Top-end graphics card exist or just vapourware?

  • Thread starter Thread starter doug.drodskie
  • Start date Start date
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doug.drodskie

Both ATI (e.g. X800XT PE) and nVidia's (e.g. 6800 Ultra Extreme) top end
cards seem to have been produced in such small quantities that they are
unobtainable at any price. New top cards are being announced but will we
ever be able to buy them? They seem to be targeting the mid/low-range and
the high-end stuff is just show-off talk, about as meaningful as political
speeches.
 
Seems that retailers are getting very little stock. I had Newegg.com
auto notify me by email when the one I wanted became availible.
While I was messing with my email all of asudden i got the
notification. I jumped right on it and placed the order and within 5
min of doing so it went back to auto notify meaning stock was gone.
 
Hawkeye said:
Seems that retailers are getting very little stock.
Click to expand...

I think the real issue with everyoje is the high prices. When you can buy an
ENTIRE PC, with a monitor, printer, dvd burner, and installed software for
the same price as *just* a graphics cards, there's obviously a problem
somewhere.

And when I can buy a PS2, an X-Box, AND a GameCube for less then the price
of just a graphic card, the problem becomes more apparent.
 
Gareee© said:
I think the real issue with everyoje is the high prices. When you can buy
an
ENTIRE PC, with a monitor, printer, dvd burner, and installed software for
the same price as *just* a graphics cards, there's obviously a problem
somewhere.
Click to expand...
I don't think this is a problem.
The manufacturers know they can sell the top cards at premium prices, and a
certain section of society are willing to pay top dollar for them, and will
be happy campers.
I have bought a couple of £300 cards in my time, and I'm glad I did, they
have served me well (it also helps I am a graphics whore).

But now even if you have £300-400 you can't buy the bloody things.
This is presumably because they pushed the technology too much and cannot
get the yield quantity on the silicon, and for what? So they could win the
benchmark wars in the online press. So they create demand for a product they
cannot meet.
And when I can buy a PS2, an X-Box, AND a GameCube for less then the price
of just a graphic card, the problem becomes more apparent.
Click to expand...
This just means you have no excuse not to own all three consoles!! :-)
 
I think the real issue with everyoje is the high prices. When you can buy an
ENTIRE PC, with a monitor, printer, dvd burner, and installed software for
the same price as *just* a graphics cards, there's obviously a problem
somewhere.
Click to expand...

Any user with half a brain that is into gaming isnt looking for the
above described deals because you are speaking of a PC that is good
for nothing but surfing the web and playing checkers at that price.

And when I can buy a PS2, an X-Box, AND a GameCube for less then the price
of just a graphic card, the problem becomes more apparent.
Click to expand...

I stopped buying gaming consoles years ago. PC gaming is where its
at if your serious about it.


I have the ability to pay top dollar for what I desire and dont worry
about what others might be doing or thinking.
 
Both ATI (e.g. X800XT PE) and nVidia's (e.g. 6800 Ultra Extreme) top end
cards seem to have been produced in such small quantities that they are
unobtainable at any price. New top cards are being announced but will we
ever be able to buy them? They seem to be targeting the mid/low-range and
the high-end stuff is just show-off talk, about as meaningful as political
speeches.
Click to expand...

6800UE wasn't really official released -- there was some boards, but
it product was basicly redrawn before it came on the market. The
X800XT PE was delivered to the retail-market in limited quantities.
OEMs got hold on a great part of this production. Now the X800XT PE
basicly have been replaced by the X850-series, at least for PCI-E. As
it seems, the PCI-E-version of the high-end ATI-boards have been
easier to get than the AGP-versions.
 
Hawkeye said:
I stopped buying gaming consoles years ago. PC gaming is where its
at if your serious about it.


I have the ability to pay top dollar for what I desire and dont worry
about what others might be doing or thinking.
Click to expand...
Not to change the subject or anything... but let me ask you this... I
currently have a A8V and a Athlon 64 3500 with an older 9500Pro. Should I
go for the FX55 or a X800XT PE? Are you happy with the 55's performance?
 
Matt said:
Not to change the subject or anything... but let me ask you this... I
currently have a A8V and a Athlon 64 3500 with an older 9500Pro. Should I
go for the FX55 or a X800XT PE? Are you happy with the
55's performance?
Click to expand...

Do you want to crunch numbers or play games?

If you play games, you should upgrade the Graphics card.

I would say that your card is the bare minimum now (probably not even enough
for some games), whereas your CPU will last at least a year.

Ben
 
Ben Pope said:
Do you want to crunch numbers or play games?

If you play games, you should upgrade the Graphics card.

I would say that your card is the bare minimum now (probably not even
enough for some games), whereas your CPU will last at least a year.
Click to expand...

Well I'm playing FarCry at max settings with no problems... and I also use
the computer for a lot of Photoshop and Video work. I'm personally thinking
that other than a select few games that the card my hold me until the end of
the year but I could benefit from the processor upgrade... but I'll probably
win either way
 
Not to change the subject or anything... but let me ask you this... I
currently have a A8V and a Athlon 64 3500 with an older 9500Pro. Should I
go for the FX55 or a X800XT PE? Are you happy with the 55's performance?
Click to expand...


I ran a 3500 in the system for a month or so and it did great. Here
are some benchmarks I ran with the 3500 and then after i swappped it
out for the 55. I was happy with the 3500 and 800XT combo but it was
going into another system once I got the 55. But of course I love the
55.

All stock runs


3500

Aquamark 66,239

3dmark2001 1024x768 23474
800x600 24465

pcmark04 4339

3dmark05 1024x768 5727
800x600 6556

******************************

FX-55

Aquamark 73,661

3dmark2001 1024x768 27777
800x600 29119

pcmark04 5015

3dmark05 1024x768 5799
800x600 6683
 
Hawkeye said:
Go for the video upgrade unless you too have deep pockets and can do
both
Click to expand...
unfortunately it's one or the other... I like the bench marks (thanks for
posting them), but I guess the 9500Pro is going to bottleneck me more than
the processor.
 
If you ask me the whole pc gaming thing is pretty overpriced, but then as a
17 year old student i'm going to say that aren't i.
But on the other hand after looking at the market carefully, us "poor" guys
are the ones getting screwed not those spending 300 quid on single
components, cause when you put together a pc for close to 2 plus grand, you
don't really need to spend it again for a good 3,4 years which is a very
long time in the pc world. meanwhile us cheapo's buy a new pc for 500 quid
and then HL2 comes out and we shell out cash for another pc that just meets
the min requirements. Its on going cycle.

Personally after working on building a pc that can HL2 fairly comfortably
for 200 quid, i plan on building all my pcs from now on, next time i'm gonna
try and get a terabyte of HDD space, lol.
 
Both ATI (e.g. X800XT PE) and nVidia's (e.g. 6800 Ultra Extreme) top end
cards seem to have been produced in such small quantities that they are
unobtainable at any price. New top cards are being announced but will we
ever be able to buy them? They seem to be targeting the mid/low-range and
the high-end stuff is just show-off talk, about as meaningful as political
speeches.
Click to expand...


I had to laugh when I read a recent (maybe the current) issue of Maximum PC
magazine. Somewhere in the first 20 pages was a picture of the back of a
milk carton with the word MISSING on it with a picture of the X800XT PE and
a description of it underneath, and last seen details, etc.! Although the
picture pretty much sums things up, it was a good spot of humor on their
part!
 
Go on Pricewatch.Com; you'll find the XT-PE in stock for much higher than
MSRP. The Ultra Extreme is no longer an official retail product.

These high-end cards are like Corvettes and Vipers. They are produced in
very limited quantities (just for reviewers, it seems...) to boost the
brand's image. The scrap rate at the chip foundry is ~ 20%, an insanely high
percentage in other industries.

There was a time when the product cycle is only six months. Now it takes
more than eight months for announced products to even approach being
available.
 
Indeed, and bleeding-edge computer hardware is still quite economical
compared to, say, upgrading sports cars.

There are more expensive hobbies out there.
 
Look at the bright side young one. At least you werent with us in oh
what was it 1975 or so walking a couple miles in the cold or heat to
the arcade to play Pong or Astroids if your familiar with those.
 
First of One said:
Go on Pricewatch.Com; you'll find the XT-PE in stock for much higher than
MSRP. The Ultra Extreme is no longer an official retail product.

These high-end cards are like Corvettes and Vipers. They are produced in
very limited quantities (just for reviewers, it seems...) to boost the
brand's image. The scrap rate at the chip foundry is ~ 20%, an insanely high
percentage in other industries.

There was a time when the product cycle is only six months. Now it takes
more than eight months for announced products to even approach being
available.
Click to expand...
My daughter took up a post with Disney Cruise Lines 6 months ago and she
went over there with strict instructions to buy and send back an X800XT PE
(huge currency SAVING of around $650). Despite her efforts to solicit help
from places like Circuit City and my direct requests to ATI to assist her
(which were refused), she returns next week empty handed. Telling her to
look out for a 6800 Ultra as a second choice didn't help either, no stocks
anywhere.

A few weeks ago I called off the quest when ATI told me "there are no plans
for an X850XT PE in AGP in the foreseeable future" and a little research
revealed just how fast the industry is killing off AGP e.g. the mobo
manufacturers. Bringing my system up to the X800XT PE's full capability
would soon be impossible.

Settled for 120% saving on a nice digital camera instead. :)

Just an afterthought: If, in the ATI/nVidia race, one of them could say
"yes, our top end card is a few FPS slower than the opposition's, but gamers
and enthusiasts can get one anytime, in any store, anywhere .............. I
would declare them the winner and support them.
 
Veritech said:
If you ask me the whole pc gaming thing is pretty overpriced, but
then as a 17 year old student i'm going to say that aren't i.
But on the other hand after looking at the market carefully, us
"poor" guys are the ones getting screwed not those spending 300 quid
on single components, cause when you put together a pc for close to 2
plus grand, you don't really need to spend it again for a good 3,4
years which is a very long time in the pc world. meanwhile us
cheapo's buy a new pc for 500 quid and then HL2 comes out and we
shell out cash for another pc that just meets the min requirements.
Its on going cycle.
Personally after working on building a pc that can HL2 fairly
comfortably for 200 quid, i plan on building all my pcs from now on,
next time i'm gonna try and get a terabyte of HDD space, lol.
Click to expand...

Hehehe... I just finished that period of my life, haha... Well, the only
time I ever bought a complete PC (except for later hobby projects, and a few
laptops) was my first baby; a 486 DX-33. That baby is now a P4 3.2 GHz with
an OC'd modded 9500 NP 128 MB.

Upgrading, then selling off older components was the key for me. I bought my
voodoo 1 card for 100 guilders, sold it for 75. I then got a Banshee for
150, sold it for 75. In went a TNT2 for 150, sold for 100. Etcetera
etcetera. I always bought second hand, dirt cheap parts, then I modded,
overclocked them until I had a cheap but 'comfortable' gaming system. You
dont need to have the top of the line to be able to play the latest games...
My 9500 np is still blazing along after 2 years :-)

Thomas.
 
Gareee© said:
I think the real issue with everyoje is the high prices. When you can buy
an ENTIRE PC, with a monitor, printer, dvd burner, and installed software
for the same price as *just* a graphics cards, there's obviously a problem
somewhere.

And when I can buy a PS2, an X-Box, AND a GameCube for less then the price
of just a graphic card, the problem becomes more apparent.
Click to expand...

Not really comparable, PS2 and X-boxes are subsidised, that is they are
basically sold at cost or even below cost based on the expectation people
will buy more games (remember PS2s were 3 times the cost when there was no
X-Box around?). If you are going to compare, you should at least consider
that the lower resolution of the graphics are equivalent to a mid to low end
PC card.

Top end cards are basically like buying high performance engine compared to
a bog standard engine for your car. Fewer are made, and cost more to make.
Fewer sales would be made which means the price is higher to cover
production costs.
 
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