Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD

  • Thread starter Thread starter John Doe
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J

John Doe

Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
benefit of an SSD swapfile?

In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
another swapfile in a different location.
 
Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
benefit of an SSD swapfile?

In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
another swapfile in a different location.
Click to expand...


My Swapfile is on my D: spin drive, Always has been, always will be.
My SSD will die one day in the future Then I will buy a new one.
Just can't waste time worrying about minor possibilities.

Rene
 
And what is the benefit of that.


Fine, but my post is meant for technically oriented users. You
know, people who enjoy making the most out of their systems. If
you are computer illiterate, you should stick to asking questions.
Click to expand...


Question? No I won't waste my time with you.

Rene
 
Try finding discussion of whether (pagefile.sys) is manipulated by
SSD wear leveling, and then get back to me about being technically
oriented. Until then, consider yourself a troll...

--
 
Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
SSD handling (pagefile.sys).

--
 
Extraneous newsgroups snipped.
Try finding discussion of whether (pagefile.sys) is manipulated by
SSD wear leveling, and then get back to me about being technically
oriented.
Click to expand...

Any file writes are handled by wear leveling since wear leveling is
handled at the SSD firmware level so *any* file write is seen the same
by the SSD.
Until then, consider yourself a troll...
Click to expand...

Pot, meet kettle.
 
On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:43:59 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
SSD handling (pagefile.sys).
Click to expand...

That's because (as any technically inclined user knows) pagefile.sys is
a file. To the storage medium, a file is a file, no matter what
purpose the OS puts it to. Wear leveling is done in the SSD firmware,
which sees any file write the same as any other so wear leveling
applies.

--
Zaphod

"Yeah. Listen, I'm Zaphod Beeblebrox, my father was Zaphod Beeblebrox
the Second, my grandfather Zaphod Beeblebrox the Third..."

"What?"

"There was an accident with a contraceptive and a time machine. Now
concentrate!"
 
on Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:43:59 +0000 (UTC):
Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
SSD handling (pagefile.sys).
Click to expand...

Wear leveling is done on firmware level. Your pagefile is just more
sectors on the SSD. There absolutely zero benefit to managing this
yourself. I certainly wouldn't waste time messing with the page file
on the remote possibility that my SSD is defective and not doing its
own wear leveling.
 
Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
benefit of an SSD swapfile?

In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
another swapfile in a different location.
Click to expand...

The SSD wear leveler does a better job of this than you possibly
could. Leave it alone.
 
Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
SSD handling (pagefile.sys).
Click to expand...

Why would the SSD know or care that it was in the pagefile? It's just
a frequently written block.
 
Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.

--
 
Loren Pechtel said:
Why would the SSD know or care that it was in the pagefile? It's
just a frequently written block.
Click to expand...

The SSD might not, but Windows does. Windows is able to deal on a
very low level with hardware.
 
I've seen conflicting opinions about whether (pagefile.sys) is
handled like any ordinary file with respect to SSD wear leveling.
Somehow I doubt that information is available to anybody except
Microsoft, Intel, and similarly situated hardware engineers. So I
wouldn't just brush it off.

--

Loren Pechtel said:
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From: Loren Pechtel <lorenpechtel hotmail.com>
Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 13:54:31 -0800
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Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
benefit of an SSD swapfile?

In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
another swapfile in a different location.
Click to expand...

The SSD wear leveler does a better job of this than you possibly
could. Leave it alone.
Click to expand...
 
If this were a waste of time, it wouldn't generate so much
interest. I seriously doubt this thing really knows what it's
talking about...

--
 
on Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC):
Just because wear leveling
is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
Click to expand...

Actually that's exactly what it means. Instead of just guessing, why
not look up "static wear leveling" and read about it? Don't waste
your time deleting and moving files in hopes that you will by accident
do something better than your SSD is designed to do on purpose and by
default.

Look at it this way: let's say you have an almost-full SSD with a PE
cycle limit of 10,000 (to pick a number), how many times do you think
you have to "move" your page file to effectively handle wear leveling
on your own over, say, three years?
 
Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
benefit of an SSD swapfile?

In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
another swapfile in a different location.
Click to expand...

I don't understand how you think "moving" the swap file (on purpose,
every once in a while) will imporve anything. The way the controller
works, the "swapped" information is "moved" to a new location on the
SSD every time new data is written. Data is "never" written back to
the old cells on a (relatively new) SSD. Only very old SSDs (or very
full ones) didn't write to previously erased cells, because erasing
cells is much slower.
 
Spammer

--

fwibbler said:
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Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
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Are you on some sort of medication?
Click to expand...
 
I did with this troll said, I searched for

"static wear leveling" "pagefile.sys"

And received a total of four results, none of them useful.

I wonder why so much interest from the UK.

--

Brandon Staggs said:
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Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
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on Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC):
Just because wear leveling
is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
Click to expand...

Actually that's exactly what it means. Instead of just guessing, why
not look up "static wear leveling" and read about it? Don't waste
your time deleting and moving files in hopes that you will by accident
do something better than your SSD is designed to do on purpose and by
default.

Look at it this way: let's say you have an almost-full SSD with a PE
cycle limit of 10,000 (to pick a number), how many times do you think
you have to "move" your page file to effectively handle wear leveling
on your own over, say, three years?
Click to expand...
 
Charlie Hoffpauir said:
I don't understand how you think "moving" the swap file (on
purpose, every once in a while) will imporve anything.
Click to expand...

I don't see why you are so confident that the SSD wear leveling
algorithm would treat (pagefile.sys) like any ordinary file.
Obviously it doesn't, considering a reboot is required whenever
that file is changed.
The way the controller works, the "swapped" information is
"moved" to a new location on the SSD every time new data is
written. Data is "never" written back to the old cells on a
(relatively new) SSD. Only very old SSDs (or very full ones)
didn't write to previously erased cells, because erasing cells
is much slower.
Click to expand...

But obviously (pagefile.sys) is not manipulated like any ordinary
file. Otherwise a reboot would not be required whenever it's
changed.

As far as I know, the operating system addresses the swap file
differently than other files. That's why it is unmovable on the
drive. Seems to me it would be addressing the actual locations on
the drive, instead of working its way through drive software.
Unless you're an engineer, I'm very sure you don't know better.
 
I don't see why you are so confident that the SSD wear leveling
algorithm would treat (pagefile.sys) like any ordinary file.
Obviously it doesn't, considering a reboot is required whenever
that file is changed.


But obviously (pagefile.sys) is not manipulated like any ordinary
file. Otherwise a reboot would not be required whenever it's
changed.
Click to expand...
The SSD doesn't "know" it's dealing with any particular file. How can
it know it's handling pagefile.sys "now"? And a reboot is required for
"many" things in windows, including (sometimes) installing new
software.
As far as I know, the operating system addresses the swap file
differently than other files.

That's why it is unmovable on the
drive. Seems to me it would be addressing the actual locations on
the drive, instead of working its way through drive software.
Click to expand...

It's certainly not unmovable on the drive. I've moved mine several
times.
Unless you're an engineer, I'm very sure you don't know better.
Click to expand...

Actually, I am an engineer, but that has nothing to do with the
discussion.

The simple fact is that rotating disks can write new information to a
location without specifically erasing the old information first. A SSD
can't do that . It has to do an "erase" in a cell before it can
"Write" to the same cell. But it doesn't do it cell-by-cell. It does
it in blocks. So when it writes "new" data to the swap file, it CANNOT
write it into the same blocks where the previously written data was
stored.... or if it does, it has to wait for the erase to take place,
which takes a lot longer than the write. So the whole idea of making a
SSD fast depends on writing to previously erased locations, and
depending on the garbage collection to take care of erasing no longer
needed cells and getting them ready for the fast writes to come at a
later time. .... So, new swap file data is always written to "new"
locations on a SSD. Because the old data can't be erased before the OS
tells the controller that the old information has been "replaced" by
the new.
 
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