New Program to add to spyware list

  • Thread starter Thread starter JoeM
  • Start date Start date
JoeM said:
I would like Microsoft to add iTunes to their spyware/adware list
Click to expand...

More information on the subject;
<http://www.safer-networking.org/en/news/2006-01-13.html>
<http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-6026542.html>
<http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303066>


Silj

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siljaline

MS - MVP Windows (IE/OE) & Security, AH-VSOP
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Reply to group, as return address
is invalid that we may all benefit.
 
The Weather Bug people have successfully appealed this with Microsoft, and
been delisted. Which of the guidelines that Microsoft has published do you
see Weather Bug transgressing? How about Apple? The more specific you can
be, the more likely this is to happen.

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/isv/analysis.mspx
is where the guidelines can be found.

Please don't write back and tell me that it is spyware anyway--I might or
might not agree with that--however, Microsoft needs to have a position it can
defend in court in making a distinction like this. I'd be happy to help
press the case--I've read some of the details about the Apple issue--but
unless "someone" can make a clear case under the published guidelines for
this, it ain't gonna happen. (I don't know how likely it is, even if--but
they did go after Sony, after all....)
 
When they install the spyware/adware by default.

Example: WMP10, MSN Messenger asks if you would like to be monitored to
improve the product. (which is OFF by default). If this option is enabled
by default on MSFT products or ANY products I deem it spyware/adware and
would like it marked for removal.
 
I think Microsoft is increasingly very careful about such options--every new
product I've seen from them has better wording about the kinds of
interactions between your machine and their servers, and clearer wording
about the choices you make that involve such interactions at install time.

I'm not sure that simply having an option and it being on by default is
enough to make a product spyware according to Microsoft's current guidelines,
though. If the interactions are clearly described in the EULA, I suspect
that's enough--but I'd have to read all the stuff about Apple, and go back
and read the guidelines again--and I'm going to leave that to the folks that
are sufficiently incensed about this issue to spend the time. I'm not at all
belittling the effort--it just isn't something I can take on personally.
 
Weather bug has the spyware turned on by default, other p2p programs
include spyware by default, some of which have an option (check box) to not
install it. But most Spyware removal program count them as spyware.
 
Just install iTunes again ver6.0.2 still has the adware installed by
default.
Second there has been several reports plus severl machines I have worked on
that had spyware come through apple podcast,(which by the way is on by
default). And since iTunes is always running on your computer(through
services) you are more prone to being attacked. You don't see WMP always
loading when you install it now do you.
 
Then when you turn the dam ad off you have a popup window taking up half the
screen asking you to turn it off. Now tell me why I don't have any of
these problems with WMP and my mp3 player.
 
JoeM said:
Weather bug has the spyware turned on by default, other p2p programs
include spyware by default, some of which have an option (check box) to not
install it. But most Spyware removal program count them as spyware.
Click to expand...

From my experience that Spyware cannot be easily shutdown once
installed (e.g. the one that comes with Mess plus). However when you
close iTunes, it goes.
 
JoeM said:
Actuall that is not true, since iTunes is always running. Check your
services
Click to expand...

Yes but it's not always sending data. The service is only to iPods can
be used. It's not like adware that randomly pops up with no close button.

Anyone with common sense, and no grudge against Apple can see it aint
spyware!
 
That part my be true, but they have a problem with their services, 1 it
takes away resources and customers want to know why their computers are
slowing down, and 2 a vulnerability was discovered with this service that
allows spyway/virues to download and run. Now I don't see any WMP services
running or any MP3 player services running.
 
You're really mixing apples and oranges here, I think:

1) the vulnerability was in Itunes versions before 4.7.1.
http://www.idefense.com/intelligence/vulnerabilities/display.php?id=180

This thread was started because of feature found in Itunes 6.0.2, right?

I do agree that vendors need to do a better job of describing to the users
what interactions the software has with other machines across the Internet
or other networks, however.

2)--the issue of resources and load on the users machine: What software
vendor gives any clear indication about these issues? I'm not aware of any
guidance you can find about this kind of issue other than looking at minimum
system requirements and the like--or perhaps other users experience in
groups such as these. Sure--extra "features" Apple adds do use resources on
your machine. It'd be nice to be able to turn every one of them on or off
easily, quickly, and without repercussions for any other functionality on
the system or within the application. I've yet to find an app of any
complexity that really allows for all that though.....

In the last analysis--uninstalling the app, not buying the product--is the
recourse a consumer has--and that's a lot more likely to have a clear effect
than critiquing the product in a third party forum, such as this one.

I realize that you had a specific request in starting the thread--and it was
a reasonable idea--I don't know whether Microsoft is likely to take cues
from these groups about such a matter--but it certainly doesn't hurt to
bring the matter up--but it needs to be clearly described in terms of
Microsofts published criteria--exactly how Itunes 6.0.2 is in violation of
those criteria.

As I understand it Apple has modified the app slightly to give clearer
notice to the user about this interaction.

I've got to say that this sure reminds me of the Alexa feature in Internet
Explorer that raised such a fuss--you bring up a URL, and then there's a
"like sites" button or something like that that you can hit. Well--hitting
that button passed the URL up to Alexa so they could pass back "like
sites."--not too hard to understand, you'd think--but raised enough ruckus
that the feature is gone.

We're demanding (or maybe the vendors are providing) functionality that
resembles magic in apps these days--then when we figure out the hocus pocus
behind that magic we're offended--what--you mean it isn't Extra Sensory
Perception that enables Apple to show me music that is similar to the music
that I am listening to?

I'm sounding off too much here--I guess--I agree with you that the feature
needed to be better described and laid out in the eula and other descriptive
material--and they've improved on that--so I'm willing to let it rest at
this point.

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