Modem Problems

[JH]

Hope someone can help me. I have already posted previously wrt. this
problem. I will describe it again:

I have a (now relatively) new computer which initially had some problems and
the HD and graphics card had to be replaced. Installed a PCI modem which at
location A works perfectly well. It dials out and connects at a resonable
speed. So no problems. Brought the computer to location B and as soon as I
attached the modem to the phone line I noticed listening to the dial tone
that it was less audible (fyi no ADSL on this line). When trying to dial out
the modem does not detect the dial tone. When telling it to blind dial I can
hear it dial but the dial tone remains. So it never gets a connection. I
have tried 2 different modems at this location. The first had the same
problem as just described, the second seemed to work but after about a month
the phones went dead and the telco people had to replace one of the sockets.
They said it was the computer which caused the problem. No more info than
that. I have tried a different phone cord, also tried unhooking all other
phones to see if the latest modem will dial. The computer is properly
grounded. Haven't tried it at a different power outlet. Checked inside the
computer to see if any of the wiring from the PSU is damaged or touching the
casing. No problems as far as I can tell.

What could be causing this computer to work perfectly well at location A but
not at location B regarding the modem? The only difference is that there is
another monitor / speakers / printer attached at location B. Telephone lines
should work the same, shouldn't they? It's in a relatively new building so I
assume the phone lines are in good condition. The dial tone when the modem
is not attached seems good, no crackling noises or indication that the line
is in bad condition.

Thanks in advance.

 

[notritenotteri]

Phone companies never have equipment problems that's why they have to
employ technicians as a sacrifice to prevent problems not to repair
them. Just because a building is new or newest means squat.
normally when a phone system is installed only some of the lines are
tested. Cozy up to the phone company and explain to them that its
their problem. If the system works at location A but not at B the
only difference is the location so its the problem.

 

[CBFalconer]

I have a (now relatively) new computer which initially had some
problems and the HD and graphics card had to be replaced.
Installed a PCI modem which at location A works perfectly well.
It dials out and connects at a resonable speed. So no problems.
Brought the computer to location B and as soon as I attached
the modem to the phone line I noticed listening to the dial tone
that it was less audible (fyi no ADSL on this line). When trying
to dial out the modem does not detect the dial tone. When
telling it to blind dial I can hear it dial but the dial tone
remains. So it never gets a connection. .... snip ....

A bad connection. Look to the various sockets and cables etc.
Also see what happens if you make the modem pulse dial (use ATDP
in place of ATDT). If you plug a standard telephone into the line
and tone dial, does it work?

You should see about 60 V (at least 20) across the line when
disconnected (on hook). When off hook the line voltage should go
down to under 5, usually under 2, and the line current should be
at least 20 mA, often 60 mA.

 

[Trent©]

I have a (now relatively) new computer which initially had some problems and
the HD and graphics card had to be replaced. Installed a PCI modem which at
location A works perfectly well. It dials out and connects at a resonable
speed. So no problems. Brought the computer to location B and as soon as I
attached the modem to the phone line I noticed listening to the dial tone
that it was less audible (fyi no ADSL on this line). When trying to dial out
the modem does not detect the dial tone.

Do you have the phone and the phone line plugged into the proper ports
on the modem? Make sure you don't have them reversed.

When telling it to blind dial I can
hear it dial but the dial tone remains.

What is a 'blind dial'? Whatever it is, I don't understand what yer
sayin'. You just said you get a 'no dial tone' error? If so, it
shouldn't be able to dial...no matter HOW you dial it out.

So it never gets a connection.

FORGET about the connection...at least for now. Are you gettin' a 'no
dial tone' error...all the time? Or aren't you.

I
have tried 2 different modems at this location. The first had the same
problem as just described, the second seemed to work but after about a month
the phones went dead and the telco people had to replace one of the sockets.
They said it was the computer which caused the problem. No more info than
that. I have tried a different phone cord, also tried unhooking all other
phones to see if the latest modem will dial. The computer is properly
grounded. Haven't tried it at a different power outlet. Checked inside the
computer to see if any of the wiring from the PSU is damaged or touching the
casing. No problems as far as I can tell.

As I said before...if you have DSL at any of the locations...and you
want to DIAL with a modem...you MUST have a splitter in the phone
jack...supplied by your DSL provider...and the modem MUST be plugged
into the PHONE side...for a dial-up connection.

What could be causing this computer to work perfectly well at location A but
not at location B regarding the modem? The only difference is that there is
another monitor / speakers / printer attached at location B.

Again...you DID say...correct?...that one of the locations has DSL.

Telephone lines
should work the same, shouldn't they? It's in a relatively new building so I
assume the phone lines are in good condition.

Is this a commercial building?...or is it a residential building? If
its a commercial building...will any kind of rollover on the
phones...this will not work at expected. More than likely, you'll
need to have yer modem connected to the primary line for it to be able
to dial out.


Have a nice week...

Trent

Follow Joan Rivers' example --- get pre-embalmed!

 

[JH]

Do you have the phone and the phone line plugged into the proper ports
on the modem? Make sure you don't have them reversed.

Yes, phone is plugged into the proper port.

What is a 'blind dial'? Whatever it is, I don't understand what yer
sayin'. You just said you get a 'no dial tone' error? If so, it
shouldn't be able to dial...no matter HOW you dial it out.

With "blind dial" I mean not wait for the dial tone before dialling. At
this location they have voice mail on the line so the dial tone is not what
the modem expects. This is a voicemail system that is set up by the
telephone company from their end. I have tried this at another house with
the same voicemail system on the line and it works there when telling it to
not wait for the dial tone. At the house with the problem when telling the
modem to "not wait for dial tone" it dials (as expected) but the phone is
not picked up (don't know the correct term) i.e. I can still hear the dial
tone.

Sorry about not mentioning the voicemail. Lots of phones here have it on the
line (Portugal) and it's not a problem as long as you tell the modem to not
wait for a dial tone.

The important thing to note, though, is that independent of the modem
dialling out or not, as soon as its plugged into the line, the dial tone and
voice conversations, when listening from a phone, are less audible. Could it
be due to static electricity building up on the line from the computer? I'm
only guessing here.

FORGET about the connection...at least for now. Are you gettin' a 'no
dial tone' error...all the time? Or aren't you.

I am getting a no dial tone error when I tell the modem to wait for the dial
tone. This is normal as they have the voice mail I mentioned. If "do not
wait for dial tone" is selected it dials but nothing happens. I think whats
important to note is that when this modem is connected to the line, the
quality is affected i.e. the dial tone is less audible and voice
conversations are also less audible. So something in the computer is drawing
too much power into / out of the phone line?? How can I go about determining
what that could be? And this has happened with 2 different modems so odds
are the modem is not faulty.

As I said before...if you have DSL at any of the locations...and you
want to DIAL with a modem...you MUST have a splitter in the phone
jack...supplied by your DSL provider...and the modem MUST be plugged
into the PHONE side...for a dial-up connection.

At the House (sorry if I confused you about the location A B business, they
are different houses) where the problem is there is No ADSL on the line. At
the house with no problems I have ADSL but the splitter/filter is right at
the beginning where the line comes into the house. It was set-up by the
provider. In any case there is no problem with the modem dialling at this
house.

Again...you DID say...correct?...that one of the locations has DSL.

Yes, but the one with DSL has no problems with the modem dialling.

Is this a commercial building?...or is it a residential building? If
its a commercial building...will any kind of rollover on the
phones...this will not work at expected. More than likely, you'll
need to have yer modem connected to the primary line for it to be able
to dial out.

This is a residential building. I now have another computer temporarily at
the location and the modem is dialling out normally.

Hope you can steer me in the right direction here. Sorry if my explanations
were not that clear.

 

[Trent©]

Yes, phone is plugged into the proper port.

At least you answered all the questions. lol Thanks...that's a big
help in trying to solve yer problem.

One big caveat...before we continue...

I didn't realize you don't live in the U.S. I'm not an expert in
phone connections. And I'm certainly not an expert on phone service
in your country. So take all this with a grain of salt.

With "blind dial" I mean not wait for the dial tone before dialling. At
this location they have voice mail on the line so the dial tone is not what
the modem expects. This is a voicemail system that is set up by the
telephone company from their end. I have tried this at another house with
the same voicemail system on the line and it works there when telling it to
not wait for the dial tone. At the house with the problem when telling the
modem to "not wait for dial tone" it dials (as expected) but the phone is
not picked up (don't know the correct term) i.e. I can still hear the dial
tone.

Voice mail has NOTHING to do with an outgoing call. You need to tell
your modem to wait for a dial tone. That's probably the biggest part
of your problem.

Sorry about not mentioning the voicemail. Lots of phones here have it on the
line (Portugal) and it's not a problem as long as you tell the modem to not
wait for a dial tone.

Again...voice mail is for incoming...unless you have a special kinda
setup there. You MUST have a dial tone in order for your modem to
dial out. So make sure its set up to wait for a dial tone.

The important thing to note, though, is that independent of the modem
dialling out or not, as soon as its plugged into the line, the dial tone and
voice conversations, when listening from a phone, are less audible. Could it
be due to static electricity building up on the line from the computer? I'm
only guessing here.

More than likely...because of the way you have it set up and because
of the delay...the modem is trying to dial...or getting ready to
dial...when you have the phone picked up. At any rate, you should not
HAVE the phone picked up! If you pick up any other phone on the same
line, the modem won't be able to dial. Its just like trying to dial
from one phone when you have another phone off hook. It just can't be
done.

And, until you get this modem problem solved, unplug ALL devices from
the phone jacks except the modem while you experiment. Once you solve
the problem, you should be able to use the modem and keep the phone's
plugged in also. But you can't use BOTH at the same time. You can
either use the computer's modem...or you can make a voice call with
the phone. But you can't use both.

I am getting a no dial tone error when I tell the modem to wait for the dial
tone.

Okay...that's fine. So it looks like the computer is recognizing the
modem.

Now...when you get this error message...unplug the modem line AT THE
WALL JACK...and plug a phone into that jack. Then listen for a dial
tone there...to be sure that jack is working.

This is normal as they have the voice mail I mentioned.

Again...I think yer confused on this.

If "do not
wait for dial tone" is selected it dials but nothing happens.

That's because its not connected to any outside phone line.

I think whats
important to note is that when this modem is connected to the line, the
quality is affected i.e. the dial tone is less audible and voice
conversations are also less audible.

You won't be able to dial out if you have a phone off-hook to listen
to this difference. Actually...as I mentioned...you should disconnect
all and any phones from the wall jacks until you solve the modem
problem.

The phone/line connection at the back of the modem is simply a
straight-thru connection...so that you can use the phone INSTEAD of
the modem at that location. You cannot use BOTH at the same time.

So something in the computer is drawing
too much power into / out of the phone line?? How can I go about determining
what that could be? And this has happened with 2 different modems so odds
are the modem is not faulty.

Correct. Its yer PROCEDURE that's faulty! lol

At the House (sorry if I confused you about the location A B business, they
are different houses) where the problem is there is No ADSL on the line. At
the house with no problems I have ADSL but the splitter/filter is right at
the beginning where the line comes into the house. It was set-up by the
provider. In any case there is no problem with the modem dialling at this
house.

If you have DSL at the other house...and yer using it...you aren't
even USING the modem there...unless you're PURPOSELY using a dial-up
connection there. I'm just guessing that's why you don't have a
problem there. Yer connected to the Internet via DSL...and yer
dialing/doing voice thru the phone. At any rate, that's the way it
should be.

And I think yer also confused about the DSL split. There may indeed
be a split at the outside box. But, if its done that way, from that
point on...going into your house...you'd need to have SEPARATE jacks
for the DSL and for the phone. Do you have separate jacks in the
house for DSL? You'd need to have 2 jacks at each location...side by
side. I doubt if this is the case. More than likely, you have only
one jack. If so, you need a splitter there.

At least that's the way it works over here.

Yes, but the one with DSL has no problems with the modem dialling.

When you use the modem at the no-problem location, do you also plug
your network cable into the computer?...that other cable that looks
like a big phone cable.

This is a residential building. I now have another computer temporarily at
the location and the modem is dialling out normally.

Is the other computer also set up for DSL?

Hope you can steer me in the right direction here. Sorry if my explanations
were not that clear.

That's okay...that's common. That's why I asked those other
questions...and those here.

Trying to recap...

Location A...location with DSL...Internet is probably NOT via the
dial-up modem. Its probably thru your DSL modem.

Location B...location without DSL...Internet is probably thru dial-up.
In order to dial, you MUST have a dial tone. Setting up your modem to
dial without a dial tone is causing you problems

And voice mail has nothing to do with any of this.

You do have 2 modems...correct? One for DSL?...and another for
dial-up?


Good luck...let us know.


Have a nice week...

Trent

Follow Joan Rivers' example --- get pre-embalmed!

 

[kony]

With "blind dial" I mean not wait for the dial tone before dialling. At
this location they have voice mail on the line so the dial tone is not what
the modem expects. This is a voicemail system that is set up by the
telephone company from their end. I have tried this at another house with
the same voicemail system on the line and it works there when telling it to
not wait for the dial tone. At the house with the problem when telling the
modem to "not wait for dial tone" it dials (as expected) but the phone is
not picked up (don't know the correct term) i.e. I can still hear the dial
tone.

Sorry about not mentioning the voicemail. Lots of phones here have it on the
line (Portugal) and it's not a problem as long as you tell the modem to not
wait for a dial tone.

Is it possible you need to input a key sequence to access an outside
line when dialing, that you haven't set the modem to do this?

The important thing to note, though, is that independent of the modem
dialling out or not, as soon as its plugged into the line, the dial tone and
voice conversations, when listening from a phone, are less audible. Could it
be due to static electricity building up on the line from the computer? I'm
only guessing here.

For the time being I wouldn't worry about that, it may simply be that
the modem is a winmodem that derives some power from the telephone
line. I don't have any futher details about that, but vaguely recall
reading it in specs of some PCTel chipset.

I am getting a no dial tone error when I tell the modem to wait for the dial
tone. This is normal as they have the voice mail I mentioned. If "do not
wait for dial tone" is selected it dials but nothing happens.

Let's simplify the dialing concept...

When a call is to be initiated by the modem, it flips a relay,
mechanical or solid-state version, then generates the tones or pulses
the line. If a standard telephone can be plugged into the phone
system and works, the modem should attempt to duplicate it's function.

Is a normal phone using pulse or tone dialing? Is the modem set up to
use same method?

Is a normal phone required to use a certain procedure to access an
outside line? Is this duplicated by the modem?

If you keep all phones "hung up", unused, and first try initiating a
dialing sequence with the modem, and THEN pick up a telephone receiver
to listen, what do you hear? How does that differ from what you would
hear if dialing out with one of those telephones?

 

[JH]

On Mon, 2 Feb 2004 12:17:39 -0000, "JH"


Is it possible you need to input a key sequence to access an outside
line when dialing, that you haven't set the modem to do this?

You mean like 0,? Dialling is done normally without needing to access an
outside line. If I try dialling the provider from a phone I get through ok.

For the time being I wouldn't worry about that, it may simply be that
the modem is a winmodem that derives some power from the telephone
line. I don't have any futher details about that, but vaguely recall
reading it in specs of some PCTel chipset.

That doesn't explain why it works well at another location. Also it doesn't
work when all phones are disconnected from the line. It shouldn't take that
much power from the line.

Let's simplify the dialing concept...

When a call is to be initiated by the modem, it flips a relay,
mechanical or solid-state version, then generates the tones or pulses
the line. If a standard telephone can be plugged into the phone
system and works, the modem should attempt to duplicate it's function.

Is a normal phone using pulse or tone dialing? Is the modem set up to
use same method?

Normal phone uses tone and modem is set up to use tone as well.

Is a normal phone required to use a certain procedure to access an
outside line? Is this duplicated by the modem?

No procedure is necessary. It's a standard analog line with direct access.

If you keep all phones "hung up", unused, and first try initiating a
dialing sequence with the modem, and THEN pick up a telephone receiver
to listen, what do you hear? How does that differ from what you would
hear if dialing out with one of those telephones?

When initiating with modem it dials the number but in the background I can
still hear the dial tone. When its finished dialling all that remains is the
dial tone. When done from the phone it does as expected. The number is
dialled (tone dialling) and the other side picks up.

I think it may have something to do with what you mentioned about winmodems
pulling power from the line. As I mentioned in my intial post there was a
modem which worked normally for some time until the phones went dead. I
couldn't tell you if its a winmodem or not. Its a Conceptronic 56PM. What
I'm using now (which has the problems) is a Q-Tec 561MI 56K PCI modem with
Intel chipset. Also another which gives the same problem is a Conceptronic
C56PMI. But even though its a Winmodem it shouldn't take that much power
from the line. And if they both work normally at another location, why not
at this particular location.