forms vs. DAP

  • Thread starter Thread starter maggie
  • Start date Start date
M

maggie

After spending approximately 80 hours setting up a
database and creating what I consider user-friendly forms
my teammates think that it will be too difficult for our
executives to use. They want it to be more "web-like". I
know there is a way to create data access pages (DAPs)
that can be used for data entry but after looking into it
I don't believe it is something that is reachable with my
skillset.

My question is how big is the learning curve for creating
DAPs including understanding the front-end, back-end
server stuff?

Can I get there from here - or do I need to take some
classes?
 
Why not make your application more web like?

Further, you can't possibility expect users to go out and have to take a
course on how to use ms-access to use YOUR application.

So, since users should not have to use ms-access, do you make efforts to
hide, or at least ensure that users don't have to know to use ms-access?

If you simply switch something that is hard to use to a web based system,
you will only create anther disaster.

Web based systems tend to be slow, and very clunky to use. However, web
based systems do force the designers of the application to break up tasks
into a series of steps since you don't have things like nice menu bars etc.

If your application is well designed, then your application SHOULD BE easier
then a web based system. This is not a issue of web vs winfoms, but an issue
of making a easy to use and intuitive UI.

For example, when a user has to search for a name, or invoice or whatever,
how do you do that? Some access people actaully thow up a form, and then
hope the user knows about using filters, or placig the curosor in a field
and going ctrl-f etc. That is WAY WAY WAY too much junk to confuse the user
with!. So, you need to make the task of seaching VERY easy. Here is what I
do, and you can read about it here:

http://www.attcanada.net/~kallal.msn/Search/index.html

There is also a link in that above article to a on-line book on creeating
user friently software.

And, if your executive type users are find the system hard to use, then you
need to make some nice screens for them (they are not donig data entry..so
you need nice report prompt screens). You can see some examples of this idea
here:

http://www.attcanada.net/~kallal.msn/ridesrpt/ridesrpt.html

And, if you want some tip on how to reducing training, and make ms-access
easy to use..you can read the follwing, and there is some nice screen shots
also:

http://www.attcanada.net/~kallal.msn/Articles/UseAbility/UserFriendly.htm
 
I don't think I made myself clear. My database is very
user friendly. All the user has to do is launch ms-access
and they begin at a sign in screen. It is the only option
available to them. Once they type in their ID they are
sent to a set of forms set up similiar to the employees
form in the northwind database. There are several tabs
and the data is populated with the current information
available. They are asked to check a box if the
information is correct on the tab, correct anything that
is wrong and add any new information in the space
provided. On the last page all they do is click a button
and it closes the database.

What happened was that yesterday we tried to paste the
address of the sharedrive into an email so that all the
executives would have to do is select the link and it
would automatically put the user into the first form in
access.

Unfortunately, our Outlook will not allow you to open an
link with the extension .mdb because of all the recent
virus activity. So the only option the recipient has is
to save the database to their hard drive. This doesn't
help me collect data and it could potentially put
information onto the executive's hard drive that is not
related to them. They would have to know the trick of
holding down the shift key when opening and I don't think
they have the time or malicious intent to get to the
information.

Our only options are to ask the executive to copy the
address into the run box or the IE address box and it will
launch the database or send them to the share drive via
the address (minus the accessfile.mdb )and ask them to
open the database.

Neither of these options was acceptable to the team. It
was to me but they are more sensitive to the executives
software acumen than I am.

By the way I was on you site today and your article about
using a WAN with ms-access answered the mystery of why I
keep crashing another database I put together everytime I
run an update query over the cable modem. I have
corrupted the database at least 10 times this past year.

It also made me question if what I am trying to accomplish
is feasible without a SQL server as a back end. You also
made me aware of this Thin Server Technology that I might
have to look into once I either covert this to DAP or find
a way to launch ms-access without violating any security.

I don't even want to think about this now.

Thanks for all of your information.

Please let me know if you know of any workarounds for my
current situation besides rebuilding using DAPs.

Maggie
 
Ah, ok, then it sounds like the real issue is not so much user friendly, but
an issue of users being able to run/use the application.

So, that is my miss-understanding here (often, some people say, make the app
web friendly..and as a solution will NOT fix bad software).

However, you are 100% correct in assuming that web based does solve most
problems of accessibility, and allows users just about anywhere to use the
application.

You can start to use DAP. This does mean of course that you need to run a
web server.

In addition, any time you deploy ms-access applications on your network, you
SHOULD be running a split database. That means each users pc gets a front
end database (usually a mde). So, this issue of pasting the path name to a
server copy of the database is NOT the recommend way to run a ms-access
database (even with a good network, you will often get corruptions if you
allow multiple users into he same front end. So, run a split arrangement,
and that should eliminate/reduce corruptions on your network.
What happened was that yesterday we tried to paste the
address of the sharedrive into an email so that all the
executives would have to do is select the link and it
would automatically put the user into the first form in
access.
Click to expand...

As mentioned, you should not allow multiple users into the same front end
And, I have to assume you are running a split database anyway..right? (if
you have not split...then how are you doing any development on the
database?).
So the only option the recipient has is
to save the database to their hard drive. This doesn't
help me collect data
Click to expand...

Well, if you run a proper setup, then yes, all data stays on the server..and
only the forms/code (the app) gets placed on each pc.

My whole article on using a wan is very much centered around this issue of
people trying to use a split database. Any budding developer will quickly
realize that the only reasonable approach to development is a split
database. The next step learned is that for multi-user applications, then
the front end is placed on each pc. Then, my article on wans comes into
play, as users THEN think you can run a split database across a wan. You
certainly can, and should run a split database across a lan..but NOT a wan.

It is not clear to me if you have done the first two steps (split..and then
place a mde on each computer).

You can certainly using something like WinZip, and ziip up a mde file and
email it to users on your system. You simply have the zipped file un-zip to
a working dir..and then users can launch the mde file..but course the
tables/data is still sitting on your server (as mentioned, this process
reduces corruption by a lot).

You can read up on splitting here:

http://www.granite.ab.ca/access/splitapp.htm
 
Albert -

Thanks so much for all of your advice. To answer your
question - no I haven't ever split a database. I hope you
didn't fall off you chair when you read that!

When I want to do work on the database I look to see if
anyone is using it. If they are I send an email or call
them and tell them to get out. It is a real grass roots
effort. The more I learn about ms-access the less I feel
know. I have broke so many rules its scary.

Of course this wouldn't work with executives.

Thanks again for all of you help!

Maggie
 
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