P
Prince Lee
What's the latest consensus on this, install or stay away?
A
Andrew
I tried it but couldn't use Bluetooth, so reverted back. Overall you
are much better off getting a decent firewall (the SP2 one is absolute
crap), using Firefox for browsing and getting a better email/usenet
client than the useless OE. You will then have a far more secure and
useable system than you will achieve with SP2.
P
Prince Lee
That makes sense, what about performance hits? Also ATI is recommending it
be installed for thier new CAT drivers, should I go with that recommendation
or take heed to th horror stories of SP2 and stay away?
be installed for thier new CAT drivers, should I go with that recommendation
or take heed to th horror stories of SP2 and stay away?
A
Andrew
For the few days I used it, I had no gaming issues with it. Which Cats
you use probably depends on which card you use. Everything since 4.4
for me has been a step backwards in performance and stability for my
9700 Pro.
P
Prince Lee
I know what you mean, I still have the AIW8500DV, and it seems that ATI
manages to break something while fixing something else in each release. I'm
trying to see if this new set will fix a prob I've been having with an old
game that was working up until 4.0.100.1190.
Before that I was having troubles with vid capture and timeshift unstable. I
was hoping they fixed inadvertantly fixed everything with the new driver
set, and I wanna try them, but not if I have to put SP2 on my system.
At least I'd like to know if SP2 is functioning better than what I've heard,
and whethter its absolutely necessary for the new CAT's.
manages to break something while fixing something else in each release. I'm
trying to see if this new set will fix a prob I've been having with an old
game that was working up until 4.0.100.1190.
Before that I was having troubles with vid capture and timeshift unstable. I
was hoping they fixed inadvertantly fixed everything with the new driver
set, and I wanna try them, but not if I have to put SP2 on my system.
At least I'd like to know if SP2 is functioning better than what I've heard,
and whethter its absolutely necessary for the new CAT's.
V
vellu
No horror stories here, SP2 + 9600 no problems. Haven't noticed any
performance decrease in any of the games I play. Haven't done any actual
benchmarking because I couldn't care less if my 3DM is 3500 instead of
3600 (or whatever). Real-life performance matters, and that has remained
the same, as far as the human eye can detect.
Ps. I do use Firefox+Thunderbird instead of IE/OE. Can't remove IE
though because it's still needed for WUpdate. That's the only thing I
use it for.
performance decrease in any of the games I play. Haven't done any actual
benchmarking because I couldn't care less if my 3DM is 3500 instead of
3600 (or whatever). Real-life performance matters, and that has remained
the same, as far as the human eye can detect.
Ps. I do use Firefox+Thunderbird instead of IE/OE. Can't remove IE
though because it's still needed for WUpdate. That's the only thing I
use it for.
I
Inglo
Whatever you've heard about SP2 probably comes from clueless fools who
don't know how to manage their systems properly. The main thing SP2
does is by default enable a more aggressive integrated software firewall
(along with the entire "Security Center"), for people without any
experience dealing with any kind of firewall (besides the previous
iteration of the Windows Internet Firewall which didn't do much) this
creates issues , this is what you hear about.
I have *zero* issues with SP2, I use ZoneAlarm, I turned the new thing
off as I'd done with the previous version.
The only thing that is necessary is having the latest .NET framework in
order to run the Catalyst Control Center. I'm not certain if that
requires SP2, I don't think it does.
I have SP2, the latest .NET framework, the 4.11 drivers +CCC and a 9800
Pro. Everything runs great.
P
Paul Murphy
I have the AIW 8500DV as well and I'm using it with MMC9.02 on Windows XP
MCE 2005 which includes SP2 built in. I have absolutely zero issues with it
other than the fact the latest Catalyst drivers (it could be argued,
rightly) don't support the 8500DV under MCE 2005 - only standard XP.
Interestingly though, the OS has built in drivers for the 8500DV which work
fine outside of the Windows Media Centre. Thats not an SP2 issue though. If
its good enough for MSFT to include it in their Windows XP media now, then I
say go for it.
Paul
MCE 2005 which includes SP2 built in. I have absolutely zero issues with it
other than the fact the latest Catalyst drivers (it could be argued,
rightly) don't support the 8500DV under MCE 2005 - only standard XP.
Interestingly though, the OS has built in drivers for the 8500DV which work
fine outside of the Windows Media Centre. Thats not an SP2 issue though. If
its good enough for MSFT to include it in their Windows XP media now, then I
say go for it.
Paul
B
Bandit
No problems here with SP2 
running the latest drivers with control
panel not the control center S*** cause i didn't like the .net
framework stuff
running the latest drivers with controlpanel not the control center S*** cause i didn't like the .net
framework stuff
P
Prince Lee
Thanks for the responses, guess I'll go ahead and try it, I've already made
sure there is no spyware on my system, I know there aren't any viruses.
These are things I have on a pretty tight lockdown, as well as firewall
protection, but I was mostly concerned about program breakage, as MS said
that there would be some programs that would no longer work once SP2 is
installed.
sure there is no spyware on my system, I know there aren't any viruses.
These are things I have on a pretty tight lockdown, as well as firewall
protection, but I was mostly concerned about program breakage, as MS said
that there would be some programs that would no longer work once SP2 is
installed.
D
Don Burnette
Prince said:
I did do the following just prior to installing SP2
Checked for adware/spyware with Ad Aware 6.0
Checked for latest updates for my peripherals
Checked for latest updates for my applications
Updated my AV software virus definition files.
Ran a virus scan.
Did a disk cleanup, cleaning out temp files and cookies.
Did a chkdsk on my system drive.
Imaged my system partition with PowerQuest Drive Image to external hard
drive. ( if no imaging software, I would strongly recommend , at the least,
backing up all important data files, and settings ). Take precaution when
deciding what to back up, make triple sure you have any data files that are
very important to you backed up in some way, either to another partion, hard
drive, cdr, floppy.
Downloaded SP2 network version ( complete 266 mb file) from windows update
catalogue site.
Disabled my AV software.
Installed SP2. I think it took about 15 minutes for me, maybe 20 at the
most.
After installation:
Ran disk defragger on system partition. Made sure AV software was activated
again. Checked my main applications and programs I run to make sure no
issues.
No problems, and my computer appears to be a little snappier. No conflicts
with any of the security features, matter of fact i have a hardware nat
firewall with my router for my cable internet, and have the XP firewall on,
and no issues. I also really like the pop up blocker.
A
Aki Peltola
Don Burnette said:
[huge list of actions]
Guess I was simply lucky then, I did practically nothing
(didn't even disable Avast-antivirus) before starting the
SP2-update process and no problems
Of courserunning Defrag was quite necessary afterwards, because
disk got so nicely fragmented and loading slowed down.
B
Barry Watzman
Install, with a few caveats:
-Clean your system (virus' and adware/spyware) FIRST
-IF you have a Prescott, make sure that you have an SP2 compatible BIOS,
and install the latest BIOS update for your motherboard
-If at all possible, do a backup first
-It's best to use the full 270 megabyte SP2 installation set instead of
using "Windows Update", although the latter usually works ok.
I've installed SP2 on a few dozen machines, really no problems at all
(although I know other people who did have problems), I think it's a
very good upgrade.
-Clean your system (virus' and adware/spyware) FIRST
-IF you have a Prescott, make sure that you have an SP2 compatible BIOS,
and install the latest BIOS update for your motherboard
-If at all possible, do a backup first
-It's best to use the full 270 megabyte SP2 installation set instead of
using "Windows Update", although the latter usually works ok.
I've installed SP2 on a few dozen machines, really no problems at all
(although I know other people who did have problems), I think it's a
very good upgrade.
B
Barry Watzman
What is your experience with MCE and the 8500DV? I know that the 8500DV
is not recommended by Microsoft for MCE (media center edition), in fact
generally no ATI products are recommended. MS' position is that MCE
requires hardware MPEG encoding, which no ATI products currently have
with one single exception, the "e-Home Wonder" (a PCI tuner card). I
tried an e-Home Wonder and couldn't get it to install, ran into a
problem that others are having, ATI used a bogus version of
Installshield to create the drivers, and it won't install on many
systems. There's no workaround for this, so I returned it and purchased
a Hauppauge card instead (hasn't come yet).
Anyway, as I mentioned, ATI AIW cards are not recommended for MCE, so
I'm curious as to what your experience was.
is not recommended by Microsoft for MCE (media center edition), in fact
generally no ATI products are recommended. MS' position is that MCE
requires hardware MPEG encoding, which no ATI products currently have
with one single exception, the "e-Home Wonder" (a PCI tuner card). I
tried an e-Home Wonder and couldn't get it to install, ran into a
problem that others are having, ATI used a bogus version of
Installshield to create the drivers, and it won't install on many
systems. There's no workaround for this, so I returned it and purchased
a Hauppauge card instead (hasn't come yet).
Anyway, as I mentioned, ATI AIW cards are not recommended for MCE, so
I'm curious as to what your experience was.
C
Conor
THe program breakage is a red herring. If you check on MS's website, it
is basically a list of older programs where newer versions are
available or ones that'll run in compatibility mode.
P
Paul Murphy
Windows XP MCE 2005 is based on XP Professional SP2 so as such the OS
contains drivers for the card (was detected and installed from scratch). The
problem is that MCE cant utilise the TV Tuning capability of the card
because it has no hardware encoding and the special Encode software written
by ATI to bypass this requirement for some All In Wonder equipped MCE
machines (yes they DO exist and were released by some OEMs such as Dell)
only works with the theatre 200 chipset (which came with AIW 9700 cards and
newer - basically all All In Wonders after the 8500 series). The consequence
of this is that XP MCE works fine when not using the Media Centre
functions - ie can install ATIs MMC 9.02 (and I guess 9.03) on it to control
the card. When you start Media Centre using either the remote or menu
shortcut, windows complains that the graphics card or drivers aren't
supported under media centre (even though most of the functions will still
run except the TV becomes dodgy). If I go into device manager and disable
all of the tuner related resources, this problem in Media Centre disappears
and an eHome Wonder can be used for TV instead - I know because I have one
in this machine - installed using the brand new (only a few days old)
drivers for the eHome Wonder designed specifically for MCE 2005 from ATIs
website. Pity that you've returned the eHome Wonder because with the new
drivers its the cats whiskers. I particularly like the feature where using a
caller ID capable modem, a callers phone number pops up on the TV screen
whenever the phone rings.
Paul
contains drivers for the card (was detected and installed from scratch). The
problem is that MCE cant utilise the TV Tuning capability of the card
because it has no hardware encoding and the special Encode software written
by ATI to bypass this requirement for some All In Wonder equipped MCE
machines (yes they DO exist and were released by some OEMs such as Dell)
only works with the theatre 200 chipset (which came with AIW 9700 cards and
newer - basically all All In Wonders after the 8500 series). The consequence
of this is that XP MCE works fine when not using the Media Centre
functions - ie can install ATIs MMC 9.02 (and I guess 9.03) on it to control
the card. When you start Media Centre using either the remote or menu
shortcut, windows complains that the graphics card or drivers aren't
supported under media centre (even though most of the functions will still
run except the TV becomes dodgy). If I go into device manager and disable
all of the tuner related resources, this problem in Media Centre disappears
and an eHome Wonder can be used for TV instead - I know because I have one
in this machine - installed using the brand new (only a few days old)
drivers for the eHome Wonder designed specifically for MCE 2005 from ATIs
website. Pity that you've returned the eHome Wonder because with the new
drivers its the cats whiskers. I particularly like the feature where using a
caller ID capable modem, a callers phone number pops up on the TV screen
whenever the phone rings.
Paul
B
Barry Watzman
So the bottom line is that no AIW cards prior to the 9700 work, and even
in the AIW 9700 and later, ATI "kludged" a software work-around for the
lack of hardware MPEG, which probably means that the performance is
pathetic.
Re: "Pity that you've returned the eHome Wonder because with the new
drivers its the cats whiskers. I particularly like the feature where
using a caller ID capable modem, a callers phone number pops up on the
TV screen whenever the phone rings."
Well, the "e-Home Wonder" wouldn't install ..... AT ALL. And it's not
just me, see for example the thread at:
http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33787475&hi
ATI has known about this problem for the better part of at least 90
days, all that they have to do to fix it is rebuild the install CD with
a different version of Installshield, but have they done so? No ....
Screw it. ALL indications are the the Hauppauge card, which only sells
for $61 (at www.buy.com) is a better card anyway, with better quality video.
in the AIW 9700 and later, ATI "kludged" a software work-around for the
lack of hardware MPEG, which probably means that the performance is
pathetic.
Re: "Pity that you've returned the eHome Wonder because with the new
drivers its the cats whiskers. I particularly like the feature where
using a caller ID capable modem, a callers phone number pops up on the
TV screen whenever the phone rings."
Well, the "e-Home Wonder" wouldn't install ..... AT ALL. And it's not
just me, see for example the thread at:
http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33787475&hi
ATI has known about this problem for the better part of at least 90
days, all that they have to do to fix it is rebuild the install CD with
a different version of Installshield, but have they done so? No ....
Screw it. ALL indications are the the Hauppauge card, which only sells
for $61 (at www.buy.com) is a better card anyway, with better quality video.
P
Paul Murphy
I don't agree with your use of the word "kludged" because All In Wonders
weren't designed to be used in MCE - only standard Windows. For MCE ATI has
a card designed for the job and thats the eHome Wonder (and the HDTV Wonder
for US customers using it over there). Encode (the software "workaround")
hasn't been developed for MCE 2005.
Paul
weren't designed to be used in MCE - only standard Windows. For MCE ATI has
a card designed for the job and thats the eHome Wonder (and the HDTV Wonder
for US customers using it over there). Encode (the software "workaround")
hasn't been developed for MCE 2005.
Paul
N
Nerdillius Maximus
Paul Murphy said:
Rage Fury Maxx, anyone? How soon we forget...