Vista and Windows ME

  • Thread starter Thread starter Guest
  • Start date Start date
G

Guest

Hello,

Has anyone successfully networked a Vista machine with a ME machine? My
Vista machine can access my ME machine but *not* the other way. My ME machine
sees the Vista machine but locks up when I try to access the public folder.

-Len
 
Hello,

Has anyone successfully networked a Vista machine with a ME machine? My
Vista machine can access my ME machine but *not* the other way. My ME machine
sees the Vista machine but locks up when I try to access the public folder.

-Len
Click to expand...

I recently spoke with some networking people at Microsoft. As I
understand it, Microsoft doesn't support Vista sharing its folders
over a network with computers running Windows 95/98/Me. It isn't part
of Vista's design, they haven't tested it, and there's no guarantee
that it will work.

I've seen these problems when trying to access Vista's shared folders
from 95/98/Me:

1. Incompatible default network authentication protocols. Windows
95/98/Me uses LM and NTLM authentication. Vista uses NTLMv2
authentication. This causes a prompt for the IPC$ password on
95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled on Vista. There
is no valid response to the IPC$ prompt.

2. Incomplete enumeration of shares. 95/98/Me only sees some of
Vista's shared folders, and the names of some shared folders are
truncated, making them inaccessible.

3. Instability. Accessing Vista's shared folders makes 95/98/Me hang
or crash.

I'd love to know if anyone has found solutions to those problems.

Here's how to configure Vista to use LM and NTLM authentication to
allow access from 95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled.
I'd like to thank my fellow MVP Evan Pearce, who helped me understand
and test this:

1. Click the Start button, type "regedit" in the Start Search box, and
press Enter.

2. Click "Continue" in the User Account Control prompt.

3. Open this registry key:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa

4. If they don't already exist, create DWORD values named
LmCompatibilityLevel and NoLmHash.

5. Set LMCompatibilityLevel to 1.

6. Set NoLmHash to 0.

7. Restart the Vista computer.

8. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts, click "Change your password",
enter your current password in the boxes for "Current password", "New
password", and "Confirm new password", and click "Change password".
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
 
Hi,
I have the same problem.
Trying to perform a printer acces from Vista to ME is not succesfull will
copying files is.
Strang is that from Vista i can also copy files from ME to Vsta although Me
sees Vista but v
cannot acces it.
I tried mostly everthing what was mentioned on the forum without any succes.

A collegue expert told mee that i will not work because there is a conflict
between machines (ME of XP) if ther are using the FAT32 while Vista is using
NFTS.

Regards
Huib
 
"Huib" said:
Hi,
I have the same problem.
Trying to perform a printer acces from Vista to ME is not succesfull will
copying files is.
Strang is that from Vista i can also copy files from ME to Vsta although Me
sees Vista but v
cannot acces it.
I tried mostly everthing what was mentioned on the forum without any succes.

A collegue expert told mee that i will not work because there is a conflict
between machines (ME of XP) if ther are using the FAT32 while Vista is using
NFTS.

Regards
Huib
Click to expand...

Vista should be able to access shared folders and printers that belong
to Windows ME. In order to use ME's shared printer, a Vista computer
must have a Vista driver for that printer installed.

FAT32 vs. NTFS makes no difference in networking. Each computer knows
how to read its own hard disk and send the contents to other computers
on the network. So, for example, ME can access a shared NTFS disk
belonging to XP.
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
 
Steve Winograd said:
I recently spoke with some networking people at Microsoft. As I
understand it, Microsoft doesn't support Vista sharing its folders
over a network with computers running Windows 95/98/Me. It isn't part
of Vista's design, they haven't tested it, and there's no guarantee
that it will work.

I've seen these problems when trying to access Vista's shared folders
from 95/98/Me:

1. Incompatible default network authentication protocols. Windows
95/98/Me uses LM and NTLM authentication. Vista uses NTLMv2
authentication. This causes a prompt for the IPC$ password on
95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled on Vista. There
is no valid response to the IPC$ prompt.

2. Incomplete enumeration of shares. 95/98/Me only sees some of
Vista's shared folders, and the names of some shared folders are
truncated, making them inaccessible.

3. Instability. Accessing Vista's shared folders makes 95/98/Me hang
or crash.

I'd love to know if anyone has found solutions to those problems.

Here's how to configure Vista to use LM and NTLM authentication to
allow access from 95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled.
I'd like to thank my fellow MVP Evan Pearce, who helped me understand
and test this:

1. Click the Start button, type "regedit" in the Start Search box, and
press Enter.

2. Click "Continue" in the User Account Control prompt.

3. Open this registry key:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa

4. If they don't already exist, create DWORD values named
LmCompatibilityLevel and NoLmHash.

5. Set LMCompatibilityLevel to 1.

6. Set NoLmHash to 0.

7. Restart the Vista computer.

8. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts, click "Change your password",
enter your current password in the boxes for "Current password", "New
password", and "Confirm new password", and click "Change password".
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
Click to expand...

Thank you for your response Steve. I'll give this a try. I actually did the
reverse earlier. I set up NTLNv2 on the ME machine, to no avail.

My main concern is not folder sharing but getting a printer attached to the
Vista machine accessible to the ME machine.

Len
 
Thank you for your response Steve. I'll give this a try. I actually did the
reverse earlier. I set up NTLNv2 on the ME machine, to no avail.

My main concern is not folder sharing but getting a printer attached to the
Vista machine accessible to the ME machine.

Len
Click to expand...

You're welcome, Len. I haven't tried sharing a Vista printer with ME,
and I'm interested in your results.

How did you set up NTLMv2 on ME? Did you install the Windows 2000
Active Directory Client Extension and edit the registry, as described
here?

http://www.imss.caltech.edu/cms.php?op=wiki&wiki_op=view&id=414

I've seen the same problems in both cases: after enabling NTLMv2 on
Windows 95/98/Me, and after enabling LM and NTLM on Vista.
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
 
Steve Winograd said:
You're welcome, Len. I haven't tried sharing a Vista printer with ME,
and I'm interested in your results.

How did you set up NTLMv2 on ME? Did you install the Windows 2000
Active Directory Client Extension and edit the registry, as described
here?

http://www.imss.caltech.edu/cms.php?op=wiki&wiki_op=view&id=414

I've seen the same problems in both cases: after enabling NTLMv2 on
Windows 95/98/Me, and after enabling LM and NTLM on Vista.
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
Click to expand...

Yes, I used the procedure of the link you posted. I'm wondering...since I
don't have password protected sharing enabled, do you think the Vista
registry edit will make a difference?
 
Yes, I used the procedure of the link you posted. I'm wondering...since I
don't have password protected sharing enabled, do you think the Vista
registry edit will make a difference?
Click to expand...

The best way for you to find out is to try it and see.

However, I think that there are two separate problems here:

1. Authentication (LM and NTLM vs. NTLMv2).

2. Folder and file access. Some of Vista's folders are invisible on
95/98/Me, some folders have truncated names, and accessing Vista's
files can hang or crash 95/98/Me.

The first problem can be solved by editing Vista's registry or by
installing the Active Directory Client Extension on Windows 95/98/Me.

I don't know of a solution to the second problem, and the people who I
spoke with at Microsoft couldn't suggest one.
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
 
Steve Winograd said:
The best way for you to find out is to try it and see.

However, I think that there are two separate problems here:

1. Authentication (LM and NTLM vs. NTLMv2).

2. Folder and file access. Some of Vista's folders are invisible on
95/98/Me, some folders have truncated names, and accessing Vista's
files can hang or crash 95/98/Me.

The first problem can be solved by editing Vista's registry or by
installing the Active Directory Client Extension on Windows 95/98/Me.

I don't know of a solution to the second problem, and the people who I
spoke with at Microsoft couldn't suggest one.
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
Click to expand...

I tried the vista registry change and the problem remains. The ME machine
cannot acces the the vista machine's printer or shared folder. Oh well. Thank
you for all your help, Steve. I really appreciate it.

I guess this is a dead issue from here?

-Len
 
Len and Steve,

I have been able to connect to Vista without difficulty using everything
from MSDOS 6.22, through Windows 95-ME, and all versions of NT. First, all
of the PCs are Domain joined, and I have not tried tried a Workgroup
scenario, but it should work. Second, all of the PCs are running TCP/IP
(v4). Third, NTLM is used so they can all "speak the language" (so to
speak...). Fourth, sharing on Vista needs to be configured to let this work.

What I do on Vista is to go the the drive/folder that I want to share, and
right-click. Under Sharing I select Advanced Sharing. I then check 'Share
this folder" and click on Permissions. Under Permissions, I click Add. Since
the Vista PCs are Domain joined, I typically add a group (not individual
User) that I want to have access. Again, I have not tried individual Users,
but it should work. Then, once they are added, I select which Permissions to
grant them. Last, and most important, I then delete "Everyone", so the added
Users and Groups are the only ones listed. Finally click OK to get out.

This should work, I have been using it for some time without difficulty. A
few comments... Since Vista, and all of the other PCs are Domain joined,
accounts and passwords are already in place, so that is not an issue. The
big stumbling block has been "Everyone", which in this case essentially
translates to "No One". In a Workgroup setting, then accounts and passwords
will need to be arranged to allow access.

In closing, Vista is actually quite accessable from MSDOS on, with the
correct configuration.

John Baker
 
Hello John,

Thank you for your reply. This might be beyond my understanding of networks,
but I tried what you have suggested.

I have 3 machines hooked up to a home network:

#1 (Len-PC) running vista home premium.
#2 (AMYSPC) running Windows ME
#3 (FAMILYPC) running xp sp2.
All are on my MSHOME network. All can see each other. The ME machine cannot
access the vista machine or its attached printer.

When I get to the point of adding a user (or group) to permissions on the
vista machines public folder, I don't see the other machines on my network.
It only shows me whats available from the location Len-PC. I tried adding
*NETWORK* and removing *EVERYONE* but it still doesn't work. IOW the ME
machine still cannot access the vista machine or it's attached printer.

I hope I'm explaining this correctly because I really would like to get this
straightened out. Any further help would be appreciated.

Thanks!
Len
 
"JRB Associates" said:
Len and Steve,

I have been able to connect to Vista without difficulty using everything
from MSDOS 6.22, through Windows 95-ME, and all versions of NT. First, all
of the PCs are Domain joined, and I have not tried tried a Workgroup
scenario, but it should work. Second, all of the PCs are running TCP/IP
(v4). Third, NTLM is used so they can all "speak the language" (so to
speak...). Fourth, sharing on Vista needs to be configured to let this work.

What I do on Vista is to go the the drive/folder that I want to share, and
right-click. Under Sharing I select Advanced Sharing. I then check 'Share
this folder" and click on Permissions. Under Permissions, I click Add. Since
the Vista PCs are Domain joined, I typically add a group (not individual
User) that I want to have access. Again, I have not tried individual Users,
but it should work. Then, once they are added, I select which Permissions to
grant them. Last, and most important, I then delete "Everyone", so the added
Users and Groups are the only ones listed. Finally click OK to get out.

This should work, I have been using it for some time without difficulty. A
few comments... Since Vista, and all of the other PCs are Domain joined,
accounts and passwords are already in place, so that is not an issue. The
big stumbling block has been "Everyone", which in this case essentially
translates to "No One". In a Workgroup setting, then accounts and passwords
will need to be arranged to allow access.

In closing, Vista is actually quite accessable from MSDOS on, with the
correct configuration.

John Baker
Click to expand...

Thanks for the very interesting report, John. It wouldn't surprise me
if networking DOS and 9x with Vista works in a domain, but not in a
workgroup. People at Microsoft have domain-connected computers, and I
don't think that they're fully aware of what workgroup users face.

I don't have access to a domain for testing. I'll do some tests in my
workgroup, removing the Everyone group from share permissions and
explicitly adding individual users. Your experience gives me some
hope that it will work. :-)
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
 
Hello John,

Thank you for your reply. This might be beyond my understanding of networks,
but I tried what you have suggested.

I have 3 machines hooked up to a home network:

#1 (Len-PC) running vista home premium.
#2 (AMYSPC) running Windows ME
#3 (FAMILYPC) running xp sp2.
All are on my MSHOME network. All can see each other. The ME machine cannot
access the vista machine or its attached printer.

When I get to the point of adding a user (or group) to permissions on the
vista machines public folder, I don't see the other machines on my network.
It only shows me whats available from the location Len-PC. I tried adding
*NETWORK* and removing *EVERYONE* but it still doesn't work. IOW the ME
machine still cannot access the vista machine or it's attached printer.

I hope I'm explaining this correctly because I really would like to get this
straightened out. Any further help would be appreciated.

Thanks!
Len
Click to expand...

Hi, Len. In a workgroup, you can only set permissions for users who
have an account on the local computer. Those permissions apply to the
same users when they try to connect to the local computer from another
computer on the network.

Define user accounts on Vista for everyone who should have access to
Vista's shared folders, with the same user names and passwords that
they use to log into the other computers.

Ron Lowe and I have written an article showing how to set permissions
on Windows XP Professional, and the same steps should work in Vista:

Windows XP Professional File Sharing
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/sharing/xp_filesharing/index.htm

In particular, see the section on setting up access control lists:

http://www.practicallynetworked.com/sharing/xp_filesharing/06acl.htm
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Program
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
 
I recently spoke with some networking people at Microsoft. As I
understand it, Microsoft doesn't support Vista sharing its folders
over a network with computers running Windows 95/98/Me. It isn't part
of Vista's design, they haven't tested it, and there's no guarantee
that it will work.

I've seen these problems when trying to access Vista's shared folders
from 95/98/Me:

1. Incompatible default network authentication protocols. Windows
95/98/Me uses LM and NTLM authentication. Vista uses NTLMv2
authentication. This causes a prompt for the IPC$ password on
95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled on Vista. There
is no valid response to the IPC$ prompt.

2. Incomplete enumeration of shares. 95/98/Me only sees some of
Vista's shared folders, and the names of some shared folders are
truncated, making them inaccessible.

3. Instability. Accessing Vista's shared folders makes 95/98/Me hang
or crash.

I'd love to know if anyone has found solutions to those problems.
..
..
<snip>
..
..
8. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts, click "Change your password",
enter your current password in the boxes for "Current password", "New
password", and "Confirm new password", and click "Change password".
Click to expand...

Well I'd like to find out which you meant in step 8 above. WinME or
Vista??
 
8. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts, click "Change your password",
enter your current password in the boxes for "Current password", "New
password", and "Confirm new password", and click "Change password".
Click to expand...


That is to say, this step 8 is not consistent with those in either
machine. Again, which machine did you mean?
 
I recently spoke with some networking people at Microsoft. As I
understand it, Microsoft doesn't support Vista sharing its folders
over a network with computers running Windows 95/98/Me. It isn't part
of Vista's design, they haven't tested it, and there's no guarantee
that it will work.

I've seen these problems when trying to access Vista's shared folders
from 95/98/Me:

1. Incompatible default network authentication protocols. Windows
95/98/Me uses LM and NTLM authentication. Vista uses NTLMv2
authentication. This causes a prompt for the IPC$ password on
95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled on Vista. There
is no valid response to the IPC$ prompt.

2. Incomplete enumeration of shares. 95/98/Me only sees some of
Vista's shared folders, and the names of some shared folders are
truncated, making them inaccessible.

3. Instability. Accessing Vista's shared folders makes 95/98/Me hang
or crash.

I'd love to know if anyone has found solutions to those problems.

Here's how to configure Vista to use LM and NTLM authentication to
allow access from 95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled.
I'd like to thank my fellow MVP Evan Pearce, who helped me understand
and test this:

1. Click the Start button, type "regedit" in the Start Search box, and
press Enter.

2. Click "Continue" in the User Account Control prompt.

3. Open this registry key:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa

4. If they don't already exist, create DWORD values named
LmCompatibilityLevel and NoLmHash.

5. Set LMCompatibilityLevel to 1.

6. Set NoLmHash to 0.

7. Restart the Vista computer.

8. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts, click "Change your password",
enter your current password in the boxes for "Current password", "New
password", and "Confirm new password", and click "Change password".
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Programhttp://mvp.support.microsoft.com
Click to expand...

OK then. Here's the original problem of mine: in WinME, clicking
"Entire Network" in MyNetwork Places always responded with an error
box, telling me this: "Unable to browse network. Windows is unable to
gain access to the network. This may be a number of reasons."

This is fixed by installing DSClient (Active Directory Client
Extension), setting the LMCompatibility in WinME registry to 3, and
recycle logoff and logon in WinME. That enables WinME to see the
shared folders on Vista, but only that. Beyond that, WinME hangs when
clicking on a shared folder.

#1 above is not really an issue; that's resolved.
The issuer is possibly #2 but definitely #3.

The step #8 need not be performed. All you do is logout of WinME,
then log back in.

Because #3 issue remains, the solution to #1 is moot.
 
I recently spoke with some networking people at Microsoft. As I
understand it, Microsoft doesn't support Vista sharing its folders
over a network with computers running Windows 95/98/Me. It isn't part
of Vista's design, they haven't tested it, and there's no guarantee
that it will work.

I've seen these problems when trying to access Vista's shared folders
from 95/98/Me:

1. Incompatible default network authentication protocols. Windows
95/98/Me uses LM and NTLM authentication. Vista uses NTLMv2
authentication. This causes a prompt for the IPC$ password on
95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled on Vista. There
is no valid response to the IPC$ prompt.

2. Incomplete enumeration of shares. 95/98/Me only sees some of
Vista's shared folders, and the names of some shared folders are
truncated, making them inaccessible.

3. Instability. Accessing Vista's shared folders makes 95/98/Me hang
or crash.

I'd love to know if anyone has found solutions to those problems.

Here's how to configure Vista to use LM and NTLM authentication to
allow access from 95/98/Me when password protected sharing is enabled.
I'd like to thank my fellow MVP Evan Pearce, who helped me understand
and test this:

1. Click the Start button, type "regedit" in the Start Search box, and
press Enter.

2. Click "Continue" in the User Account Control prompt.

3. Open this registry key:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Lsa

4. If they don't already exist, create DWORD values named
LmCompatibilityLevel and NoLmHash.

5. Set LMCompatibilityLevel to 1.

6. Set NoLmHash to 0.

7. Restart the Vista computer.

8. Go to Control Panel > User Accounts, click "Change your password",
enter your current password in the boxes for "Current password", "New
password", and "Confirm new password", and click "Change password".
--
Best Wishes,
Steve Winograd, MS-MVP (Windows Networking)

Please post any reply as a follow-up message in the news group
for everyone to see. I'm sorry, but I don't answer questions
addressed directly to me in E-mail or news groups.

Microsoft Most Valuable Professional Programhttp://mvp.support.microsoft.com
Click to expand...

Update: I am now able to see beyond the shared folders on Vista from
WinME, but getting it to display any files after clicking on a shared
folder is extremely slow.
 
Back
Top