Warning buying MS product

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Bought a copy of MS Streets & Trips short time ago. I already had a number
of GPS programs but bought the package because it included a small GPS
receiver that connects to a usb port.

S&T works as expected, GPS receiver doesn't work anywhere near reliably,
perhaps 5% of time (at first, doesn't seem to do more than light up now) and
has never kept working longer than a few minutes.

And that's across 4 pcs so I think it safe to assume it's toast given
everything works properly when I hook up my standalone Garmin GPS to any of
these software packages.

MS takes no responsibility for the peice of hardware, even stating in the
packaging (only readable after opening) to go to Pharos (GPS manufacturer)
for support for it. Pharos simply stated 'take it back and get your money
back'!!! Dealer won't take it back as it was old stock when I bought it at a
loss already for him instead telling me to "send it in for warranty".

WHAT F***ING WARRANTY does one have when both pass the buck for brand new
item.

So I end up swallowing another cost for something that doesn't work and
never did.

MS, you wonder why I will try first and sometimes continue to use "pirated"
software. You steal money out of my pocket continually for defective
products so it's the only way to protect myself.
 
news.microsoft.com said:
Bought a copy of MS Streets & Trips short time ago. I already had a
number of GPS programs but bought the package because it included a
small GPS receiver that connects to a usb port.

S&T works as expected, GPS receiver doesn't work anywhere near
reliably, perhaps 5% of time (at first, doesn't seem to do more
than light up now) and has never kept working longer than a few
minutes.
And that's across 4 pcs so I think it safe to assume it's toast
given everything works properly when I hook up my standalone Garmin
GPS to any of these software packages.

MS takes no responsibility for the peice of hardware, even stating
in the packaging (only readable after opening) to go to Pharos (GPS
manufacturer) for support for it. Pharos simply stated 'take it
back and get your money back'!!! Dealer won't take it back as it
was old stock when I bought it at a loss already for him instead
telling me to "send it in for warranty".
WHAT F***ING WARRANTY does one have when both pass the buck for
brand new item.

So I end up swallowing another cost for something that doesn't work
and never did.

MS, you wonder why I will try first and sometimes continue to use
"pirated" software. You steal money out of my pocket continually
for defective products so it's the only way to protect myself.
Click to expand...

You bought a probably out-of-date version of something at a discounted price
and it didn't go well so you are blaming someone else?

What do your parents/teachers say?
 
Shenan Stanley said:
You bought a probably out-of-date version of something at a discounted
price and it didn't go well so you are blaming someone else?
Click to expand...

No, I went into a store and bought a product in it's original packaging at
the
asking price. The included hardware does not work and neither MS (who
"branded" the product) nor the hardware manufacturer take any
reasponsibility.

THAT AIN"T RIGHT!!!
What do your parents/teachers say?
Click to expand...

Morally and ethically they'd agree. I know right from wrong and it's
certainly
wrong that it's the paying consumer always taking the chance if it works or
not with no recourse. If the dealer won't take it back, MS should least
offer
a refund as it is their product. And I don't care when it was made, it isn't
biological
so didn't "go bad".

As I said, just drives people to pirate. You don't like that; too bad. I
couldn't give
a hoot what you do or don't like, just give me back my money.
 
Since the software works, and that isn't what your beef is, WHY are you
ranting here? Also thanks for telling the world you are a self
proclaimed thief!
 
Were you born a HoopleHead thief, or did you work your way down?

: Bought a copy of MS Streets & Trips short time ago. I already had a number
: of GPS programs but bought the package because it included a small GPS
: receiver that connects to a usb port.
:
: S&T works as expected, GPS receiver doesn't work anywhere near reliably,
: perhaps 5% of time (at first, doesn't seem to do more than light up now)
and
: has never kept working longer than a few minutes.
:
: And that's across 4 pcs so I think it safe to assume it's toast given
: everything works properly when I hook up my standalone Garmin GPS to any
of
: these software packages.
:
: MS takes no responsibility for the peice of hardware, even stating in the
: packaging (only readable after opening) to go to Pharos (GPS manufacturer)
: for support for it. Pharos simply stated 'take it back and get your money
: back'!!! Dealer won't take it back as it was old stock when I bought it at
a
: loss already for him instead telling me to "send it in for warranty".
:
: WHAT F***ING WARRANTY does one have when both pass the buck for brand new
: item.
:
: So I end up swallowing another cost for something that doesn't work and
: never did.
:
: MS, you wonder why I will try first and sometimes continue to use
"pirated"
: software. You steal money out of my pocket continually for defective
: products so it's the only way to protect myself.
:
:
 
Bob I said:
Since the software works, and that isn't what your beef is, WHY are you
ranting here? Also thanks for telling the world you are a self proclaimed
thief!
Click to expand...

I bought it for the hardware (included GPS transponder). Certainly didn't
care if I had S&T as I already have OziExplorer, Garmin Mapsource, MapPoint
(later ver than the S&T) and MapSend. I'll repeat, the included hardware
doesn't work hence I should be able to get a refund which I can't as no-one
takes any responsibility. That's what the rants about!
 
In
news.microsoft.com said:
Shenan Stanley said:
You bought a probably out-of-date version of something at
a discounted price and it didn't go well so you are
blaming someone else?
Click to expand...

No, I went into a store and bought a product in it's
original packaging at the
asking price. The included hardware does not work and
neither MS (who "branded" the product) nor the hardware
manufacturer take any reasponsibility.

THAT AIN"T RIGHT!!!
What do your parents/teachers say?
Click to expand...

Morally and ethically they'd agree. I know right from wrong
and it's certainly
wrong that it's the paying consumer always taking the
chance if it works or not with no recourse. If the dealer
won't take it back, MS should least offer
a refund as it is their product. And I don't care when it
was made, it isn't biological
so didn't "go bad".

As I said, just drives people to pirate. You don't like
that; too bad. I couldn't give
a hoot what you do or don't like, just give me back my
money.

To the OP:

OK: Provide your full name, street address, city/state/zip and phone, along
with a valid e-mail address and an alternate e-mail address (no disposable
accounts, BTW) in a return post. Also include the proof of purchase,
date/time of sale and invoice number. In return you'll receive an RMA number
within three weeks and within 6 weeks after that, you'll receive notice
whether you'll receive another like product or a check for the amount you
paid, less S&H of course.
We'll also need you to return the complete product, properly packaged,
and all documentaiton what was supplied with the item in question. To verify
that you at one time actually installed the product, we will also need to
access your computer remotely for that verification. No personal information
will be sent to us that we don't already have during that access. The only
other check to be made of course will be to ascertain that your activation
code is current and functional.
65% Restocking charges will be applied, based on the then current selling
price of the item when you send us the bad unit, postage paid and a full
explanation of the problems you experienced.
Click to expand...
 
Twayne said:
In
news.microsoft.com said:
No, I went into a store and bought a product in it's
original packaging at the
asking price. The included hardware does not work and
neither MS (who "branded" the product) nor the hardware
manufacturer take any reasponsibility.

THAT AIN"T RIGHT!!!


Morally and ethically they'd agree. I know right from wrong
and it's certainly
wrong that it's the paying consumer always taking the
chance if it works or not with no recourse. If the dealer
won't take it back, MS should least offer
a refund as it is their product. And I don't care when it
was made, it isn't biological
so didn't "go bad".

As I said, just drives people to pirate. You don't like
that; too bad. I couldn't give
a hoot what you do or don't like, just give me back my
money.


To the OP:

OK: Provide your full name, street address, city/state/zip and phone,
along with a valid e-mail address and an alternate e-mail address (no
disposable accounts, BTW) in a return post. Also include the proof of
purchase, date/time of sale and invoice number. In return you'll receive
an RMA number within three weeks and within 6 weeks after that, you'll
receive notice whether you'll receive another like product or a check for
the amount you paid, less S&H of course.
We'll also need you to return the complete product, properly packaged,
and all documentaiton what was supplied with the item in question. To
verify that you at one time actually installed the product, we will also
need to access your computer remotely for that verification. No personal
information will be sent to us that we don't already have during that
access. The only other check to be made of course will be to ascertain
that your activation code is current and functional.
65% Restocking charges will be applied, based on the then current
selling price of the item when you send us the bad unit, postage paid and
a full explanation of the problems you experienced.
Click to expand...

Cute :) LOL
Click to expand...
 
news.microsoft.com said:
I bought it for the hardware (included GPS transponder). Certainly didn't
care if I had S&T as I already have OziExplorer, Garmin Mapsource, MapPoint
(later ver than the S&T) and MapSend. I'll repeat, the included hardware
doesn't work hence I should be able to get a refund which I can't as no-one
takes any responsibility. That's what the rants about!
Click to expand...

This pretty much sums it up
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/894511
 
Bob I said:
This pretty much sums it up
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/894511
Click to expand...

Been there, tried all methods on 3 separate pcs. Everything appears ok
software wise and it certainly should get a signal when it's 100' (laptop
first then dragged two separate desktops out on extension cord trying) or so
facing south into 2 acre+ freshly mowed field (BIG lawn :). Damn thing has
come alive occasionally but goes dead after few minutes use is "best"
experience to date. Just wanted the thing to permanently mount on 4x4 with
old laptop running OziExplorer (preferred as it uses very hi-res aerial
photos of local area I have rather than canned commercial maps) when back in
woods rather than having to use new Garmin handheld (which works with all
systems over all software).

I'm far from rich, old geezer limited pension. Money I spent wasn't trivial
to me and I feel like I've been robbed, e.g. someone just reached in took
from me and left nothing of value.
 
news.microsoft.com said:
Bought a copy of MS Streets & Trips short time ago. I already had a
number of GPS programs but bought the package because it included a
small GPS receiver that connects to a usb port.

S&T works as expected, GPS receiver doesn't work anywhere near
reliably, perhaps 5% of time (at first, doesn't seem to do more
than light up now) and has never kept working longer than a few
minutes.
And that's across 4 pcs so I think it safe to assume it's toast
given everything works properly when I hook up my standalone Garmin
GPS to any of these software packages.

MS takes no responsibility for the peice of hardware, even stating
in the packaging (only readable after opening) to go to Pharos (GPS
manufacturer) for support for it. Pharos simply stated 'take it
back and get your money back'!!! Dealer won't take it back as it
was old stock when I bought it at a loss already for him instead
telling me to "send it in for warranty".
WHAT F***ING WARRANTY does one have when both pass the buck for
brand new item.

So I end up swallowing another cost for something that doesn't work
and never did.

MS, you wonder why I will try first and sometimes continue to use
"pirated" software. You steal money out of my pocket continually
for defective products so it's the only way to protect myself.
Click to expand...

Microsoft North American Retail Product Refund Guidelines
http://www.microsoft.com/mscorp/productrefund/refund.mspx

What *exact* Streets and Trips version is this and what was the date of
purchase?

- Streets & Trips 2006 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=9977)
- Streets & Trips 2007 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=11947)
- Streets & Trips 2008 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=12565)
- Streets & Trips 2009 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=13795)
- Streets & Trips 2010 with GPS Locator
(LifeCycle not listed yet)

The reason for the query should be obvious.

Tried to get help from Microsoft if it is still a supported product?

MapPoint / Streets & Trips / AutoRoute Solution Center
http://support.microsoft.com/ph/1058#tab0

Specifically:
Contact a support professional by E-mail, Online, or Phone
http://support.microsoft.com/gethelp/default.aspx?content=ph;en-us;1058

Reasonable questions, I think.
 
news.microsoft.com said:
Been there, tried all methods on 3 separate pcs. Everything appears ok
software wise and it certainly should get a signal when it's 100' (laptop
first then dragged two separate desktops out on extension cord trying) or so
facing south into 2 acre+ freshly mowed field (BIG lawn :). Damn thing has
come alive occasionally but goes dead after few minutes use is "best"
experience to date. Just wanted the thing to permanently mount on 4x4 with
old laptop running OziExplorer (preferred as it uses very hi-res aerial
photos of local area I have rather than canned commercial maps) when back in
woods rather than having to use new Garmin handheld (which works with all
systems over all software).

I'm far from rich, old geezer limited pension. Money I spent wasn't trivial
to me and I feel like I've been robbed, e.g. someone just reached in took
from me and left nothing of value.
Click to expand...

If the store refuses to take it back and Pharos says thats the method of
fixing the issue perhaps you paid with a credit card, and have some
recourse there?
 
Shenan Stanley said:
Microsoft North American Retail Product Refund Guidelines
http://www.microsoft.com/mscorp/productrefund/refund.mspx
Click to expand...

That's a guideline no company is forced to follow so it's a lot like
insurance bureau, better business bureau etc. and basically is the self
serving make people feel good before fact bs common to all.
What *exact* Streets and Trips version is this and what was the date of
purchase?
Click to expand...

S&T 2008 with included GPS. Installed fine, validated etc. no problem and
software itself works. Less than 2 months old in original packaging. Isn't
the warranty from date of purchase and not date plastic was put on package?
- Streets & Trips 2006 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=9977)
- Streets & Trips 2007 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=11947)
- Streets & Trips 2008 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=12565)
- Streets & Trips 2009 with GPS Locator
(http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?p1=13795)
- Streets & Trips 2010 with GPS Locator
(LifeCycle not listed yet)

The reason for the query should be obvious.

Tried to get help from Microsoft if it is still a supported product?
Click to expand...

MS supports the software but all indications from all support angles
indicate they pass off any hardware problems to that manufacturer even
though there's no mention of any other than MS involved on packaging when
making purchase decision. Hence the subject line.
MapPoint / Streets & Trips / AutoRoute Solution Center
http://support.microsoft.com/ph/1058#tab0

Specifically:
Contact a support professional by E-mail, Online, or Phone
http://support.microsoft.com/gethelp/default.aspx?content=ph;en-us;1058
Click to expand...

Been there, done that, as said hardware good-bye and go see hardware
manufacturer.
Reasonable questions, I think.
Click to expand...

I't does look like perhaps Pharos is going to make some effort anyway. They
refused anything to do with it via email support but after a phone call and
an argument about "How can a consumer that goes into a store to buy
something supposed to know that product was made 'x' time ago so no longer
under warranty." they have agreed to "take a look at it" with no promises
provided I send everything to them including even the USB extension cable.
Now have to remember which of the 1/2 dozen of those is the one came with
the unit as I tried a few during debugging sessions and I have a feeling
they'll use any excuse to avoid any sense of responsibility.
 
news.microsoft.com said:
That's a guideline no company is forced to follow so it's a lot like
insurance bureau, better business bureau etc. and basically is the self
serving make people feel good before fact bs common to all.


S&T 2008 with included GPS. Installed fine, validated etc. no problem and
software itself works. Less than 2 months old in original packaging. Isn't
the warranty from date of purchase and not date plastic was put on
package?

MS supports the software but all indications from all support angles
indicate they pass off any hardware problems to that manufacturer even
though there's no mention of any other than MS involved on packaging when
making purchase decision. Hence the subject line.


Been there, done that, as said hardware good-bye and go see hardware
manufacturer.


I't does look like perhaps Pharos is going to make some effort anyway.
They refused anything to do with it via email support but after a phone
call and an argument about "How can a consumer that goes into a store to
buy something supposed to know that product was made 'x' time ago so no
longer under warranty." they have agreed to "take a look at it" with no
promises provided I send everything to them including even the USB
extension cable.
Click to expand...

Don't the instructions say NOT to use any kind of extension or USB hub, that
the GPS needs to be plugged directly into a USB port?
 
SC Tom said:
Don't the instructions say NOT to use any kind of extension or USB hub,
that the GPS needs to be plugged directly into a USB port?
--
Click to expand...

Yes, that is one of the debugging steps. As mentioned tried that on a laptop
and two desktops. Think that is mostly to guard against a bad extension
cable though as clearly if it's directly connected to the usb port on a pc
it has restricted access to the sky to pick up sats. Using a known good
extension cable hasn't been any different than without in how reliable the
product is.
 
If they say not to use an exten sion cable, I wouldn't.

I have a Brother laser printer. It will only work a maximum of 6 feet cable.
Extensions of any kind do not work and it states it in their manual.
 
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