OT--spam problem

[MZB]

I don't know how these idiots got my address but:

It started with 1-3 stock tips per day and now it's up to about 20. The
emails all have the same format with a different sender and innocuous
subject.

How can I screen them out??

Mel

 

[James Egan]

I don't know how these idiots got my address but:

It started with 1-3 stock tips per day and now it's up to about 20. The
emails all have the same format with a different sender and innocuous
subject.

How can I screen them out??

Buy the stock and wait for your computer to be re-possessed.


Jim

 

[Sla#s]

I don't know how these idiots got my address but:

It started with 1-3 stock tips per day and now it's up to about 20. The
emails all have the same format with a different sender and innocuous
subject.

How can I screen them out??

Do like those Russians - find the spammer then go round to his place and
beat him to a bloody pulp with baseball bats.
http://www.spamhelp.co.uk/2005/07/russian-spammer-murdered.html

That unfortunately is the only way to stop spam.

What I don't understand is, nearly 80% of all emails are spam, why do
ISPs put up with it? Do they get paid extra for it?


Slatts

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

What I don't understand is, nearly 80% of all emails are spam, why do
ISPs put up with it? Do they get paid extra for it?

"Put up with it?" <lol> If ISPs *could* stop it, they certainly would.

There have been numerous links and stories published in the last .. 10?
... years about how expensive fighting spam has become for most ISPs. It
costs real people billions of dollars/euros/yen/pick your currency every
year to try and filter it out.

There is only one way to stop spam: when all internet users take the
Boulder Pledge ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boulder_Pledge ). If a
spammer sends a million copies (virtually for free through the bot net
of zombied clueless home users), and sells just one fake Rolex, or just
one pirated copy of (name software), he makes money.

When the last spammer has not made a nickel of profit, he will quit.

 

[Ernie B.]

Do like those Russians - find the spammer then go round to his place and
beat him to a bloody pulp with baseball bats.
http://www.spamhelp.co.uk/2005/07/russian-spammer-murdered.html

That unfortunately is the only way to stop spam.

Nope. The Boulder Pledge, <http://www.panix.com/~tbetz/boulder.shtml>, is the
best way to put spammers out of business. Unfortunately spammers can show a
profit with a very small percentage of suckers replying.

What I don't understand is, nearly 80% of all emails are spam, why do
ISPs put up with it? Do they get paid extra for it?

There was a time when most ISPs enforced their AUP/TOS. Since the advent of
ignored open relays in Korea, Brazil and China and the the increase in the
number of clueless computer users who allow their systems to be 'zombied'
because they don't bother learning about safe hex or using AV and firewalls, I
suppose that the problem has become overwhelming.

 

[Ghostown]

I had the same problem and Ive got about 5 or 6 email addresses Ive had for
a long time and dont want to get rid of. A blog I visit was advertising
"Spamarrest". Its a challenge/response system designed to stop spam. It
costs about $6 per month but it stopped my spam problem completely. Its web
based and basically you redirect your incoming mail to their servers, where
if the sender or domain is not approved by you, they are sent an email with
a link that asks that they physically type in a code presented on the
website. This "proves" to them that you are not a bot or compromised
machine sending spam out and your email goes to the intended recipient. If
they do not type in the code, the mail sits on the server for 7 days or
until you delete it. Of course, you can always choose to accept whatever
mail is sent to you. All in all its an exceptional tool IMO.

www.spamarrest.com

 

[Ant]

"Spamarrest". Its a challenge/response system designed to stop spam. It
costs about $6 per month but it stopped my spam problem completely.

C/R systems might stop your spam, but they generate more unwanted
email to innocent bystanders.

if the sender or domain is not approved by you, they are sent an email with
a link that asks that they physically type in a code presented on the
website.

And what happens when the spammer forges the sender (as they always
do) with valid addresses taken from their "millions" CD?

I get loads of bounces, out-of-office-replies and challenges to mail I
never sent. Most of it is deleted, but I sometimes reply to the
misdirected challenges so the C/R user gets the spam anyway. I don't
see why I should have to suffer the backscatter from someone else's
poor server or inbox management.

To the OP (MZB):
Ask your question in alt.spam, where there are a few knowledgeable
posters who can advise about spam filtering.

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

Its a challenge/response system designed to stop spam. It
costs about $6 per month but it stopped my spam problem completely.

...and pissed off everyone else who wanted to send you real mail.

C/R systems are almost as bad as spam.

Every month I get a few requests for info at my web contact forms from
people who use one of those. I dutifully reply with the info - and get
hit with a challenge message. Well, screw 'em.

 

[Ghostown]

C/R systems might stop your spam, but they generate more unwanted
email to innocent bystanders.

How so? ..honest question.. I see it as Im just one address out of
millions they send to. If the spam doesnt get to me, how does that affect
others?

And what happens when the spammer forges the sender (as they always
do) with valid addresses taken from their "millions" CD?

The chances that the forged sender is in my approved list of senders/domains
is relatively small to almost non-existent.
In the time that Ive had this service, its caught 100% of spam sent to me
and prior to this, I got quite a bit of spam.

I get loads of bounces, out-of-office-replies and challenges to mail I
never sent. Most of it is deleted, but I sometimes reply to the
misdirected challenges so the C/R user gets the spam anyway. I don't
see why I should have to suffer the backscatter from someone else's
poor server or inbox management.

I spent a long time and many hours doing routine inbox management..creating
filters etc. Nothing has worked like this has. And Ive yet to get an
intended piece of spam. If this was to occur, I would simply block the user
or the domain and it wouldnt happen again.

Steve

 

[Ghostown]

..and pissed off everyone else who wanted to send you real mail.

Na. I dont get that much "legitimate" email anyway and when I switched
over, I let friends and family know that I was moving to a very aggressive
form of spam filtering and if they should get a C/R to take the few seconds
to verify and it would be fine. It wasnt really necessary as I had added
them as approved senders prior to implementing my solution. They never got
the C/R and I got their mail.

C/R systems are almost as bad as spam.

I havent come across any issues yet and I dont believe any of the people I
send email to have either.

Every month I get a few requests for info at my web contact forms from
people who use one of those. I dutifully reply with the info - and get
hit with a challenge message. Well, screw 'em.

Well, let me ask..what should be done about unwanted email? Filters only do
so much and personally, I got sick and tired of constantly doing inbox
maintenance and creating filters for the latest bunch of crap.

Steve

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

Na. I dont get that much "legitimate" email anyway and when I
switched over, I let friends and family know that I was moving to a
very aggressive form of spam filtering and if they should get a C/R
to take the few seconds to verify and it would be fine. It wasnt
really necessary as I had added them as approved senders prior to
implementing my solution. They never got the C/R and I got their
mail.


I havent come across any issues yet and I dont believe any of the
people I send email to have either.

No, you and your close friends don't see it. What you don't realize is
that every time a spammer uses some other victim's address in his FROM:
field to send you spam, that victim gets one of your C/R bounce
messages, further filling up *his* inbox, and making him angry at the
spammer *and* you.

Your inbox is clean, but everyone else gets twice as much junk.

Well, let me ask..what should be done about unwanted email? Filters
only do so much and personally, I got sick and tired of constantly
doing inbox maintenance and creating filters for the latest bunch of
crap.

Get an email service that better filters spam. I use AT&T Worldnet for
most mail, and their filters block at least 90-95% of incoming spam; I
can tell by viewing their web-based Screened Mail folder if I choose.

I have another web site address which has no filtering at all that I
relay to my cable internet email service. I'll get 2-300 spams per day.
However, my mail client, Thunderbird, catches almost all of them and
puts them in the Junk folder. Once every few days I click on the folder
and delete them all.

 

[Ant]

How so? ..honest question..

I explained that in the rest of my post.

I see it as Im just one address out of millions they send to.
If the spam doesnt get to me, how does that affect others?

Because you send challenges to people who didn't email you.

The chances that the forged sender is in my approved list of senders/domains
is relatively small to almost non-existent.

You don't understand. When the spammer spams you and uses my email
address as the sender, then you send a challenge to me. If my address
was used as the fake sender for every spam in a big spam-run, I could
be overwhelmed with challenges. I consider those misdirected
challenges spam, and will notify an appropriate blacklist. You could
find that some mail servers will no longer accept your mail.

I spent a long time and many hours doing routine inbox management..creating
filters etc. Nothing has worked like this has.

You should use something like SpamPal (which has the ability to query
DNSBLs) between your mail-agent and your POP server. Filtering on
bogus senders is pointless. You need to filter on the IP address where
the spam was really sent from.

And Ive yet to get an intended piece of spam. If this was to occur,
I would simply block the user or the domain and it wouldnt happen again.

The domain in the return path or the "From" does not belong to the
spammer. Tomorrow he will forge a different username and domain while
continuing to send spam by proxy from some lusers trojanised PC
connected to a large consumer ISP's broadband network.

 

[Ghostown]

No, you and your close friends don't see it. What you don't realize is

that every time a spammer uses some other victim's address in his FROM:
field to send you spam, that victim gets one of your C/R bounce
messages, further filling up *his* inbox, and making him angry at the
spammer *and* you.

This is assuming that the address in the FROM field is legitimate. The
majority of spam I get is from bots and have random generated "names".

What is the ratio of legitimate "victims" to made up addresses in the FROM
field?

Get an email service that better filters spam. I use AT&T Worldnet for
most mail, and their filters block at least 90-95% of incoming spam; I
can tell by viewing their web-based Screened Mail folder if I choose.

I would love to. I have Road Runner and they filter NOTHING. Its brutal.

I have another web site address which has no filtering at all that I
relay to my cable internet email service. I'll get 2-300 spams per day.
However, my mail client, Thunderbird, catches almost all of them and
puts them in the Junk folder. Once every few days I click on the folder
and delete them all.

I have one email account that I couldnt "protect" with Spamarrest and I
still get about 10 a day, but thats perfectly acceptable knowing what it was
before and its not one of my primary email accounts so its not a problem and
I dont even see it unless I physically go and log in to see the account.

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

Ghostown wrote:
[Beauregard wrote:]

This is assuming that the address in the FROM field is legitimate.
The majority of spam I get is from bots and have random generated
"names".

What is the ratio of legitimate "victims" to made up addresses in the
FROM field?

Who can say?

I just looked through my Junk folder, and it seems about half of them
appear to have real addresses. If I was using a C/R system, that would
be about a hundred or more people getting a challenge bounce message
every day.

If you don't think this is important, then .. well .. you just don't
care about anyone else, I suppose.

 

[Ghostown]

You should use something like SpamPal (which has the ability to query

DNSBLs) between your mail-agent and your POP server. Filtering on
bogus senders is pointless. You need to filter on the IP address where
the spam was really sent from.

Ok, I can see using DNSBL's but how does that help with the "new" spam I
get?

Ive used POPFile in the past and was pretty happy with it. This seems
better, using the BL's.

Ill give SpamPal a try and see how well it works.

Thanks

Steve

 

[Ghostown]

If you don't think this is important, then .. well .. you just don't
care about anyone else, I suppose.

Actually, I didnt understand the implications of using a C/R system. When I
did the research on it, all I saw was how its probably the most effective
form of spam management. Ant has provided me with an option called SpamPal
and Im currently setting that up. I certainly dont want my C/R being part
of the problem. All I want is for my spam problem to go away but I dont
want anyone affected needlessly. Thanks for the info. It was enlightening.
;-)

 

[Ghostown]

Just to let you know, SpamPal seems to be working just fine. It already
accurately identified 2 email on the account Im testing with.

Thanks for this heads up.

Steve

 

[Vito Corti]

Ive used POPFile in the past and was pretty happy with it.

Just wondering, why did you stop using POPFile?

Vito

 

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

Actually, I didnt understand the implications of using a C/R system.

The Real Story is not something companies providing C/R bother to tell
you...

When I did the research on it, all I saw was how its probably the
most effective form of spam management.

A simple search of the Google Group archives turns up quite a many
threads, such as this one:

Ant has provided me with an option called SpamPal and Im currently
setting that up. I certainly dont want my C/R being part of the
problem. All I want is for my spam problem to go away but I dont
want anyone affected needlessly. Thanks for the info. It was
enlightening. ;-)

Glad you found something better, and thanks for taking the time.

 

[Ghostown]

I discovered the C/R system and the other benefits Spamarrest was offering
like web based maintenance.