USB ports degraded..

  • Thread starter Thread starter Walter M
  • Start date Start date
W

Walter M

Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front of my
PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the other ports,
four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though still working
are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in transferring
data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the Enhanced
Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is there
any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If I do
this, will I need to delete the exisiting drivers and controllers, and so on,
to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and if so, am I
likely to run into difficulties at any time, including reverting, if I can't
access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
 
Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS
 
Walter said:
Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front of my
PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the other ports,
four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though still working
are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in transferring
data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the Enhanced
Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is there
any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If I do
this, will I need to delete the exisiting drivers and controllers, and so on,
to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and if so, am I
likely to run into difficulties at any time, including reverting, if I can't
access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...

Your cheapest alternative right now, is to install a new expansion card.
The driver installed for the card will be handled independently by
Windows. In other words, when a hardware device is added, the best
driver for the device is installed. Windows would look at the
enumeration of the new USB expansion chip, and install a separate enhanced
entry for it.

Based on the response of the new USB expansion card, you'll get a better
idea of whether your theory is correct or not - that there is a problem
with all the USB ports on the Southbridge.

When an ICH5 or ICH5R Southbridge has a latchup failure on its USB
ports, all the Southbridge USB ports fail at the same time. What
happens in that case, is wires inside the chip, connected to
the USB power source, burn out. That is just an example of a failure
where all ports can die at the same time.

The following, gives a simple walkthrough, of how they tell the difference
between USB 1.1 and USB 2.0 at the hardware level.

http://www.lvr.com/usbcenum.htm

A program like the Microsoft UVCView, can be used to get the enumeration
information from a USB device. But that doesn't tell you whether the
physical layer is damaged or has a high error rate on transmission.
It could be, that your ports are simply failing part of the
detection process for USB2 devices, and all the devices end up running
at USB 1.1 instead. While Microsoft used to host this file, it has
been removed, and now we rely on archived copies. (It might also be
part of one of their SDKs.) You'll need other information from the web,
to interpret what appears in the window.

ftp://ftp.efo.ru/pub/ftdichip/Utilities/UVCView.x86.exe
http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/USB_IDs/UVCView.x86.exe

File size is 167,232 bytes.
MD5sum is 93244d84d79314898e62d21cecc4ca5e

This is a picture of what the UVCView info looks like.

http://www.die.de/blog/content/binary/usbview.png

Some information on the parameters seen in UVCView.

http://www.beyondlogic.org/usbnutshell/usb5.htm

Paul
 
No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might make
sense..

JS said:
Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Walter M said:
Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front of
my
PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the other ports,
four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though still
working
are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in transferring
data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced
Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is
there
any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If I do
this, will I need to delete the exisiting drivers and controllers, and so
on,
to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and if so,
am I
likely to run into difficulties at any time, including reverting, if I
can't
access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Thanks for all that. With your reassurance I'll go ahead and install a card..
To be honest, if that gives me proper hi-speed functionality I doubt I'll
have the resolve to investigate the existing ports further, though you give
me a lot to go on!


Paul said:
Walter said:
Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front of my
PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the other ports,
four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though still working
are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in transferring
data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the Enhanced
Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is there
any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If I do
this, will I need to delete the exisiting drivers and controllers, and so on,
to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and if so, am I
likely to run into difficulties at any time, including reverting, if I can't
access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...

Your cheapest alternative right now, is to install a new expansion card.
The driver installed for the card will be handled independently by
Windows. In other words, when a hardware device is added, the best
driver for the device is installed. Windows would look at the
enumeration of the new USB expansion chip, and install a separate enhanced
entry for it.

Based on the response of the new USB expansion card, you'll get a better
idea of whether your theory is correct or not - that there is a problem
with all the USB ports on the Southbridge.

When an ICH5 or ICH5R Southbridge has a latchup failure on its USB
ports, all the Southbridge USB ports fail at the same time. What
happens in that case, is wires inside the chip, connected to
the USB power source, burn out. That is just an example of a failure
where all ports can die at the same time.

The following, gives a simple walkthrough, of how they tell the difference
between USB 1.1 and USB 2.0 at the hardware level.

http://www.lvr.com/usbcenum.htm

A program like the Microsoft UVCView, can be used to get the enumeration
information from a USB device. But that doesn't tell you whether the
physical layer is damaged or has a high error rate on transmission.
It could be, that your ports are simply failing part of the
detection process for USB2 devices, and all the devices end up running
at USB 1.1 instead. While Microsoft used to host this file, it has
been removed, and now we rely on archived copies. (It might also be
part of one of their SDKs.) You'll need other information from the web,
to interpret what appears in the window.

ftp://ftp.efo.ru/pub/ftdichip/Utilities/UVCView.x86.exe
http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/USB_IDs/UVCView.x86.exe

File size is 167,232 bytes.
MD5sum is 93244d84d79314898e62d21cecc4ca5e

This is a picture of what the UVCView info looks like.

http://www.die.de/blog/content/binary/usbview.png

Some information on the parameters seen in UVCView.

http://www.beyondlogic.org/usbnutshell/usb5.htm

Paul
Click to expand...
 
Well if the USB connector is badly damaged it might have created a partial
electrical short.
At the very least it takes the damaged connector out of the picture as a
possible cause.

JS

Walter M said:
No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might make
sense..

JS said:
Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Walter M said:
Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front
of
my
PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the other
ports,
four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though still
working
are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in
transferring
data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced
Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is
there
any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If I
do
this, will I need to delete the exisiting drivers and controllers, and
so
on,
to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and if
so,
am I
likely to run into difficulties at any time, including reverting, if I
can't
access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
JS said:
Well if the USB connector is badly damaged it might have created a partial
electrical short.
Click to expand...

Or more likely, an open.
At the very least it takes the damaged connector out of the picture as a
possible cause.

JS

Walter M said:
No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might
make
sense..

JS said:
Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front
of my PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the
other
ports, four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though
still
working are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in
transferring data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is
there any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether reinstalling
some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If I
do
this, will I need to delete the existing drivers and controllers, and
so
on, to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and
if
so, am I likely to run into difficulties at any time, including
reverting, if I
can't access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
An open? The USB contacts by default are open in reference to themselves,
how could breaking the port make them any more open? More likely some of the
contacts are shorted

--

----
Crosspost, do not multipost http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm
How to ask a question http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375



Bill in Co. said:
JS said:
Well if the USB connector is badly damaged it might have created a
partial
electrical short.
Click to expand...

Or more likely, an open.
At the very least it takes the damaged connector out of the picture as a
possible cause.

JS

Walter M said:
No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might
make
sense..

:

Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the front
of my PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the
other
ports, four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though
still
working are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in
transferring data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is
there any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether
reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If
I do
this, will I need to delete the existing drivers and controllers, and
so
on, to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and
if
so, am I likely to run into difficulties at any time, including
reverting, if I
can't access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
When you plug a device in, the presumption is that the contacts are being
made between the USB device and the USB connector (which is in turn wired to
the MB). If they aren't (for any one of them), that is an open (broken)
circuit, not a shorted one. Of course, it is possible to have a short
circuit condition between two (or more) of them, but I really expect that is
very unlikely.
An open? The USB contacts by default are open in reference to themselves,
how could breaking the port make them any more open? More likely some of
the
contacts are shorted

--

----
Crosspost, do not multipost http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm
How to ask a question http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375



Bill in Co. said:
JS said:
Well if the USB connector is badly damaged it might have created a
partial
electrical short.
Click to expand...

Or more likely, an open.
At the very least it takes the damaged connector out of the picture as a
possible cause.

JS

No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might
make
sense..

:

Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the
front
of my PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the
other
ports, four at the back and the second one on the front panel, though
still
working are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower in
transferring data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or is
there any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether
reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise: If
I do
this, will I need to delete the existing drivers and controllers, and
so
on, to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports; and
if
so, am I likely to run into difficulties at any time, including
reverting, if I
can't access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Ahh, ok, wasn't following your first post. As far as the short, as the OP
stated that he physically damaged the front port, the likely hood of a short
is pretty good, I've seen quite a few, the plastic support piece gets broken
off inside the port, all you have left are the 4 connections, the don't have
to move much to short out.

--

----
Crosspost, do not multipost http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm
How to ask a question http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375
Help Us Help You http://dts-l.net/goodpost.htm



Bill in Co. said:
When you plug a device in, the presumption is that the contacts are being
made between the USB device and the USB connector (which is in turn wired
to the MB). If they aren't (for any one of them), that is an open
(broken) circuit, not a shorted one. Of course, it is possible to have a
short circuit condition between two (or more) of them, but I really expect
that is very unlikely.
An open? The USB contacts by default are open in reference to themselves,
how could breaking the port make them any more open? More likely some of
the
contacts are shorted

--

----
Crosspost, do not multipost http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm
How to ask a question http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375



Bill in Co. said:
JS wrote:
Well if the USB connector is badly damaged it might have created a
partial
electrical short.

Or more likely, an open.

At the very least it takes the damaged connector out of the picture as
a
possible cause.

JS

No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might
make
sense..

:

Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the
front
of my PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the
other
ports, four at the back and the second one on the front panel,
though
still
working are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower
in
transferring data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or
is
there any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether
reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card
to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise:
If
I do
this, will I need to delete the existing drivers and controllers,
and
so
on, to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports;
and
if
so, am I likely to run into difficulties at any time, including
reverting, if I
can't access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
OK. I can see that happening too.
Ahh, ok, wasn't following your first post. As far as the short, as the OP
stated that he physically damaged the front port, the likely hood of a
short
is pretty good, I've seen quite a few, the plastic support piece gets
broken
off inside the port, all you have left are the 4 connections, the don't
have
to move much to short out.

--

----
Crosspost, do not multipost http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm
How to ask a question http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375
Help Us Help You http://dts-l.net/goodpost.htm



Bill in Co. said:
When you plug a device in, the presumption is that the contacts are being
made between the USB device and the USB connector (which is in turn wired
to the MB). If they aren't (for any one of them), that is an open
(broken) circuit, not a shorted one. Of course, it is possible to have
a
short circuit condition between two (or more) of them, but I really
expect
that is very unlikely.
An open? The USB contacts by default are open in reference to
themselves,
how could breaking the port make them any more open? More likely some of
the
contacts are shorted

--

----
Crosspost, do not multipost http://www.blakjak.demon.co.uk/mul_crss.htm
How to ask a question http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375



JS wrote:
Well if the USB connector is badly damaged it might have created a
partial
electrical short.

Or more likely, an open.

At the very least it takes the damaged connector out of the picture as
a
possible cause.

JS

No, I haven't done that - do you imply I should? I can see that might
make
sense..

:

Did you disconnect the cable from the motherboard to
the damaged front panel USB connector?

JS

Some time ago I damaged physically one of the USB 2 ports on the
front
of my PC, and subsequently (probably as a result) find that all the
other
ports, four at the back and the second one on the front panel,
though
still
working are now functioning in a very degraded mode and are slower
in
transferring data by a factor of 10 or 20.

There's no error or warning displayed in Device Manager against the
Enhanced Host Controller, or anywhere else.

Is it likely that I've broken some hardware on the motherboard, or
is
there any diagonstic that I can perform to clarify whether
reinstalling some
firmware or driver might fix this?

At worst, I could presumably install a USB/Firewire expansion card
to
replace the failed ports.. A couple of other questions then arise:
If
I do
this, will I need to delete the existing drivers and controllers,
and
so
on, to avoid conflicts, and hence abandon the existing USB ports;
and
if
so, am I likely to run into difficulties at any time, including
reverting, if I
can't access an XP installation disk?

Many thanks for any thoughts..

[Windows XP Home, SP3]
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Bill in Co. wrote (in news:[email protected]):
When you plug a device in, the presumption is that the contacts are being
made between the USB device and the USB connector (which is in turn wired to
the MB). If they aren't (for any one of them), that is an open (broken)
circuit, not a shorted one. Of course, it is possible to have a short
circuit condition between two (or more) of them, but I really expect that is
very unlikely.
Click to expand...


No, short is correct. The OP isn’t complaining about devices plugged into the
damaged port not working, he’s complaining about problems with the other ports
on that controller.

If there was a broken contact on the port in question, then it would only affect
devices plugged into it; it would have no effect on the other ports. If it has a
short, then the electrical signal travels back through the controller and can
affect the other ports.

As an analogy, imagine an electrical cord plugged into the outlet in the wall.
If the cord is cut so that the wire is not connected, then whatever the cord is
connected to won’t work, but the rest of the building’s power system is
unaffected. If the cord is cut in a way that causes a short, then the current
flows back and blows the fuse/throws the breaker.
 
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