Help! Drive Image 2002 question

[mydeadpresidents]

I've been happily using Drive Image 2002 for some time now with great
success, but recently I'm having a problem and could really use some
help.

I have one Hard Drive with several partitions. In the past I have
restored my entire primary partition (Operating System) to a Drive
image file on a different partition (same HD). I'm using (past and
present) Windows XP SP2 with every thing formated in NTFS. In the past
Drive image has broken up my image files into two pieces one over 2
gigs and the other about 1.6 gigs. No problems restoring.

Since my last backup, I wanted to change the sizes of my partitions. I
did nothing to my primary partition, but I ended up deleteing all my
logical drives and then recreating them (with the same names and drive
letters but with different GB allotments). Before altering my old
logical drive partitions, I burned the image file to a DVD. (I didn't
back up Drive image to DVD, I just moved the locally created image onto
a DVD and burned it that way). Later, after recreating my logical
drive partitions, I moved the two file image from DVD back onto my Hard
Drive and from there I restored my primary drive without issue.
(Something I can still do without a problem)

After restoring, I made some changes and added some applications, then
I created another new image with drive image as I have done many times
in the past. (This time the second image file was 1.8 gigs instead of
1.6 but otherwise no different). Later on when I tried to restore from
that image I got the error "Error #1831 Image File Not Found". I
repeated the process with verify ON, but then it just dumped me out
before finishing with the same error message.

To me it seems clear that my failure to be able to create a new image
must be directly related to the changes I made in my logical drive
partitions. (The primary partition has not been changed and remains
the same throughout this whole ordeal). I know this is old software
and I know symantec bought out powerquest (or at least drive image)
some time ago.

Please help if you can even just by pointing me in the right direction.
I feel like I must be missing something obvious.

Thanks.

 

[Rod Speed]

(e-mail address removed) wrote

I've been happily using Drive Image 2002
for some time now with great success,

Its getting pretty dated in its capabilitys now,
time for something much better like True Image.

but recently I'm having a problem and could really use some help.

I have one Hard Drive with several partitions. In the past I
have restored my entire primary partition (Operating System)
to a Drive image file on a different partition (same HD).

What you actually did was restore to a different partition
than the one you created the image file from.

I'm using (past and present) Windows XP SP2 with every thing formated
in NTFS. In the past Drive image has broken up my image files into two
pieces one over 2 gigs and the other about 1.6 gigs.

Thats normal, it does that because 2GB is a
file size that is supported on all file systems.

No problems restoring.

Since my last backup, I wanted to change the sizes of my partitions.
I did nothing to my primary partition, but I ended up deleteing all my
logical drives and then recreating them (with the same names and
drive letters but with different GB allotments). Before altering my
old logical drive partitions, I burned the image file to a DVD. (I didn't
back up Drive image to DVD, I just moved the locally created image
onto a DVD and burned it that way). Later, after recreating my
logical drive partitions, I moved the two file image from DVD back
onto my Hard Drive and from there I restored my primary drive
without issue. (Something I can still do without a problem)

Yes, that approach works fine.

After restoring, I made some changes and added some applications,
then I created another new image with drive image as I have done
many times in the past. (This time the second image file was 1.8 gigs
instead of 1.6 but otherwise no different). Later on when I tried to restore
from that image I got the error "Error #1831 Image File Not Found".
I repeated the process with verify ON, but then it just dumped me
out before finishing with the same error message.

DI 2002 can get seriously confused about
permissions for files on NTFS partitions.

To me it seems clear that my failure to be able to create a new image
must be directly related to the changes I made in my logical drive partitions.

Nope, its just got confused about file permissions that
changed when you change the logical drive partitions.

(The primary partition has not been changed and
remains the same throughout this whole ordeal).
I know this is old software and I know symantec bought
out powerquest (or at least drive image) some time ago.

Bought out powerquest.

Please help if you can even just by pointing me in the right
direction. I feel like I must be missing something obvious.

Yes you are, the file permissions.

You should be able to bypass the file permissions by booting
the DI 2002 floppys or CD and doing the restore from there.

You can create a bootable CD by saving an image directly to
the CD burner and then aborting that once the first CD is written.
Just use that for a bootable DI off CD and specify the image to
be restore manually browsing to the image files on the hard drive.

 

[mydeadpresidents]

(e-mail address removed) wrote

Thanks for the help Rod. I'm running out of ideas fast with few
resources to turn to.

What you actually did was restore to a different partition
than the one you created the image file from.

Not sure if I'm understanding you. In the past I successfully created
an image of partition C, saving that image to partition D. Later when
I restored partition C, I did it using the image saved to partition D
(although that image had since been moved onto a DVD then moved back to
a newly created partition "D" on the same hard drive). In the past
each time I restored my primary drive I made the choice to delete the
primary partition and then restore it with the image previously created
by drive image. So in that sense I've delete and recreated the primary
partition each time. Other than that I've never recreated or
manipulated my primary partition so I'm not sure how it would be a
different partition that I'm restoring TO.

Thats normal, it does that because 2GB is a
file size that is supported on all file systems.



Yes, that approach works fine.


DI 2002 can get seriously confused about
permissions for files on NTFS partitions.


Nope, its just got confused about file permissions that
changed when you change the logical drive partitions.

That seems to be the key. However, I've only ever used one log on for
this computer and it's been the same all along before and after
changing the partitions, so in that sense the permissions "should be"
the same. (BTW, to be clear, to initallly create and later to change
the logical drives, I used the tools found in Control
Panel/Administrative Tools/Computer Management/Disk Managment). Even
so, for whatever reason, I'm happy to accept as given that for some
reason DI is confused about the permisssions as you say.

Bought out powerquest.

Okay, thanks for the clairification.

Yes you are, the file permissions.

Thanks for that insight!

You should be able to bypass the file permissions by booting
the DI 2002 floppys or CD and doing the restore from there.

You can create a bootable CD by saving an image directly to
the CD burner and then aborting that once the first CD is written.
Just use that for a bootable DI off CD and specify the image to
be restore manually browsing to the image files on the hard drive.

Okay, I think I understand. Thanks! I really appreciate it. If I
understand you right I should only have to create the boot CD once but
then use that from now as a way to redirect to future hard drive images
which will be different in the future. I'm assuming I'll have to
follow that method from now on. I'll give that a try very soon and let
you know how it turned out.

Of course the obvious question is, is there a practical way of getting
DI to recognize the new permissions? Perhaps by reinstalling DI? (I'm
guessing it's just not that simple, right?)

Finally, if I was going to buy the newest Drive Image type software
(mainly just to backup my OS partition) what would you suggest is the
best choice on the market? Norton Ghost 2005 v9.0?

Thanks again for your help Rod. I really was at a dead end for what to
do until I read your post.

 

[Rod Speed]

(e-mail address removed) wrote

Rod Speed wrote

Thanks for the help Rod. I'm running out
of ideas fast with few resources to turn to.

Yeah, can be a problem with imagers.

That's another advantage with True Image, a very
decent forum with Acronis reps responding to questions.

Not sure if I'm understanding you.

I was just quibbling with your wording there.
You cant restore TO an image file.

In the past I successfully created an image of partition C, saving
that image to partition D. Later when I restored partition C, I did
it using the image saved to partition D (although that image had
since been moved onto a DVD then moved back to a newly
created partition "D" on the same hard drive). In the past each
time I restored my primary drive I made the choice to delete the
primary partition and then restore it with the image previously
created by drive image. So in that sense I've delete and recreated
the primary partition each time. Other than that I've never recreated
or manipulated my primary partition so I'm not sure how it
would be a different partition that I'm restoring TO.

Sure, I worded that a bit carelessly myself, I didnt mean to emphasise that bit.

That seems to be the key. However, I've only ever used
one log on for this computer and it's been the same all
along before and after changing the partitions,

I did too when I saw that problem when I used an NTFS
partition for the image files. Up till then I used a FAT32
partition for the image files and never saw a problem.

so in that sense the permissions "should be" the same.

Its more complicated than that in practice. It appears to
be more of a problem with DI 2002 in the bug sense than
a fundamental problem with NTFS permissions. I didnt
really make that clear enough in my original comments.

(BTW, to be clear, to initallly create and later to change
the logical drives, I used the tools found in Control Panel/
Administrative Tools/Computer Management/Disk Managment).

Yeah, that's the best place to do it and where I did it too.

Even so, for whatever reason, I'm happy to accept as given that
for some reason DI is confused about the permisssions as you say.

Yeah, it appears to be a bug/wart in DI.

I have also seen XP run out of slots too and had to
increase those when even explorer had a problem
with access to the files on that NTFS drive.

Okay, thanks for the clairification.

Thanks for that insight!

Okay, I think I understand. Thanks! I really appreciate it. If
I understand you right I should only have to create the boot
CD once but then use that from now as a way to redirect to
future hard drive images which will be different in the future.

Yes, its just a more convenient way to boot DI than the floppys.

I'm assuming I'll have to follow that method from now on.
I'll give that a try very soon and let you know how it turned out.

Yes, please, we dont get enough feedback on whether
a suggestion worked out the way it should do.

Of course the obvious question is, is there a practical way of getting
DI to recognize the new permissions? Perhaps by reinstalling DI?
(I'm guessing it's just not that simple, right?)

I didnt look at that closely, I was rather irritated by
it showing its age in other areas, particularly network
support, and that was the last straw, I dont plan to
use it anymore, changed over to True Image now.

Finally, if I was going to buy the newest Drive Image type
software (mainly just to backup my OS partition) what
would you suggest is the best choice on the market?

True Image in my opinion.

Norton Ghost 2005 v9.0?

I dont like it at all. It does some ops fine, but it cant create an
image from the booted CD and that is a very serious lack for me.
I prefer to image a system that isnt mine before doing any work
on it for safety and need to be able to image from the booted CD.
Ghost 9 has to be installed before it will create an image and thats
very undesirable in that situation.

And its close to useless when migrating to a new hard drive.
Again, you cant do the cloning from the booted CD, you have
to do the cloning from the installed Ghost and that has very
real downsides with drive letters doing the cloning at the XP level.
You have to clone the partitions individually in that situation, and
it failed to clone one of my partitions, and was damned slow with
the one it did succeed. True Image cloned the entire drive in
much less time than Ghost took to do the one it manage to clone.

Thanks again for your help Rod. I really was at
a dead end for what to do until I read your post.

No problem, that's what these technical newsgroups are for.

 

[mydeadpresidents]

Hey Hey, just wanted to say your suggestion worked great! I'm back up
and running like before with my backup in good shape. Thanks a bunch.

I'll keep the boot disk around for future use, but I'm still going to
shop for a new Imager. Sounds like True Image is the way to go. I'll
definitely look into it. Generally speaking I've never been too crazy
about symantec anyway, and it's good to hear True Image provides some
support.

Anyway, thanks a lot. It's not just a matter of these technical groups
serving their purpose. It's somebody giving their time to help out a
total stranger and, for what it's worth, I appreciate it.

 

[Derek Baker]

Hey Hey, just wanted to say your suggestion worked great! I'm back up
and running like before with my backup in good shape. Thanks a bunch.

I'll keep the boot disk around for future use, but I'm still going to
shop for a new Imager. Sounds like True Image is the way to go. I'll
definitely look into it. Generally speaking I've never been too crazy
about symantec anyway, and it's good to hear True Image provides some
support.

Anyway, thanks a lot. It's not just a matter of these technical groups
serving their purpose. It's somebody giving their time to help out a
total stranger and, for what it's worth, I appreciate it.

I recently replaced DI2002 with True Image, and have been very pleased: can
use the computer while imaging, it's faster and it does incrementals.

 

[Rod Speed]

(e-mail address removed) wrote

Hey Hey, just wanted to say your suggestion worked great! I'm back up
and running like before with my backup in good shape. Thanks a bunch.

No problem, thanks for the feedback.

I'll keep the boot disk around for future use, but I'm still going
to shop for a new Imager. Sounds like True Image is the way
to go. I'll definitely look into it. Generally speaking I've never
been too crazy about symantec anyway,

Yeah, I've always had the same reservations myself.

and it's good to hear True Image provides some support.

Anyway, thanks a lot. It's not just a matter of these technical
groups serving their purpose. It's somebody giving their time to
help out a total stranger and, for what it's worth, I appreciate it.

No problem, happy to help. I actually enjoy the
challenge with less than obvious problems.

 

[Lil' Dave]

The windows menu for DI2002 has a selection for creating rescue boot
diskettes. You could not do this in XP? Lack of msdos the reason?

My DI2002 is installed on a 98SE partition. When PQ indicated there may be
unspecified problems restoring an XP partition, I upgraded to DI 7.0. Been
with it since for XP only, NTFS. All else is FAT32, no problems here.
Triboot 98SE/ME/XP.

 

[mydeadpresidents]

Thanks Lil'Dave, but I think I Rod cleared everything up. It was all
about the permissions. Following his advice it works well enough for
me at this time.

 

[mydeadpresidents]

Just a follow up. All's working well, but I'm unable to move the newly
created image file from its current location on my hard drive. As you
might have guessed, it's a problem with permissions. Using your
method, the data can be backed up and stored, and later restored, so
that's all that matters to me. However, this last inconvience is
probably the last excuse I needed to get a new imager. Just wanted to
mention this for anyone else following this thread who might want the
insight.

Thanks again.

 

[Rod Speed]

Just a follow up. All's working well, but I'm unable to move the
newly created image file from its current location on my hard drive.
As you might have guessed, it's a problem with permissions. Using
your method, the data can be backed up and stored, and later
restored, so that's all that matters to me. However, this last
inconvience is probably the last excuse I needed to get a new imager.
Just wanted to mention this for anyone else following this thread who
might want the insight.

Thanks for that, yes I forgot to mention that other downside with DI 2002.