Help with CPU upgrade for Sony PCV-R522DS

  • Thread starter Thread starter James C. Brogan
  • Start date Start date
J

James C. Brogan

I'm trying to upgrade my Sony PCV-R522DS from a PII to PIII which Sony
said was compatable on their website. When I put the chip in the
computer would not boot - just dead. Replace the old cpu & everything
is fine. My computer specs are below along with the upgrade CPU
specs. Any ideas on why it won't work? Do I just need a BIOS upgrade
(which I have not done)?

BIOS Date: 05/26/99
BIOS Type: Award Modular BIOS v4.51PG
BIOS ID: 05/26/99-i440BX-P2B
OEM Sign-On: ACPI BIOS Revision 1005
Chipset: Intel 440BX/ZX rev 3
Superio: Unknown
OS: WinXP
CPU: Pentium® II With On-Die L2 Cache 467 MHz
BIOS ROM In Socket: Unknown
BIOS ROM Size: Unknown
Memory Installed: 191 MB

Intel Celeron (Pentium III based) 1.3 GHz, 256K L2 Cache Processor -
OEM
Specification
Model: Intel Celeron
Core: Tualatin
Operating Frequency: 1.3 GHz
FSB: 100MHz
Cache: L1/12K+8K; L2/256K
Voltage: 1.5V
Process: 0.13Micron
Socket: Socket 370
Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE
Packaging: OEM (Processor only)

asrjcb
 
I'm trying to upgrade my Sony PCV-R522DS from a PII to PIII which Sony
said was compatable on their website. When I put the chip in the
computer would not boot - just dead. Replace the old cpu & everything
is fine. My computer specs are below along with the upgrade CPU
specs. Any ideas on why it won't work? Do I just need a BIOS upgrade
(which I have not done)?

BIOS Date: 05/26/99
BIOS Type: Award Modular BIOS v4.51PG
BIOS ID: 05/26/99-i440BX-P2B
OEM Sign-On: ACPI BIOS Revision 1005
Chipset: Intel 440BX/ZX rev 3
Superio: Unknown
OS: WinXP
CPU: Pentium® II With On-Die L2 Cache 467 MHz
BIOS ROM In Socket: Unknown
BIOS ROM Size: Unknown
Memory Installed: 191 MB

Intel Celeron (Pentium III based) 1.3 GHz, 256K L2 Cache Processor -
OEM
Specification
Model: Intel Celeron
Core: Tualatin
Operating Frequency: 1.3 GHz
FSB: 100MHz
Cache: L1/12K+8K; L2/256K
Voltage: 1.5V
Process: 0.13Micron
Socket: Socket 370
Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE
Packaging: OEM (Processor only)

asrjcb
Click to expand...

When a motherboard is "just dead" like that, it means the Vcore
regulator on the motherboard isn't capable of honouring a request
for 1.5V. The Vcore regulator shuts down, to prevent damage to
the processor.

On my motherboard, part of the solution to using a Tualatin, was
to change the voltage regulator chip from an ACB to a BCB part.

There can be pinout issues with the Tualatin as well, and an
old socket 370 design might need some modding to use it. That
would include a number of older slockets - some Googling might
dig up references on how to modify them for a Tualatin.

Since my motherboard was a Slot 1, an Upgradeware.com Slot-T
for roughly $25, performed the necessary interface changes,
including a voltage translation chip for some of the
signals. My soldering of a new voltage regulator chip was needed
to make this cheap solution work - otherwise I would have needed
a Powerleap slot 1 adapter. Considering the cost of incidentals
needed to do the mod, this is better done by someone dedicated
to modding, like the author of the p2bmod site.

Some references:

"How do I find out which voltage regulator chip..."
http://homepage.hispeed.ch/rscheidegger/p2b_procupgrade_faq.html

http://tipperlinne.com/p2bmod

(Adapter if your motherboard had the right voltage regulator.
They also make an S370 adapter, the 370GU.)
http://www.upgradeware.com/english/product/slott/slott.htm

(Slot 1 adapter which has the correct voltage regulator built-in.
Only available if you buy a processor at the same time as the
adapter purchase. Still pretty cheap compared to other alternatives,
such as 1GHz Coppermine slot-1's from Ebay.)

http://www.powerleap.com/PL-iP3T.html

HTH,
Paul
 
James said:
I'm trying to upgrade my Sony PCV-R522DS from a PII to PIII which Sony
said was compatable on their website. When I put the chip in the
computer would not boot - just dead. Replace the old cpu & everything
is fine. My computer specs are below along with the upgrade CPU
specs. Any ideas on why it won't work? Do I just need a BIOS upgrade
(which I have not done)?

BIOS Date: 05/26/99
BIOS Type: Award Modular BIOS v4.51PG
BIOS ID: 05/26/99-i440BX-P2B
OEM Sign-On: ACPI BIOS Revision 1005
Chipset: Intel 440BX/ZX rev 3
Superio: Unknown
OS: WinXP
CPU: Pentium® II With On-Die L2 Cache 467 MHz
BIOS ROM In Socket: Unknown
BIOS ROM Size: Unknown
Memory Installed: 191 MB

Intel Celeron (Pentium III based) 1.3 GHz, 256K L2 Cache Processor -
OEM
Specification
Model: Intel Celeron
Core: Tualatin
Operating Frequency: 1.3 GHz
FSB: 100MHz
Cache: L1/12K+8K; L2/256K
Voltage: 1.5V
Process: 0.13Micron
Socket: Socket 370
Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE
Packaging: OEM (Processor only)

asrjcb
Click to expand...

You are attempting an upgrade to a Tualatin processor (not a PIII
processor), which your current BIOS does not support.

Your motherboard is an OEM version of the Asus P2B (P2B-AE). AFAIK Sony
has not published a Tualatin-capable BIOS for your motherboard, but it
may be possible to use a BIOS for the P3B-1394:

http://groups.google.com/[email protected]

According to the above post, the P3B-1394 BIOS supports PIII processors
on your motherboard, but Tualatin support remains an unknown. The latest
P3B-1394 BIOS is here:

ftp://ftp.asuscom.de/pub/ASUSCOM/BIOS/Slot_I/INTEL_Chipset/i440BX/P3B-1394/

However, I would not recommend trying it unless you have some means of
recovering from a bad flash, such as BIOS Savior or a spare BIOS chip.

HTH

P2B
 
P2B said:
You are attempting an upgrade to a Tualatin processor (not a PIII
processor), which your current BIOS does not support.

Your motherboard is an OEM version of the Asus P2B (P2B-AE). AFAIK Sony
has not published a Tualatin-capable BIOS for your motherboard, but it
may be possible to use a BIOS for the P3B-1394:

http://groups.google.com/[email protected]


According to the above post, the P3B-1394 BIOS supports PIII processors
on your motherboard, but Tualatin support remains an unknown. The latest
P3B-1394 BIOS is here:

ftp://ftp.asuscom.de/pub/ASUSCOM/BIOS/Slot_I/INTEL_Chipset/i440BX/P3B-1394/

However, I would not recommend trying it unless you have some means of
recovering from a bad flash, such as BIOS Savior or a spare BIOS chip.

HTH

P2B
Click to expand...

.... and as Paul has quite correctly pointed out, even if you are able to
flash a suitable BIOS, your motherboard may not be able to supply the
correct voltage for a Tualatin processor - in which case you will need
to use a Powerleap adapter or replace the voltage regulator chip.

P2B
 
If the CPU I'm trying to upgrade to is not compatible - then what is
or where would I find this out? Sony tech support is useless - they
said this processor would work.

Thanks for all the help.

asrjcb
 
If the CPU I'm trying to upgrade to is not compatible - then what is
or where would I find this out? Sony tech support is useless - they
said this processor would work.

Thanks for all the help.

asrjcb
Click to expand...

The Asus info basically covers placing a Slot 1 Intel module in
a Slot 1 board, and a S370 FCPGA/FCPGA2 device in a socket 370
board. The use of third party slockets is presumed to be documented
by the maker of those products, and so guess work and reverse
engineering has been used to fill in the gaps.

http://www.asuscom.de/support/FAQ/faq.htm
http://www.asuscom.de/support/FAQ/faq086_CPU_Upgrade_III.htm
http://www.asuscom.de/support/FAQ/faq086b_CPU_Upgrade_III.htm

The archived versions of these webpages are easier to read, as
for some reason Asus tech support in Germany decided to toast
the nice tables they used to have (presumably a squabble with
head office about web pages formats and using a common format
for all company web pages).

http://web.archive.org/web/20020603...om.de/support/techmain/FAQ/mobo_cpu/index.htm

(Early archive.org archiving efforts broke the HTML links, so
you need to hack the URLs by hand some times...)
http://web.archive.org/web/20020603...hmain/FAQ/mobo_cpu/faq086_CPU_Upgrade_III.htm

Roland's FAQ is a restatement of some of the info in those
pages.

Powerleap has a compatibility database, but they could have taken
better care of the contents, as frequently information is missing
that might have helped reassure users the solution would work.
Basically, what the BIOS supports is not adequately documented,
and there were some issues with particular speeds of processors
and particular versions of BIOS. Generally, taking the latest
BIOS for a board, is the best you can do. In the case of OEM
product, if BIOS support was dropped early in the life of the
board, flashing with a retail BIOS is a risky gamble that might
or might not work (a BIOS Savior is recommend if this is the
first time someone has tried a particular combo of transplanted
BIOS and motherboard).

https://www.quickbase.com/db/6v74ue7a (old list)
https://www.quickbase.com/db/6v74ue7a?a=q&qid=46 (iP3/T == Tualatin)

http://www.powerleap.com/SystemSearch.html
"We are sorry but the ASUS P2B-AE is not Compatible with our
upgrades." That, presumably, is a statement about the BIOS
situation.

http://www.upgradeware.com/english/product/slott/compatibility.htm

The info is out there, but each information source must be
crossreferenced, to determine what the issues might be with
a particular solution.

When a Tualatin upgrade isn't in the cards, you can always
look for a used slot 1 module on Ebay.

HTH,
Paul
 
James said:
If the CPU I'm trying to upgrade to is not compatible - then what is
or where would I find this out? Sony tech support is useless - they
said this processor would work.
Click to expand...

It seems unlikely you'll get a definitive answer as to your CPU upgrade
possibilities - after considerable searching all I learned is that
precious little information is available.

No BIOS updates appear to be available, although some users report
successfully using the latest BIOS for the Asus P3B-1394 I mentioned in
a previous post - but given it's release date, I doubt it includes
Tualatin processor support. The IEEE1394 port may not work if you
install the Asus BIOS since the P3B-1394 uses a TI chipset and I've read
yours uses a Sony chipset.

It seems likely you could upgrade to a Coppermine P3 Socket 370
processor on a Slot-T adapter, running at 1.8v if the voltage regulator
is unable to provide the 1.65-1.75v these processors nominally require.
I was unable to determine if your existing BIOS supports Coppermine
processors, but the Asus BIOS definitely does. Again, I would recommend
obtaining a BIOS Savior or spare BIOS chip before experimenting with a
non-Sony BIOS.

Alternatively, you could go to unicore.com, run their "BIOS Agent", then
submit the results and ask if there's anything they can do for you.

http://unicore.com/biosagent/

Do you have a BIOS flasher for your board? If so you could dump the
existing BIOS to file and email it to me. I could tell you which
processors it appears to support based on the microcode.

P2B
 
Paul & P2B,

Thanks for all the help. I do have some emails in to various companys
like Unicore, ASUS, etc. to see if they can help.

I wish I could read German - It may prevent me from being repetative
here ;-)

Okay, what I really want to know is what is the fastest CPU I can go
with for this obviously piece of crap motherboard I have? I want to
squeeze every drop out of this unit before having to upgrade to a real
system.

If the P2B-AE motherboard is the same as the P3B-1394 motherboard, the
specs say I upgrade to a P3 600MHz. Any thoughts on whether this is
okay or even worth it?

Also, if the P2B-AE motherboard is the same as the P3B-1394
motherboard, the P3B-1394 can support up to 512K RAM, so could I put
512K RAM on the P2B-AE?
 
James said:
Paul & P2B,

Thanks for all the help. I do have some emails in to various companys
like Unicore, ASUS, etc. to see if they can help.

I wish I could read German - It may prevent me from being repetative
here ;-)
Click to expand...

I doubt German would help as Asus doesn't publish any information about
your board since it was exclusively OEM for Sony.
Okay, what I really want to know is what is the fastest CPU I can go
with for this obviously piece of crap motherboard I have? I want to
squeeze every drop out of this unit before having to upgrade to a real
system.
Click to expand...

Nothing wrong with the motherboard, it's a P2B :-)

Your problem is lack of support for upgrades from Sony. Sony's lack of
support is the reason you cannot get a definitive answer as to the
fastest processor you can use.
If the P2B-AE motherboard is the same as the P3B-1394 motherboard, the
specs say I upgrade to a P3 600MHz. Any thoughts on whether this is
okay or even worth it?
Click to expand...

The P2B-AE is not the *same* as the P3B-1394, just very similar, and
apparently BIOS is interchangeable.

600Mhz was probably the fastest P3 CPU available at the time those specs
were published. The most recent P3B-1394 manual (Jan 2000) confirms
support for Coppermine P3s and lists switch settings for processors up
to 700Mhz. Coppermine P3s were available later at up to 1.1Ghz. The most
recent P3B-1394 BIOS (Nov 2001) supports all Coppermine P3s, but I would
avoid the 1.1Ghz just in case that BIOS has the same 11x multiplier bug
which was prevalent in Asus beta BIOSes of that era.

IMHO you should go to at least 900Mhz to make the upgrade worthwhile.

Note that Coppermine P3s were available for both 100Mhz & 133Mhz FSB
(you want a 100Mhz version), and in Slot-1 and Socket 370 form factors
(you want Socket 370 so you can mount it on a Slot-T adapter and set the
CPU voltage)
Also, if the P2B-AE motherboard is the same as the P3B-1394
motherboard, the P3B-1394 can support up to 512K RAM, so could I put
512K RAM on the P2B-AE?
Click to expand...

Yes, you should be able to run 2 x 256MB DIMMS for a total of 512MB RAM
- but again, the Asus BIOS may be required. Make sure you purchase RAM
compatible with the 440BX chipset - the most reliable way to ensure
compatibility is to use the memory selector at www.crucial.com (Tell it
you have a P3B-1394).

P2B
 
P2B,

You said...
The most recent P3B-1394 BIOS (Nov 2001) supports all Coppermine P3s,
Click to expand...
but I >would avoid the 1.1Ghz just in case that BIOS has the same 11x
multiplier bug
which was prevalent in Asus beta BIOSes of that era.
Click to expand...

Where can I get this BIOS? Link? BIOSMAN tells me the latest is
ver.2003 dated August 2000.

asrjcb
 
James said:
P2B,

You said...



but I >would avoid the 1.1Ghz just in case that BIOS has the same 11x
multiplier bug



Where can I get this BIOS? Link? BIOSMAN tells me the latest is
ver.2003 dated August 2000.

asrjcb
Click to expand...

I posted the link in my first reply to this thread.

P2B
 
James said:
I'm trying to upgrade my Sony PCV-R522DS from a PII to PIII which Sony
said was compatable on their website. When I put the chip in the
computer would not boot - just dead. Replace the old cpu & everything
is fine. My computer specs are below along with the upgrade CPU
specs. Any ideas on why it won't work? Do I just need a BIOS upgrade
(which I have not done)?

BIOS Date: 05/26/99
BIOS Type: Award Modular BIOS v4.51PG
BIOS ID: 05/26/99-i440BX-P2B
OEM Sign-On: ACPI BIOS Revision 1005
Chipset: Intel 440BX/ZX rev 3
Superio: Unknown
OS: WinXP
CPU: Pentium® II With On-Die L2 Cache 467 MHz
BIOS ROM In Socket: Unknown
BIOS ROM Size: Unknown
Memory Installed: 191 MB

Intel Celeron (Pentium III based) 1.3 GHz, 256K L2 Cache Processor -
OEM
Specification
Model: Intel Celeron
Core: Tualatin
Operating Frequency: 1.3 GHz
FSB: 100MHz
Cache: L1/12K+8K; L2/256K
Voltage: 1.5V
Process: 0.13Micron
Socket: Socket 370
Multimedia Instruction: MMX, SSE
Packaging: OEM (Processor only)

asrjcb
Click to expand...

For the archives:

The OP and I worked together via email to complete the upgrade to his
Sony PCV-R522DS system, which had an Asus P2B-AE motherboard (OEM board,
similar to the P3B-1394) and Celeron 466Mhz processor.

First we flashed the last beta BIOS for the P3B-1394. This BIOS works
perfectly on the P2B-AE, supporting all onboard components including the
firewire ports.

We decided to go with an S370 PIII 1Ghz/133Mhz Coppermine processor and
Slot-T adapter since the P2B-AE has an ICS9248-39 clock chip (150Mhz
capable) and HIP6004BCB voltage regulator (Tualatin capable), but no
BIOS support for Tualatin processors.

The upgrade was partly successful - the processor ran at 750Mhz as there
are no FSB jumpers or switches on the P2B-AE, and the FSB jumpers on the
Slot-T were only effective for selecting between 66Mhz and 100Mhz FSB -
the board ignored the 133Mhz setting and ran at 100Mhz.

Next the OP picked up a P3B-1394 cheaply on eBay and swapped it in. This
board has the FSB switches missing from the P2B-AE, and is able to run
the 1Ghz/133Mhz processor at full rated speed.

The P2B-AE board is now surplus to the OP's requirements, and he has
offered to send it to me in consideration of my assistance. I plan to
determine why the board does not honor the CPU's 133Mhz FSB request, fix
it, and post details of the modification on my P2B site. I will also try
a Tualatin processor on it, but don't really expect it to work due to
lack of BIOS support.

P2B

http://tipperlinne.com/p2bmod
 
The upgrade was partly successful - the processor ran at 750Mhz as there
are no FSB jumpers or switches on the P2B-AE, and the FSB jumpers on the
Slot-T were only effective for selecting between 66Mhz and 100Mhz FSB -
the board ignored the 133Mhz setting and ran at 100Mhz.
Click to expand...
P2B

http://tipperlinne.com/p2bmod
Click to expand...

Maybe only one of the BSEL pins from the slot is wired to the clock
gen ? I don't have a table of BSEL values handy, but it is possible
that one of the BSEL pins is effectively always a zero and is not
really wired to the processor.

Sounds like you had fun, though. I bet your next report will be,
it is running at 150MHz :-)

Paul
 
Paul said:
Maybe only one of the BSEL pins from the slot is wired to the clock
gen ? I don't have a table of BSEL values handy, but it is possible
that one of the BSEL pins is effectively always a zero and is not
really wired to the processor.
Click to expand...

I expect that's exactly what Asus did - leaving BSEL1 as a no connect
would produce the observed behavior. When the board arrives, I plan to
disconnect BSEL0 as well, then install switches to enable the full range
of FSB settings supported by the clock chip, as Asus did on the P3B-1394.
 
Does all this have to do with this info: http://tipperline.com/p2bmod or is
this a different board. I was looking at this info the other day and
considering building a Dos 6.22/Windows 95/Windows 98 system -w- a trios
drive selector in it. Yes I know the dual cpu's wouldn't be used with the OS
I mention but I also have other's I may use.
ME
 
Does all this have to do with this info: http://tipperline.com/p2bmod or is
this a different board. I was looking at this info the other day and
considering building a Dos 6.22/Windows 95/Windows 98 system -w- a trios
drive selector in it. Yes I know the dual cpu's wouldn't be used with the OS
I mention but I also have other's I may use.
ME
Click to expand...
I haven't seen the whole thread, so perhaps you won't find this post
useful but I'll say it just in case it may help. I run a program
called BootIT NG which allows you to boot multiple operating systems
without buying the Trios Drive Selector.

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/bootitng.html

I have a Dos 6.22 partition, two Windows 98 systems, a Windows XP Pro
and ready for a Mandrake Linux 10.0 install when I feel well enough to
do it. It can hide the various partitions and drives from each install
as you choose, so one OS can't even see the other partitions. It is a
shareware program, so you get to try it first and make sure it'll do
exactly what you desire before having to pay for it. They also run a
free newsgroup support forum and I found plenty of people willing to
answer questions. I also installed one of those removable hard drive
bays which allows you to install/remove different drives without
running an external USB/Firewire solution. The one I installed says it
must be installed on the secondary IDE channel for some reason, so I
couldn't use it to swap in different hard drives as the boot drive.
That restriction may not be true of other models, so it might be worth
researching as another alternative to the Trios. It wouldn't require
using up three drive bays. This is the model I have just to show what
it looks like.

http://www.genica.com/Harddrives/gn-210.htm

Hope this helps
 
Hello "Capman"
Thanks for your post. Sorry this reply was late, lot's of computer problems
to deal with. The info is very helpful as the current version Trios wont
work on newer systems and I wanted a Windows XP option. I've downloaded the
software and will try it out shortly.
Thanks
ME
 
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