The life of a hard drive?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ablang
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A

Ablang

How long are hard drives supposed to last anyway (in your
experience)? I know some probably have an MTBF of about 30 years, but I
had a WD 6.x GB HD that just became as good as dead a few weeks ago (too
many bad sectors; scandisk ran forever).

So tell me about the bad ones in your life?
 
Ablang said:
How long are hard drives supposed to last anyway (in your
experience)? I know some probably have an MTBF of about 30 years, but I
had a WD 6.x GB HD that just became as good as dead a few weeks ago (too
many bad sectors; scandisk ran forever).

So tell me about the bad ones in your life?
Click to expand...


As for many products the failure rate is 'bath' shaped, high at the start
(like yours
then very low for a long time untill ageing starts to take effect.
If it lasts a year it is lilkely last a lifetime these days, a lifetime
being so long that
effectively it would be obsolete by the time it failed, an example would be
a
20 megabyte (not giga) drive, many of which may still work today but no one
would every use one today.
 
As for many products the failure rate is 'bath' shaped, high at the start
(like yours
then very low for a long time untill ageing starts to take effect.
If it lasts a year it is lilkely last a lifetime these days, a lifetime
being so long that
effectively it would be obsolete by the time it failed, an example would be
a
20 megabyte (not giga) drive, many of which may still work today but no one
would every use one today.
Click to expand...

The formal definition of the the MTBF rating is the # of hours over
which 50% of the drives would fail, BUT, only applies within the
stated lifetime of the product. So, given a 30 year MTBF and a 5year
life specification one twelveth of the drives will fail. I think I've
got that right. After 5 years all bets are off.

You can pull the spec sheet for any drive model from the manufatcurers
web site. Look for lifetime, MTBF, and recommended max operating
temperature. Keep yoiu rdrive cool.
 
Ablang said:
How long are hard drives supposed to last anyway (in your
experience)? I know some probably have an MTBF of about 30 years, but I
had a WD 6.x GB HD that just became as good as dead a few weeks ago (too
many bad sectors; scandisk ran forever).

So tell me about the bad ones in your life?
Click to expand...

The last 6 dead drives I replaced just happen to all be WD. Two this
week. Coincidence?

They don't seem to go more than 3-4 years, at best.
 
As for many products the failure rate is 'bath' shaped, high at the start
(like yours
then very low for a long time untill ageing starts to take effect.
If it lasts a year it is lilkely last a lifetime these days, a lifetime
being so long that
effectively it would be obsolete by the time it failed, an example would be
a
20 megabyte (not giga) drive, many of which may still work today but no one
would every use one today.
Click to expand...

I don't know about that "lasts a year it'll last a lifetime" part... to
me it seems more accurate that if it lasts 3 months it'll likely last 5
years but after that all bets are off, it becomes too much of a liability
to continue using it, and even shorter replacement interval is warranted
with more valuable data, not even considering the performance or capacity
benefits.
 
kony said:
I don't know about that "lasts a year it'll last a lifetime" part...
to me it seems more accurate that if it lasts 3 months it'll likely
last 5 years but after that all bets are off, it becomes too much of
a liability to continue using it, and even shorter replacement
interval is warranted with more valuable data, not even considering
the performance or capacity benefits.
Click to expand...

After many years in IT support I'd have to say the main reasons for drives
ending their life are in order:

Becoming Obsolete
Physical Abuse
Component Failure

With the order reversed during the first few months.

Alan
 
Ablang said:
How long are hard drives supposed to last anyway (in your
experience)? I know some probably have an MTBF of about 30 years, but I
had a WD 6.x GB HD that just became as good as dead a few weeks ago (too
many bad sectors; scandisk ran forever).

So tell me about the bad ones in your life?
Click to expand...
IDE drives are NOT intended to run over 50% service (on for 12 hours,
OFF for 12 hours!)

My best drives are SCSI, and the 10,000rpm Cheetah by Seagate last 7
years in 100% service, on servers! (my records). Zero failurs in 7 years.

Western Digital, Maxtor, Fujitsu, Hitachi, Seagate, and IBM IDE drives
seem to do OK on my 100% systems, but, I see from my records, that they
get to be RMA under warranty about 30%. So, about one out of three IDE
drives fails every two years!

The failed drives start doing a slow click, click click...
That lets me know that it is time to backup, R&R...
I run SCSI on these systems, also, so I jsut move the stuff over to a
SCSI drive!
 
Alan Walker said:
After many years in IT support I'd have to say the main reasons for drives
ending their life are in order:

Becoming Obsolete
Physical Abuse
Component Failure

With the order reversed during the first few months.
Click to expand...

After many years of using disks, all the way back to the old Bryant 2A with
3.5 FOOT platters (honest!), I believe that today, with the modern
technology, dropping a disk is the biggest cause of failure followed by
bearing wear. I have never had a disk fail that I could prove was due to
positioner problems or to the electronics failing. Cables can be a problem.
Power supplies don't seem to be a cause either.
 
IDE drives are NOT intended to run over 50% service (on for 12 hours,
OFF for 12 hours!)
Click to expand...

Sources please? I've never heard this.
Western Digital, Maxtor, Fujitsu, Hitachi, Seagate, and IBM IDE drives
seem to do OK on my 100% systems, but, I see from my records, that they
get to be RMA under warranty about 30%. So, about one out of three IDE
drives fails every two years!
Click to expand...

I've got a lab full of IDE systems running 24/7 and haven't had to
replace a drive in well over 3 years. Your 30% failure rate is
ridiculously high.

MT
 
Patrick said:
IDE drives are NOT intended to run over 50% service (on for 12 hours,
OFF for 12 hours!)
Click to expand...

Really thats pretty much how my computer has been run over the last
5 years, on daytime, off at night, just like 99% of home computers.
Perhaps you had better inform the main PC manufacturers that
they have been using the wrong type of drives in their PC's for
the past decade or so.
It will be quite a shock to them!!
 
I have only had two systems. Added an extra HDD to both. I never (actually only once or
twice) defragmented the first pc. The same sectors were always hit. It was almost like a
familiar melody that I would hear while using the under memory-ed pc. Anyway, the primary
HDD started to go south. Luckily just I bought the second pc. So dumped everything into
the new pc HDD by slaving the primary from the first pc. I didn't even disconnect the HDD
from power supply. I just pulled it out of the case to have enough room so the ribbon
cable could reach. Yes certain sectors weren't available. Luckily that wasn't data but the
OS. HDD's seem to be pretty reliable as long as you have enough memory on your system so
they aren't being constantly called on to spin up and work. That should be pretty much
reserved for bootup, opening an app or downing loading something huge. Other than that let
it sleep and live. Sorta like Rip Van Winkle.
 
ToolPackinMama said:
The last 6 dead drives I replaced just happen to all be WD. Two this
week. Coincidence?

They don't seem to go more than 3-4 years, at best.
Click to expand...


I've had 4 WD's. One died because I didn't defragment it and it kept on hitting the same
sectors. Almost like dropping a needle on a phonograph record in the same pace over and
over again. My current WD's have been in this old dog since 1997 PII MMX. I attribute
their longevity to having max memory. Add a decent firewall to that. With that the HDD's
haven't had to do much work other than at startup and at cleanup on shutdown for the last
few years.

I'm looking to build a new system and have no problem using a WD. If anything did happen I
would just do what I did last time. I'll just slave another HDD onto the system and dump
what I can onto the fresh one. Personally I don't see it happening. If used properly,
HDD's including WD are bullet proof.
 
After many years of using disks, all the way back to the old Bryant 2A with
3.5 FOOT platters (honest!), I believe that today, with the modern
technology, dropping a disk is the biggest cause of failure followed by
bearing wear. I have never had a disk fail that I could prove was due to
positioner problems or to the electronics failing. Cables can be a problem.
Power supplies don't seem to be a cause either.
Click to expand...

o_O

*Hatter ponders for a moment.*

Are you guys talking about how long it'll last mechanically or integrity wise? Cause uh...it's like
I've never had a HD fail on me (except that one time I stuck my head too close to try and hear if it
was initializing and ZAP...heh, static) however I have had old drives wind up with MASSIVE
corruption that only gets worse and worse and worse the more you try and use it. *shrugs*

And I'm guessing that none of you guys has ever run a server, cause they go through HDs like most
people go through Big Macs at McDonalds. The more you use a HD, not in the sheer number of hours,
but I mean the more you USE it (ie shits being accessed and written to it 24/7)...yeah, it's gonna
crap out in about a year or two at best.
 
Are you guys talking about how long it'll last mechanically or integrity wise? Cause uh...it's like
I've never had a HD fail on me (except that one time I stuck my head too close to try and hear if it
was initializing and ZAP...heh, static) however I have had old drives wind up with MASSIVE
corruption that only gets worse and worse and worse the more you try and use it. *shrugs*
Click to expand...

Barring a head crash or platter defect that may easily be a mechanical
failure, or rather the progressive wear (essentially still a mechanical
failure-in-progress).

And I'm guessing that none of you guys has ever run a server, cause they go through HDs like most
people go through Big Macs at McDonalds. The more you use a HD, not in the sheer number of hours,
but I mean the more you USE it (ie shits being accessed and written to it 24/7)...yeah, it's gonna
crap out in about a year or two at best.
Click to expand...

I've never heard of anyplace that has a rotation interval (routine
non-failed drive replacment) of less than 1 year, usually closer to 2, but
then I don't go around asking...
 
IDE drives are NOT intended to run over 50% service (on for 12 hours,
OFF for 12 hours!)
Click to expand...

????? I've never heard of a duty duty for retail hard drives.
Can you refer us to something to support this ?
 
Al said:
????? I've never heard of a duty duty for retail hard drives.
Can you refer us to something to support this ?
Click to expand...

Maybe he means they are not made to be head seeking more than half the time?

Really I don't believe they typically wear out just from spinning.
 
Barring a head crash or platter defect that may easily be a mechanical
failure, or rather the progressive wear (essentially still a mechanical
failure-in-progress).



I've never heard of anyplace that has a rotation interval (routine
non-failed drive replacment) of less than 1 year, usually closer to 2, but
then I don't go around asking...
Click to expand...

Well, I think the idea is to replace them after about a year BEFORE you start to have any sorts of
problems...plus that way you can resell the "good" drives instead of just being left with shit after
2 to 3 years. ^_^
 
Ablang said:
How long are hard drives supposed to last anyway (in your
experience)? I know some probably have an MTBF of about 30 years, but I
had a WD 6.x GB HD that just became as good as dead a few weeks ago (too
many bad sectors; scandisk ran forever).

So tell me about the bad ones in your life?
Click to expand...

FWIW: Before you write off your hard drive try a low level format.
 
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