PING: Paul Lutus

  • Thread starter Thread starter Stan Harrison
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Stan Harrison

Paul,

I wanted to ask you for permission to make available a significantly
modified version of Arachnophilia that I've developed over the past
three or four months.

My build changes Arachnophilia from being an html/programming
editor into being a webwriting utility, with expanded support for HTML;
newly developed support for XHTML, CSS 1, and CSS 2; the Web Design
Group's HTML and CSS reference guides (linked to Arachnophilia's help
screen); and a host of new features, including Template, MyCode, and
Script libraries.

My modified version of Arachnophilia is available for download at
http://harrisoncenter.ws/help-desk/howtos/arachnophilia-harrisonbuild.html

May I have your permission to make my Arachnophilia makeover generally
available?

Thanks for your consideration,

Stan
 
Stan said:
Paul,

I wanted to ask you for permission to make available a significantly
modified version of Arachnophilia that I've developed over the past
three or four months.
Click to expand...

First, had you really wanted to contact me, you would have posted to my
website message board, http://www.arachnoid.com/messages. But that very
clearly was not your intention. In fact, by posting to Usenet, any by
posting to a group I rarely read, you wanted to take my non-reply as
permission. No such luck.

Second, had you wanted to get permission to hack my program Arachnophilia,
you would have asked in advance, not after you had committed several
felonies and posted the results on your website. But that was very clearly
not your intention.

The evidence shows that you have:

1. Hacked into my Arachnophilia JAR file and made changes there to suit your
purposes, a violation of federal copyright law.

2. Located and removed my copyright notice (the "About" button) from the
main Arachnophilia toolbar of your hacked version, a violation of federal
copyright law.

3. Posted and offered for download these hacked versions of my copyrighted
property on your website, a violation of federal copyright law.

4. Made no serious effort to contact me about your intentions, before,
during, or after the commission of these felonies, a further violation of
federal copyright law.
My modified version of Arachnophilia is available for download at
http://harrisoncenter.ws/help-desk/howtos/arachnophilia-harrisonbuild.html
Click to expand...

This is quite unbelievable. What planet are you from? Do they have laws
there?
May I have your permission to make my Arachnophilia makeover generally
available?
Click to expand...

You needed to ask this months ago, and in a way likely to be read by me. The
only reason I saw this notice is because I regularly make global searches
of the Google Usenet archive for sleazy stunts like this. Had you asked
before beginning this project, I would have given you a short course in
copyright law.

To avoid felony prosecution:

1. REMOVE AT ONCE your hacked versions of my program now posted on your
Website.

2. DESTROY ALL COPIES of the hacked version from your personal files.

I will check back in 48 hours. If the federal copyright law violations are
still posted on your Website, I will have you arrested.

You ALWAYS had the right to create macros for Arachnophilia, and publicly
offer them. You still have this right, as does everyone. Had you carried
out your project in this way, we would not be having this conversation.

You DO NOT have the right to change the Arachhnophilia JAR/EXE downloads in
any way whatsoever. This is a safeguard against a dozen very bad things,
things I should not have to list for you.

(CC by e-mail)
 
Paul,

I am so sorry to have upset you.

I've deleted my macro-altered, JAR intact version of your program.

No offense was intended, I assure you. I believe that will become clear
to you over the course of this message.

In you message, you wrote that had I really wanted to contact you, I
would have posted to you website message board. To tell you the truth,
I've looked through you site for ways of contacting you and only found
the link to your bug report link. Perhaps that message board link was
always there for me to see. But the truth is that I never saw it (and
still can't see it).

You then suggested that I posted my message to a Usenet group that you
rarely read and did so for the purposes of receiving a non-reply and
taking that for permission. In fact, that's not what I intended. I
posted to alt.comp.freeware because I remembered how you responded to
many posts from users who were having real problems getting your program
to start-up (problems with Zip programs having associated themselves
with .jar files seemed to the common problem) when you first released
your Java version of Arachnophilia. Seeing as how I couldn't find an
email link on your site and was pretty certain you did read this usenet
group, I posted my message in the genuine hope that you would come
across it. You did, and I'm glad you did.

Thereafter, you suggested that I had violated copyright law by hacking
into your Arachnophilia JAR file. Long and short answer: I didn't. I
couldn't. I don't know anything about Java, how to program it, how to
open a file, how to change a file. Every program specific change I made
was through the macro editor that you included for the express purpose
of allowing people to change your macros, menus, etc. So, I hope you see
that I didn't violate copyright law on that account. I just didn't do
what you said I did. I didn't change your JAR file. I'm simply incapable
of doing what you said I did.

Next, I didn't really drop your copyright notice from my non-hacked
version of Arachnophila as you suggested I did. Yes, I did remove your
About button from the main toolbar, but I didn't remove your About
button from the Help menu or your copyright notice from your linked Help
file. You wrote the program, and my macro-modified version of your JAR
intact program testifies to that fact. I didn't write your program and
never wanted to take any credit for your work, which has always
impressed me. I just wanted to reorganize the program interface to make
it function as an HTML/XHTML/CSS1&2 editor -- and to preserve links to
your copyright notice. Since I did leave your copyright notice on the
program interface (not even buried in a hidden menu), I don't think I
violated any copyright law. I was just reorganizing the toolbar system
and retaining your copyright notice in ways that I thought were in
keeping with what I took to be your stated purposes for the program (to
allow users to "write and distribute Arachnophilia macros, in fact, this
is encouraged") and to protect your legal rights over the Arachnophilia
JAR file (the guts of the program).

Yes, I posted and offered my macro-altered (something you encourage)
version of Arachnophilia to my website, but I did so in hopes that you
would download the macros and be impressed that I had devoted so much
time to working with your program. Since you're not impressed with my
work and believe I did something that I never did or could do, I'm happy
to remove my macro-altered (not JAR altered) version of your program.

As for your statement that I should have asked for your permission
before starting my work on Arachnophilia's macro-structure (and
templates ... which you say one can do in your Tips of the Day file), I
want to let you know that I only started modifying Arachnophilia this
summer when I decided that 1st Page 2000 was never going to come out
with a new version and that I might begin to develop your program's
macro structure so that Arachnophilia could become (in my eyes and for
my use) a bona-fide replacement for 1st Page 2000. I never intended on
making my work generally available until -- well -- last week, when I
looked at my adjusted interface and thought, "Man, that's good."

In closing, let me repeat that your program is remarkable, that your JAR
file is well beyond my comprehension (even beyond my capacity to open
it), that I never hacked your JAR file, that my goal was to please, that
I never removed your copyright notice from the interface (though I did
quite innocently and perhaps stupidly remove _one_ of the links to your
copyright notice), that I posted to usenet because I've never been able
to find the message board your mentioned in your post and hoped that you
would get my message and take a look at my download (which doesn't
include the JAR file), that I managed to communicate with you (which was
always my intent), that I've received my answer, and that I'm happy to
eliminate my macro-adjusted version of your JAR intact program in
accordance with your wishes.

Feel better, and my very best regards,

Stan
 
Paul,

I wanted to ask you for permission to make available a significantly
modified version of Arachnophilia that I've developed over the past
three or four months.
Click to expand...

I stumbled on Paul L's stuff years ago when I was learning stuff about
computers n stuff .... I knew I knew that name

he strikes me as a real nice and very interesting person ..... check out
his tales of sailing sometime at the very least and I bet you will pull
that cracked code asap .... and email the guy with your questions ...

geeeze ........ yer basically stealing from a church
 
gust said:
geeeze ........ yer basically stealing from a church
Click to expand...

No, I didn't steal from the church. And I shouldn't have written that I
modified his program.

Instead, I should have written that I modified his program's
macro-extensions, which, of course, Mr. Lutus suggested that
Arachnophilia users should do.

Bad choice of words on my part. I never changed one byte of his program,
that is, the JAR file that makes Arachnophilia run, the core and essence
of Mr. Lutus' program.

I just modified his program's macro-extensions and then struggled to
find the words to express what I had done.

All will come right in the end.

No way would I steal from this church. I respect him and his work way
too much.

Stan
 
Stan said:
No, I didn't steal from the church. And I shouldn't have written that I
modified his program.
Instead, I should have written that I modified his program's
macro-extensions, which, of course, Mr. Lutus suggested that
Arachnophilia users should do.
Bad choice of words on my part. I never changed one byte of his program,
that is, the JAR file that makes Arachnophilia run, the core and essence
of Mr. Lutus' program.
I just modified his program's macro-extensions and then struggled to
find the words to express what I had done.
All will come right in the end.
No way would I steal from this church. I respect him and his work way
too much.
Click to expand...

Whew boy! I hope everybody involved in this gets things sorted out and
that there's no bad feelings in the end. Sounds like a series of
misunderstandings. I also hope that Paul allows you to post the
macros. What you're doing sounds kind of like what J.D.:

http://www.jd5000.net/

is doing for Proxomitron, and nobody sees any harm in that.
 
Stan said:
No, I didn't steal from the church. And I shouldn't have written that I
modified his program.

Instead, I should have written that I modified his program's
macro-extensions, which, of course, Mr. Lutus suggested that
Arachnophilia users should do.
Click to expand...

No, this ("modified") is not what I recommend in the case of a distributed
macro set. I do not recommend that people distribute modifications of the
standard set of macros, but instead create macros that are kept separate
from the standard ones. In no case should an "extension" have the effect of
overwriting any of the standard macros -- that isn't even consistent with
the meaning of the word.

This is separate from the activity of editing the existing macros for
personal use. Once a person begins to think about distributing
Arachnophilia macros, the rules must change -- otherwise I will get even
more of the kind of e-mail that begins "My Arachnophilia doesn't have
button so-and-so, how come?"

This procedure is consistent with the Arachnophilia architecture, one in
which any menu or toolbar can be deactivated. Using this system, you can
create any suitable macro sets and activate them, and allow the *user* to
choose to deactivate the standard ones to conserve room in the user
interface.
Bad choice of words on my part. I never changed one byte of his program,
that is, the JAR file that makes Arachnophilia run, the core and essence
of Mr. Lutus' program.

I just modified his program's macro-extensions and then struggled to
find the words to express what I had done.

All will come right in the end.
Click to expand...

Okay, on reviewing this, I see there is a huge chasm between what you
described, and what you did.

1. Please feel free to post your macro extensions, and describe them just
that way. Make sure they are extensions, not modifications of the standard
macro set.

2. To re-emphasize, do not overwrite or delete any of the standard
Arachnophilia macros (menus, toolbars, key hooks). Create separate toolbars
and menus (or add menu items and/or toolbar buttons to exisating menus and
toolbars) to contain your own extensions.

3. In no event should you delete my "About" button from the main toolbar. I
think you now realize how significant that is. It in essence suggests that
this is somehow a different program, no longer the property of the original
author.

4. Think about what will happen at the time of the next Arachnophilia
revision, and the one after that, etc.. Your extensions should not force a
user to stick with an out-of-date version. The easiest way to do this is to
append your macros onto the existing macro file, rather than overwriting
the original, as you were doing.

5. In the future, I strongly recommend that you contact the originator of a
program as your first step, not your last.
 
Stan said:
Paul,

I am so sorry to have upset you.

I've deleted my macro-altered, JAR intact version of your program.

No offense was intended, I assure you. I believe that will become clear
to you over the course of this message.

In you message, you wrote that had I really wanted to contact you, I
would have posted to you website message board. To tell you the truth,
I've looked through you site for ways of contacting you and only found
the link to your bug report link. Perhaps that message board link was
always there for me to see. But the truth is that I never saw it (and
still can't see it).
Click to expand...

It's on the primary, tier-one menu list on the Home Page. It's labeled
"Messages". It also is easily accessed with:
http:/www.arachnoid.com/messages, and it is an address that is linked on
about 1/5 of all the pages at arachnoid.com.
You then suggested that I posted my message to a Usenet group that you
rarely read and did so for the purposes of receiving a non-reply and
taking that for permission. In fact, that's not what I intended.
Click to expand...

Be that as it may, you need to remember that your intentions may not be
reflected in how your actions are perceived (the law of unintended
consequences). Always ask yourself how your decisions will look to others.

Next, I didn't really drop your copyright notice from my non-hacked
version of Arachnophila as you suggested I did.
Click to expand...

Actually, as far as the average user is concerned, a user who never reads
help pages, the copyright notice is gone from your version. This sends a
clear signal. It's a signal that was reinforced in the content of your
deleted Web page -- that this is a "rewritten" Arachnophilia.
Yes, I did remove your
About button from the main toolbar, but I didn't remove your About
button from the Help menu or your copyright notice from your linked Help
file.
Click to expand...

You need to realize that this just doesn't fly. Under copyright law, you
can't remove *any* copyright notices. The law on this issue can't be
interpreted to mean it's all right to remove all but one notice.

Yes, I posted and offered my macro-altered (something you encourage)
version of Arachnophilia to my website,
Click to expand...

This is not correct. and I'll have to further clarify my instructions on
this point. A "macro-altered" version is the norm for end users, but should
not be distributed that way. For distribution, one must create separate
macros that do not overwrite the existing, standard macros.
but I did so in hopes that you
would download the macros and be impressed that I had devoted so much
time to working with your program. Since you're not impressed with my
work ...
Click to expand...

No, that's a bit unfair. I never even looked at your work. I have been
focusing only on the legal issues here. Arachnophilia is so popular, so
widely distributed now, that I have to address any violation of the rules
to prevent a potentially serious "slippery-slope" effect.

I've been in the software business for three decades, and I think I may have
seen everything. I've seen any number of my programs stolen in various
ingenious ways, sometimes by lawyers, sometimes simply because I wasn't
careful enough.

Example. I get regular phone calls from companies who want to buy
Arachnophilia, and I just hang up on them. Some of the less intellectually
gifted end users think that, because Arachnophilia has no price, it must
have no value. But companies don't think that -- all they know is
Arachnophilia is (typically) better than the program they are trying to get
people to pay for. So they try to buy it, just to get it out of the way.
And if I was less experienced or less wealthy, I might listen to them for
thirty seconds. Speaking hypothetically.

My point is that I have to defend Arachnophilia just as though it were being
offered for sale, because it is (as valuable as/more valuable than) a bunch
of programs that are being offered for sale.

As for your statement that I should have asked for your permission
before starting my work on Arachnophilia's macro-structure (and
templates ... which you say one can do in your Tips of the Day file),
Click to expand...

Yes, as an end user for personal use, not for distribution. I'll have to
make this distinction more clear in the next release. Released macro sets
should be kept separate from the standard ones.

< snip >
 
Stan,

I'm sure you did good work, but you used the wrong approach for publishing.

As Paul says, I suggest you modify your macros in a way so they are an
"add-on package" to arachnophilia. Tthen distribute this package separately
from Arachnophilia.

The original arachnophilia distribution may not be changed in any way,
otherwise this is a copyright violation.
 
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