Suggestions for the future of PC Review

[Ian]

PC Review has been around in one form or another since 1999, and a lot has changed since then - we now have over sixty-six thousand members! However we've noticed a few problems with PC Review recently, and we really want to take action wherever we can to improve the site.

Over the past few years PCR has developed a core group of long-standing members who are very close. Whilst we feel that there is a good community spirit within that group, it can be a little off-putting to new members who are not part of the 'clique'. We've had a lot of feedback raised recently about this, and if would be great if we could get back to being the friendly, welcoming and helpful forum that we always used to be. It would be great to get more activity going too!

We've been having a think about how we can change things for the better, and here are some ideas that we've come up with...

News
The daily news has been a similar format for years now, and we feel that it's time for a shake up. Rather than sharing one hardware review each day, we thought it might be more interesting to make it more editorial and include more discursive topics. We could have regular round-ups of hardware reviews, but perhaps focus on reviews of budget/mid-range hardware (as suggested here a while back). Most of all we want the news to be interesting to you, so feel free to let us know what you want to see!

Current affairs in the off-topic forum
We tend to avoid topics relating to current affairs in the off-topic forum, and this is something that might be nice to change. Obviously we don't want to encourage arguments - what we had in mind was a more open discussion and debate. We would put rules in place so that things don't get out of hand (for example, personal attacks will never be tolerated) and we would keep a close eye on things. Is this something you would like to see? Are there any topics you wouldn't want to see discussed? (eg religion?)

Welcoming new members
When new members join, sometimes they don't get the warmest of welcomes. The main reason for that may be that we are often the target of spammers, and sometimes it is not clear to existing members whether a newbie is a spammer or not. Rest assured that we have systems in place to flag up spammers, and they will be removed from the forum, so if you see a member posting a new topic feel free to say hi whether or not you can help them out with their query.

Articles
It might be a good idea if we have more frequent short articles rather than infrequent hardware reviews. This could include editorial pieces, tutorials, and anything else that you might find interesting.

Now, over to you!

We would love to hear your honest thoughts and feedback here. Let us know what you think about our suggestions above and if you have any other suggestions or ideas please feel free to share them here. If there is anything you want to submit anonymously please send a message to either @Becky or me and we will share it here on your behalf. Once we've all had a good chat about it here, we will post another topic outlining the changes that will be made.

 

[muckshifter]

"reviews of budget/mid-range hardware"

Do you need a 1080? well if you have the moneys, then why not, but it's certainly not 'needed' to run a majority of DX9 games, nevermind 'just to do Office work' ... yep, I like to see more on the lines of what is a, base, for reasonable gaming, without breaking the bank.

I am, however, not that good with writing up an 'review/article' ... It's a mouse, it's got 2buttons a wheel and moves a cursor around your screen & you can change the DPI and "stuff" ... the end. oh, it has lights that ........ you cover up with your hand. Err, maybe I could do sitcom writeups.




and will someone please tell the Euro-fighter to stop flying overhead here, we left, sell it!

 

[Ian]

Glad you like the sound of it . @bootneck02 suggested including more budget items a while ago, but most of the review sites seem to review the latest gear, so Bex is going to change how the news editions work so that we can ensure there is much more coverage of everyday hardware included. No need to worry about writing anything, although of course anyone that wants to submit something to the user review section is very welcome .

 

[Becky]

Bex is going to change how the news editions work so that we can ensure there is much more coverage of everyday hardware included.

Yep, that's right. So as Ian said in his first post, instead of me posting one hardware review each day I could post a variety of different things. For example, current tech-related news topics, product launches, events, editorials, plus hardware review round-ups (but focusing more on budget/mid-range hardware). So there could be fewer hardware reviews, depending on what people would prefer.

 

[Taffycat]

This sounds like a really positive initiative. PCReview was always so informative, lively and welcoming, so it will be great if we can recapture a little of that "old" atmosphere.

I daresay some folk might have reservations about getting into "topical" debates, but it's usually interesting to read the views of others, and to exchange thoughts, so long as participants interact with civility, of course.

I also wonder whether it would be possible to generate a tad more interest in our crunching team? Naturally, I'm not suggesting that anyone should feel forced, but, if they understand that crunching does not need to be "competetive" (no need to run a PC 24/7 to achieve some very useful results) perhaps we could see a few more names added to the PCR team again? Just a thought, please don't shoot me.

 

[bootneck02]

Hi Ian firstly I do agree with you on the subject of religion as hopefully many of our members come from different religions and Christian denominations or none at all and could cause offense to many. Personally I would like to see more advice and help with open source operating systems, I know that there is much on the net but often it is nice to here it from people you trust and consider Internet friends

 

[Core]

This was an interesting read. I personally stopped frequenting soon after signing up because, while people here are generally nice and everything, it felt a bit like the site revolved around an existing group of friends. When you are a new member on any site, it takes a while to get your bearings, but this site somehow felt like it would take years to become part of the site. It's difficult to put my finger on it, but I think part of it was that everyone else seemed to have 10,000 posts to their name, and there were very few - if any at all - with low post counts. This kind of made it feel like there was a regularly visiting group whose turf I was stepping on. I've been participating in online forums for 20 years so I am not entirely sure why this was an issue here to the extent that I would be discouraged from posting.

Just rambling on, but I just wanted to throw my thoughts in.

 

[muckshifter]

I, for one, wouldn't mind NOT having a post count, 90% of mine are mostly irrelevant anyway.

 

[Ian]

I also wonder whether it would be possible to generate a tad more interest in our crunching team? Naturally, I'm not suggesting that anyone should feel forced, but, if they understand that crunching does not need to be "competetive" (no need to run a PC 24/7 to achieve some very useful results) perhaps we could see a few more names added to the PCR team again? Just a thought, please don't shoot me.

I'm sure that we can give the WCG team a push once we've grown and attracted more members - at the moment all of the regulars know about it, but I agree it would be good to have a way to explain how it works and how to join the team. Perhaps an article on the things that WCG has achieved would be a good read and then show why it's something that people may be interested in joining.

Hi Ian firstly I do agree with you on the subject of religion as hopefully many of our members come from different religions and Christian denominations or none at all and could cause offense to many. Personally I would like to see more advice and help with open source operating systems, I know that there is much on the net but often it is nice to here it from people you trust and consider Internet friends

One of the things that we may end up doing is re-working the forum categories slightly, to combine quiet/similar forums (i.e. we have lots of different Windows sub sections now, and perhaps that could be merged - it's up for debate anyway). This would give more prominence to the Linux section and I'm sure @Becky can scout out news from the open source world, to give it a boost .

This was an interesting read. I personally stopped frequenting soon after signing up because, while people here are generally nice and everything, it felt a bit like the site revolved around an existing group of friends. When you are a new member on any site, it takes a while to get your bearings, but this site somehow felt like it would take years to become part of the site. It's difficult to put my finger on it, but I think part of it was that everyone else seemed to have 10,000 posts to their name, and there were very few - if any at all - with low post counts. This kind of made it feel like there was a regularly visiting group whose turf I was stepping on. I've been participating in online forums for 20 years so I am not entirely sure why this was an issue here to the extent that I would be discouraged from posting.

Just rambling on, but I just wanted to throw my thoughts in.

Thanks Core - it's great to get advice from a new members perspective from someone who we know (myself and TC know Core from other places). I've had very similar feedback from a couple of local friends that signed up to the site a while back but aren't regulars, and I've been scratching my head on how to fix it.

I suppose we are quite a clique on here as there are a good number of us that have been here for 5/10 years or more, with fewer members joining in recent months. I think you've hit the nail on the head and this is probably the biggest problem for getting the site to return to activity. I really want to make sure we're a welcoming place and encourage new members, rather than having it somewhere that is an exclusive club.

Perhaps introducing the "VIP" memberships was a bad idea in the long run, as although at the time it seemed like a nice way to reward regular members for being part of the PCR family, that number now includes almost all of the active posters. New members may find it intimidating to see that all of the other posters have something different about them. I'd be interested to hear what other people think about this too.

The post count issue is an interesting point, and @muckshifter sums up what I think about my own post count - I really don't mind if it disappears. However I'm not sure what other people think about it? Normally I would say that post counts are a useful thing to have on a forum, however we're in an unusual situation where we have lots of high post count members but very few new ones - so this may contribute to the problems you mentioned and put new members off. I'd be tempted to trial removing the post count and VIP colours, as that is what is most likely to set the majority of existing members apart from anyone new that joins. Perhaps that will make the site feel like a place that is easier to participate in if you're new. As we grow and activity comes back, I guess it may be less of an issue.

As you're exactly the sort of person that we'd all like to see on PCR, your comments are something that we need to pay attention to!

 

[Becky]

I'd be up for the removal of post count...

I'm sure that we can give the WCG team a push once we've grown and attracted more members - at the moment all of the regulars know about it, but I agree it would be good to have a way to explain how it works and how to join the team. Perhaps an article on the things that WCG has achieved would be a good read and then show why it's something that people may be interested in joining.

Perhaps introducing the "VIP" memberships was a bad idea in the long run, as although at the time it seemed like a nice way to reward regular members for being part of the PCR family, that number now includes almost all of the active posters. New members may find it intimidating to see that all of the other posters have something different about them. I'd be interested to hear what other people think about this too.

... and I agree that the VIP status probably isn't necessary. In addition, how about creating a new rank/badge for Crunchers?

 

[Taffycat]

I too, would feel happy with post-count removal. After all, many of my own posts only consist of a "good morning" in the crunching thread (for example) so are not an indication of "techy expertise."

Hmm... this has sparked another thought. When my Google searches for advice about something, land me on a previously-unknown forum, I usually try to establish whom the "trusted" contributors are, from the well-intentioned "one-post-wonders." I am thinking specifically of the contributors who pass through, often answering questions which are several months (or even years) old. (I know that some will actually impart excellent knowledge, but merely choose not to stay, for whatever reason, so no disrespect intended.) I just wonder whether members who have genuine knowledge/expertise, could be flagged as "recognised gurus" (only using that term for example-purposes!) so that new members can feel more confident about following their advice?

Thinking that @Becky's rank/badge idea could be more of an "across the board" type thing which would help to denote who's who?

 

[Ian]

Good point TC, I too look at the post count/join date to try and judge trust (not accurate, but it's all there is!). I've seen that there are award addons available for the forum software that can give mini badges to members, i.e. a crunching award, technical experience award, etc. Some of these things can be demonstrated very quickly, so would show experience for new and old members equally. It could also be used for recognition for crunching, etc... too.

Maybe something I can set up as a test to show people how it works? It may help new members feel that they're excluded from an inner circle of longstanding posters, but recognise technical experience, helpfulness and other things in a more equal way.

There are downsides to this too, but they'd mainly be a problem if we have significant numbers of new members and we need to manually award things based on knowledge - a nice problem to have though .

As always, please let me know your thoughts - I'd hate to make big changes without a mandate from the members .

 

[bootneck02]

Just another thing looking back over the years some newbies ether on their first or second post have asked a software or hardware question but had no answer too that question, although several members have looked at the question so as to show that we do not have the answer would it be a good thing for them to receive a reply even though no solution has been forthcoming. Also to encourage them to participate in the forum by possibly to point them in the right direction of a solution. So as to show we appreciate their input.

 

[V_R]

I'd be tempted to trial removing the post count and VIP colours, as that is what is most likely to set the majority of existing members apart from anyone new that joins.

... and I agree that the VIP status probably isn't necessary. In addition, how about creating a new rank/badge for Crunchers?

I'm happy with any of these things, and more of what I've read above.

Interesting reading Core's post too, a nice insight into what a new member might feel/think.

As always, please let me know your thoughts - I'd hate to make big changes without a mandate from the members .

You've good some good ideas to mull over or try, If they don't work we can always sack them off.

Out of interest, I know from what you've said in the past that the site has some quite strict anti spam filters in place, I take it they don't impede people trying to join or anything like that?


There has been a lot more excel and such questions for a while now too, the sort of thing that usually goes in the newsgroups - and which is probably in all honesty better suited there. Is this something to consider one way or another?

I'm just kind of thinking out loud here.

 

[nivrip]

A bit late on the scene here – been busy with other things but now have had a chance to read right through this thread and very interesting it is too.

I’m very much for current affairs but no religion and probably no politics as they can be very divisive.

As to new members, yes we should be encouraging them, and I have always tried to say hello to as many as possible and I think we should all try this even if the odd one does get thrown out. You can’t beat a good, genuine welcome to encourage you to come on to the site again.

I like TC’s idea of pushing the crunching that we do and even to suggest that people can simply crunch when they are using their PCs or laptops and it will all help no matter how little. It is not necessary to be a full time cruncher.

Core’s post was very illuminating. I’m sure the clique that we have puts people off ( although it happens on all forums) and I think it would need to be no VIP badge, no post count and no Likes as all of these demonstrate longer standing members. You could leave the Like comments but maybe not the number of Likes. Even the Joining Date is questionable as this, too, indicates longevity and possible clique membership. Hell, we'll end up with nothing. However, I do think that a cruncher’s badge would be useful and possibly an incentive to encourage people to join up (but I would say that, wouldn’t I?)

Is there a way of giving an answer to all questions, even if it is only to say that, “ I don’t know the answer but hopefully someone else might be able to help later”. This will also keep the post visible for a little longer and give a little encouragement, whereas no answer at all is not likely get anyone coming back.

There may be more ideas as the thread develops.

 

[Taffycat]

You could leave the Like comments but maybe not the number of Likes.

The "likes" can be a quick way of indicating that a post has been read and appreciated, but as you suggest @nivrip, not quite so relevant to actually keep count.

Even the Joining Date is questionable as this, too, indicates longevity and possible clique membership.

Hmm... I would agree that it can indicate longevity, but maybe that is a positive aspect? I'm not sure join-dates alone would necessarily denote a clique.

I have been checking-out some of the "opposition" on the interwebs, and see that many forums follow a similar format to the one we already have in place - member join dates and post counts! Places where mixes of old and new members post enthusiastically and without any apparent problems. So perhaps the whole clique thing, purely boils down to behavioral traits; remembering that newcomers cannot be expected to automatically know who's who, or "get" their sense of humour straight away.

That reminds me... Way back when I first joined, I recall an area where one was "introduced" to the forum Mods - it was a who's who of PCR. Anyone else remember that? Perhaps it would be a thought to have an up-to-date, meet-the-team thread - or info section?

 

[nivrip]

Yes, TC, I had a bit of trouble trying to decide about the joining dates. On one side it indicates longevity, and possible cliques, and on the other longstanding members are (I think) deemed to be good upstanding, wise people with, perhaps, lots of knowledge of computers etc. Not quite sure where that leaves me, hardly knowing one end of a PC from the other.

I cannot remember being introduced to the Mods when I joined, although memories do fade with time. I do, however, remember being asked to introduce myself to the forum which I did. Again this could work both ways. Some will be more than happy to put up info about themselves but others will not like the idea at all.

Have we reached the " going round in circles" period?

 

[Taffycat]

On one side it indicates longevity, and possible cliques, and on the other longstanding members are (I think) deemed to be good upstanding, wise people with, perhaps, lots of knowledge of computers etc. Not quite sure where that leaves me, hardly knowing one end of a PC from the other.

Perhaps this is where a badge-system, or some other form of forum "titles" might be useful. Something which would indicate the techy-types from the keen-but-not-so-techy!

Have we reached the " going round in circles" period?

Nah...! We are just demonstrating little-grey-cell activity.

 

[floppybootstomp]

Not bothered about post count.

VIP status - let the VIP members decide, maybe with a vote.

Try and get folk to write more equipment reviews.

Leave join dates in place.

No religion or politics.

No cussin' (I hasten to add it doesn't bother me - look at me on Facebook - but it's nicer without).

Crunching - encouragement is fine, pouncing on new members asking them to crunch when they've only just got their feet wet is not fine.

I'd like more Linux but I don't think anybody here is a real Linux expert, though Urmas is certainly knowledgeable in that field.

Core's post was informative, I liked that.

I think that's all my views, if I think of more I will post again.

 

[V_R]

Flops is pretty bang on I think.