problems upgrading RAM

  • Thread starter Thread starter friesian
  • Start date Start date
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friesian

I think it is a compatibility issue, but if so, I don't know why or how
to prevent the same problem.

Here is what happened. My computer has two slots, and I currently have
two 512 sticks. My nephew has a two slots, with only one 512 card. I
bought 3 sticks of 1GB. I was going to replace my two and give them to
my sister (her computer has 4 slots). And give the 3rd one to my
nephew.

Well, tonight, I tried to replace my two, and the computer won't run.
It beeps and then shuts down. I have tried it with one new one, two new
ones, or one new and one old. No go. The computer will not accept them.
I will try them on my nephew's computer tomorrow, but I doubt they will
work as his computer is the same brand, similar production date, though
different model. I am not confident they will work, so I cannot wrap it
and give it as a gift.

According to the specs, they should work fine. PC2700 just like the
original stick when I bought the computer used about 6 months ago. I
upgraded to the 512 sticks. I believe they are PC3200. The guy that
sold them to me said they would work, and they did. They just don't
have a label. But the new sticks do have labels, and they say PC2700.

So, any ideas why they won't work, and what I need to look for to find
sticks that do work on my computer? It looks like I will need to sell
these and start looking again. Belarc Advisor does not state what type
of memory I have, other than the amount. The labels do not mention
speed. The new ones say CL2.5

And advice would be greatly appreciated. This was a triple gift (my own
upgrade plus my nephew and sister), so I am really bummed right now
that it is not working. I spent over $200 on them and only have a
couple little things to give them until I get this figured out or
replaced.

Thank you very much.
 
Since you didn't mention the computer or motherboard manufacturer/make/model, we
won't even know if they should work or not.
Go here: http://www.crucial.com/

Either use the 3 steps to get a list of compatible modules or use the System Scanner
and let it figure it out.

--

Brian A. Sesko { MS MVP_Shell/User }
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375
 
Brian said:
Since you didn't mention the computer or motherboard manufacturer/make/model, we
won't even know if they should work or not.
Click to expand...

Sorry. I was thinking it was something different about this set of RAM,
and didn't think of it being a motherboard issue.

The computer is an eMachines T2682
Go here: http://www.crucial.com/

Either use the 3 steps to get a list of compatible modules or use the System Scanner
and let it figure it out.
Click to expand...

It says I have two sticks of 512 DDR PC3200, and it says:

Each memory slot can hold DDR PC2700 with a maximum of 1GB per slot.

The only thing I can think of is that these sticks are not DDR even
though the ad said "Apacer DDR 1GB - 333 Mhz PC2700".

The label on the sticks say "1GB REG PC2700 CL2.5"

Would this be the problem?
 
I think it is a compatibility issue, but if so, I don't know why or how
to prevent the same problem.

Here is what happened. My computer has two slots, and I currently have
two 512 sticks. My nephew has a two slots, with only one 512 card. I
bought 3 sticks of 1GB. I was going to replace my two and give them to
my sister (her computer has 4 slots). And give the 3rd one to my
nephew.

Well, tonight, I tried to replace my two, and the computer won't run.
It beeps and then shuts down. I have tried it with one new one, two new
ones, or one new and one old. No go. The computer will not accept them.
I will try them on my nephew's computer tomorrow, but I doubt they will
work as his computer is the same brand, similar production date, though
different model. I am not confident they will work, so I cannot wrap it
and give it as a gift.

According to the specs, they should work fine. PC2700 just like the
original stick when I bought the computer used about 6 months ago. I
upgraded to the 512 sticks. I believe they are PC3200. The guy that
sold them to me said they would work, and they did. They just don't
have a label. But the new sticks do have labels, and they say PC2700.

So, any ideas why they won't work, and what I need to look for to find
sticks that do work on my computer? It looks like I will need to sell
these and start looking again. Belarc Advisor does not state what type
of memory I have, other than the amount. The labels do not mention
speed. The new ones say CL2.5

And advice would be greatly appreciated. This was a triple gift (my own
upgrade plus my nephew and sister), so I am really bummed right now
that it is not working. I spent over $200 on them and only have a
couple little things to give them until I get this figured out or
replaced.

Thank you very much.
Click to expand...

The Crucial web site has a search engine. You give it the motherboard
name and it tells you which memory is compatible. Kingston also has
such a function.

http://www.crucial.com

With no details, it is hard to tell what has happened. If you stick
registered memory in an unbuffered computer, the computer will beep
at you, and tell you the memory won't work. Within the unbuffered memory
type, at the 1GB level for DDR, there are two kinds - the product on
the right hand side of this web page, comes with warnings as to which
chipsets it works with. Crucial would not sell you a product like the
stuff on the right.

(Example of an honest warning about sticks with 128Mx4 chips. Notice
how the ones with a warning, are also the cheapest.)
http://www.portatech.com/catalog/memory.asp?ID=285

HTH,
Paul
 
The computer is an eMachines T2682

The label on the sticks say "1GB REG PC2700 CL2.5"

Would this be the problem?
Click to expand...

As this web page shows "unbuffered" and you bought
"registered" memory, yes, that is the problem.
It is "beep city" for you. There should be no damage.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=T2682

Buy some unbuffered DDR instead. Also check that the
second computer to receive a 1GB stick, takes unbuffered
as well. Unbuffered is the most common type for desktops,
while registered tends to be used in servers. Registered
memory has one cycle more latency, but more sticks can be
used on the same memory bus, without overloading it. Which
is why registered is used on big server motherboards.

Paul
 
Paul said:
As this web page shows "unbuffered" and you bought
"registered" memory, yes, that is the problem.
It is "beep city" for you. There should be no damage.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=T2682

Buy some unbuffered DDR instead. Also check that the
second computer to receive a 1GB stick, takes unbuffered
as well. Unbuffered is the most common type for desktops,
while registered tends to be used in servers. Registered
memory has one cycle more latency, but more sticks can be
used on the same memory bus, without overloading it. Which
is why registered is used on big server motherboards.
Click to expand...


Thanks.

Can DDR be both unbuffered and registered? Or does this mean that these
sticks are not DDR. Is the value comparable? I will need to sell these,
and I do not want to misrepresent them.

Also, where does it say buffered or unbuffered? I will need to check
the specs for the other computer (which are probably the same), but I
don't see that terminology on the page listed above.

Thank you very much!
 
Thanks.

Can DDR be both unbuffered and registered? Or does this mean that these
sticks are not DDR. Is the value comparable? I will need to sell these,
and I do not want to misrepresent them.

Also, where does it say buffered or unbuffered? I will need to check
the specs for the other computer (which are probably the same), but I
don't see that terminology on the page listed above.

Thank you very much!
Click to expand...

A stick can be only one thing at a time.
Popular formulations of memory (applicable to different
memory technologies as well, like SDRAM, DDR, DDR2) could
have all of these forms:

1) Unbuffered without ECC - memory array is 64 bits wide, as
is the pinout on the DIMM (64 bits wide).
2) Unbuffered with ECC - memory array is 72 bits wide. The
ECC is for error detection and correction. The extra bits
hold a checksum, and allow detecting bad values (corrupted
while they were stored perhaps).
3) Registered with ECC - a register is placed on the address
bus. The register buffers the electrical signals from the
memory controller. The memory controller sees fewer electrical
loads because of this, and more DIMMs can be driven by the
controller.

1) ----- addr --- memory Unbuffered (no ECC)
array
64 of
--/-- data --- chips

2) ----- addr --- memory Unbuffered (with ECC)
array
72 of
--/-- data --- chips

3) ---- register ---- addr --- memory Registered (with ECC)
array
72 of
--/--------------- data --- chips

The "register" shown above, typical consists of three chips. Two
are the registers, with a one cycle delay from input to output.
The third chip is a phase locked loop, for clock signal
regeneration and fanout.

The "memory array" might be eight chips for a 64 bit interface
or nine chips for a 72 bit interface. Sometimes, on the DIMM,
you can see room for the nineth chip, but no chip in place.
That allows the same PCB blank to be used for two different
types of memory.

The "REG" in your part description, is what told me you had
registered memory. Make sure that "registered" is in your
description. The picture of the module should help confirm
it, for someone in the market for some registered RAM.

This is a picture of registered DDR. The nine chips on one
side of the module, form a 72 bit wide bank. The two chips
in the center, are part of the registering. One chip is smaller
than the other. One chip is the PLL and the other is the
register. If you flip the module over, there will be the
third chip for the registering function. Plus another
nine chips for the second bank.

http://images.tigerdirect.com/skuimages/large/2packDDRAM.jpg

This is apparently, registered SDRAM, from a bygone era.
The DIMM has a different number of pins on it, but the
chips do similar things.

http://users.ameritech.net/anton56/512_mitsubi.jpg

And finally, this is the latest thing. This is a registered DDR2
module. The chips are smaller, the pins are underneath the chips,
but again, similar functions.

http://www.smartm.com/binary/photo/DDR2RegUltra-web.jpg

This is the "ultimate registered DIMM". This is an FBDIMM,
a standard that may well be short lived. Used on servers this
year, but maybe not for much longer. The chip in the center
of this DIMM, is a giant registering device, which gets real
hot. The user's data has a long trip through these things,
if a bunch sit on a channel. A different protocol is used
between the memory controller and the giant registering
device.

http://www.pcstats.com/articleimages/200507/FBDIMM_FBDIMM-micron.jpg

HTH,
Paul
 
Thanks.

Can DDR be both unbuffered and registered? Or does this mean that these
sticks are not DDR. Is the value comparable? I will need to sell these,
and I do not want to misrepresent them.
Click to expand...

Why do you have to sell them? Take them back and get a refund from where you
purchased them since they said they would work.

Crucial has you modules on sale:
http://www.crucial.com/store/mpartspecs.asp?mtbpoid=E45E22C5A5CA7304
Also, where does it say buffered or unbuffered? I will need to check
the specs for the other computer (which are probably the same), but I
don't see that terminology on the page listed above.
Click to expand...

You needed to click on one of the module links or scroll down and you would have
seen it mentioned. Also the modules will have a sticker on them.

--

Brian A. Sesko { MS MVP_Shell/User }
Conflicts start where information lacks.
http://basconotw.mvps.org/

Suggested posting do's/don'ts: http://www.dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
How to ask a question: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555375
 
I think it is a compatibility issue, but if so, I don't know why or how
to prevent the same problem.

Here is what happened. My computer has two slots, and I currently have
two 512 sticks. My nephew has a two slots, with only one 512 card. I
bought 3 sticks of 1GB. I was going to replace my two and give them to
my sister (her computer has 4 slots). And give the 3rd one to my
nephew.

Well, tonight, I tried to replace my two, and the computer won't run.
It beeps and then shuts down. I have tried it with one new one, two new
ones, or one new and one old. No go. The computer will not accept them.
I will try them on my nephew's computer tomorrow, but I doubt they will
work as his computer is the same brand, similar production date, though
different model. I am not confident they will work, so I cannot wrap it
and give it as a gift.

According to the specs, they should work fine. PC2700 just like the
original stick when I bought the computer used about 6 months ago. I
upgraded to the 512 sticks. I believe they are PC3200. The guy that
sold them to me said they would work, and they did. They just don't
have a label. But the new sticks do have labels, and they say PC2700.

So, any ideas why they won't work, and what I need to look for to find
sticks that do work on my computer? It looks like I will need to sell
these and start looking again. Belarc Advisor does not state what type
of memory I have, other than the amount. The labels do not mention
speed. The new ones say CL2.5

And advice would be greatly appreciated. This was a triple gift (my own
upgrade plus my nephew and sister), so I am really bummed right now
that it is not working. I spent over $200 on them and only have a
couple little things to give them until I get this figured out or
replaced.

Thank you very much.
Click to expand...


It is absolutely essential that any new RAM module(s) be fully
compatible with both the motherboard and/or any other RAM module(s)
already in the system. Additionally, there are sometimes jumper
switches on older motherboards that need to be reset for new RAM
configurations. Consult your motherboard's manual or the
manufacturer's web site for specific instructions and compatibility
requirements.

If you cannot lay your hands upon the computer's manual and the
manufacturer doesn't provide a support web site, you can use these
utilities to help determine the correct type of RAM needed:

SiSoft's Sandra
http://www.sisoftware.co.uk/index.php?dir=&location=sware_dl&lang=en

Belarc Advisor
http://www.belarc.com/free_download.html

Unlimited Possibilities' AIDA32
http://forum.aumha.org/overflow/aida32.zip

Also, Crucial Memory's web site (www.crucial.com) has a database
to help to find the right RAM for your specific make and model
computer and/or motherboard.


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -Benjamin Franklin

Many people would rather die than think; in fact, most do. -Bertrand Russell
 
Brian said:
Why do you have to sell them? Take them back and get a refund from where you
purchased them since they said they would work.
Click to expand...

I bought them from a guy on craigslist. His title did not say REG, but
the ad did have that mentioned, so while it was kind of misleading, and
he probably knew that most people couldn't use it; it wasn't
fraudulant. He's not a store, so there won't be a refund or exchange.

The best I can do is sell them, hopefully get what I paid, and then
look for a new set. Unfortunately, it's hard to find 1GB sticks since
most people aren't upgrading to something larger than that. And store
prices are too high for me to buy 3 or 4 of them. Thsi was a good deal
(had they been compatible) as I got 3 of them for $210. Even at the
Cricual website, 2 o fthem would cost more than that.

I am disappointed, but these things happen. I do a lot of buying and
selling via craigslist, and this is the first problem I have had. So,
it's not that bad. Just disappointing since I was going to upgrade two
computers as Christmas gifts as well as my own. The timing was bad.

Live and learn. I do appreciate the great help here. eMachines was fast
in replying, but not very helpful with information. They would tell me
what I needed and where to buy it (of course), but they would not
answer my questions about the sticks I have in front of me.
 
This happened to me when I purchased a 1gb stick from an off brand(can't
remember the name), I sent them back to newegg.com and replaced it with a 1gb
stick from PNY, now no problems, be careful of low end brands.
 
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