QUESTION pagecounts

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tiktak

I hear a lot the word "pagecount" is this something like the mileage on a
car? a number that stays there when powered off, when toner changed, etc?
does it only apply to certain printers? if so, would the hp lj 1100 be one
of them? and if so, would a 7000 pagecount be considered low, moderate or
high?

regards.

please remove spam if emailing me.
 
Page counts are just what they say they are. The number of pages printed.
I've not had any laser's that didn't give a page count and even my Canon
inkjets give a page count. 7000 isn't even a case and a half of paper. I
haven't had an HP 1100, but I'm sure it would give you that info from the
configuration printout.
 
thank you.
I just wasn't aware of what they are.

so I was correct then, they are a count number of some sort, showing up on
some display when you turn on the printer, and this number cannot be erased
modified etc. everytime a page prints, it increases... stored on some sort
of internal memory, so its not erased while printer is off line. did I get
it right pretty much?

thanks again.
 
so I was correct then, they are a count number of some sort, showing up on
some display when you turn on the printer, and this number cannot be erased
modified etc. everytime a page prints, it increases... stored on some sort
of internal memory, so its not erased while printer is off line. did I get
it right pretty much?
Click to expand...

Pretty much. Often they don't get displayed on startup, but you can ask
the printer to print the pagecount. (on my HP LJ4+, it's on the test
page).

Some printer/scanner combinations will give two counts - scans and
prints.

The page count is useful for seeing how long consumables last, seeing
when a service is due, and to see how much a used printer is worth!
 
Bob Eager said:
Pretty much. Often they don't get displayed on startup, but you can ask
the printer to print the pagecount. (on my HP LJ4+, it's on the test
page).

Some printer/scanner combinations will give two counts - scans and
prints.

The page count is useful for seeing how long consumables last, seeing
when a service is due, and to see how much a used printer is worth!
Click to expand...

good.
thank you.

yes it definitely is useful. right now, to me the use of it is much more in
the sense of the use of a car mileage when you buy it. but I understand the
other uses as well.

regards.
 
yes it definitely is useful. right now, to me the use of it is much more in
the sense of the use of a car mileage when you buy it. but I understand the
other uses as well.
Click to expand...

Just as with a car mileage, it can sometimes be faked...!

I find it useful to know how long a toner cartridge has lasted, and how
long to go. I have a sticker inside the lid where I record toner
changes...
 
Bob Eager said:
Just as with a car mileage, it can sometimes be faked...!

I find it useful to know how long a toner cartridge has lasted, and how
long to go. I have a sticker inside the lid where I record toner
changes...
Click to expand...

I See. so it can be faked.
like everything else today I suppose!

how do I tell or suspect whether its been faked? I think I could tell on a
car...but a printer?
 
I See. so it can be faked.
like everything else today I suppose!

how do I tell or suspect whether its been faked? I think I could tell on a
car...but a printer?
Click to expand...

General wear and tear...but needs experience!
 
tiktak said:
I hear a lot the word "pagecount" is this something like the mileage on a
car? a number that stays there when powered off, when toner changed, etc?
does it only apply to certain printers? if so, would the hp lj 1100 be one
of them? and if so, would a 7000 pagecount be considered low, moderate or
high?
Click to expand...
I think this is a cheap and cheerful laser but even so 7000 isnt much, I
would guess its probably on its third toner cartridge.
 
I See. so it can be faked.
like everything else today I suppose!
how do I tell or suspect whether its been faked? I think I could tell on a
car...but a printer?
Click to expand...

It's harder to tell on a printer, esp since it's part of the normal
operation to reset the page count when you replace key parts... for
example on an inkjet it's common to replace the waste bin aka the
diaper.

7000 on a lj1100 for example (Canon LBP-22X print engine IIRC)... is
equal to two large toner replacements, or three small toner
replacements. It also represents 14 packs of paper.

To best judge if this is alot or a little is to look at the lifespan of
other parts in the printer such as the fuser, the part that heats the
paper and affixes the toner to it. I know it's rg5-4589-000 but I
have no clue what life is on that part. A fuser's life can be anywhere
from the 10,000 range to the 100,000 range depending on the printer and
model... though I've never actually replaced one in my life. Given
it's a $70-$120 part i'm sure it's life is lowish esp since the fuser
was the foil type and not a tough teflon roll. I would guess 10,000p
is a good number to check the condition of the rollers, if good check
again at 20,000p.
 
It's harder to tell on a printer, esp since it's part of the normal
operation to reset the page count when you replace key parts... for
example on an inkjet it's common to replace the waste bin aka the
diaper.
Click to expand...

Not true on the average laser printer; it's supposed to be
non-resettable.

For example, on the LaserJet 4 it can be reset by an engineer - and that
is done if the engineer changes the board with the counter NVRAM on it.
He is supposed to set the new board to have the same count as the old
one.
 
tiktak said:
I hear a lot the word "pagecount" is this something like the mileage on a
car? a number that stays there when powered off, when toner changed, etc?
does it only apply to certain printers? if so, would the hp lj 1100 be one
of them? and if so, would a 7000 pagecount be considered low, moderate or
high?

regards.

please remove spam if emailing me.
Click to expand...

7000 pages is quite low, I have seen a LJ1100 with nearly 100,000 pages but
that is rare.
If the print quality is good and it does not exhibit any feeding problems
(multiple feed, failing to feed or skewed feed) then it is probably a good
printer. They are very reliable.
The only way to reset the page count on a LJ1100 is to replace the main logic
board so far as I know.
Tony
 
Not true on the average laser printer; it's supposed to be
non-resettable.

For example, on the LaserJet 4 it can be reset by an engineer - and that
is done if the engineer changes the board with the counter NVRAM on it.
He is supposed to set the new board to have the same count as the old
one.
Click to expand...

On an HP4 or 5 at least, you can set the pagecount to be anything you
want from the front panel if you know the magic combination of
keypresses to enter "service mode". It's in the service manual, which
you can find at http://www.fixyourownprinter.com/reference/manuals.
I don't think this is a secret from anyone unscrupulous enough to want
to do it, so be aware it's no guarantee.
 
On an HP4 or 5 at least, you can set the pagecount to be anything you
want from the front panel if you know the magic combination of
keypresses to enter "service mode". It's in the service manual, which
you can find at http://www.fixyourownprinter.com/reference/manuals.
I don't think this is a secret from anyone unscrupulous enough to want
to do it, so be aware it's no guarantee.
Click to expand...

Isn't that what I said? (without giving details)?
 
Isn't that what I said? (without giving details)?

Actually you said "on the LaserJet 4 it can be reset by an engineer -
and that
is done if the engineer changes the board with the counter NVRAM on
it".
From experence i've met a few LJ4s that have been rebult where the
Click to expand...
rebuilder has reset the counter to zero after replacing all the rollers
and some key parts... and explained that after a major rebuild it was a
good idea to set it to zero so he and others know how many prints are
on the new parts. I imagine it would be unscrupulous if they had set
it to a value under that zero... and sold them as rebuilt.
 
rebuilder has reset the counter to zero after replacing all the rollers
and some key parts... and explained that after a major rebuild it was a
good idea to set it to zero so he and others know how many prints are
on the new parts. I imagine it would be unscrupulous if they had set
it to a value under that zero... and sold them as rebuilt.
Click to expand...

It's completely at variance with the instructions in the service manual.
A proper maintenance log will give the same information. What is lost
with your engineer's method is the life of the parts that are not
replaced...!
 
Actually, no, it's not what you stated at all.

You said: engineer required, only can be done during board exchange

He said: User accessible with service code, done by front panel presses.

That's a bit like equating hiring a mechanic to replace a faulty
transmission so your car will go, with turning the correct ignition key
on your car to start it and drive away.

Art
 
Actually, no, it's not what you stated at all.

You said: engineer required, only can be done during board exchange
Click to expand...

No, I didn't. Here, cut and pasted from my post:

"For example, on the LaserJet 4 it can be reset by an engineer - and
that
is done if the engineer changes the board with the counter NVRAM on it.
"

At no point did I say "engineer required". I just said it can be reset
by an engineer. As long as one has the information in the service
manual, anyone CAN do it.

And I did not say "only can be done during board exchange". I said that
the value is reset by the engineer when the board is changed - that is
to carry over the value from the old board to the new, so that the page
count is preserved.
He said: User accessible with service code, done by front panel presses.
Click to expand...

Yes, it is done with front panel presses. I didn't mention the precise
mechanism, that's all. It's usually only done by an engineer, of course
- or a dishonest user - or an honest user changing the formatter board.
 
It's completely at variance with the instructions in the service manual.
A proper maintenance log will give the same information. What is lost
with your engineer's method is the life of the parts that are not
replaced...!
Click to expand...

You assume that the "engineer" in question has the offical service
manual. I wouldn't call them "engineers" my self but rather mechanics.


I have seen rebuilt HP printers... or ones that have gone through major
service get their counters reset. Some cases this is logged... honest
joes who are depending on the printer's counter to see how much has
been printied out of their shop. Is this in varanace with the offical
instructions? Very bloody likely... but never the less this is done
esp in cases where service is under warranty for a specific number of
pages. Other cases this is not logged.

Not to speak of average joe users who encounter a problem on their
printer that says "need service now" who rather than getting service
will just reset the counters so the printer thinks it's new and
continue printing till the next time.

A good rule of thumb... always bet on stupid... or rather always bet on
someone doing things their own way in total varanace with the offical
instructions.
 
zakezuke said:
You assume that the "engineer" in question has the offical service
manual. I wouldn't call them "engineers" my self but rather mechanics.
Click to expand...
Would you compromise and call them technicians? They cannot do their job well
without a good knowledge of several operating systems, networking and of course
the eccentricities of badly written drivers as well as a thorough knowledge of
maybe several dozen different printers. Just a thought.
But with respect to page counters.....several older and/or low end monochrome
laser printers don't have a counter. Some have one counter that may or may not
be resettable without replacing a board. And some have two or more counters
related to total pages printed and pages since the last maintenance kit was
fitted, toner/drum life etc. Colour lasers on the other hand may have more than
a dozen counters all of which are often resettable if you have the codes.
Clearly a technician has a responsibility to reset counters appropriately and
whilst I am sure there are some that don't it really is not in their interest
to artificially reduce page counts (it may be in their interest to increase
them if they are unscrupulous!).
Bit of a moot point really....The most important counter is total page count
since "birth" since this is a measure of the printers overall usage hence the
requirement to enter this count into the memory of the printer if the
appropriate electronics are replaced, unfortunately this is not always possible
if the original page count cannot retreived after an electronic failure, hence
the advisability of the user to keep a log especially with high throughput
printers.
Tony

<snip>
 
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