New Printer Advice Appreciated

[Wendy]

As Director of a not for profit, most everything I need to print for
clients is primarily in a jpg format. I scan tons of CD inserts and
import them onto a 6 x 13-3/4 x 3/4" Matte paper for album insertion.
I currently use an Epson 6600. It's beyond slow.

What I'm specifically looking for in a printer:
An all in one - As I need to scan, copy and print
Has 4 individual ink cartridges, 3 Color & 1 Bk
Is relatively fast
Prints great jpgs
Uses ink efficiently
Ink cartridges are more affordable (we're a not for profit)
Is consistent and reliable
Feeds paper accurately

Also, if an effort to reduce our costs of ink usage, we've tried to
use a few generic brands of ink (one advertised on this page) with
compromised graphics as a result. If anyone knows of a good source to
buy ink cartridges that offers a lower cost without greatly
diminishing the results of a printed page full of jpgs, I would be
grateful to know. Every dime we save goes into helping those very ill
or dying...so...I do my best to continually reduce costs.

I greatly appreciate any help you can give me,

Wendy

 

[Burt]

As Director of a not for profit, most everything I need to print for
clients is primarily in a jpg format. I scan tons of CD inserts and
import them onto a 6 x 13-3/4 x 3/4" Matte paper for album insertion.
I currently use an Epson 6600. It's beyond slow.

What I'm specifically looking for in a printer:
An all in one - As I need to scan, copy and print
Has 4 individual ink cartridges, 3 Color & 1 Bk
Is relatively fast
Prints great jpgs
Uses ink efficiently
Ink cartridges are more affordable (we're a not for profit)
Is consistent and reliable
Feeds paper accurately

Also, if an effort to reduce our costs of ink usage, we've tried to
use a few generic brands of ink (one advertised on this page) with
compromised graphics as a result. If anyone knows of a good source to
buy ink cartridges that offers a lower cost without greatly
diminishing the results of a printed page full of jpgs, I would be
grateful to know. Every dime we save goes into helping those very ill
or dying...so...I do my best to continually reduce costs.

I greatly appreciate any help you can give me,

Wendy

Wendy - the previous generation of Canon multipurpose printers were an
excellent choice for your needs. There are still some new and some
refurbished MP780 printers available online. This printer has a large black
cartridge for text printing and four carts - magenta, cyan, yellow, and
black, for color and photo printing. There are lots of vendors with
compatable carts available, but you should consider refilling your carts
inhouse for much cheaper ink and better control over consistancy in your ink
supply. Refilling is very easy and the minimal mess is easily controlled
once you have done it a few times. I found one source online for the
printer and you should check with them to be certain it is a new unit. If
you are interested in refilling your own carts there are good instructions
from the online vendors and there is a forum - the Nifty-Stuff forum - that
has lots of info on bulk inks, refilling techniques, tips and tricks, and
problem solving when using refilled carts. You will be able to refill for
about $1 per cart. MIS, Formulabs, Hobbicolors, and Computer Friends have
good quality refill inks. If you are interested in really saving money this
is the way to go.

Canon has new models of multipurpose printers, but the ink carts are
chipped. They are a good alternative if you can't find the mp780. You can
refill them as well, but you lose the ink monitoring function and may also
void your warranty. The aftermarket prefilled carts don't have the chips on
them and you have to transplant the chip from the Canon cart to the
aftermarket cart to make them work.

I am on the board of a non-profit that does important community charitable
work. If we were on a really tight budget I would do exactly what I am
suggesting. If you have volunteers or staff members with the time to do the
refilling this is the way to go. It would be best, however, to have one
person learn the little tricks in the refilling technique and do it.
Otherwise you could experiment with aftermarket prefilled carts to see which
ones might be the best. Participants on this NG and the nifty forum can
possibly suggest good aftermarket prefilled carts for you.

Bulk refill inks will not harm the printer. The only downside is that the
refill inks are less fade resistant over time. From what you've described,
you don't need archival quality in your printing. Pay no attention, by the
way, to the comments from our newsgroup troll, Measekite, who generally
follows my posts with derisive comments about aftermarket inks and their
vendors.

http://www.shoplet.com/office/db/CNM9791A002.html
http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/

 

[Dan G]

Canon MP460 is a safe bet. Newer Canon models have chipped ink tanks, so
using compatibles takes a few extra steps to get around that. Refilling has
the same hurdle to clear.

This AIO printer has lots of great user reviews. If you want to go with more
gizmos and extras, look at the higher-priced Canon MP models.

 

[measekite]

As Director of a not for profit, most everything I need to print for
clients is primarily in a jpg format. I scan tons of CD inserts and
import them onto a 6 x 13-3/4 x 3/4" Matte paper for album insertion.
I currently use an Epson 6600. It's beyond slow.

What I'm specifically looking for in a printer:
An all in one - As I need to scan, copy and print
Has 4 individual ink cartridges, 3 Color & 1 Bk
Is relatively fast
Prints great jpgs
Uses ink efficiently
Ink cartridges are more affordable (we're a not for profit)
Is consistent and reliable
Feeds paper accurately

Also, if an effort to reduce our costs of ink usage, we've tried to
use a few generic brands of ink (one advertised on this page) with
compromised graphics as a result. ++

All Generic non OEM ink will not only produce lesser results but will
also have tendencies to fade more rapidly and has a higher risk of clogging.

If you print a great deal I would not get an all in one because if one
function goes out you lost the other. I would get a Canon IP4300 and an
Epson Scanner that is as good as the 4180. If you must get an all in
one then get a Canon MP500 or better.

 

[Warren Block]

Also, if an effort to reduce our costs of ink usage, we've tried to
use a few generic brands of ink (one advertised on this page) with
compromised graphics as a result.

This is a newsgroup. You are apparently seeing it through Google, along
with their advertising. Don't mistake that for an endorsement by the
members of the newsgoup.

 

[Tony]

As Director of a not for profit, most everything I need to print for
clients is primarily in a jpg format. I scan tons of CD inserts and
import them onto a 6 x 13-3/4 x 3/4" Matte paper for album insertion.
I currently use an Epson 6600. It's beyond slow.

What I'm specifically looking for in a printer:
An all in one - As I need to scan, copy and print
Has 4 individual ink cartridges, 3 Color & 1 Bk
Is relatively fast
Prints great jpgs
Uses ink efficiently
Ink cartridges are more affordable (we're a not for profit)
Is consistent and reliable
Feeds paper accurately

Also, if an effort to reduce our costs of ink usage, we've tried to
use a few generic brands of ink (one advertised on this page) with
compromised graphics as a result. If anyone knows of a good source to
buy ink cartridges that offers a lower cost without greatly
diminishing the results of a printed page full of jpgs, I would be
grateful to know. Every dime we save goes into helping those very ill
or dying...so...I do my best to continually reduce costs.

I greatly appreciate any help you can give me,

Wendy

Wendy
Please ignore the poster that said "All Generic non OEM ink will not only
produce lesser results but will
also have tendencies to fade more rapidly and has a higher risk of clogging."
He is right in a very limited way, generic ink is not a good idea, where he is
deliberately misleading is that he does not differentiate between Generic and
Compatible inks, compatible inks from one of the several excellent brands will
not do any of the bad things he mentions. If in doubt, google his name and you
will see just how much misinformation he posts.
Tony

 

[Wendy]

Wendy
Please ignore the poster that said "All Generic non OEM ink will not only
produce lesser results but will
also have tendencies to fade more rapidly and has a higher risk of clogging."
He is right in a very limited way, generic ink is not a good idea, where he is
deliberately misleading is that he does not differentiate between Generic and
Compatible inks, compatible inks from one of the several excellent brands will
not do any of the bad things he mentions. If in doubt, google his name and you
will see just how much misinformation he posts.
Tony- Hide quoted text -

- Hide quoted text -

I wanted to stop by and thank everyone for their advice. You can bet
I'll be looking at purchasing a Canon AIO and one of the models
suggested, soon. Also, I don't have any problem refilling ink
cartridges, aside from the fact that it's one more thing I have to
do. But I used to refill HP tricolors without a hitch and since my
greater concern is saving money without compromising the printed
results, it's well worth my time.

And yeah, unfortunately, I do have to go through Google to access
these groups now, but the bottom line is that I didn't assume this
newsgroup was endorcing any ads I might have seen here. I just
noticed 1800Save**** 's ad on the page...and while their prices are
great, the results don't meet my need. But I'll admit...I'm a wee bit
anal when it comes to printing quality.

Thanks again,

Wendy

 

[measekite]

Wendy
Please ignore the this
poster

who is in the printing business and is partial to the relabelers in his
industry. You need to watch the posters with financial interests in
this industry.

that said "All Generic non OEM ink will not only
produce lesser results but will
also have tendencies to fade more rapidly and has a higher risk of clogging."

 

[measekite]

I wanted to stop by and thank everyone for their advice. You can bet
I'll be looking at purchasing a Canon AIO and one of the models
suggested, soon. Also, I don't have any problem refilling ink
cartridges, aside from the fact that it's one more thing I have to
do. But I used to refill HP tricolors without a hitch and since my
greater concern is saving money without compromising the printed
results, it's well worth my time.

And yeah, unfortunately, I do have to go through Google to access
these groups now, but the bottom line is that I didn't assume this
newsgroup was endorcing any ads I might have seen here. I just
noticed 1800Save**** 's ad on the page...and while their prices are
great, the results don't meet my need. But I'll admit...I'm a wee bit
anal when it comes to printing quality.

If you are then you will use Canon ink. If you do not use Canon ink
then you are not anal when it comes to photo quality but it means that
you do not know how to properly judge results.

 

[Burt]

I wanted to stop by and thank everyone for their advice. You can bet
I'll be looking at purchasing a Canon AIO and one of the models
suggested, soon. Also, I don't have any problem refilling ink
cartridges, aside from the fact that it's one more thing I have to
do. But I used to refill HP tricolors without a hitch and since my
greater concern is saving money without compromising the printed
results, it's well worth my time.

And yeah, unfortunately, I do have to go through Google to access
these groups now, but the bottom line is that I didn't assume this
newsgroup was endorcing any ads I might have seen here. I just
noticed 1800Save**** 's ad on the page...and while their prices are
great, the results don't meet my need. But I'll admit...I'm a wee bit
anal when it comes to printing quality.

Thanks again,

Wendy

The mp780 (if you can get one) has what I believe is the print engine of the
ip4000, a very good, fast printer. You may be concerned about the price for
an older generation printer, but the savings in ink will more than make up
for the up front costs. I've used MIS inks in my i960 and ip5000 and find
the color response excellent. You will have to experiment with settings,
but this ink is very close to OEM ink colors. Others have been very happy
with Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and Hobbicolors inks that can be
purchased, along with extra empty carts from their ebay site.

 

[Wendy]

The mp780 (if you can get one) has what I believe is the print engine of the
ip4000, a very good, fast printer. You may be concerned about the price for
an older generation printer, but the savings in ink will more than make up
for the up front costs. I've used MIS inks in my i960 and ip5000 and find
the color response excellent. You will have to experiment with settings,
but this ink is very close to OEM ink colors. Others have been very happy
with Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and Hobbicolors inks that can be
purchased, along with extra empty carts from their ebay site.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not to intentionally disagree with you, measekite, but Costco used to
sell refill kits and I used that kit to refill my home HP printer -
which was included within the list of many brands. If there was a
difference in print quality (including photos), it wasn't one I could
detect. So, in my opinion, refills are a viable choice...when a
trusted and reliable source is used. I'll admit, I don't know much
about Canon AIOs though. I simply wanted input from this group and
I'm very glad I stopped by to receive it! I'll direct my purchase to
a Canon product...

Thanks again,

Wendy

 

[Burt]

Not to intentionally disagree with you, measekite, but Costco used to
sell refill kits and I used that kit to refill my home HP printer -
which was included within the list of many brands. If there was a
difference in print quality (including photos), it wasn't one I could
detect. So, in my opinion, refills are a viable choice...when a
trusted and reliable source is used. I'll admit, I don't know much
about Canon AIOs though. I simply wanted input from this group and
I'm very glad I stopped by to receive it! I'll direct my purchase to
a Canon product...

Thanks again,

Wendy

Wendy - the Costco refill kits are branded IMS (not to be confused with MIS,
the ink I use) and are sold as universal for several brands of printers.
IMS ink is essentially generic and most of us avoid using generic inks. You
were lucky that they worked well with your HP. Best advice is to purchase
inks formulated for your printer. The ones I mentioned have a good
reputation with real users on this NG and the Nifty-Stuff forum. No need to
apologize about disagreeing with Measekite - He spews misinformation
constantly. He has a pathological aversion to anyone who reports success
with aftermarket ink. This has been going on for more than two years that
I've been on this NG. For the longest time his posts were openly
antagonistic, profane, and demeaning to all who disagreed with him. He
admittedly has no firsthand knowledge of this subject and still misinforms
anyone who will maintain any dialog with him. Nearly all the regular
participants on this NG have killfiled him.

If you want more advice on refilling the bci-6 and bci-3ebk carts go onto
the Nifty-Stuff forum. Good info on creating and sealing a fill hole,
occasionally purging carts to renew them to good function, etc. If you get
into refilling you should consider buying a set of squeeze bottles from
Howard Electronics. No more syringes needed as these squeeze bottles have a
fitting that a hypodermic needle fits into. I bought 2 oz. bottles with
needles but called and asked them to substitute longer needles instead of
the one half inch ones they send with them.

http://heinc.com/kahnetics/squeezebottles.html

 

[Wendy]

Wendy - the Costco refill kits are branded IMS (not to be confused with MIS,
the ink I use) and are sold as universal for several brands of printers.
IMS ink is essentially generic and most of us avoid using generic inks. You
were lucky that they worked well with your HP. Best advice is to purchase
inks formulated for your printer. The ones I mentioned have a good
reputation with real users on this NG and the Nifty-Stuff forum. No need to
apologize about disagreeing with Measekite - He spews misinformation
constantly. He has a pathological aversion to anyone who reports success
with aftermarket ink. This has been going on for more than two years that
I've been on this NG. For the longest time his posts were openly
antagonistic, profane, and demeaning to all who disagreed with him. He
admittedly has no firsthand knowledge of this subject and still misinforms
anyone who will maintain any dialog with him. Nearly all the regular
participants on this NG have killfiled him.

If you want more advice on refilling the bci-6 and bci-3ebk carts go onto
the Nifty-Stuff forum. Good info on creating and sealing a fill hole,
occasionally purging carts to renew them to good function, etc. If you get
into refilling you should consider buying a set of squeeze bottles from
Howard Electronics. No more syringes needed as these squeeze bottles have a
fitting that a hypodermic needle fits into. I bought 2 oz. bottles with
needles but called and asked them to substitute longer needles instead of
the one half inch ones they send with them.

http://heinc.com/kahnetics/squeezebottles.html- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thank you so much for all this information. It would have taken me
quite a bit of time to research this on my own.

Let me ask one more question. I got plenty of advice and went looking
for a Canon AIO. I love to shop Costco because of their return
policy...especially when it concerns our foundation. I found a Canon
PIXMA MP530 there for $200 (seems pretty inexpensive for all that's
included). Here's the link. Unless there's an issue with this Costco
package, I'd like to lean in this direction. Any particular issues
you'd like to share with me that might change my mind?

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Produc...75&Ns=P_Price|1||P_SignDesc1&Sp=C&ec=&topnav=

Also, thanks for the extensive info covering the ink subject. Once
again, saved me tons of time...and money down the road.

Wendy

 

[Burt]

(snip)>

Thank you so much for all this information. It would have taken me
quite a bit of time to research this on my own.

Let me ask one more question. I got plenty of advice and went looking
for a Canon AIO. I love to shop Costco because of their return
policy...especially when it concerns our foundation. I found a Canon
PIXMA MP530 there for $200 (seems pretty inexpensive for all that's
included). Here's the link. Unless there's an issue with this Costco
package, I'd like to lean in this direction. Any particular issues
you'd like to share with me that might change my mind?

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Produc...75&Ns=P_Price|1||P_SignDesc1&Sp=C&ec=&topnav=

Also, thanks for the extensive info covering the ink subject. Once
again, saved me tons of time...and money down the road.

Wendy

The mp530 does use the four separate dye-based carts, but it is the most
recent generation of Canon printers and the ink carts have a computer chip
on them to prevent refilling. There are compatable inks for them and they
can be refilled, but once emptied the carts send a message to the printer
that they are empty (even if you refill them) and you get a "nag" message
that continuing to print with them will void your warranty. You can bypass
the message, but Canon has set the printer up to disable the ink level
indicator. This leaves you with the requirement to monitor your ink levels
visually or risk damaging the printhead if you run a cart dry. Not a big
deal if you are the only user, but not a great option if several people who
don't understand this issue are using the printer.

There are aftermarket prefilled carts available for the mp530, but they
don't have the chips on them and require that you remove the chip from the
original cart and attach it to the aftermarket one. You still run into the
problem of having to bypass the nag screen and possibly voiding the
warranty.

Even though the 780 will cost more, there are aftermarket inks and prefilled
cartridges available that are easy to use, and, if you can find a new one,
you will have a year warranty without concern for Canon voiding it if you
refill.

The Costco price is OK, and I buy things from Costco frequently. I have
done better online. Buy.com has the mp530 for sale for $180 net, including
shipping and tax. Amazon sells it for about $185 net. I've bought printers
from both of them. You are right that Costco has a no-questions-asked
return policy which is very convenient.

I don't know how big or how well funded your non-profit is. If it is really
cash-strapped and if you have the time to refill carts I feel you are best
off to spend the extra money on a new mp780 if you can find one and learn to
refill the carts. The consumables are the real cost with these units. In
addition, you may end up losing more with the 530 if you refill, lose the
warranty before the year is up, and have to buy a new printer. It has been
my experience that good aftermarket inks will not harm the printer any more
than Canon OEM inks will, but the chipped carts and their feature to
purposely defeat refilling are a problem.

A suggestion - if you buy the mp780 online, have someone use a platinum
credit card with an extended warranty feature purchase it. I have replaced
a printer and had an external hard drive repaired by my credit card provider
after the original warranty had expired. My card doubled the warranty from
the one year the manufacturer provided.

 

[measekite]

I do not argue that it is a good printer but that advice is downright
stupid. Why buy technology that is 2 generations old. The new Canon
ink is more fade resistant. And I know it is $2.00 more a cart. And it
will not clog the printer and it will produce much better results than
generic ink. And it is consistent.You never know what you are getting because they will not tell you and
each time you purchase you never know if it is the same formula.

Not to intentionally disagree with you, measekite, but Costco used to
sell refill kits and I used that kit to refill my home HP printer -
which was included within the list of many brands. If there was a
difference in print quality (including photos), it wasn't one I could
detect.

If you could not tell that is because of your inability to discern
quality. Costco discontinued the generic ink because of the rapid
fading and because of the complaints about the ink clogging their
customers printers. And many returned their printers because of
clogging and poor results and it was costing Costco more than what they
were making on the inferior ink.

So, in my opinion, refills are a viable choice...when a
trusted and reliable source is used. I'll admit, I don't know much

I agree with you

snip

 

[measekite]

That is a refillers cult and you will not get an objective answer
there. Look to Wilhelm Labs, PC World and PC Magazine for more
objective tests.

 

[Wendy]

That is a refillers cult and you will not get an objective answer
there. Look to Wilhelm Labs, PC World and PC Magazine for more
objective tests.







- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- hide quoted text -

Thanks for all your help, Burt. I greatly appreciate all the time
you've taken to give me so much info. If I have any more questions
I'll contact you directly...if you don't mind. I lose interest in
participating in forums and newsgroups because of pimetime "players"
like measekite. But you've given me plenty of info to satisfy my
needs. Thanks again!

Wendy

measekite...What I don't understand is why you enjoy acting like that
arrogant bully that loves to play King of the Hill, taking pleasure in
knocking people down. It's obvious you're intelligent, so I'm
surprised you've somehow neglected to learn that while you might stand
atop this hill, you stand...alone. What I would suggest to you is to
take the high road instead of enjoying being on top of your haughty
hill, because while you've proven you're a character, it seems you've
failed to develop any. Just provide info without the sniping. Try
it...

 

[measekite]

As Director of a not for profit, most everything I need to print for
clients is primarily in a jpg format. I scan tons of CD inserts and
import them onto a 6 x 13-3/4 x 3/4" Matte paper for album insertion.
I currently use an Epson 6600. It's beyond slow.

What I'm specifically looking for in a printer:
An all in one - As I need to scan, copy and print
Has 4 individual ink cartridges, 3 Color & 1 Bk
Is relatively fast
Prints great jpgs
Uses ink efficiently
Ink cartridges are more affordable (we're a not for profit)
Is consistent and reliable
Feeds paper accurately

Also, if an effort to reduce our costs of ink usage, we've tried to
use a few generic brands of ink

That is why you are not for profit. Generic ink in the long run costs
more money