should the swap file reside on a drive with data frequently accessed?

[Rahul]

Hi,

Since I was running out of space on my old 40 GB HDD (C I recently
added a new drive. This was an old piece lying around so is pretty
small for today (20GB) I started by formatting it and added a small
2GB partition(E at its very "front" to hold my swap file. (I've 1GB
RAM)

The remaining 17odd GB are free for "data" as a seperate
partition(F. C: remains my master-drive with all my Windows and
other programs installed there. I probably want to keep those
untouched.

But now I have a choice as to what components I want to move to the
new drive(D!

The three targets that come to mind are:
(1)MyDocuments,
(2)GoogleDesktop Index,
(3)Thunderbird_IMAP_Offline_mailbox (rightnow that's a MASSIVE and
SUPER fragmented file; makes TB very unresponsive at times)

In the descending frequency order of file access requests these
probably are: (2), (3) (1)

Which should I put on the new physical drive. Note that the first
logical partition on this physical drive holds my swap file. So I
probably don't want to have anything on D: that would detract from the
swap access function, right?

Any suggestions?

-Rahul

 

[Jerry]

You do not need or require a separate partition just for the swap file. It's
putting the swap file on a separate drive that is an enhancement. Having 1Gb
of RAM has no bearing on the swap file though some would say it should be
2.5 times larger than your RAM. Re-partition that 20Gb drive to just one
partiton.

Moving My Documents is viable. The others - I've never heard of them.

 

[Rahul]

You do not need or require a separate partition just for the swap file. It's
putting the swap file on a separate drive that is an enhancement. Having 1Gb
of RAM has no bearing on the swap file though some would say it should be
2.5 times larger than your RAM. Re-partition that 20Gb drive to just one
partiton.

Thanks Jerry! Is a seperate partition not required or not recommended?
Will it degrade my performance? Do I really have to repartition the
drive?

Moving My Documents is viable. The others - I've never heard of them.

Question is: if I have to share something on a drive that has a swap
file what should it be? Rarely accessed data / frequently accessed
files?

-Rahul

 

[Jerry]

A separate partition is not required or recommended. Period.

I mentioned repartitioning the drive because it makes no sense to have a
20Gb drive split into 1Gb and 19Gb pieces. If you cannot move/save whatever
it is you have on the 19Gb partition then forget it - that's up to you.

Why are you sharing anything? With who? A separate system, a network? What?
The swap file has no impact on sharing - what makes you think it does?

 

[Rahul]

Why are you sharing anything? With who? A separate system, a network? What?
The swap file has no impact on sharing - what makes you think it does?

I should have phrased it better. Drive X and Y. If swap's on X and I
have a choice of what other files to put on X vs Y, is there a guiding
philosophy for good performance?

That's what I meant. Other files include choices of:

(1) Programs vs data
(2)Frequency of access
(3) File size
(4) Frequency of changes

 

[Gerry]

Rahul

I take a different view to Jerry. Be aware that there are two opposing
views on partitioning and it is not simply his view and my view.
Knowlegeable users are on both sides of the debate. A dedicated separate
partition for the pagefile at the beginning of the second drive is just
fine.
http://aumha.org/win5/a/xpvm.htm

What are thr read/write speeds of each hard drive?

Relocating files to a second drive can be made easier using TweakUi:

My Documents is one of a number of system created Special Folders
including My Pictures and My Music. These can more easily be relocated
using Tweak Ui. Download TweakUI, one of the MS powertoys, from here:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/downloads/powertoys.asp

In TweakUi select My Computer, Special Folders. You can scroll down to
see the full list of Special Folders to the left of the Change
Location button.

You may also need to change Default File locations in the Microsoft
Office programmes you choose to move the My Documents folder. For Word
go to Tools, Options, File Locations, highlight Documents, click on
Modify and change file path. For Excel go to Tools, Options, General
and change default file path.

Given you are short of free disk space on C I am setting out below some
further ways to create space which may help.

The default allocation to System Restore is 12% on your C partition
which is over generous. I would reduce it to 700 mb. Right click your My
Computer icon on the Desktop and select System Restore. Place the cursor
on your C drive select Settings but this time find the slider and drag
it to the left until it reads 700 mb and exit. When you get to the
Settings screen click on Apply and OK and exit.

Another default setting which could be wasteful is that for temporary
internet files, especially if you do not store offline copies on disk.
The default allocation is 3% of drive. Depending on your attitude to
offline copies you could reduce this to 1% or 2%. In Internet Explorer
select Tools, Internet Options, General, Temporary Internet Files,
Settings to make the change. At the same time look at the number of days
history is held.

The default allocation for the Recycle Bin is 10 % of drive. Change to
5%, which should be sufficient. In Windows Explorer place the cursor
on your Recycle Bin, right click and select Properties, Global and
move the slider from 10% to 5%. However, try to avoid letting it get
too full as if it is full and you delete a file by mistake it will
bypass the Recycle Bin and be gone for ever.

Select Start, All Programs, Accessories, System Tools, Disk CleanUp to
Empty your Recycle Bin and Remove Temporary Internet Files. Also
select Start, All Programs, accessories, System Tools, Disk CleanUp,
More Options, System Restore and remove all but the latest System
Restore point. Run Disk Defragmenter.

You can generate more space in the system partition by relocation of
folders.

For Temporary Internet Files select Start, Control Panel, Internet
Options, Temporary Internet Files. Settings, Move Folder.

To move the Outlook Express Store Folder select in Outlook Express
Tools, Options, Maintenance, Store Folder, Change.
http://www.tomsterdam.com/insideoe/files/store.htm


--



Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Rahul]

I take a different view to Jerry. Be aware that there are two opposing
views on partitioning and it is not simply his view and my view.
Knowlegeable users are on both sides of the debate. A dedicated separate
partition for the pagefile at the beginning of the second drive is just
fine.http://aumha.org/win5/a/xpvm.htm

Thanks Gerry! Actually, I think it was one of your previous posts on
this group that prompted me to do the seperate partition strategy!

What are thr read/write speeds of each hard drive?

Can I find this anywhere on the computer, easily? Or else I'll reopen
my box at the end of today and look on the cases. (I was anyways
thinking of putting HDD2 on a seperate IDE bus. What do you think
about that? Right now both HDDs are on the same channel. But I have a
free connector on the cable that's currently connected to my CD-ROM)

Relocating files to a second drive can be made easier using TweakUi:

Oh! Is that how that's supposed to be done? I naively used
My_Documents->Properties->Move to do it. Will that break anything?


Thanks again both Gerry and Jerry!

 

[Gerry]

Rahul

You can research information on drive manufacturers web sites by
searching on the drive model number. You can usually ascertain the
rotational spindle speeds but average read / write speeds are not always
available. The point you need to watch is whether the older and smaller
drive is significantly slower than the larger drive.

In HD Tune (freeware) there is a benchmark feature:
Download and run it and see what it turns up.
http://www.hdtune.com/

--



Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Rahul]

Rahul

You can research information on drive manufacturers web sites by
searching on the drive model number. You can usually ascertain the
rotational spindle speeds but average read / write speeds are not always
available. The point you need to watch is whether the older and smaller
drive is significantly slower than the larger drive.

In HD Tune (freeware) there is a benchmark feature:
Download and run it and see what it turns up.http://www.hdtune.com/

Thanks again Gerry!
I quote below the numbers HDTune gave me and also the spec. sheets I
could find.(since I'm not sure what the relevant statistic is!)

40 GB drive:
HDTune's Max Read speed=40MB/sec
http://www.seagate.com/staticfiles/...on/data_sheets/diamondmax_D740X_datasheet.pdf
Maxtor6L040J2

20 GB drive:
ST320420A
HDTune's Max Read speed=28MB/sec
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/manuals/ata/vailpmb.pdf

Apparently, the second drive is slower.

-Rahul

 

[Gerry]

Rahul

This is not a subject I am fully conversant with. Both drives have a
rotational speed of 7,200 RPM so they will be similar.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Access_time

The main way to decrease access time is to increase rotational speed,
while the main way to increase throughput and storage capacity is to
increase areal density.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_drive#Capacity_measurements

--



Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Derek Harvey]

Thanks, Gerry, for all that very useful information. Do you happen to know
whether and how the location of the Hibernate file (hiberfil.sys?) can be
changed as that might be a cause of the difficulties I am having with
hibernation after enhancing from 1G to 2G RAM, as C is down to (ONLY!) 10G,
mostly software. I have plenty of space on two other partitions and could
consider re-partitioning to move them about but it's rather a daunting task
and an easier solution would be welcome.

Derek
PS. Interested to see, Gerry, that you live in Stourport as I am in
mid-Wales so, relatively, almost near enough to reach over and shake hands!
It's one of my favourite places on the canal network, being a canal boating
enthusiast. Perhaps you are too?

 

[Gerry]

Derek

You may find this Article on hiberfil.sys helpful
http://www.softwarepatch.com/tips/hiberfil-sys-xp.html

I do not know how one might attempt relocating hiberfil.sys. It would
seem that relocating hiberfil.sys is not advisable. There are usually
other better ways to increase limited free disk space on a system
partition.

How to defragment hiberfil.sys is a different question and not one I
have personally ever attempted. SFAIK hiberfil.sys cannot be
defragmented using a conventional Defragmenter. Given that hiberfil.sys
is being constantly updated, even if you are successful in achieving a
contiguous file, then the next time it is updated it fragments. One way
you can try to create a contiguous file would be to turn off the
Hibernation feature, clean up the drive using cCleaner plus the System
Restore option in Disk CleanUp, More Options, run Disk Defragmenter,
turn Hibernation back on and restart the computer. The advantage this
will give is that it increases the chances for defragmenting other
files, which might otherwise not defragment because there is limited
free space i.e. less than 15%. I have created a contiguous fixed size
pagefile using this approach but it works best if you have more than 50%
free disk space.

How large is your C partition and how much free disk space do you have?
Do you have one or two internal hard drives? Is your computer a desktop
or a laptop?

One problem with using hibernation is the temptation to leave the
computer on 24/7. This has the effect of allowing any memory leaks to
continuously grow unchecked. Users eventually start to complain of poor
performance and can add RAM memory when it may not be needed. Ironically
adding RAM increases the size of hiberfil.sys.

I have only ever had one weeks holiday on the canals and that was nearly
40 years ago. My late brother-n-law was the longboat enthusiast in my
family. It is a relaxing mode of transport. Mid Wales is a pleasant part
of the country. which we have explored from time to time.


--



Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Derek Harvey]

Thanks Gerry.
Since raising that question someone else has pointed me to a MS hotfix
K909095 about problems with >=1Gb Ram (what the MS article refers to as
'lots of RAM'!!!) and that does seem to have solved the problem (fingers
crossed, not done many hibernates since). I did also free up some more C
space by moving some unwanted audio files, now have 15Gb (>10G before) which
might have helped as well.

I am aware of the desirability of a full restart every now and then and do
it every few days.

Derek.

 

[Gerry]

Derek

How large is your C partition?

--



Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~