Is it time for 'N?'

  • Thread starter Thread starter jay lunis
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J

jay lunis

I believe I need a new router and would like guidance on whether I
should get 'G' or 'N.' A few months ago I read there were problems with
'N' - the only one I think I remember, was incompatibility across
manufacturers. So, does 'N' have all the problems resolved or should I
stick with 'G?'
 
Steven L Umbach said:
Stay away from N!! Stick with plain Jane G such as the Linksys WRT54G.
When Sonicwall and Cisco make SOHO/business class wireless N routers then
the time may be right.



Steve
Click to expand...
Aren't current N routers really just Draft-N? That name certainly sounds
like beta software (which I never use).

Jim
 
Hi
There is No 802.11n there is pre-N or Draft-N.

The issue is Not so much resolving functional problems but rather agreeing
on a standard.

If you buy a Draft-N Wireless Router and a Wireless card from the same
manufacturer it would work OK.
However when the standard comes out you can end up with devices that do not
comply to the standard. It might Not work with same, or any other
manufacturer devices'.

Given that the price of a Draft-N Router + Draft N Wireless card is about
$200 (and $100 more for each computer that needs Draft-N Card), it might be
a waste of money buying the Draft-N.

The most important advantage of 802.11n (when it would be finalized) is
better range and higher LAB Bandwidth (speed).

The higher Bandwidth would help only for local transfer (it would not
improve Internet traffic), so if one does not employ heavy LAN transfer
between his computers, Draft-N would not be of a significant advantage.

As for range, High Power 802.11g would cover the same or more range costing
30% to 40% less and maintaining a decent range with any 802.11g card
Example: http://www.ezlan.net/buffalo.html

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Buff...62405/catOid/-12980/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

Disclaimer - I have no connection with any Brand that manufactures Network
Devices (or any other computer hardware) of any kind, nor any connection
computer's hardware vendors. My comments are as a frame of reference based
on hardware that I buy with my own money.

Jack (MVP-Networking).
 
Steven L Umbach said:
You are absolutely right Jim.

If someone wants to try N then I suggest that they make sure they are
using all the same N equipment [router and network adapters] from the same
manufacturer/product line and have the latest drivers/firmware installed
also.

The problem I see is that users are try to install N wireless routers to
use with their laptop's built in wireless adapter that can not take full
advantage of N technologies anyhow.

I find that N claims for range and speed seem to be extremely exaggerated
also and have know users to try and use a N wireless router when they are
having weak signal issues with their current equipment and have found no
increase in signal to the client computer where in such cases additional
wireless access points, possibly in repeater mode, are the ultimate
solution.

Steve

.


Jim said:
Aren't current N routers really just Draft-N? That name certainly
sounds like beta software (which I never use).

Jim
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
That is what I understood. In addition, there can be no guarantee that
draft-N gear will be compatible with the approved version.
Jim
 
Steven said:
Stay away from N!! Stick with plain Jane G such as the Linksys WRT54G. When
Sonicwall and Cisco make SOHO/business class wireless N routers then the
time may be right.



Steve
Click to expand...
OK, any wild guess when N standards are adopted and equipment produced?
Weeks? Months?
 
I have not been following that closely to have a good idea. I just read
recently where Cisco is going to be shipping [or already is] draft N which
is interesting in I did not think they would do that until there was a N
standard.

Steve

http://www.crn.com/networking/201803911
 
Duh. Article mentions later half of 2008 as current best guess of an N
standard. I have a hard time believing Cisco [NOT Linksys made by Cisco]
will be selling many draft N devices at their prices unless they are going
to be upgradeable to the standard when ratified but still I would be leary
and wait for the N standard.

Steve


Steven L Umbach said:
I have not been following that closely to have a good idea. I just read
recently where Cisco is going to be shipping [or already is] draft N which
is interesting in I did not think they would do that until there was a N
standard.

Steve

http://www.crn.com/networking/201803911

jay lunis said:
OK, any wild guess when N standards are adopted and equipment produced?
Weeks? Months?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Stay away from N!! Stick with plain Jane G such as the Linksys WRT54G. When
Sonicwall and Cisco make SOHO/business class wireless N routers then the
time may be right.



Steve
 
You are absolutely right Jim.

If someone wants to try N then I suggest that they make sure they are using
all the same N equipment [router and network adapters] from the same
manufacturer/product line and have the latest drivers/firmware installed
also.

The problem I see is that users are try to install N wireless routers to use
with their laptop's built in wireless adapter that can not take full
advantage of N technologies anyhow.

I find that N claims for range and speed seem to be extremely exaggerated
also and have know users to try and use a N wireless router when they are
having weak signal issues with their current equipment and have found no
increase in signal to the client computer where in such cases additional
wireless access points, possibly in repeater mode, are the ultimate
solution.

Steve

..
 
Steven said:
Stay away from N!! Stick with plain Jane G such as the Linksys WRT54G. When
Sonicwall and Cisco make SOHO/business class wireless N routers then the
time may be right.



Steve
Click to expand...

As it happens, I emailed 3 router manufacturers a couple of days before
my original post here. Two days without response prompted my original
post. (OK, I'm impatient.)
As it turns out, all three - Netgear, Linksys, D-Link - claim there IS a
standard for 'N' and all three claim their routers meet the standard and
are compatible with ALL manufacturers 'N' products. The people on this
ng state there is NO standard. Any idea what logic D-Link et al are
using to claim there is?
 
jay said:
As it happens, I emailed 3 router manufacturers a couple of days before
my original post here. Two days without response prompted my original
post. (OK, I'm impatient.)
As it turns out, all three - Netgear, Linksys, D-Link - claim there IS a
standard for 'N' and all three claim their routers meet the standard and
are compatible with ALL manufacturers 'N' products. The people on this
ng state there is NO standard. Any idea what logic D-Link et al are
using to claim there is?
Click to expand...

The *fact* is that there is no standard yet approved. See
http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/11/Reports/tgn_update.htm

The current *prediction* is that final approval will be in Sept 2008:
http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/11/Reports/802.11_Timelines.htm

On the other hand, because the issues to be resolved seem to be getting
fewer (and because they want to sell more products), the WiFi Alliance
(the industry group that is behind the push for a standard) has begun a
program of "certification" of products that comply with 802.11n draft
2.0: http://www.wi-fi.org/pressroom_overview.php?newsid=618

The WiFi Alliance says:
<QUOTE>
The Wi-Fi CERTIFIED logo is your only assurance that a product has met
rigorous interoperability testing requirements to ensure that compatible
products from different vendors will work together. Look for the Wi-Fi
CERTIFIED logo with color-coded Standard Indicator Icons (SII) on
product packaging, or search through our web site listing of CERTIFIED
products before making a Wi-Fi purchase.
</QUOTE>

What this means, I guess, is that a certified Draft 2.0 802.11n device
from Linksys will work with a certified Draft 2.0 802.11n device from
D-Link.

So, if you are a bleeding edge person, go ahead and buy some certified
draft 2.0 802.11n devices. They'll *probably* work just fine. For best
results, be sure that all of the wireless devices in your network are
certified draft 2.0 802.11n, and -- notwithstanding the certification --
preferably from the same manufacturer.

And *probably* these devices will work with devices that are "certified"
to meet the *real* 802.11n spec -- whenever that actually arrives. But
you won't care about that -- until you need to replace one of your
components or add another wireless device to your network.

I haven't really kept up with the latest changes, but I believe that the
certified draft 2.0 802.11n devices no longer have the behavior of
earlier draft 802.11n devices that tended to cause neighbors of users of
such devices to come after them with pitchforks and baseball bats
(because they disrupted nearby 802.11b and g networks).

--
Lem -- MS-MVP - Networking

To the moon and back with 4KB of RAM and 72KB of ROM.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Guidance_Computer
http://history.nasa.gov/afj/compessay.htm
 
Lem said:
The *fact* is that there is no standard yet approved. See
http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/11/Reports/tgn_update.htm

The current *prediction* is that final approval will be in Sept 2008:
http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/11/Reports/802.11_Timelines.htm

On the other hand, because the issues to be resolved seem to be getting
fewer (and because they want to sell more products), the WiFi Alliance
(the industry group that is behind the push for a standard) has begun a
program of "certification" of products that comply with 802.11n draft
2.0: http://www.wi-fi.org/pressroom_overview.php?newsid=618

The WiFi Alliance says:
<QUOTE>
The Wi-Fi CERTIFIED logo is your only assurance that a product has met
rigorous interoperability testing requirements to ensure that compatible
products from different vendors will work together. Look for the Wi-Fi
CERTIFIED logo with color-coded Standard Indicator Icons (SII) on
product packaging, or search through our web site listing of CERTIFIED
products before making a Wi-Fi purchase.
</QUOTE>

What this means, I guess, is that a certified Draft 2.0 802.11n device
from Linksys will work with a certified Draft 2.0 802.11n device from
D-Link.

So, if you are a bleeding edge person, go ahead and buy some certified
draft 2.0 802.11n devices. They'll *probably* work just fine. For best
results, be sure that all of the wireless devices in your network are
certified draft 2.0 802.11n, and -- notwithstanding the certification --
preferably from the same manufacturer.

And *probably* these devices will work with devices that are "certified"
to meet the *real* 802.11n spec -- whenever that actually arrives. But
you won't care about that -- until you need to replace one of your
components or add another wireless device to your network.

I haven't really kept up with the latest changes, but I believe that the
certified draft 2.0 802.11n devices no longer have the behavior of
earlier draft 802.11n devices that tended to cause neighbors of users of
such devices to come after them with pitchforks and baseball bats
(because they disrupted nearby 802.11b and g networks).
Click to expand...
Thanks for the explanation. Think I'll wait.
 
That is interesting info. My guess is that those manufactures are kind of
bending the truth to get sales but no doubt they are trying to get draft N
to work better.

I have known too many people that have had numerous issues with draft N
equipment and the only ones I know of that had any luck used only draft N
equipment from the same manufacturer within the same product line which
means they also had USB adapters connected to their laptops that already had
built in wireless that was disabled.

On the other had most of the electronics stores have a liberal
exchange/refund policy usually for at least 30 days. So by all means if you
want to try draft N give it a shot and you can return within the refund
period if within the refund guidelines [original packaging, like new, all
parts, receipt, etc].

Myself I like to use the wireless adapter built into my laptop and even G is
way faster than my cable internet speed. If I have a need for maximum
performance/reliability I always use a Cat6 cable to a switch on my network
and even draft N is way way slower than that.

Steve
 
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