newbie midi editing/Anvil Studio question

  • Thread starter Thread starter J. S. Greenfield
  • Start date Start date
J

J. S. Greenfield

I found Anvil Studio, and have been trying to use it to do some simple
truncation. (I'm trying to adjust some freely available files for use
as ringers.)

I find that most of time, truncating results in a modification the rest
of the file. (i.e., it sounds different, as if some midi tracks have
been removed or modified.)

Any hints as to what I'm doing wrong, how to remedy this, or pointers to
other software packages I should consider using? (Commercial software
is ok, if it's available at a mass market price. I'm not looking to pay
huge dollars to edit ringtones. ;)

Thanks for any help.


--
J. S. Greenfield

I represent nobody but myself. The opinions expressed --
especially any particularly stupid ones -- are mine, and
mine, alone.
 
I found Anvil Studio, and have been trying to use it to do some simple
truncation. (I'm trying to adjust some freely available files for use
as ringers.)

I find that most of time, truncating results in a modification the rest
of the file. (i.e., it sounds different, as if some midi tracks have
been removed or modified.)

Any hints as to what I'm doing wrong, how to remedy this, or pointers to
other software packages I should consider using? (Commercial software
is ok, if it's available at a mass market price. I'm not looking to pay
huge dollars to edit ringtones. ;)
Click to expand...

If you're cutting off the front of the midi file, you're cutting off
the setup information, including the program change commands telling
each track what sound to play. These are conventionally included in
the "silent" bar at the beginning of a song.

I don't know how polyphonic ring tones handle program change
information. But you need to sort out how to tell each track what
sound it plays.

CubaseFAQ www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm
"Possibly the world's least impressive web site": George Perfect
 
Laurence said:
If you're cutting off the front of the midi file, you're cutting off
the setup information, including the program change commands telling
each track what sound to play. These are conventionally included in
the "silent" bar at the beginning of a song.

I don't know how polyphonic ring tones handle program change
information. But you need to sort out how to tell each track what
sound it plays.
Click to expand...

I am usually trying to clip the beginning of the file, in order to cue
the file up to a point where it actually starts making significant
sound. (8 seconds of silence/near-silence at the beginning of a file
isn't exactly ideal for a ringtone.)

I would have expected an editing tool (like Anvil) to truncate
intelligently (i.e., not deleting setup info).

Any suggestions as to how I can accomplish the desired trimming, without
screwing up the setup info?


--
J. S. Greenfield

I represent nobody but myself. The opinions expressed --
especially any particularly stupid ones -- are mine, and
mine, alone.
 
I am usually trying to clip the beginning of the file, in order to cue
the file up to a point where it actually starts making significant
sound. (8 seconds of silence/near-silence at the beginning of a file
isn't exactly ideal for a ringtone.)

I would have expected an editing tool (like Anvil) to truncate
intelligently (i.e., not deleting setup info).

Any suggestions as to how I can accomplish the desired trimming, without
screwing up the setup info?
Click to expand...

I guess you've got some MID files that DO work as ringtones? Open
them up in Anvil and see where the program change commands are. (I
imagine Anvil DOES support Control message editing?) I would expect
them to be in a short silent portion before the melody starts. Then
move the Control Change messages from your sequences to a similar
position before truncating.

A midi sequencer program can be set to look back and respond to
previous Control changes, even if playback is started from a later
point. Obviously, a player can't look back to Control messages that
have been chopped off :-)

CubaseFAQ www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm
"Possibly the world's least impressive web site": George Perfect
 
I found Anvil Studio, and have been trying to use it to do some simple
truncation. (I'm trying to adjust some freely available files for use
as ringers.)

I find that most of time, truncating results in a modification the rest
of the file. (i.e., it sounds different, as if some midi tracks have
been removed or modified.)

Any hints as to what I'm doing wrong, how to remedy this, or pointers to
other software packages I should consider using? (Commercial software
is ok, if it's available at a mass market price. I'm not looking to pay
huge dollars to edit ringtones. ;)

Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...

GNMIDI (www.gnmidi.com, shareware) has a function to alter song
length smartly in it.

As others point out, if you simply cut out part of the song --
especially the beginning -- you can cut out parts of the setup
information. There is no simple way to automatically filter that out,
other than looking at the actual song data and deciding which things
must go.

You can try to just find the first note, then cut from that point
onward. But if you're trying to cut out silence, there is no way to
know just how much of the silent start area is filled with important
info without looking.

Also, the timing of that info matters. One of the first messages
sent in many files is a GM system reset sysex, which resets a General
MIDI compatible synth to default values. It takes some time to run
the reset cycle -- this is synth dependent -- and you can't put any
other messages out until the reset completes. So to work around this,
the initial reset(s) go first in the file, then there is a wait of
about a quarter to half second with no messages, and *then* the
initial messages are sent. You can't send any notes until all of the
setup info is sent off, and depending on the song, that can take a few
milliseconds. All this adds up to simple convention: the first song
measure is left empty, with no notes.


For a simple synth, which ignores resets or doesn't need them, whose
setup messages are pretty limited, you can shorten this. But figuring
out what to take out of a file can be tricky.

GNMIDI has a function to strip all non-GM compatible messages, all
sysex, and in general simplify the MIDI file. I doubt that most
ringtone synths handle full GM compatibility, let alone a lot of the
stuff which many computer MIDI synths do (not even considering what a
lot of musical instrument synths can do). With all the extras taken
out, you might find it easier to edit.
 
J. S. Greenfield said:
I am usually trying to clip the beginning of the file, in order to cue
the file up to a point where it actually starts making significant
sound. (8 seconds of silence/near-silence at the beginning of a file
isn't exactly ideal for a ringtone.)

I would have expected an editing tool (like Anvil) to truncate
intelligently (i.e., not deleting setup info).
Click to expand...

From a MIDI sequencer's delete operation user expect that anything
(including notes, text, and settings) will be deleted in selected range.
It must be a special cut operation or requires options for deleting only
certain kind of commands (e.g. notes) that the "cut" works as you need it.

GNMIDI shareware (http://www.gnmidi.com) has such a specialized
operation to copy a part of song into a new MIDI file (leaving
important settings in result).
http://www.gnmidi.com/manual/english/index.html?cutpart.htm

If cutting away too much pause between time critical MIDI commands and
following commands then this could cause wrong sounds on some devices
(e.g. GM reset sysex requires some delay till next command).

Günter
 
Back
Top