind Regards,

Matt

 

[Matt]

Nope.  The noise is overstated, especially since the recording is MUCH higher in

frequency than the actual HD.  There is noticeable noise during heavy seek
periods (e.g., while defragging), but not as a matter of course.  I would
characterize it as less than half the level heard on the recording (though what
you or I may hear from the mp3 depends a LOT on the speakers and volume level).
You can also minimize it by using rubber mounting pads between the HD andthe
rails.

The problem is I sit quite close to my PC. The seek noise reminds me a
lot of the noise my very first hard drive, a 3.2GB WD drive, would
make whilst seeking. I would find that noise too distracting.

Basically it seems pointless to build a system with 4GB of RAM and a
quad core Q9450, then install a WD Caviar 750GB drive that will run
noticeably slower. Would a RAID setup with a pair of 500GB Caviar's
for example be difficult to setup? Would it be anywhere near the
performance of the WD Raptor?

Kind Regards,

Matt

 

[Matt]

The problem is I sit quite close to my PC. The seek noise reminds me a lot of
the noise my very first hard drive, a 3.2GB WD drive, would make whilst
seeking. I would find that noise too distracting.

My machine is about a foot from my left knee.  I seldom notice any noise...

Basically it seems pointless to build a system with 4GB of RAM and a quad core
Q9450, then install a WD Caviar 750GB drive that will run noticeably slower.
Would a RAID setup with a pair of 500GB Caviar's for example be difficult to
setup? Would it be anywhere near the performance of the WD Raptor?

I have not set up RAID on the DS4, but I suspect it would be easy; the rest of
the manual is straightforward.  Also, the pair of Caviars would probably come
close to, or exceed the Raptor in performance.  The tradeoff is data
integrity -- any single-point failure means you lose all the data on bothHDs.
The good news is that a controller failure (built into the Southbridge) means
you can recover by replacing the MoBo.

Get a copy of Acronis TrueImage, and make regular data backups to an external HD
as well.  Clone a copy of your boot partition to a separate [primary] partition
on that HD so you can use it immediately as an emergency backup.

You mentioned a RAID 0 failure earlier. Are these as common as a
typical mechanical failure in a hard drive, or should I be braced for
some downtime?

Kind Regards,

Matt

 

[John Doe]

I am NOT a fan of RAID 0 (the only way to get "more performance"
with a pair of HDs). The 74s were once in RAID 0 on an older
MoBo, and I had to reload the system from scratch after a logical
RAID error left one of them inaccessible. I switched to RAID 1
after that. I could notice the degraded performance, but to me it
was worth the peace of mind.

Maybe a good use for a well-developed copy of Windows. I guess both
drives get trashed, so it would require the copy on another
drive/disk/media. And there might be complications copying the known
good developed installation of Windows back into place. Maybe
booting to the third drive and using the Disk Manager from there, a
wild guess, assuming the RAID 0 drives don't have to be the boot
drive. Even if that doesn't work, there probably are other
possibilities. Hmm.

 

[John Doe]

The only downside for me is the noise on these Raptor drives.

Do you suffer from migraines, live in a soundproof room, and wear an
earpiece that boosts the sound around you 10 times or more?

Get real.

You are among real people who actually own Raptors. Instead of
promoting silliness, why don't you just ask?

I own the 150, it doesn't make noise.

 

[John Doe]

The problem is I sit quite close to my PC.

I think you're from another planet.

 

[Ed Medlin]

From reports I've read, logical failures from the controllers are more
likely than mechanical failures. With RAID 0 it is a particular problem
because you have NO backup! In RAID 1 you can rebuild from the good HD,
and in RAID 5 you can rebuild from the remaining HDs.

The failure I had was a transient one (embedded Promise controller in an
older MoBo), and I was able to recover both HDs by reformatting them (they
are the same Raptor 74s I still run). After running fine for 6 months, I
didn't expect a failure, either,but... I did not trust that controller in
RAID 0 any more, though I had no failures after that after switching to
RAID 1.

Bottom line is that your chances of failure are significantly more than
double with RAID 0. The stats are still very small, but the results if
you get caught are bad...

JR........I have found a direct correlation between <1>the amount of time
from your last backup and <2>the time for a failure of a RAID 0 array. The
longer <1> is, the shorter <2> is..............


Ed

 

[John Doe]

The Samsung F1 Spinpoint drives (500Gb and 1Tb) are the current
leaders in almost every review I have seen in the last few
months... You can have a 1Tb Spinpoint for under œ100 and its just
as fast as a Raptor, especially with 32Mb of cache!

And the cow jumped over the moon.

 

[John Doe]

The Samsung F1 Spinpoint drives (500Gb and 1Tb) are the current
leaders in almost every review I have seen in the last few
months... You can have a 1Tb Spinpoint for under £100 and its just
as fast as a Raptor, especially with 32Mb of cache!

Load times are the most noticeable hard drive performance index.

http://techreport.com/articles.x/14200/5

Yours is near the bottom of the list in every test.

The Raptors are near the top.

 

[John Doe]

Hmm... Me thinks you misrepresent the data.

You left out the worst results.

You get what you pay for. The Samsung F1 Spinpoint hard drives are
frequently DOA (mentioned 26 times in the first 100 reviews) and carry
an unspecified or short warranty.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152102

Excellent 59 reviews 56%
Good 10 reviews 9%
Average 7 reviews 6%
Poor 11 reviews 10%
Very poor 21 reviews 19%

Western Digital Raptor.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136011

Excellent 398 reviews 77%
Good 72 reviews 14%
Average 27 reviews 5%
Poor 7 reviews 1%
Very poor 15 reviews 3%

 

[John Doe]

I have had IBM/Hitachi, WD and Maxtor all DOA in the past... I
never had a Samsung DOA... don't doubt your figures, but every
brand has bad batches, just I personally have never had a bad
Samsung. We use dozens of them at work, all with no problem.

Your singular experience doesn't discount the user feedback on
Newegg.

Custom PC May 2008
...
Custom PC Aug 2008
...

So you aren't aware of the fact that magazines get paid for
advertising.

 

[John Doe]

I don't know where you get that "short warranty" from..

I got it from the user reviews on Newegg.

the Samsungs all come with a three year warranty!

Maybe you're talking about the retail version!!!

From the user reviews on Newegg experiencing frequent DOAs with
Samsung F1 hard drives.

"There is no warranty"

"No warranty - per Samsung"

"I called the warranty department today and this drive only has a 1
year warranty"

"Samsung's warranty replaces a faulty drive with a refurb"

"Warranty replacement gives you a refurb"

"BEWARE OF WARRANTY TERMS"

"Samsung won't make good with absolutely no company warranty, so I'm
out several hundred dollars"

 

[John Doe]

Whoa...

Is this your first post to USENET, or are you nym-shifting?

Why are you all fighting over half a second difference on
something that takes 30 odd seconds to load?

The difference loading stuff with a Raptor is in fact a lot greater
than that.

For me the answer would be simple. I have no use for a 150gb
drive,

Nobody needs to know that. Hard drive size is explicitly stated and
universally understood.

no matter how fast it is,

That sounds like a personal problem.

and I sure as hell aren't going to (a) sit there with
a stopwatch measuring it

Maybe not, but I bet you do weirder stuff than that.

or (b) going to pay that sort of money for it.

Okey-dokey. So how's the weather?

It's all about the law of dminishing returns,

Actually, that depends on how fast it is and how much you use a
computer during the day. You're mistaken if you think that an
individual result is all you get out of it.

The Samsung that Rarius is mentioning has a 3 year warranty,

Do you work for Samsung?

 

[John Doe]

"John Doe" <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> wrote in message

Ok. I'll bite. What's the difference?

A lot.

Yup, and 150gb is small by todays standards.

You are narrowminded.

Some people I know will fill that much space in a few weeks.

Especially if you download lots of porn and other multimedia. I'm a
gamer. I could have backup copies of Windows, and installed Flight
Simulator, Supreme Commander, and all of my other games on my 150 GB
Raptor with space left over.

You're not enlightening anybody, DaSilvor. And hopefully you're not
suggesting that no one can use a 150 GB hard drive. I used a 37 GB
Raptor until about six months ago. Raptors rock.

Because, of course, hard drive speed is in fact a major limiting
factor of a computer.

Hmmmm. Nope.
Liar.



I use one every day. Build my own as well; have done for the last
17 years.

Good. If you hang around here, your horizons will be broadened.

 

[John Doe]

What other version would I be talking about?

Most of us homebuilders buy basic OEM hardware/components, like from
an online merchant. That's what Newegg is, DaSilvor, as you could
easily find out by searching the Internet.

 

[John Doe]

I will repeat my original assessment, that I would not buy

a 150gb harddrive for œ115, no matter how fast it is.

That might matter if the world revolved around DaSilvor.

Lose the ego, dude.

 

[John Doe]

So why would CustomPC publish such a bad review of the Raptor
then?

Maybe the effect of advertising is much greater for a new arrival.

Hopefully you aren't denying the fact that hardware makers pay
magazines to say good things about their products.

<snipped lots of exclamation points and ellipsis>

Try to find user reviews that support your excitement about Samsung
F1 hard drives. The user reviews I've seen and posted above in this
thread suggest that they are unreliable and not well supported.

Subject: Re: WD Raptor or WD Caviar in RAID setup?
From: "Rarius" <rarius rarius.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 00:33:18 +0100
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[Shadow39]

Anybody else thinking of a phrase with the words "pot", "kettle" and
"black" in it?

Rarius

Oh yea. John Doe is the LAST dude to be telling anyone to lose thier ego....

 

[John Doe]

Oh yea. John Doe is the LAST dude to be telling anyone to lose
thier ego....

Says a nym-shifting troll in agreement with someone who claims
to have no posting history at all.