network problem access 97/2003

  • Thread starter Thread starter steve goodrich
  • Start date Start date
S

steve goodrich

I have had an Access 97 database on the network for 5 years that over 100
members of our staff use daily. The database has worked perfectly. Recently
I amended it slightly and added a few validation rules.

It works ok for the majority of staff but a few have had trouble accessing
it - I'm not sure exactly what the problems are because I'm out of the
office for a couple of weeks - but one e-mail I received quoted the
following error message:-



"The document caused a serious error the last time it was opened, would you
like to continue opening it"



I know this particular user has Access 2003 installed if that makes any
difference.



Can anyone offer any advice as what the problem could be?



Thanks for any advice



Steve Goodrich
 
I'm going to guess that your database is residing in its entirety as 1 file
on the server. If that's the case, the fact that it hasn't corrupted before
now is a testament to the quality and stability of the Access 97 application
code. In fact, with a hundred users, I'd consider it a minor miracle.

Immediately, import all the objects into a new clean database and then split
it with the data only on the server and a copy of the front-end on each
workstation. Now your Access 2003 user will have his own version which can
access the data on the server. There is a database splitter utility. In
Access 97 it is located at: Tools >>> Add-Ins >>> Database Splitter.
 
steve goodrich said:
I have had an Access 97 database on the network for 5 years that over 100
members of our staff use daily. The database has worked perfectly. Recently
I amended it slightly and added a few validation rules.

It works ok for the majority of staff but a few have had trouble accessing
it - I'm not sure exactly what the problems are because I'm out of the
office for a couple of weeks - but one e-mail I received quoted the
following error message:-



"The document caused a serious error the last time it was opened, would you
like to continue opening it"



I know this particular user has Access 2003 installed if that makes any
difference.



Can anyone offer any advice as what the problem could be?



Thanks for any advice



Steve Goodrich
 
as far as I am aware although you can do 'read only' data operations on a 97
mdb table you cannot update 97 tables from Access 2003 , to be able to do
this you need to convert to Access 2000 table. structure.
 
simcon said:
as far as I am aware although you can do 'read only' data operations on a
97
mdb table you cannot update 97 tables from Access 2003 , to be able to do
this you need to convert to Access 2000 table. structure.

The data in Access 97 tables is fully updateable with Access 2000, 2002, and
2003 databases. I haven't had Access 97 tables anywhere where I could check
them with Access 2007. What is read only is the database structure. That is
only updateable with the same format as it's written in.
 
The data in Access 97 tables is fully updateable with Access 2000,
2002, and 2003 databases. I haven't had Access 97 tables anywhere
where I could check them with Access 2007. What is read only is
the database structure. That is only updateable with the same
format as it's written in.

Don't you mean the same version of Jet, not Access?
 
David W. Fenton said:
Don't you mean the same version of Jet, not Access?

I'm not sure I follow your question. Versions of Access since Access 2000
have multiple versions of Jet. For instance Access 2002 can read and write
Access objects in 2000 or 2002/2003 or Jet engine objects in 2000 or
2002/2003.
 
I'm not sure I follow your question. Versions of Access since
Access 2000 have multiple versions of Jet. For instance Access
2002 can read and write Access objects in 2000 or 2002/2003 or Jet
engine objects in 2000 or 2002/2003.

The whole reason A2K2 and A2K3 can handle A2K MDBs is because the
Jet data structures that store the Access project are Jet 4 data
structures.

A replicated A2K database is still updatable in all later versions
of Access, but that is *not* the case for differing *Jet* versions.
That is, A2K cannot update tables in an A97 replicated back end
(i.e., Jet 3.5). So, it is not true that all older data tables are
updatable by later versions. Certain functionality requires the same
Jet engine to be updatable.
 
David;

Have you got a reference for that somewhere?

I swear to god that's the first I've ever heard of that; and I used to
work in a mixed 97/2000 environment.. maybe this is the reason I left
MDB in the first place.... Because I was tired of random 'you cant
edit this record' problems

I used 97 and 2000 extensively; it was a nightmare

and then one day I figured out how to spell ADP.

I'm just curious if this is documented somewhere by Microsoft; because
im not positive that I believe you. You have previously made
erroneous claims and I want to be able to seperate the fact from the
fiction.

For example you are the one that said 'Access 97 replication works
flawlessly' and 'Access 2000 replication works flawlessly'

and I don't believe that your 97 / 2000 incompatability fits very well
in the model of 'Access 97 replication works flawlessly' if I can't
update those records using Access 2000.

Like seriously here.

I want to know if you came to that conclusion yourself; or if you read
that somewhere from MS.

Thanks


-Aaron
 
The database is indeed just one file. I thought it should be split, but
never having done it before and the database being so stable I didn't
attempt to split it - If it aint broke don't fix it is my usual policy!



The idea of splitting the database has raised all sorts of questions from
various users. Here are some of them.

If you could answer any of them it would be most appreciated





QUESTIONS



a..
b.. Should the front end be converted to a mde file before distributing?
c.. Are there any disadvantages to splitting?
d.. Would I need a copy of Access 2003 installing on my pc as well as 97
e.. How easy to update front end?
f.. Would I need to convert a copy to 2003 so I could distribute to 2003
users.
g.. if I had my back end in 2003 would access97 users be able to use it?
h..
i.. Should I e-mail a copy of the front end to all users, and will I need
to send a new version out if I make any amendments to the form. If so how
can I be sure that the user will use the new version.
j.. Will the table links work across different networks?
k.. Some offices use the same public folder. Can I place a copy of the
database in the public folder (max of 2 people would use it at any one
time - the are 16 people in one office for example but only 2 pcs, or would
it be better to send them a copy each.
l.. Every ones personal files are stored on one of our networks - can the
database be stored with these documents or should it be stored on the
workstations hard drive, ie C drive. ( we have staff who use more than one
pc and staff who share the same pc).
 
you should not listen to these fools

splitting makes things more complex

and all it does is make you think that you now have a 'database
server'

move your data to a real database server-- like sql server and use
access data projects

mdb is unnecessarily complex; ADP is plug and play.

ADP is easier development; you can reuse business logic across all of
your machines.. with MDB you're always pushing out a new version and
copying queries around.. I mean the whole frontend / backend thing is
really really ridiculous
 
The database is indeed just one file. I thought it should be
split, but never having done it before and the database being so
stable I didn't attempt to split it - If it aint broke don't fix
it is my usual policy!

If it's not split, it's already "broke," in my opinion.
The idea of splitting the database has raised all sorts of
questions from various users. Here are some of them.

If you could answer any of them it would be most appreciated

QUESTIONS

a..

The answer to question a. is "". ;)
b.. Should the front end be converted to a mde file before
distributing?

Distributing as an MDE has certain advantages (no loss of global
variables on an unhandled error, smaller size, no decompiling, no
ability for users to edit, slightly faster execution in some cases),
but also can have disadvantages (no ability to fix a bug for a
single user in their MDB without pushing out a new MDE, potential
problems in a mixed environment with multiple versions of Access on
the desktop of the users).
c.. Are there any disadvantages to splitting?

It can cause a decrease in performance, but usually it's not one
that matters except in cases where the original monolithic app was
incredibly badly designed.
d.. Would I need a copy of Access 2003 installing on my pc as
well as 97

Not sure I understand. If you have a split database, you can leave
the back end tables in A97 and create your front end in A97 for the
A97 users, and then convert to A2K format for your A2K3 users.
Splitting makes this *easier*.
e.. How easy to update front end?

As easy as FILE | COPY. It can be easily automated with tools like
Tony Toews' front end updater utility.
f.. Would I need to convert a copy to 2003 so I could distribute
to 2003
users.

Ideally, you'd distribute to those users in A2K format, which is
usable in A2K, A2K2, A2K3 and A2K7, whereas A2K3 format is usable
only in A2K3 and A2K7. Of course, since your app derives from A97,
there is no advantage at all to using the A2K3 format, since you
won't be taking advantage of any of the features added in A2K3 that
make its format different from A2K2 or A2K.

But it *is* possible for an A97 MDB to be enabled to run in later
versions of Access. I don't know how complete that is, though, nor
how stable.
g.. if I had my back end in 2003 would access97 users be able to
use it?

Absolutely not.

See answer to question a. ;)
i.. Should I e-mail a copy of the front end to all users, and
will I need
to send a new version out if I make any amendments to the form.
If so how can I be sure that the user will use the new version.

If you use an automatic update like Tony Toews', then you won't have
to worry about it.
j.. Will the table links work across different networks?

If they are mapped appropriately, or dynamically re-assigned at
runtime, yes.
k.. Some offices use the same public folder. Can I place a copy
of the
database in the public folder (max of 2 people would use it at any
one time - the are 16 people in one office for example but only 2
pcs, or would it be better to send them a copy each.

Each user should have a separate copy of the front end.
l.. Every ones personal files are stored on one of our networks
- can the
database be stored with these documents or should it be stored on
the workstations hard drive, ie C drive. ( we have staff who use
more than one pc and staff who share the same pc).

I'd store it on the C: drive if the domain policies allow it because
then the front end doesn't have to be loaded across the network. But
chances are that there won't be a huge difference between these two
alterantives.
 
If it is in MDB then it is BROKE!

I can use SQL Server Profiler, Database Tuning Advisor.. Sql Agent,
Replication.

MDB is for cripples and retards that don't have the capacity to learn
SQL Server

-Aaron
MCITP: Database Administrator
 
David's answers, as usual, are right on. I'd like to add a few comments:

1. If it ain't split is IS broke ... or eventually will be.

2. The slight performance hit is only noticeable if you are running the
front-end from the server as well as the back-end.

3. Copies of the front-end are always placed on the server as a backup, or
if there is an update. User's then download them to their workstation, or
have it done automatically by Tony Toews AutoFE Updater
http://www.granite.ab.ca/access/autofe.htm or my Starter
http://www.datastrat.com/Download/Starter.zip which can use versioning, or
just replace the file at startup (i.e. no front-end maintenance)

4. Without exception, every user runs his/her own copy of the front-end from
their workstation. NEVER run the front-end from the server unless it's a
Terminal Server. In that case, always have a separate folder for each user
with his/her own copy.
--
Arvin Meyer, MCP, MVP
http://www.datastrat.com
http://www.mvps.org/access
http://www.accessmvp.com
 
Thanks for your time guys, Given me quite a bit to think about.
Steve
If it is in MDB then it is BROKE!

I can use SQL Server Profiler, Database Tuning Advisor.. Sql Agent,
Replication.

MDB is for cripples and retards that don't have the capacity to learn
SQL Server

-Aaron
MCITP: Database Administrator
 
I just swear that you con artists preach 'unnecessary complexity' so
that you can SELL him a bandaid next month when he needs some DAO to
refresh tables

ADP IS SO MUCH SIMPLER!
 
Back
Top