USB harddisk problem

  • Thread starter Thread starter Linea Recta
  • Start date Start date
L

Linea Recta

For some time now I'm using an external harddisk which often disbehaves.
The problem is that after some time it seems to go in some stand by mode.
Then, when I try to access this drive (or another external drive) it often
disconnects (hearing the disconnect sound)
I can hear the sound of the drive starting up slowly, but seemingly often
too late.
I suppose this has to do with some kind of time-out parameter? Can I
increase this setting somewhere?

BTW This problem only occurs when using the drive with the (Windows XP) PC.
Using the drive connected to the (Vista) notebook it never fails.

- Medion USB harddisk with its own power adaptor.




--
regards,

|\ /|
| \/ |@rk
\../
\/os
 
For some time now I'm using an external harddisk which often disbehaves.
The problem is that after some time it seems to go in some stand by mode.
Then, when I try to access this drive (or another external drive) it often
disconnects (hearing the disconnect sound)
I can hear the sound of the drive starting up slowly, but seemingly often
too late.
I suppose this has to do with some kind of time-out parameter? Can I
increase this setting somewhere?

BTW This problem only occurs when using the drive with the (Windows XP) PC.
Using the drive connected to the (Vista) notebook it never fails.

- Medion USB harddisk with its own power adaptor.
Click to expand...

I have the same problem with my two Samsung Story external drives. Mine
does it under all OS and will timeout in about 5 minutes when not being
used and then spin down. In my case, they programmed mine this way. And
there is nothing the end user can do about it.
 
BillW50 said:
I have the same problem with my two Samsung Story external drives. Mine
does it under all OS and will timeout in about 5 minutes when not being
used and then spin down. In my case, they programmed mine this way. And
there is nothing the end user can do about it.
Click to expand...


I suppose that's what they mean with "SMART"... leaving the user with no
control of any sort.
My condolences!



--
regards,

|\ /|
| \/ |@rk
\../
\/os
 
Elmo said:
Here's something you can try:

Open Device Manager, open the properties on each USB hub, click the
Power tab, and deselect "Allow the computer to turn off this device to
save power".
Click to expand...


I got this advice more often, but... switching off powersaving altogether
isn't quite what I had in mind.
Is there no way to permit the drive more time to wake up?



--
regards,

|\ /|
| \/ |@rk
\../
\/os
 
Elmo said:
Here's something you can try:

Open Device Manager, open the properties on each USB hub, click the
Power tab, and deselect "Allow the computer to turn off this device to
save power".
Click to expand...


I just checked all USB hubs and all power saving boxes where already
unchecked.
I suppose the problem is due to in-the-drive integrated stupidity?


--
regards,

|\ /|
| \/ |@rk
\../
\/os
 
Linea said:
For some time now I'm using an external harddisk which often disbehaves.
The problem is that after some time it seems to go in some stand by mode.
Then, when I try to access this drive (or another external drive) it often
disconnects (hearing the disconnect sound)
I can hear the sound of the drive starting up slowly, but seemingly often
too late.
I suppose this has to do with some kind of time-out parameter? Can I
increase this setting somewhere?
Click to expand...

You can. Add the following to the registry (I hope you know how):

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Disk]
"TimeOutValue"=dword:00000020

It makes the timeout value 32 seconds (20 hex). I researched and added
that, because my external HD (WD Elements) was getting timeout errors,
*but it never disconnected* ! I could see that there had been a problem
only when looking at the event log. I would have been really worried if
it was disconnecting the way you write.

See if adding the timeout fixes the disconnect.
 
Patok said:
Linea said:
For some time now I'm using an external harddisk which often disbehaves.
The problem is that after some time it seems to go in some stand by mode.
Then, when I try to access this drive (or another external drive) it
often
disconnects (hearing the disconnect sound)
I can hear the sound of the drive starting up slowly, but seemingly often
too late.
I suppose this has to do with some kind of time-out parameter? Can I
increase this setting somewhere?
Click to expand...

You can. Add the following to the registry (I hope you know how):

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Disk]
"TimeOutValue"=dword:00000020

It makes the timeout value 32 seconds (20 hex). I researched and added
that, because my external HD (WD Elements) was getting timeout errors,
*but it never disconnected* ! I could see that there had been a problem
only when looking at the event log. I would have been really worried if it
was disconnecting the way you write.

See if adding the timeout fixes the disconnect.
Click to expand...


I just added the value to the registry as you wrote and rebooted.
It would be great if this resolves the issue! I'll be back with the results.



--
thanks,

|\ /|
| \/ |@rk
\../
\/os
 
Linea said:
I just checked all USB hubs and all power saving boxes where already
unchecked.
I suppose the problem is due to in-the-drive integrated stupidity?
Click to expand...

The stupidity is inside the box, and I don't think software has
control of it. It was done in this way, to reduce the incidences
of drive high operating temperatures, as a result of designing
3.5" hard drive housings without cooling solutions on them.
You're trying to force 6-12W through a sealed plastic box.
Spindown was seen to be "better", than providing proper cooling.
Now, if you're running a backup that writes at 5MB/sec for
two hours, the drive remains spinning, and the "toasting" of
the drive will continue (because this brain dead feature
can't help in that case). Spindown as a cooling solution, only
helps for "quiet desktops", where you don't use the drive much.

But I can't give you any implementation details. While the hard
drive standard itself has options like that, in cases when this
happens, I can't be sure it is the drive, or the USB chip that
is doing it. In terms of a division of labor, it makes sense
for the drive itself to be doing this (short timeout followed
by spindown). But in cases where the manufacturer wants to
enforce this in all cases, I suppose they could add a feature
to the USB adapter chip, to issue the command as well.

The long spinup time for the drive, might be responsible for
a timeout. Drives are allowed 35 seconds in the BIOS, to
spin up (and 35 seconds may be allocated in the ATA/ATAPI spec),
but in Windows, a delayed write failure (happening because the
OS thinks the drive is running), occurs in about 5 seconds or so.
Whatever that number is, they don't wait 35 seconds before
declaring a problem.

I suppose, as experimenters, we could take a drive we regularly
use in a desktop computer, and pop it into the Seagate or
WD housing, and see if the same bad behavior is still present.
If that was the case, then we'd know it was the USB chip
doing it.

Paul
 
Paul said:
The stupidity is inside the box, and I don't think software has
control of it. It was done in this way, to reduce the incidences
of drive high operating temperatures, as a result of designing
3.5" hard drive housings without cooling solutions on them.
You're trying to force 6-12W through a sealed plastic box.
Click to expand...


Aluminum in my case. I have a Maxtor one touch (no dismounting problems) and
a Medion (I think there is a Seagate inside). Both drives do not become very
warm on the outside when used over long time. Of course this doesn't say
very much about the temperature inside...

Spindown was seen to be "better", than providing proper cooling.
Now, if you're running a backup that writes at 5MB/sec for
two hours, the drive remains spinning, and the "toasting" of
the drive will continue (because this brain dead feature
can't help in that case). Spindown as a cooling solution, only
helps for "quiet desktops", where you don't use the drive much.
Click to expand...


I have to listen very carefully to hear any sound at all from these drives.

But I can't give you any implementation details. While the hard
drive standard itself has options like that, in cases when this
happens, I can't be sure it is the drive, or the USB chip that
is doing it. In terms of a division of labor, it makes sense
for the drive itself to be doing this (short timeout followed
by spindown). But in cases where the manufacturer wants to
enforce this in all cases, I suppose they could add a feature
to the USB adapter chip, to issue the command as well.
Click to expand...


So much for stadardization...

The long spinup time for the drive, might be responsible for
a timeout. Drives are allowed 35 seconds in the BIOS, to
spin up (and 35 seconds may be allocated in the ATA/ATAPI spec),
Click to expand...


I tried the different BIOS settings for (legacy?) USB also.

but in Windows, a delayed write failure (happening because the
OS thinks the drive is running), occurs in about 5 seconds or so.
Whatever that number is, they don't wait 35 seconds before
declaring a problem.

I suppose, as experimenters, we could take a drive we regularly
use in a desktop computer, and pop it into the Seagate or
WD housing, and see if the same bad behavior is still present.
If that was the case, then we'd know it was the USB chip
doing it.
Click to expand...


Hardware as follows:


PC
Windows XP Pro SP3 - mobo: Asus P4B266 - cpu: Intel P4 1,6 GHz. - RAM: 1512
MB. - video: Matrox Marvel G450eTV 32 MB. (AGP) - monitor: 19-inch Medion
Akoya MD 20119 - sound: SB Audigy 1394 (PCI) - hd: 2 X Maxtor 60 GB. -
DVD/CD-ROM: Toshiba DVD-ROM SD-M1712 - DVD+RW/+R: LG GSA-H44N - standalone:
LG RH7500 - modems: ADSL: Alcatel speedtouch 330 (USB) - analog: Dynalink
Lucent Win Modem 56k6 (PCI) - printer: HP DeskJet 720C (parallel) - scanner:
HP ScanJet 2200C (USB) - keyb: PS/2 MS Internet Keyboard - mouse: Logitech
Pilot Wheel Mouse Optical (USB) - webcam: Logitech QuickCam Zoom (USB) -
removables: Maxtor One Touch 120 GB (USB) - Medion 500 GB (USB) - Iomega
ZipDrive 100 (parallel)

Wi-Fi netwerk
Sitecom ADSL2+ Modem/Router 54G Turbo WL-174

notebook
17-inch Medion Akoya MODEL: MIM2300 (MD 96662)
Windows Vista Home Premium SP2
 
Patok said:
Linea said:
For some time now I'm using an external harddisk which often disbehaves.
The problem is that after some time it seems to go in some stand by mode.
Then, when I try to access this drive (or another external drive) it
often
disconnects (hearing the disconnect sound)
I can hear the sound of the drive starting up slowly, but seemingly often
too late.
I suppose this has to do with some kind of time-out parameter? Can I
increase this setting somewhere?
Click to expand...

You can. Add the following to the registry (I hope you know how):

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Disk]
"TimeOutValue"=dword:00000020

It makes the timeout value 32 seconds (20 hex). I researched and added
that, because my external HD (WD Elements) was getting timeout errors,
*but it never disconnected* ! I could see that there had been a problem
only when looking at the event log. I would have been really worried if it
was disconnecting the way you write.

See if adding the timeout fixes the disconnect.

BTW This problem only occurs when using the drive with the (Windows XP)
PC.
Using the drive connected to the (Vista) notebook it never fails.

- Medion USB harddisk with its own power adaptor.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...



Drive is still doing great. Thanks!



--
regards,

|\ /|
| \/ |@rk
\../
\/os
 
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