test of thermal pad on AMD

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Stacey

Lots of talk here recently about thermal pads and what is better etc. I've
seen big drops in temp's ditching the thermal pads and just using plain 'ol
white HS compound instead. Others claim you'll only see a minor change
so...

I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by brother. It
was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as supplied and when
I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in the bios. Seemed kinda
high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.

After I got it all set up, the system was pretty noisy from the fans so
wanted to try to quiet it down some. Removed the fan grills, added some
10ohm 1W resistors to the case fan and PSU fan etc. Rechecked and the CPU
temp was the same but now the CPU fan was the loudest one.

So I took the factory HS off and removed the pad. It wasn't like intel's
pad, more like a gooey piece of cheeze? Anyway removed the pad and sanded
the bottom of the HS smooth, it was pretty rough and I know HS compound
likes a smooth surface. The pad was so thick this didn't matter. After I
reinstalled the HS with plain white compound, the idle temp was 11C less,
down at 39C in the bios and 29C in MBM5. Now I could add a resistor to the
CPU fan, drop the RPM 1000 RPM and still is cooler (43C) than it was with
the pad and MUCH quieter!

So anyone installing a retail AMD chip, my advice is to ditch the pad, sand
the bottom of the HS on a piece of glass and throw on some white HS
compound and stay cool/quiet.
 
Stacey said:
I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by brother. It
was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as supplied and when
I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in the bios. Seemed kinda
high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.
Click to expand...

I've got the same but with ECS N2U400-A board. Room temp was 18C,
BIOS said cpu was about 48C, no case fans, side off the case. I
turned a big room fan against the open side of the case and it
dropped to the lower 40's. Those are about the same as my AMD 2000
with a Vantec TMD Aeroflow and the white goop.
So I took the factory HS off and removed the pad. It wasn't like intel's
pad, more like a gooey piece of cheeze?
Click to expand...

Instructions said mine was a phase change material, water clear,
looked less than 1mm thick of rubber cement. Trying to get that
clip on the heat sink latched down was impressive, Even with a
screwdriver to apply pressure I couldn't get it to latch. Then
someone banged on the door and I had to move the case. The heat
sink fell off in the process. When I saw this the second time the
material had changed to a dark grey looking material with a big
impression in it where I had been applying all the pressure. I
wasn't sure whether it was one-time-only or not but I went ahead
and got up on the table with the screwdriver and REALLY applied the
pressure, along with prying the edge of the clip to let it slip
into place. Finally it popped on there.
So anyone installing a retail AMD chip, my advice is to ditch the pad,
sand the bottom of the HS on a piece of glass and throw on some white
HS compound and stay cool/quiet.
Click to expand...

I didn't notice the bottom of the sink being rough. Maybe I just
didn't look closely enough. What did you use for polishing compound?

But I think I'm leaning in the direction of a big house fan that
will be ducted to drive air through the cases.

While I was doing all this, and listening to the old house fan
roaring away, the house down the street caught fire. That reminded
me of an old fan a friend and I had mounted in a window decades ago
to pump the hot august air out of the house. The fan made a lot
of noise and fortunately we happened to be in the kitchen looking
at it when it went up in flames.

Does anyone know of a relatively cheap smoke detector like device
BUT it will switch off maybe 1000 watts of power when it thinks
that something has caught fire? I'm surprised that there isn't
something like that out there that I've seen. I'm really not wanting
to come home some evening and discover that a fan failed, burned,
and took the whole place with it.
 
MBM5 states the wrong cpu temperture. I had been running my cpu overclocked
to 2.24 at 51 C under load...But in bois it read 67 .

After some searching of the net, Found that infact MBM5 was wrong.
To get correct temp for cpu.

right click MBM in the systray. click settings, General tab> click on
advanced up the top. Un-check the box next to "Detect SMbus....." Click
apply then close.
right click again and click exit. then start MBM from the start menu. Now,
when you click underneath the sensor you have for your CPU temp LM90 Remote
should be available. Click apply and all should be sweet.
 
Lots of talk here recently about thermal pads and what is better etc. I've
seen big drops in temp's ditching the thermal pads and just using plain 'ol
white HS compound instead. Others claim you'll only see a minor change
so...

I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by brother. It
was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as supplied and when
I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in the bios. Seemed kinda
high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.
Click to expand...

Ive never seen it drop that much . Maybe its the area Im in.
On all the AMD processors Ive ever used and all the boards - it tends
to range around 108 - 125 F .

The 1 gig was in the low range and the old 1,4 gig was the hottest
around 125 F and bit higher sometimes.

My barton stays around 114-118.

Doesnt seem to matter a whole lot with me but then I live in a warm
cliimate, I done the scraping and polishing over and over and over
again on several fans using arctic silver and didnt see a huge drop so
I didnt bother. Not that my experience would always hold but Ive done
it several times even on the same CPU convinced I was doing something
wrong and it just wouldnt go lower. Its possible the Barton could
since I havent bothered to scrape it after the experiences on my 1700
and a friends 1600 and the 1.4 and 1 gig athlons I still have around.
I do notice a big drop on some CPUs when I put a big table fan
directed at the open side of the case.


The last time I saw it go down to the 80-90s was a Celeron board I
had.
 
Stacey said:
Anyway removed the pad and sanded
the bottom of the HS smooth, it was pretty rough and I know HS compound
likes a smooth surface.
Click to expand...

What grit sandpaper did you use?
 
Doesnt seem to matter a whole lot with me but then I live in a warm
cliimate, I done the scraping and polishing over and over and over
again on several fans using arctic silver and didnt see a huge drop so
I didnt bother.
Click to expand...

I wasn't using "artic silver", maybe that's the difference? Just posting the
results of what I did...
 
sooky said:
What grit sandpaper did you use?
Click to expand...

Started with 120, then 220 then 400. Put the sandpaper on some fairly thick
glass to make sure it was flat. It doesn't have to be polished, just
smooth.
 
HSV said:
MBM5 states the wrong cpu temperture. I had been running my cpu
overclocked to 2.24 at 51 C under load...But in bois it read 67 .

After some searching of the net, Found that infact MBM5 was wrong.
To get correct temp for cpu.

right click MBM in the systray. click settings, General tab> click on
advanced up the top. Un-check the box next to "Detect SMbus....." Click
apply then close.
right click again and click exit. then start MBM from the start menu. Now,
when you click underneath the sensor you have for your CPU temp LM90
Remote should be available. Click apply and all should be sweet.
Click to expand...


Where exactly is this "LM90 remote" setting? I looked around but couldn't
find that one. TIA
 
Lots of talk here recently about thermal pads and what is better etc. I've
seen big drops in temp's ditching the thermal pads and just using plain 'ol
white HS compound instead. Others claim you'll only see a minor change
so...

I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by brother. It
was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as supplied and when
I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in the bios. Seemed kinda
high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.

After I got it all set up, the system was pretty noisy from the fans so
wanted to try to quiet it down some. Removed the fan grills, added some
10ohm 1W resistors to the case fan and PSU fan etc. Rechecked and the CPU
temp was the same but now the CPU fan was the loudest one.

So I took the factory HS off and removed the pad. It wasn't like intel's
pad, more like a gooey piece of cheeze? Anyway removed the pad and sanded
the bottom of the HS smooth, it was pretty rough and I know HS compound
likes a smooth surface. The pad was so thick this didn't matter. After I
reinstalled the HS with plain white compound, the idle temp was 11C less,
down at 39C in the bios and 29C in MBM5. Now I could add a resistor to the
CPU fan, drop the RPM 1000 RPM and still is cooler (43C) than it was with
the pad and MUCH quieter!

So anyone installing a retail AMD chip, my advice is to ditch the pad, sand
the bottom of the HS on a piece of glass and throw on some white HS
compound and stay cool/quiet.
Click to expand...

You're right, the original TIM is horrible, but also consider that the
original TIM may take several days to reach max efficiency, and heatsink
surface may vary... none are what I'd call "great" but some a lot rougher
than others. Everyone should get good results following your method but
some may see less drop in temp than you did.
 
(e-mail address removed) wrote:



I wasn't using "artic silver", maybe that's the difference? Just posting the
results of what I did...
Click to expand...

And one other thing, you voided the warranty on the CPU by putting
the white thermal paste compound on it. AMD changed their policy,
that anybody who puts the white thermal paste compound on any of the
new AMD CPU's will void their warranty. From the day you put that
stuff on the CPU you picked up, the warranty is VOID. Try getting help
from AMD, they will just tell you to get stuffed and they won't help
people who used thermal paste on AMD CPU's. They only support the
thermal pad.
 
And one other thing, you voided the warranty on the CPU by putting
the white thermal paste compound on it. AMD changed their policy,
that anybody who puts the white thermal paste compound on any of the
new AMD CPU's will void their warranty. From the day you put that
stuff on the CPU you picked up, the warranty is VOID. Try getting help
from AMD, they will just tell you to get stuffed and they won't help
people who used thermal paste on AMD CPU's. They only support the
thermal pad.
Click to expand...

So what? CPUs don't generally "just die". When they do fail the odds are
overwhelming it was from an external cause that also isn't covered by the
warranty. Even so, it might be prudent to test the chip when it first
arrives in stock cnfiguration, with original TIM, so if it did happen to
be DOA you'd have the unmolested heatsink w/TIM, needing to return it with
the CPU.
 
Lots of talk here recently about thermal pads and what is better etc. I've
seen big drops in temp's ditching the thermal pads and just using plain 'ol
white HS compound instead. Others claim you'll only see a minor change
so...

I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by brother. It
was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as supplied and when
I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in the bios. Seemed kinda
high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.

After I got it all set up, the system was pretty noisy from the fans so
wanted to try to quiet it down some. Removed the fan grills, added some
10ohm 1W resistors to the case fan and PSU fan etc. Rechecked and the CPU
temp was the same but now the CPU fan was the loudest one.

So I took the factory HS off and removed the pad. It wasn't like intel's
pad, more like a gooey piece of cheeze? Anyway removed the pad and sanded
the bottom of the HS smooth, it was pretty rough and I know HS compound
likes a smooth surface. The pad was so thick this didn't matter. After I
reinstalled the HS with plain white compound, the idle temp was 11C less,
down at 39C in the bios and 29C in MBM5. Now I could add a resistor to the
CPU fan, drop the RPM 1000 RPM and still is cooler (43C) than it was with
the pad and MUCH quieter!

So anyone installing a retail AMD chip, my advice is to ditch the pad, sand
the bottom of the HS on a piece of glass and throw on some white HS
compound and stay cool/quiet.
Click to expand...

But that isn't what you DID!! You installed the pad, then took it
off, then used the paste.

Should they do it THAT way?...or not?

BTW...did you look at any of the surfaces with a microscope?


Have a nice week...

Trent©

Follow Joan Rivers' example --- get pre-embalmed!
 
Stacey said:
Lots of talk here recently about thermal pads and what is better etc.
I've seen big drops in temp's ditching the thermal pads and just
using plain 'ol white HS compound instead. Others claim you'll only
see a minor change so...

I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by
brother. It was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as
supplied and when I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in
the bios. Seemed kinda high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.

After I got it all set up, the system was pretty noisy from the fans
so wanted to try to quiet it down some. Removed the fan grills, added
some 10ohm 1W resistors to the case fan and PSU fan etc. Rechecked
and the CPU temp was the same but now the CPU fan was the loudest one.

So I took the factory HS off and removed the pad. It wasn't like
intel's pad, more like a gooey piece of cheeze? Anyway removed the
pad and sanded the bottom of the HS smooth, it was pretty rough and I
know HS compound likes a smooth surface. The pad was so thick this
didn't matter. After I reinstalled the HS with plain white compound,
the idle temp was 11C less, down at 39C in the bios and 29C in MBM5.
Now I could add a resistor to the CPU fan, drop the RPM 1000 RPM and
still is cooler (43C) than it was with the pad and MUCH quieter!

So anyone installing a retail AMD chip, my advice is to ditch the
pad, sand the bottom of the HS on a piece of glass and throw on some
white HS compound and stay cool/quiet.
Click to expand...

Not a fair test. The pad needs a few days of hard work to heat up and
squeeze out the excess material. If you'd run SETI for a week with the pad,
checked temps, then tried goo it would have been valuable data, as it is,
it's junk science.
 
~misfit~ said:
Stacey wrote:
Click to expand...
Not a fair test. The pad needs a few days of hard work to heat up and
squeeze out the excess material. If you'd run SETI for a week with the
pad, checked temps, then tried goo it would have been valuable data, as it
is, it's junk science.
--
Click to expand...


It ran 24/7 for 2 days, how long does it need to run to -start- working
right?

BTW have you ever looked at the surface on the bottom of the newer HS's they
give you in the retail box? Looks like it was surfaced with a 40 grit
grinder.
 
I did something similar with my Intel 2.4B processor. Before I lapped the
stock HS, I checked it with a straight-edge, and there was a considerable
concavity (is that a word) in the center of the HS. After lapping the HS,
and replacing the TIM with Arctic Silver 3, the temps dropped by about 10
degrees. This was on a unit that had been running for several weeks prior
to my hacking around on it.

Clint
 
(e-mail address removed) wrote:



I wasn't using "artic silver", maybe that's the difference? Just posting the
results of what I did...
Click to expand...

No Im not doubting your experiance a lot of people claim using paste
is way way better and the advice usually given is to take the pad off.

Id like to hear about anyone else who got it down to less than 100F
who doesnt live in the North Pole that is. I mean with an ambient temp
around 80 F or so.

If a lot of people are getting a Barton down to that level Ill try
doing the scraping and sanding bit again.

Oh yeah this is with a variety of fans and heatsinks too - the retail
AMD unit, Thermaltake 6 and the Thermaltake with the 80mm fan and
humongoid heatsink, thermaltake 6 heatsink with a Delta 6000 rpm +
screamer fan.
 
Stacey said:
Lots of talk here recently about thermal pads and what is better etc. I've
seen big drops in temp's ditching the thermal pads and just using plain 'ol
white HS compound instead. Others claim you'll only see a minor change
so...

I just bought a Barton 2500+ on a chaintech 7NIF2 board for by brother. It
was a retail chip with a factory HSF. I just put it on as supplied and when
I booted it up, the idle temp was right at 50C in the bios. Seemed kinda
high but MBM5 said 40C so figured it was OK.

After I got it all set up, the system was pretty noisy from the fans so
wanted to try to quiet it down some. Removed the fan grills, added some
10ohm 1W resistors to the case fan and PSU fan etc. Rechecked and the CPU
temp was the same but now the CPU fan was the loudest one.

So I took the factory HS off and removed the pad. It wasn't like intel's
pad, more like a gooey piece of cheeze? Anyway removed the pad and sanded
the bottom of the HS smooth, it was pretty rough and I know HS compound
likes a smooth surface. The pad was so thick this didn't matter. After I
reinstalled the HS with plain white compound, the idle temp was 11C less,
down at 39C in the bios and 29C in MBM5. Now I could add a resistor to the
CPU fan, drop the RPM 1000 RPM and still is cooler (43C) than it was with
the pad and MUCH quieter!

So anyone installing a retail AMD chip, my advice is to ditch the pad, sand
the bottom of the HS on a piece of glass and throw on some white HS
compound and stay cool/quiet.
Click to expand...

I replaced a customers XP 1800+ with a 2200+ the other day and the cpu
temp at idle went from 60C to 45C

--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134
 
No Im not doubting your experiance a lot of people claim using paste
is way way better and the advice usually given is to take the pad off.

Id like to hear about anyone else who got it down to less than 100F
who doesnt live in the North Pole that is. I mean with an ambient temp
around 80 F or so.
Click to expand...

80F ambient sounds a bit on the high side for average room temp.
If a lot of people are getting a Barton down to that level Ill try
doing the scraping and sanding bit again.

Oh yeah this is with a variety of fans and heatsinks too - the retail
AMD unit, Thermaltake 6 and the Thermaltake with the 80mm fan and
humongoid heatsink, thermaltake 6 heatsink with a Delta 6000 rpm +
screamer fan.
Click to expand...

Well the variety you've mentioned aren't particularly good heatsinks.
They're "OK" 'sinks, many are capable of keeping temp in a stable region
but if you insist on sub-100F temps then you're wanting a high-end
heatsink. I'm starting to lose track of all the different Athlon speed
vs. "XP" ratings but isn't a Barton only going up to 2.2GHz? I mean, at
stock speed. With something like a Thermalright SLK-900 or better an
XP3200 could potentially run at 10-15 over ambient, putting in within the
100F @ 80F ambient range you seek. Those are pretty insignificant numbers
though, is little point in trying for optimal heatsink beyond noise
reduction except when considering overclocking. Given the desire to push
a chip nearer it's limits the temp may easily exceed 20F over ambient with
any air-cooler.
 
If a lot of people are getting a Barton down to that level Ill try
doing the scraping and sanding bit again.
Click to expand...

You might try a Thermalright SLK947U,
$19.99 w/coupon code "SVC947"
May 17 thru 23
http://www.svc.com/thslsoco.html

Although, for optimal results you still might consider lapping it... a few
months back, maybe a year ago I posted about lapping an SLK900 till it
acheived same temps "dry" as with heatsink compound on it. The degree to
which I lapped it was a waste though, beyond a certain point the return
was diminishing towards nothing, especially since I used thermal compound
anyway on final fitting. On an o'c mobile Barton it gets about 20F over
ambient but it only has a voltage-reduced 80mm Panaflo M1A on it...
primary goal was highest o'c possible while still silent. At the time
the SLK947 was just hitting the market and if I'd the chance to buy again
I'd get the 947 due to higher m'board compatibility, as it's fins aren't
so wide. 947 is also better suited to P4 due to wider base, but that's
splitting hairs a bit, either is fine for P4 too.
 
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